Is the last antichrist beast a dead man made alive again?

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robert derrick

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Sounds like you're really running with this thing. All I can say is it's interesting and can't just set it aside as obviously false. If you come up with any proof I'd like to see it. Right now it's sort of like lots of circumstantial evidence without any Bible shooting it down.
There is something that at least can be taught for a dead man raised again to natural life, for the express purpose of ministry, even if false:

And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

The Scripture is teaching that the faith that saves does not come by sight, nor even by the dead raised again, if someone does not hear the prophets and apostles with the heart to obey God.

Since that is true of them witnessed to by the dead rising again, then why not the one risen from the dead himself? One would think that a man raised from the death of hell would immediately repent himself, but that is not what Scripture teaches.

The tormented rich man did not ask for himself to be raised from the dead to tell witness to his brothers the truth of the Scriptures and gospel of God, because he still did not have it in his heart to believe and obey God.

That last great antichrist, if raised to live again on earth, would only do what prophesy says he will do: Double and triple down on that Wicked false and destructive ministry and prophecy.
 
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robert derrick

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That isn't a man either. It's a global kingdom that a man will rise and control completely. This is true in Daniel 7 and Rev 13, where a man associated with a little horn (or two) is that global leader.
A man with number of a man and cast into the LOF as a man. The Lord does not cast a global kingdom, and also the false prophet, into the LOF alive.

And He goes on to destroy the armies of that global kingdom afterward. If the armies of the global kingdom are not cast into the LOF, then the global kingdom cannot be cast into the LOF. Afterall, there is no global kingdom without it's armies.
 

ewq1938

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A man with number of a man and cast into the LOF as a man. The Lord does not cast a global kingdom, and also the false prophet, into the LOF alive.


Yes, he does. A dragon, a beast with 7 heads, a woman who is also a city, and a lake made of fire are all symbolisms. The Nazi party was ALIVE in WW2 but then died.


And He goes on to destroy the armies of that global kingdom afterward.


No, those armies are destroyed at Armageddon before the two beasts are cast into the LOF.
 

Always Believing

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There is something that at least can be taught for a dead man raised again to natural life, for the express purpose of ministry, even if false:

And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

The Scripture is teaching that the faith that saves does not come by sight, nor even by the dead raised again, if someone does not hear the prophets and apostles with the heart to obey God.

Since that is true of them witnessed to by the dead rising again, then why not the one risen from the dead himself? One would think that a man raised from the death of hell would immediately repent himself, but that is not what Scripture teaches.

The tormented rich man did not ask for himself to be raised from the dead to tell witness to his brothers the truth of the Scriptures and gospel of God, because he still did not have it in his heart to believe and obey God.

That last great antichrist, if raised to live again on earth, would only do what prophesy says he will do: Double and triple down on that Wicked false and destruction ministry and prophecy.
It's a reach of course but does sound good. I've never thought of that verse in terms of the one rising from the dead and still being a false witness. I suppose it makes since that even hell doesn't bring someone to repentance, since hell on earth doesn't always do so. Some people go through hell on earth changed mentally but not spiritually. Some people go through hell on earth and come out even more bitter and angry and vicious. I've seen that myself. I guess that could be magnified 10 and 100 fold for someone going through hell in hell itself!
 

robert derrick

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Yes, he does. A dragon, a beast with 7 heads, a woman who is also a city, and a lake made of fire are all symbolisms.
Ahh. The Symbol Man's Bible.


The Nazi party was ALIVE in WW2 but then died.
NAZI's were alive and then died. The party and system was only in Hitler's mind until He put it into practise, and much of it was made up as he did so.

No, those armies are destroyed at Armageddon before the two beasts are cast into the LOF.
And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.

And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.


And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

The slaughter of the remnant left after their ministerial leaders are taken away, did not begin until after those two men, or women, were cast into the LOF. Scripture does not say there is any fighting beforehand, but only that He comes to slaughter them seeking to make war with Him. The fowls of all the earth were also already being called to eat the flesh of their armies before the battle even began, because it was a done deal before the first blow was struck.

By believing Scripture as written, even prophecy of Scripture, we get a true teaching out of it, such as any warring with the Lord is a lst cause before it ever happens.

