Jesus will not lose anyone

[Arnie Manitoba]

I want to point out a couple of things right from Jesus mouth regarding our salvation and security.

It is intended to give us confidence and encouragement as Christians .

I have underlined it below ......


35 Then Jesus declared, “I am the bread of life. Whoever comes to me will never go hungry, and whoever believes in me will never be thirsty. 36 But as I told you, you have seen me and still you do not believe. 37 All those the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never drive away. 38 For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. 39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day. 40 For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”



taken from John 6:35-40

 

[JB_Reformed Baptist]

I want to point out a couple of things right from Jesus mouth regarding our salvation and security.

It is intended to give us confidence and encouragement as Christians .

I have underlined it below ......


35 Then Jesus declared, “I am the bread of life. Whoever comes to me will never go hungry, and whoever believes in me will never be thirsty. 36 But as I told you, you have seen me and still you do not believe. 37 All those the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never drive away. 38 For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. 39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day. 40 For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”



taken from John 6:35-40

I want to point out a couple of things right from Jesus mouth regarding our salvation and security.

It is intended to give us confidence and encouragement as Christians .

I have underlined it below ......


35 Then Jesus declared, “I am the bread of life. Whoever comes to me will never go hungry, and whoever believes in me will never be thirsty. 36 But as I told you, you have seen me and still you do not believe. 37 All those the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never drive away. 38 For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. 39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day. 40 For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”



taken from John 6:35-40

Encouraging indeed to know our(saints) salvation wasn't a product of chance. Equally true is that God's ELECT are secure. Thank you LORD JESUS.

 

[Arnie Manitoba]

Where are all the people who have been making rules to keep us out of heaven ???

 

[aspen]

we were all predestined for Heaven until a serpent intervened. only Jesus can justify and sanctify us for Heaven, once more. No human was predestined for Hell.

 

[Episkopos]

The issue is not with salvation itself....all believers will be spared the wrath that will come on the world. It is the QUALITY of that salvation in regards to us. How can we compare ruling and reigning with Christ as His Bride with being spit out of His mouth to wander in nakedness and shame in darkness forever. Both are saved...but both did not please the Lord.

 

[KingJ]

Jesus will not lose anyone! Amen!

But before anyone clasps OSAS, remember we can lose Him. But, just like the story of the prodigal son, He will do everything in His power to chase after us.

 

[williemac]

The issue is not with salvation itself....all believers will be spared the wrath that will come on the world. It is the QUALITY of that salvation in regards to us. How can we compare ruling and reigning with Christ as His Bride with being spit out of His mouth to wander in nakedness and shame in darkness forever. Both are saved...but both did not please the Lord.

This is the opposite of the OP. The quality of salvation concerns the rewards given on the judgment seat of Christ. However, the location does not change. No saved nor unsaved will wander in nakedness and shame in darkness forever. Refer to John 6:50,51. Those who will not live forever will die. Those who die will not live forever. The words of Jesus.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

The issue is not with salvation itself....all believers will be spared the wrath that will come on the world. It is the QUALITY of that salvation in regards to us. How can we compare ruling and reigning with Christ as His Bride with being spit out of His mouth to wander in nakedness and shame in darkness forever. Both are saved...but both did not please the Lord.

What in GOD's name does this mean? Surely you are not suggesting that wandering in shame and darkness forever is salvation. Surely not.

 

[Episkopos]

This is the opposite of the OP. The quality of salvation concerns the rewards given on the judgment seat of Christ. However, the location does not change. No saved nor unsaved will wander in nakedness and shame in darkness forever. Refer to John 6:50,51. Those who will not live forever will die. Those who die will not live forever. The words of Jesus.

The verse says ANYONE may eat...and not die...it does not say anyone may eat and be forever in glory. Check your interpretation again against he whole bible.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

we were all predestined for Heaven until a serpent intervened. only Jesus can justify and sanctify us for Heaven, once more. No human was predestined for Hell.

