Is it ok for a Christian to kill people?

[Thankful 1]

"Jesus told us, those who are his disciples that it is no longer acceptable to kill. " - Thankful1


-- Really? Where? Because your scripture quote is about seeking revenge for something done to you.

While it is true that Jesus likely doesn't want you to kill someone out of vengeance, that doesn't mean He said it was no longer acceptable to kill under any circumstance.

Same for the verse talking about praying for those who persecute you.

Someone breaks into your home and is chasing your wife or daughter with an ax. Are you really going to just going to pick up a phone and dial 911 or sit down and say "I forgive him" instead of trying to stop him?

Am looking forward to a verse that actually supports your position.

Only Paul said anything about vengeance. Jesus did not mention vengeance. Jesus told us: (Matthew 5:39)“You have learnt how it was said: ‘Eye for eye and tooth for tooth.’ But I saythis to you: offer the wicked man no resistance.”



(Matthew 5:43-44) “You have learnt how it was said, you mustlove your neighbor and hate your enemy, but I say this to you: love yourenemies and pray for those who persecute you.”



Many people like to quote misunderstandings of what Paul wrote. Peter warned us, and Calvin and all hisfollowers just ignored Peter’s warning.

 

[KingdomCome]

I asked a very similar question once to a man on another message board. His answer was "yes." He added that he would sit by and watch his entire family be murdered rather than harm another man. Talk about a misuse of Scripture. :blink:

Say what you will, that man was probably me. Like Jesus, I am not going to harm another for any reason. Christ Jesus has shown me the way...

I believe the Scripture is true when the KJV says:
Ex 20:13 Thou shalt not kill.
De 5:17 Thou shalt not kill.
Mt 5:21 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
Ro 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

The Hebrew and the Greek words behind the word "kill", also mean to slay and murder — I choose "kill" and for any reason as Christ Jesus has shown to me in the Bible.

07523 xur ratsach raw-tsakh'

a primitive root; TWOT - 2208; v

KJV - slayer 16, murderer 14, kill 5, murder 3, slain 3, manslayer 2, killing 1, slayer + 0310 1, slayeth 1, death 1; 47

1) to murder, slay, kill
1a) (Qal) to murder, slay
1a1) premeditated
1a2) accidental
1a3) as avenger
1a4) slayer (intentional) (participle)
1b) (Niphal) to be slain
1c) (Piel)
1c1) to murder, assassinate
1c2) murderer, assassin (participle)(subst)
1d) (Pual) to be killed

Blessings

 

[Duckybill]

Christians in the NT were persecuted to the death. None killed anyone. Jesus clearly said do not kill others.

Matthew 5:39 (NASB)
[sup]39 [/sup]"But I say to you, do not resist an evil person;

 

[Foreigner]

Christians in the NT were persecuted to the death. None killed anyone. Jesus clearly said do not kill others.

Matthew 5:39 (NASB)
[sup]39 [/sup]"But I say to you, do not resist an evil person;

-- So police cannot be Christians? Soldiers cannot be Christians? Their goal is not to kill but sometimes their jobs lead them to do it. Should they quit?

If someone is trying to murder you, regardless of the reason, you cannot defend yourself?

If a person is in the process of trying to murder your family members and the only way to stop them is to kill them, so you can't do it.

Ummmmmm....no, that is not what God requires.

 

[RubberDuckey]

Hi everyone,
I found an interesting song in youtube today through a site called Christians for peace. http://www.christian.../theo/bomb.html

Here's the song:
http://www.youtube.c...h?v=T0KzmoXvyek

Any thoughts?
Can Christians kill other people?


Blessings to all,
brian

Killing is the act of taking the life of a something.
Murder is the unlawful killing of another human


The sixth commandment states that you should not murder. You can probably see where I'm going here. If someone were to try to kill my wife and son (I don't have either) I will do whatever it takes to save their lives. If that man were to die, then so be it. I was not unlawful, but rather the victim of unlawfulness.

 

[Foreigner]

Killing is the act of taking the life of a something.
Murder [font="arial][size="2"]is the unlawful killing of another human[/size][/font]

-- So as long as it is a 'justified' kill, as in the law supporting you having killed an intruder who was going to murder your family?

Or a cop who shoots someone who was drawing a gun on them?

Or a soldier who is being shot at first and returns fire, killing the attacker?