The Symbol Man's/Woman's Bible is full of sloppy Bible reading. ;)
 

ewq1938

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The slaughter of the remnant left after their ministerial leaders are taken away, did not begin until after those two men, or women, were cast into the LOF.;)


That's the opposite of what Rev 19 says. Two women LOL. How does false prophet turn into the false prophetess?
 

robert derrick

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And the order of events? The army is destroyed before the leaders are.
Scripture says otherwise.

And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.

And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

The remnant is not that of the armies, as I once thought, but is the the armies remaining after the beast and false prophet are cast alive into the LOF.
 

robert derrick

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The answer to your question is not complicated.

There would have to be, according to God's Faithfulness, a (OT and/or NT) Prophecy that would grant a platform of discovery for such to take place.

Unless, someone knows of one in the OT, there are no Prophecies or Parables given by the Lord in His Gospel of such nature.

Neither are there any Holy Spirit words/impressions/inspiration(s) given to the Apostles of such.

That would leave us Revelation - and yet there is not a single reference of 'flesh' rising from the dead to be the Last Antichrist.

Finally, why does a person assume that the Anti-Christ is a past life???

We all must listen and understand = 1 John 2:18

Children, it is the last hour; and just as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, so now many antichrists have appeared. This is how we know it is the last hour.
Here is something that at least approaches the idea of the dead man living again on earth to deceive the nations, rather than to lead them to God.

And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent. And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

Jesus is teaching that faith comes by the word of God, and repenting by believing the Scriptures are true. Faith to repent and be saved does not come, unless we are first willing to believe the gospel message. If we don't believe all Scripture as true, then we cannot have faith to repent and be saved, even if someone we know rises again from the dead to tell us so.

Faith and repentance to be saved is only by godly sorrow of the Spirit from the heart, not by sight of dead men rising. Justifying obedience can only be from the heart in the spirit and body.

The assumption we make, is that only friends of Jesus like Lazarus are brought back to life on earth to show the power of God in Jesus Christ, and for the good of them that love him. And the further assumption is that all risen to live again, would bear good testimony of Jesus when having done so. That's why the request was for this Lazarus in Abraham's bosom to go tell the brothers.

But what if He brings back to life a dead false prophet and evil-doer of old? According to the teaching, that one rising from the dead would not necessarily be persuaded to be saved himself., much less to see others come to God. I.e. there is no purgatory, because purgatory does not work the will of God to repent, but repentance is only by faith to do His word from a pure heart.

Neither the brothers would repent by righteous Lazarus rising from the dead, nor would the rich man himself repent if living again after the tormenting flames of hell.

The Lord can bring back to natural life any creature on earth, whether man or beast, and two men were brought back to life in Scripture.

And so, the Lord can cause any man to rise from the dead with his natural body again, including a wicked dead man that does not repent and goes on to do even worse than before. Tormenting flames of Hell do not soften the heart, but hardens the heart and sears the conscience beyond belief.

The last great antichrist will have absolutely no feeling for God nor man nor beast, and a heart and conscience as hard as that of Lucifer and Leviathan, like the nether millstone.

His heart is as firm as a stone; yea, as hard as a piece of the nether millstone.

The flakes of his flesh are joined together: they are firm in themselves; they cannot be moved. His scales are his pride, shut up together as with a close seal.


The skin of a crocodile is as burned flesh and charred wood, and his description in Job 41 is more of a spiritual sea-creature and dragon than any ordinary crocodile. The Rev 13 first beast rising from the sea, is described as just such a devilish water-snake with many heads, that is empowered by the dragon Satan. The pagans mythologized such a creature as the sea-Hydra.

None is so fierce that dare stir him up: who then is able to stand before me?

This Leviathan speaks of being fierce as the little horn with an eye, and in pride as being like the Lamb of God in wrath, before whom none can stand.
 
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Always Believing

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Here is something I came across reading in Luke 9:

Now Herod the tetrarch heard of all that was done by him: and he was perplexed, because that it was said of some, that John was risen from the dead; And of some, that Elias had appeared; and of others, that one of the old prophets was risen again.

And it came to pass, as he was alone praying, his disciples were with him: and he asked them, saying, Whom say the people that I am?
They answering said, John the Baptist; but some say, Elias; and others say, that one of the old prophets is risen again.