This is an outstanding point.

 

[Episkopos]

What in GOD's name does this mean? Surely you are not suggesting that wandering in shame and darkness forever is salvation. Surely not.

Are you saying that someone who comes back from a war with his arms and legs blown off was killed in combat? read the bible as it is written not as you wish it to be.

To be saved means to be passed over from the judgment and wrath on the world. But there remains the judgment seat of Christ. Some will be honoured and receive a reward and some will have far less than they have even now.


We are continually responsible for our thoughts and deeds. we are not sleep-walking our way to glory. How we live matters very much.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Are you saying that someone who comes back from a war with his arms and legs blown off was killed in combat? read the bible as it is written not as you wish it to be.
To be saved means to be passed over from the judgment and wrath on the world. But there remains the judgment seat of Christ. Some will be honoured and receive a reward and some will have far less than they have even now.

Jesus makes whole; your analogy pertains only to the world. Your interpretation makes a mockery of salvation. Wandering in shame and darkness defines hell, not salvation. Any works of ours that are wood, hay and stubble will be consumed into nothing at the judgment seat of Christ. That includes you, and that includes me and everyone else here. The loss will be degree of glory, not glory itself.

Again, to state that someone who is saved "will have far less than they have even now" makes a complete mockery of GOD's salvation.

 

[KingJ]

we were all predestined for Heaven until a serpent intervened. only Jesus can justify and sanctify us for Heaven, once more. No human was predestined for Hell.

I disagree. We were all pre-destined for Earth. Some choose heaven, some don't. If the devil was to blame, he would be the only one paying the price for sin, surely.

Again, to state that someone who is saved "will have far less than they have even now" makes a complete mockery of GOD's salvation.

Amen!

To be saved means to be passed over from the judgment and wrath on the world. But there remains the judgment seat of Christ. Some will be honoured and receive a reward and some will have far less than they have even now.

We are continually responsible for our thoughts and deeds. we are not sleep-walking our way to glory. How we live matters very much.

Being saved is only guaranteed when we put on incorruption 1 Cor 15:53.

Heaven will be nice for everyone who makes it! Everyone gets a mansion made by Jesus in the captial city.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Being saved is only guaranteed when we put on incorruption 1 Cor 15:53.

Salvation is guaranteed by the blood of the lamb. Salvation is only actualized when we put on corruption.

The difference being that if we think salvation isn't guaranteed we will try to work to earn it. But if we know salvation is a guaranteed deposit we have already received, we will rest in confidence and seek to do that which preserves that deposit..

 

[KingJ]

Salvation is guaranteed by the blood of the lamb. Salvation is only actualized when we put on corruption.

The difference being that if we think salvation isn't guaranteed we will try to work to earn it. But if we know salvation is a guaranteed deposit we have already received, we will rest in confidence and seek to do that which preserves that deposit..

I can agree with that ^_^.

 

[Episkopos]

Jesus makes whole; your analogy pertains only to the world. Your interpretation makes a mockery of salvation. Wandering in shame and darkness defines hell, not salvation. Any works of ours that are wood, hay and stubble will be consumed into nothing at the judgment seat of Christ. That includes you, and that includes me and everyone else here. The loss will be degree of glory, not glory itself.

Again, to state that someone who is saved "will have far less than they have even now" makes a complete mockery of GOD's salvation.

My "interpretation" as you call it brings the reality that the bible is describing. Only a religious indoctrination causes one to ignore the many warnings contained in the bible so as to read only that which gratifies the itching ears.

Read the bible for yourself...

How do you interpret "Loss". Is loss a good thing????

1Co 3:12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
1Co 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
1Co 3:14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
1Co 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.


G2210
ζημιόω
zēmioō
dzay-mee-o'-o
From G2209; to injure, that is, (reflexively or passively) to experience detriment: - be cast away, receive damage, lose, suffer loss.