Sounds to me like this is a greenlight activity in God's eyes.

 

[RubberDuckey]

-- So as long as it is a 'justified' kill, as in the law supporting you having killed an intruder who was going to murder your family?

Or a cop who shoots someone who was drawing a gun on them?

Or a soldier who is being shot at first and returns fire, killing the attacker?

Sounds to me like this is a greenlight activity in God's eyes.

So you're telling me that if you walked into your house and saw a man raping your wife you wouldn't do everything in your power to stop that man even if it meant he would die?

 

[Foreigner]

So you're telling me that if you walked into your house and saw a man raping your wife you wouldn't do everything in your power to stop that man even if it meant he would die?

-- Of course I would.

My concern would be that I couldn't keep from killing him because my anger/rage during the rescue and could end up killing him. That I would indeed have to answer to God for. But I would indeed kill him if that was the only way to make him stop.

That is the point of that last post. Read it again.



Also, this is one my posts from yesterday:

"I appreciate your honesty. I would defend the lives of my wife and child, even to the point of that person's death. And yes, they too are Christians.

As the head of the household one of my responsibilities is to protect the members of my family from harm if it is within my power.

If that ax-wielding intruder's death was the only way to save them, that intruder dies."




.

 

[archaeologist5]

In battle, yes!

really??? chapter and verse please to support that opinion

 

[Foreigner]

Archaeologist, he could come back and say "Provide chapter and verse that says SPECIFICALLY it is NOT alright to kill someone in battle."

You seem to think that the only way a Christian can be a soldier is if they are in a non-combat role.

Please provide chapter and verse that requires that. (See how silly your request is?)






.

 

[Duckybill]

-- So police cannot be Christians? Soldiers cannot be Christians? Their goal is not to kill but sometimes their jobs lead them to do it. Should they quit?

They cannot obey Jesus. Why would you consider those who refuse to obey Jesus to be Christians?

If someone is trying to murder you, regardless of the reason, you cannot defend yourself?

Matthew 5:39 (NASB)
[sup]39 [/sup]"But I say to you, do not resist an evil person;

If a person is in the process of trying to murder your family members and the only way to stop them is to kill them, so you can't do it.

Ummmmmm....no, that is not what God requires.

If God doesn't answer your prayers then you have a very big problem.

 

[Thankful 1]

-- So police cannot be Christians? Soldiers cannot be Christians? Their goal is not to kill but sometimes their jobs lead them to do it. Should they quit?

If someone is trying to murder you, regardless of the reason, you cannot defend yourself?

If a person is in the process of trying to murder your family members and the only way to stop them is to kill them, so you can't do it.

Ummmmmm....no, that is not what God requires.

Ibelieve hypothetical situations are used by Satan to manipulate people into notaccepting the Word of God.



Scripturetells us that we would never be put into a situation beyond are ability towithstand the temptation to disobey God.



Sowhat one would or would not do in any circumstance would be left up to thegrace of God at any given time.



Jesustold me that we were not to hurt/harm anyone for any reason. My wife did not like that word when I sharedit with her. She went away angry. I did not argue with her. I knew she had a close relationship withJesus, and would ask him personally it I was right or wrong. She came back and told me that I wasright.



Jesustold me that almost thirty years ago. Not once in those thirty years did I need to defend myself or anyoneelse.



Jesus told me if I kept my eyes on him he would take care of me, and hehas.

 

[RubberDuckey]

-- Of course I would.

My concern would be that I couldn't keep from killing him because my anger/rage during the rescue and could end up killing him. That I would indeed have to answer to God for. But I would indeed kill him if that was the only way to make him stop.

That is the point of that last post. Read it again.



Also, this is one my posts from yesterday:

"I appreciate your honesty. I would defend the lives of my wife and child, even to the point of that person's death. And yes, they too are Christians.

As the head of the household one of my responsibilities is to protect the members of my family from harm if it is within my power.

If that ax-wielding intruder's death was the only way to save them, that intruder dies."




.

My bad. Seemed like you were against self defense the way you worded it.

 

[Thankful 1]

My bad. Seemed like you were against self defense the way you worded it.

A Christian has no right to self-defense. If you believe so then show me the scripturethat says Jesus gave us that right.



Jesus said: (Matthew 5:39) “You havelearnt how it was said: ‘Eye for eye and tooth for tooth.’ But I say this toyou: offer the wicked man no resistance.”