Here is at least another double-hint of a prophet raised from the dead. In Herod's case, he would consider it a false or evil prophet. As Christians we all take the resurrection from the dead almost for granted, since the bodily resurrection is a main principle upon which our faith is based. But we don't think much of dead people raised from the grave to live out their natural lives, like the man of the OT revived by the bones of Elijah. Nothing there says he was a good or faithful Israelite. In fact, they are more like a band of thieves on the run.

But obviously the Jews of the day were very much believers in men being raised from the dead to live again, even if some did not believe in the actual resurrection of the dead. The possibility of the last beast being a prophet raised from the dead to live again on earth, may seem foreign to us Christians today, but certainly not to the Jews of Jesus' day. Whether he is a past good or evil prophet is not so much the point, but the purposes of the Lord to do so is all that matters.

God says He raised up Pharaoh to get honor on him, and He did it for two purposes. He tried His people Israel in Egypt, to prepare them for deliverance, and he brought judgement upon Egypt for following their Pharaoh's wickedness. That last antichrist, like all antichrists, is first to try the hearts of the people of God and either purify them, or allow them to be deluded into falling away to a false christ. Secondly, like Egypt, it is to bring just punishment over them worshipping a beast pretending to be christ, rather than the only true Christ of God Jesus.

In either case, the last great false christ is raised up by God for His final purposes, before He sends His Son to earth a second time. All kings and rulers are raised up by God according to His own will. Including if from the dead.
 

robert derrick

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Here is something I came across reading in Luke 9:

Now Herod the tetrarch heard of all that was done by him: and he was perplexed, because that it was said of some, that John was risen from the dead; And of some, that Elias had appeared; and of others, that one of the old prophets was risen again.

And it came to pass, as he was alone praying, his disciples were with him: and he asked them, saying, Whom say the people that I am?
They answering said, John the Baptist; but some say, Elias; and others say, that one of the old prophets is risen again.


Here is at least another double-hint of a prophet raised from the dead. In Herod's case, he would consider it a false or evil prophet. As Christians we all take the resurrection from the dead almost for granted, since the bodily resurrection is a main principle upon which our faith is based. But we don't think much of dead people raised from the grave to live out their natural lives, like the man of the OT revived by the bones of Elijah. Nothing there says he was a good or faithful Israelite. In fact, they are more like a band of thieves on the run.

But obviously the Jews of the day were very much believers in men being raised from the dead to live again, even if some did not believe in the actual resurrection of the dead. The possibility of the last beast being a prophet raised from the dead to live again on earth, may seem foreign to us Christians today, but certainly not to the Jews of Jesus' day. Whether he is a past good or evil prophet is not so much the point, but the purposes of the Lord to do so is all that matters.

God says He raised up Pharaoh to get honor on him, and He did it for two purposes. He tried His people Israel in Egypt, to prepare them for deliverance, and he brought judgement upon Egypt for following their Pharaoh's wickedness. That last antichrist, like all antichrists, is first to try the hearts of the people of God and either purify them, or allow them to be deluded into falling away to a false christ. Secondly, like Egypt, it is to bring just punishment over them worshipping a beast pretending to be christ, rather than the only true Christ of God Jesus.

In either case, the last great false christ is raised up by God for His final purposes, before He sends His Son to earth a second time. All kings and rulers are raised up by God according to His own will. Including if from the dead.
This is good. I believe you've brought the theory a step closer to being proven. Just not quite. There may be some Scripture somewhere that ties it altogether.

And I like your point about modern Christians not considering the things of ancient days to be so important and even possible, other than in movies of course. This includes being raised from the grave, demon possession, and witchcraft. It's why I first scoffed at the suggestion of the last great antichrist being an old false prophet raised from the dead, until I realized there's no Scriptural reason why not.

Thanks much
 
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Davy

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Someone, called The Light, has suggested evidence from Scripture and recent past discoveries, that the antichrist beast of Rev 13, is Nimrod-Gilgamesh, made alive again by the Lord, like the dead body that touched the bones of the prophet, and Lazarus coming out of the grave.

At first, I thought it was at least a fun suggestion, while going about thinking to show it not possible. While I'm not convinced by archeological claims, I am seeing the sense of it in prophecy of Scripture.

