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Featured Limited Atonement VS Universal Atonement

Discussion in 'Christian Theology Forum' started by Dave L, Sep 29, 2018.

  1. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    As long as you don't add the man-made fallacy of OSAS to that . . .
    Well, YOU are the one who was defending it . . .
     
  2. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    It is found in John 5:24 (kjv), John 6:47 (kjv), John 10:27-30 (kjv), Hebrews 13:5-6 (kjv), and in Matthew 28:20 (kjv)

    To me it is not an essential issue, however. I most certainly believe that if someone is baptized in Jesus' name, their salvation is absolutely assured. However, I believe also that salvation is absolutely assured to those who merely call upon the name of the Lord Jesus Christ of Nazareth for salvation. If you want power for ministry, you should definitely get baptized in Jesus' name: for the Holy Ghost is absolutely promised to those who do so: and this is not only the reality of salvation but of power for ministry.
     
  3. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    NONE of these verses supports the false, man-made invention of OSAS.
    EVERY one of them is contingent on our perseverance - one whether or not we REMAIN faithful.
    Jesus Himself said explicitly that we must be baptized in the TRINITARIAN formula - in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit (Matt. 28:19).

    And once again - the Bible does NOT guarantee salvation - UNLESS we REMAIN faithful to the end.
     
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2018
  4. Heb 13:8

    Heb 13:8 Well-Known Member

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    Well, no I mean, becoming born again is spiritual Bread. Again, H2O baptism is an outward revealing of faith that is already inward. It's to show your faith to your friends and family (like a respectful thing). Jesus already had the Holy Spirit in Him because He was God.
     
  5. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    It''s cooperation with God's grace - and it's MANDATORY (MARK 16:16, John 3:5).
    It's not simply an after thought . . .
     
  6. Heb 13:8

    Heb 13:8 Well-Known Member

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    and we cooperate out of thankfulness to the cross, not to save yourself
     
  7. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    No - our cooperation is an essential element of our faith.
    Without it, we have NO faith.(James 2:14-26).
     
  8. Heb 13:8

    Heb 13:8 Well-Known Member

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    to produce godly righteousness, not to save yourself.......

    and the definition of insanity is................... :rolleyes:
     
  9. Heb 13:8

    Heb 13:8 Well-Known Member

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    Contradiction?, or maybe.... youtube(dot)com/watch?v=O9PiAfb9PNM

    James 2:24 You see that a person is considered righteous by what they do and not by faith alone.

    Gal 2:16 know that a person is not justified by the works of the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law, because by the works of the law no one will be justified.
     
  10. mjrhealth

    mjrhealth Well-Known Member

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    Well than there is no hope for mankind.....
     
    amadeus and Nancy like this.
  11. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    If you say so...

    So Peter was being disobedient in Acts of the Apostles 2:38-39?
     
  12. Nancy

    Nancy Well-Known Member

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    I suppose BOL seems that we have to DO something to EARN our salvation...please. We need to BE not DO. The DOING flows FROM being. If ANYTHING one DOES, is NOT through the Spirit and from our hearts it is WORKS!!! And, we know how God feels about that.
    Yes indeed...no hope for mankind as, there is not a one who does not sin. Christians learn more and more to sin LESS and LESS but will not ever be sinless in these bodies...we fail, we fall, we get angry, we can have unkind thoughts, we can be selfish, we can be greedy, we can curse, lie, on and on and on...roll through a stop sign ever? Hmm, breaking the law and God says we are to follow the laws of this world. Gosh, there is so much more that is considered sin. And, if a Christian lives IN these things thinking that God just kind of "winks" at them (and-He doesn't) One might just have to question their sincerity in their proclaimed faith. A "Christian" who has no conscience in doing these things because they think that God's grace will give them a pass then IMHO-they are not a Christian. I know, it is not for me to judge! Only God knows the true intents of our hearts! Yet-do we not know them by their fruits? NOT works but, fruits.
    Now, to stick to the OP, lol - IMHO, God created humans for fellowship, not forced but...chosen, why would our Great Creator God The Father even HAVE to force/compel one, without giving them a choice to love Him for who He is? What kind of fellowship is that?? Robots.
     
  13. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    That' not what the Bible teaches, As I have repeatedly shown you, your opinions do not trump Scripture.

    What was that you said about insanity . . .
     
  14. Heb 13:8

    Heb 13:8 Well-Known Member

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    Watch.. youtube(dot)com/watch?v=O9PiAfb9PNM
     
  15. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    No - the Bible says so.
    Nope – He was telling them to be baptized in the name of Christ.
    NOWHERE did Peter tell them to be baptized ONLY in the name of Christ.

    YOU are disobeying JESUS – who is God.
    HE said to Baptized in the name of the FATHER and of the SON and of the HOLY SPIRIT (Matt. 28:19).

    THIS is the Baptism of Christ . . .
     
  16. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    "Works of the Law" refers to the MOSAIC LAW, Einstein.
    We cannot be saved by works of the Law.

    Our faith depends on our belief in God and our cooperation with His grace by completing works that HE prepared for us in ADVANCE.
     
  17. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    I'm not watching youtube videos.
    If you can't articulate your points here - don't waste my time . . .
     
  18. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    If you refuse to cooperate with God's grace - then you DON'T have a chance . . .
     
  19. Heb 13:8

    Heb 13:8 Well-Known Member

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    Contradiction?, it all about the crowd they speak to

    James 2:24 You see that a person is considered righteous by what they do and not by faith alone.

    Gal 2:16 know that a person is not justified by the works of the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law, because by the works of the law no one will be justified.
     
  20. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    Uhhhhh, no.

    Truth is not relative. It does NOT depend on the “crowd” they speak to.
    James and Paul are BOTH speaking the truth - from 2 different sides.

    Paul is talking about the inefficacy of works of the MOSAIC LAW for salvation.
    James is talking about the fact that works are PART of our faith as Christians.

    Scripture is NEVER at odds with itself – YOUR moral relativism aside . . .
     
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