1Co 9:27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

How do you interpret being a castaway? Do you see this as glory?

Do verses that bring reality to the believer make a "mockery" of the bible? Or does it make a mockery of rose coloured human interpretations that can only read good feelings into it?

I disagree. We were all pre-destined for Earth. Some choose heaven, some don't. If the devil was to blame, he would be the only one paying the price for sin, surely.



Amen!



Being saved is only guaranteed when we put on incorruption 1 Cor 15:53.

Heaven will be nice for everyone who makes it! Everyone gets a mansion made by Jesus in the captial city.

...and have a pet tiger too! You are espousing a rosy picture that you have chosen to imagine. One can dream of a nice island getaway or eternal bliss in "heaven" or one can get real with what the bible actually says.

The abiding is for right now. Salvation is IN Christ...so IF we abide in Christ and live in Him then we shall inherit the promises that Jesus made to His FOLLOWERS. Fantasies aside...there is a miraculous walk in Christ right now. Living in Christ is akin to building with gold, silver and precious stones...we are then building with materials that have been tried in heaven. but most prefer the fantasy approach that claims great things while only doing what men can do...live from themselves and somehow try to bring God into it.

Salvation is guaranteed by the blood of the lamb. Salvation is only actualized when we put on corruption.

The difference being that if we think salvation isn't guaranteed we will try to work to earn it. But if we know salvation is a guaranteed deposit we have already received, we will rest in confidence and seek to do that which preserves that deposit..

You can put on corruption if you like!

There are no guarantees in life. God is not a used car salesman with money back guarantees. He does not reward smugness. He calls us to fear and to run. Have you read this?

Php_2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

 

[afaithfulone4u]

Saved to live again and chosen to rule and reign with Christ for the 1,000 yrs are two different things. No one knows who are the chosen with the exception of the 12 apostles in which I really do not say that the Lord chose Matthias and believe that Paul will be the 12th apostle. While they ask the Lord to let the lot fall on the TWO THEY had chosen to replace Judas it does not mean that his choice was Matthias for the lot had to fall at one of them for what goes up, must come down. But I personally do not believe it to say that Jesus chose Matthias or it would have said so.
Many believers say they love Jesus, but do you see all believers producing fruit worthy of ruling the earth? Please use some godly sense and recognize that this is just a tradition of man to think such a flawed understanding.

John 17:6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.
7 Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.
8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.
9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.
10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.
12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.
KJV
John 6:70
70 Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?
KJV
Mark 13:20
20 And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.
KJV
Matt 22:14
14 For many are called, but few are chosen.
KJV
Acts 9:15
15 But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:
KJV

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

My "interpretation" as you call it brings the reality that the bible is describing. Only a religious indoctrination causes one to ignore the many warnings contained in the bible so as to read only that which gratifies the itching ears.

Read the bible for yourself...

How do you interpret "Loss". Is loss a good thing????

1Co 3:12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
1Co 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
1Co 3:14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
1Co 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

G2210
ζημιόω
zēmioō
dzay-mee-o'-o
From G2209; to injure, that is, (reflexively or passively) to experience detriment: - be cast away, receive damage, lose, suffer loss.

1Co 9:27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

How do you interpret being a castaway? Do you see this as glory?

You are picking the definition of loss that suits your understanding's needs. The word loss can also mean incur damage, which is exactly what Jesus warned against in this parable:

​Now he told a parable to those who had been invited [when he] noticed how they were choosing for themselves the places of honor, saying to them, “When you are invited by someone to a wedding feast, do not recline at the table in the place of honor, lest [someone] more distinguished than you has been invited by him, and the one who invited you both will come [and] say to you, ‘Give the place to this person,’ and then with shame you will begin to take the last place. But when you are invited, go [and] recline at the table in the last place, so that when the one who invited you comes, he will say to you, ‘Friend, move up higher.’ Then it will be an honor to you in the presence of all those who are reclining at the table with you. Luke 14:7-10

The one who exalted himself was humbled and incurred loss of honor and reputation before all, but he was not cast away.