The main thing is, I see no Scriptural proof of why not. Nothing in Scripture says that the Lord cannot bring any dead man back to life, based upon how long the body has been in the grave.

And though it is not the resurrection of the dead, which begins with the body of Abel, it still shows no time limit of bodily decay. In fact, Jesus waited four days purposely to show the body of Lazarus was indeed dead, and not just in some sort of Jewish soul-hoovering funk.

Does anyone have any Scripture plainly showing that 1st beast cannot be a long-dead man? That the Lord would never bring back to life? To have a wicked corrupter of souls live again in the flesh?

The Biblically illiterate person who told you those things must look like a spaceman because their mind is so far... out... of... touch... with... Biblical reality!

The 1st beast out of the 'sea' in Rev.13:1 is a beast 'kingdom'. The Antichrist figure that is coming will be in the role of a 'king' per Rev.17. And he will have a 'kingdom', and the ten horns, seven heads, and ten crowns structure is the kingdom, not the Antichrist.

The KJV especially uses third person personal pronouns when speaking of that 1st beast (kingdom) of Rev.13:1, but the (it) pronoun could have easily been used from the Greek too. The actual beast that is a person (the Antichrist), is given later starting at Rev.13:11, so keep reading.

Rev 13:3
3 And I saw
one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
KJV


I didn't know a person can have more than one head!?! Note "heads" above is plural. And IF... one continues to read into Rev.17, they should discover that the "seven heads" represents "seven mountains". So how is that going to be about a person, even symbolically? Even Lord Jesus uses symbols of 'real' things, so manipulating His symbols into other things is definitely the wrong path of discovering His Truth in His Revelation. Stick to what the symbol points to in real life first and understand them.

That above verse is where some uneducated country preacher got the wrong idea that the Antichrist suffers a deadly wound that is healed. They don't understand that the 1st beast of Rev.13:1 is NOT about a person, but about a beast 'kingdom', so they mis-apply that 3rd verse too.

But if one simply keeps reading in Rev.13, all this should easily be cleared up because of this...

Rev 13:11-12
11 And I beheld
another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.

12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship
the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.
KJV

This "another beast" is a 2nd beast, and is a person that appears with two horns LIKE A LAMB (Jesus) but spake as a dragon (Satan). This is definitely singular about the coming Antichrist person. He uses all the power of the 1st beast (kingdom) which had a deadly wound upon ONE OF HIS SEVEN HEADS. That means upon one of the "seven mountains" of the 1st beast kingdom.

Rev 17:9
9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom.
The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.
KJV
 

robert derrick

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The Biblically illiterate person who told you those things must look like a spaceman because their mind is so far... out... of... touch... with... Biblical reality!

The 1st beast out of the 'sea' in Rev.13:1 is a beast 'kingdom'.
I think I've argued this with you before, or in any case I've done so enough.

I don't just go around in circles anymore for the fun of it. It's grown wearisome.

The man of sin has the number of a man and is cast into the LOF with his false prophet.
 

ewq1938

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I think I've argued this with you before, or in any case I've done so enough.

I don't just go around in circles anymore for the fun of it. It's grown wearisome.

The man of sin has the number of a man and is cast into the LOF with his false prophet.


The man of sin is the false prophet. They both are described as performing miracles to deceive people.


Rev 13:13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
Rev 13:14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

wonders:

G4592
se¯meion
say-mi'-on
Neuter of a presumed derivative of the base of G4591; an indication, especially ceremonially or supernaturally: - miracle, sign, token, wonder.
Total KJV occurrences: 77

deceived:

G4105
planao¯
plan-ah'-o
From G4106; to (properly cause to) roam (from safety, truth, or virtue): - go astray, deceive, err, seduce, wander, be out of the way.
Total KJV occurrences: 39

miracles:

G4592
s?µe????
se¯meion
say-mi'-on
Neuter of a presumed derivative of the base of G4591; an indication, especially ceremonially or supernaturally: - miracle, sign, token, wonder.
Total KJV occurrences: 77


Revelation 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received
the mark of the beast
, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Here we read of the second beast, who performs miracles in the sight of the first beast and performing those miracles in order to deceive the people!