(Matthew5:43-44) “You have learnt how it was said, you must love your neighbor and hateyour enemy, but I say this to you: love your enemies and pray for those whopersecute you.”

 

[RubberDuckey]

A Christian has no right to self-defense. If you believe so then show me the scripturethat says Jesus gave us that right.



Jesus said: (Matthew 5:39) “You havelearnt how it was said: ‘Eye for eye and tooth for tooth.’ But I say this toyou: offer the wicked man no resistance.”



(Matthew5:43-44) “You have learnt how it was said, you must love your neighbor and hateyour enemy, but I say this to you: love your enemies and pray for those whopersecute you.”

[bible=' Luke 22:36, 38 ']36 He said to them, “But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one.37 It is written: ‘And he was numbered with the transgressors’; and I tell you that this must be fulfilled in me. Yes, what is written about me is reaching its fulfillment.”
38 The disciples said, “See, Lord, here are two swords.”

“That’s enough!” he replied.[/bible]

Of course read the whole chapter and it's context. Jesus told his disciples to buy a sword implying he wanted them to have self defense.

 

[Duckybill]

Of course read the whole chapter and it's context. Jesus told his disciples to buy a sword implying he wanted them to have self defense.

Actually Jesus told them NOT to use them.

Matthew 26:52 (NASB)
[sup]52 [/sup]Then Jesus *said to him, "Put your sword back into its place; for all those who take up the sword shall perish by the sword.

 

[Thankful 1]

Yes and when the disciples took Jesus literally Jesus cut it off and said that is enough. If one wants to believe that is not so then how would two swords be enough?

(Luke 22:38) “Lord, they said ‘there are two swords here now,’ He said to them, ‘that is enough!



Here is what some bible scholars said about that passage of scripture: The Apostles have taken the words of Jesus too literally and he closes the conversation abruptly. Also,





Jerusalem Bible: J. The purse to buy, the sword to procure by force the necessities of life. All this is symbolic of a mission in a hostile world.



K. The Apostles have taken the words of Jesus too literally and he closes the conversation abruptly.

 

[RubberDuckey]

Actually Jesus told them NOT to use them.

Matthew 26:52 (NASB)
[sup]52 [/sup]Then Jesus *said to him, "Put your sword back into its place; for all those who take up the sword shall perish by the sword.

Here is a webpage paralleling all four books http://www.rationalc...net/arrest.html. My understanding of this leads me to believe that Simon attacked a servant doing no violence. In that context Jesus saying "all those who take up the sword shall perish by the sword," doesn't mean when you attack anybody you will perish by the sword, but rather when you attack a man doing no violence you will perish by the sword. Also even if he did mean don't ever use the sword why did he tell them to buy swords? To not use them?

 

[Duckybill]

Also even if he did mean don't ever use the sword why did he tell them to buy swords? To not use them?

Jesus told them to get swords to fulfill the prophecy.

Luke 22:36-38 (NASB)
[sup]36 [/sup]And He said to them, "But now, whoever has a money belt is to take it along, likewise also a bag, and whoever has no sword is to sell his coat and buy one. [sup]37 [/sup]"For I tell you that this which is written must be fulfilled in Me, 'AND HE WAS NUMBERED WITH TRANSGRESSORS'; for that which refers to Me has its fulfillment." [sup]38 [/sup]They said, "Lord, look, here are two swords." And He said to them, "It is enough."

Isaiah 53:12 (NASB)
[sup]12 [/sup]Because He poured out Himself to death, And was numbered with the transgressors; Yet He Himself bore the sin of many, And interceded for the transgressors.

Jesus certainly isn't going to tell them to kill their enemies with swords after He said, Matthew 5:39 (NASB)
[sup]39 [/sup]"But I say to you, do not resist an evil person;"

 

[tomwebster]

I like what I'm reading so far, folks!

There are many Christians who support killing, whether for war, death penalty or other.. it's quite baffling. But I'm seeing that this forum is a bit different. Great news!

I wholeheartedly agree that killing is wrong, and that Jesus taught the Way of Love, not violence. May we spread this important message to fellow believers who still trust in swords and spears!

Blessings to all!
brian

I will continue to defend my family and country if called on to do so, you may run or hide if that is what you are accustom to doing.