The word translated castaway in 1 Cor 9:27 is a different word altogether that means unapproved. Paul was expressing fear that having told others how to live he might violate his own teachings, and be ashamed before everyone when Jesus would disapprove of those works in his judgment.

Saved to live again and chosen to rule and reign with Christ for the 1,000 yrs are two different things...

No they're not. Some will be exalted to higher domains of dominion than others, but all who are saved will rule and reign over creation. And all will be resurrected at the same time.

 

[KingJ]

...and have a pet tiger too! You are espousing a rosy picture that you have chosen to imagine. One can dream of a nice island getaway or eternal bliss in "heaven" or one can get real with what the bible actually says.

The abiding is for right now. Salvation is IN Christ...so IF we abide in Christ and live in Him then we shall inherit the promises that Jesus made to His FOLLOWERS. Fantasies aside...there is a miraculous walk in Christ right now. Living in Christ is akin to building with gold, silver and precious stones...we are then building with materials that have been tried in heaven. but most prefer the fantasy approach that claims great things while only doing what men can do...live from themselves and somehow try to bring God into it.

What you are proposing is no better then someone trying to selfishly buy their way into heaven. Did you not grasp my example of the house-cleaner and the wife?

Tell me, once you have ''earned'' your right into a '''good'' heaven...will you be so kind as to ''donate'' your works / endeavours / achievements however you may see them to someone who does not deserve heaven? Please don't dodge this question. With your way of thinking, works is a measurable thing and therefore something that can be traded. Similar to Abraham trading a good / innocent son to please God.

So, Yes, you will be unselfish and give your good works to the guy that murdered your whole family or NO, you will be selfish and keep your works of abiding in Christ to pay your way into heaven?

 

[Episkopos]

You are picking the definition of loss that suits your understanding's needs. The word loss can also mean incur damage, which is exactly what Jesus warned against in this parable:

​Now he told a parable to those who had been invited [when he] noticed how they were choosing for themselves the places of honor, saying to them, “When you are invited by someone to a wedding feast, do not recline at the table in the place of honor, lest [someone] more distinguished than you has been invited by him, and the one who invited you both will come [and] say to you, ‘Give the place to this person,’ and then with shame you will begin to take the last place. But when you are invited, go [and] recline at the table in the last place, so that when the one who invited you comes, he will say to you, ‘Friend, move up higher.’ Then it will be an honor to you in the presence of all those who are reclining at the table with you. Luke 14:7-10

The one who exalted himself was humbled and incurred loss of honor and reputation before all, but he was not cast away.

The word translated castaway in 1 Cor 9:27 is a different word altogether that means unapproved. Paul was expressing fear that having told others how to live he might violate his own teachings, and be ashamed before everyone when Jesus would disapprove of those works in his judgment.


No they're not. Some will be exalted to higher domains of dominion than others, but all who are saved will rule and reign over creation. And all will be resurrected at the same time.

I leave you to your rosy interpretation that skirts the obvious. You seem unable to see what is plainly written as is always evident when trying to converse with an indoctrinated person.

What you are proposing is no better then someone trying to selfishly buy their way into heaven. Did you not grasp my example of the house-cleaner and the wife?

Tell me, once you have ''earned'' your right into a '''good'' heaven...will you be so kind as to ''donate'' your works / endeavours / achievements however you may see them to someone who does not deserve heaven? Please don't dodge this question. With your way of thinking, works is a measurable thing and therefore something that can be traded. Similar to Abraham trading a good / innocent son to please God.

So, Yes, you will be unselfish and give your good works to the guy that murdered your whole family or NO, you will be selfish and keep your works of abiding in Christ to pay your way into heaven?

Abide in Christ, without Him you can do nothing. And I'm not talking about indoctrination into a "happy place" through mass hypnosis.