Paul's Antichrist was called the man of sin and he is described as doing the same things for the same reason as the false prophet:

2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
2Th 2:5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?
2Th 2:6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
2Th 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
2Th 2:9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders

lying:

G5579
pseudos
psyoo'-dos
From G5574; a falsehood: - lie, lying.
Total KJV occurrences: 9

wonders:

G5059
teras
Thayer Definition:
1) a prodigy, portent
2) miracle: performed by any one
Part of Speech: noun neuter
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: of uncertain affinity
Citing in TDNT: 8:113, 1170



"Lying wonders" is the same as "deceiving miracles".

The false prophet and the man of sin are the same person, the Antichrist.
 
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Davy

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I think I've argued this with you before, or in any case I've done so enough.

I don't just go around in circles anymore for the fun of it. It's grown wearisome.

The man of sin has the number of a man and is cast into the LOF with his false prophet.
Well, regardless of all that... the 1st beast that comes up out of the 'sea' per Rev.13:1 is a KINGDOM beast, not a person. And anyone with common sense ought to know that immediately when they read that it has "seven heads", and by the time they get to the Rev.17 chapter which also reveals the "seven heads" are "seven mountains", that again ought to show anyone with common sense that it's NOT about a person.

Now I'm not saying you don't have common sense because you don't agree, but that whatever NUT that TAUGHT YOU it's about the Antichrist entity doesn't have common sense.
 

robert derrick

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The man of sin is the false prophet. They both are described as performing miracles to deceive people.


Rev 13:13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
Rev 13:14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

wonders:

G4592
se¯meion
say-mi'-on
Neuter of a presumed derivative of the base of G4591; an indication, especially ceremonially or supernaturally: - miracle, sign, token, wonder.
Total KJV occurrences: 77

deceived:

G4105
planao¯
plan-ah'-o
From G4106; to (properly cause to) roam (from safety, truth, or virtue): - go astray, deceive, err, seduce, wander, be out of the way.
Total KJV occurrences: 39

miracles:

G4592
s?µe????
se¯meion
say-mi'-on
Neuter of a presumed derivative of the base of G4591; an indication, especially ceremonially or supernaturally: - miracle, sign, token, wonder.
Total KJV occurrences: 77


Revelation 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received
the mark of the beast
, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Here we read of the second beast, who performs miracles in the sight of the first beast and performing those miracles in order to deceive the people!



Paul's Antichrist was called the man of sin and he is described as doing the same things for the same reason as the false prophet:

2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
2Th 2:5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?
2Th 2:6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
2Th 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
2Th 2:9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders

lying:

G5579
pseudos
psyoo'-dos
From G5574; a falsehood: - lie, lying.
Total KJV occurrences: 9

wonders:

G5059
teras
Thayer Definition:
1) a prodigy, portent
2) miracle: performed by any one
Part of Speech: noun neuter
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: of uncertain affinity
Citing in TDNT: 8:113, 1170



"Lying wonders" is the same as "deceiving miracles".

The false prophet and the man of sin are the same person, the Antichrist.
The beast's number is of a man

And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

The beast is a him. Kingdoms, Nations, systems, etc... are not him cast alive into the lof.
 

robert derrick

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Now I'm not saying you don't have common sense because you don't agree, but that whatever NUT that TAUGHT YOU it's about the Antichrist entity doesn't have common sense.
I teach myself from Scripture alone, and only agree with those I confirm for myself is Scriptural truth.

These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.
 

ewq1938

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The beast's number is of a man

And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

The beast is a him.


The second beast is a him. The first beast is an empire of smaller kingdoms located within 7 mountains.


Kingdoms, Nations, systems, etc... are not him cast alive into the lof.

Wrong. Nations are sometimes symbolized as living beasts. See Daniel 7.
 

strepho

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Nimrod of genesis had a one world structure. He was rebel leader. He died. He was pagan. Antichrist means instead of christ. Second thessalonians chapter 2, the son of perdition is satan, he comes 6th trump as antichrist. Revelation 9:5, its 5 month period. Satan will claim to be messiah. Many people will worship antichrist, revelation of 13. Thier will be one world religious system near future, led by satan as antichrist. Those who are biblically illiterate, will worship antichrist. Read ephesians chapter 6, you need gospel armour on. It's wisdom and knowledge of Gods word. Many people will end up in sheol, it's holding place for the spirtualty dead. Dont worship antichrist.