Mary is all powerful!
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How can that be. She magnifies the Lord.
This is so she can show us her Son.
She is called blessed from generation to generation.
This means a tradition of honoring her for delivering the eternal Word of God.
Faith is through hearing. Hearing the Word of God.
That miracle began with the sound of Mary's voice.
No one can come to me unless the Father who sent
me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.
Only heaven could reveal the Virgin birth and Incarnation.
Praise honor veneration and devotion redound to the Glory of God who created Mary immaculate Lk 1:49 and Christ source of all grace! Jn 1:16-17
Praise, honor, veneration, and devotion are not worship, worship requires intent!
she was the first to be
New creation in Christ 2 cor 5:17
Passed from death to life 2 Tim 1:10
Out of the kingdom of darkness into the kingdom of light 1 pet 2:9
All sins washed away acts 22:16
Washed in Christ’s blood 1 pet 1:2
Member of Christ and His church
1 cor 12:13
Risen with Christ col 2:12
Sealed by God in the ark of salvation 1 pet 3:20-21
Sealed with the Holy Spirit eph 1:13
Jim B
Well-Known Member
I am a believer in the principle of sola scriptura, primarily because of the kind of nonsense that some denominations add to it. This glorification/deification of Mary is a prime example. Catholics clearly have a need to create a female deity so they manufacture a woman who is a virgin (as if that's important!), sinless, smarter than her son, and brings salvation to her people. The Biblical Mary was a teenage peasant who, by God's grace, was used by Him to give birth to a son and, along with Joseph, raised Him to become a carpenter (along with His siblings). Her parenting is hardly mentioned in Scripture, except that she lost track of Him for several days, was rebuffed by Him when she wanted to talk to Him, suggested that He make water into wine, and witnessed His crucifixion.
Everything beyond that is manufactured to satisfy a cultural need, as opposed to Biblical truth. If the Catholic church was more in tune with the Bible I would consider their doctrine, but unfortunately they would rather go along with their manufactured myths and strange rituals.
Everything beyond that is manufactured to satisfy a cultural need, as opposed to Biblical truth. If the Catholic church was more in tune with the Bible I would consider their doctrine, but unfortunately they would rather go along with their manufactured myths and strange rituals.
I've seen this somewhere before. It's the strawman!
Seriously, if you think i'm putting Jesus' mom up in His Dad's chair blame Jesus that's where He put her.oh and since you're looking for Him, we put Him up too high where you can't see.
You really don't understand the importance of the virgin birth? You shouldn't be posting.
Stop calling Jesus' Dad a user. He's not abusing Jesus' mother. I've been trying to show you all this stuff but you won't look . There is much to learn.
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Jesus thought it was too early to go to work but Dad said mom could pick the time. The wine! Can you imagine? Who knew He could do that?Not me. Nobody but her. You know mom's everything we know about their kids is what they tell us.
I see such fear for the big bad pagan man. My team beat the Pagans not to worry. Oh ye of little faith.
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Jim B
Well-Known Member
Sola Scriptura! The rest is man-made nonsense, including the content of your post.
Jesus put His mom in His Dad's chair? Blasphemy!
"we put Him up too high where you can't see" You didn't put Him anywhere. Blasphemy!
"Stop calling Jesus' Dad a user. He's not abusing Jesus' mother." I never said that. A lie and blasphemy!
"Dad said mom could pick the time" Blasphemy!
"My team beat the Pagans not to worry." Nonsense!
"Oh ye of false faith" Sola Scriptura!
Jim B
Well-Known Member
The bizarre image of Mary created by the Catholic denomination is as far from the truth of the Bible as one can get. The trinity is composed of 1) the Father, 2) the Son, and 3) the Holy Spirit. Period. Nobody else, including Mary, is part of the Godhead.
It is the epitome of blasphemy to consider Mary to be divine. She was a teenager chosen by God to give birth to Jesus and to raise Him. IMHO she did a so-so job of raising Him. What kind of mother loses track of her child for days???
Luke 2:41-46, "Every year Jesus’ parents went to Jerusalem for the Festival of the Passover. When he was twelve years old, they went up to the festival, according to the custom. After the festival was over, while his parents were returning home, the boy Jesus stayed behind in Jerusalem, but they were unaware of it. Thinking he was in their company, they traveled on for a day. Then they began looking for him among their relatives and friends. When they did not find him, they went back to Jerusalem to look for him. After three days they found him in the temple courts, sitting among the teachers, listening to them and asking them questions." Mary and Joseph -- His parents -- left Him behind in a big city and were didn't know where their child was for three days. This is the epitome of irresponsible parenting!
Here is what the Bible says about who is Jesus' mother (according to Him!) "While Jesus was still talking to the crowd, his mother and brothers(!) stood outside, wanting to speak to him. Someone told him, “Your mother and brothers are standing outside, wanting to speak to you.”
He replied to him, “Who is my mother, and who are my brothers?” Pointing to his disciples, he said, “Here are my mother and my brothers. For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother.” Matthew 12:46-50
If Mary was the person that Catholics claim why didn't Jesus say "she is the woman waiting outside to speak to me"? Clearly, Jesus didn't regard Mary as His true mother once He began His ministry.
I repeat, the bizarre image of Mary created by the Catholic denomination is as far from the truth of the Bible as one can get.
Sola scriptura.
It is the epitome of blasphemy to consider Mary to be divine. She was a teenager chosen by God to give birth to Jesus and to raise Him. IMHO she did a so-so job of raising Him. What kind of mother loses track of her child for days???
Luke 2:41-46, "Every year Jesus’ parents went to Jerusalem for the Festival of the Passover. When he was twelve years old, they went up to the festival, according to the custom. After the festival was over, while his parents were returning home, the boy Jesus stayed behind in Jerusalem, but they were unaware of it. Thinking he was in their company, they traveled on for a day. Then they began looking for him among their relatives and friends. When they did not find him, they went back to Jerusalem to look for him. After three days they found him in the temple courts, sitting among the teachers, listening to them and asking them questions." Mary and Joseph -- His parents -- left Him behind in a big city and were didn't know where their child was for three days. This is the epitome of irresponsible parenting!
Here is what the Bible says about who is Jesus' mother (according to Him!) "While Jesus was still talking to the crowd, his mother and brothers(!) stood outside, wanting to speak to him. Someone told him, “Your mother and brothers are standing outside, wanting to speak to you.”
He replied to him, “Who is my mother, and who are my brothers?” Pointing to his disciples, he said, “Here are my mother and my brothers. For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother.” Matthew 12:46-50
If Mary was the person that Catholics claim why didn't Jesus say "she is the woman waiting outside to speak to me"? Clearly, Jesus didn't regard Mary as His true mother once He began His ministry.
I repeat, the bizarre image of Mary created by the Catholic denomination is as far from the truth of the Bible as one can get.
Sola scriptura.
This is old school anti-catholic stuff. Why not think for yourself and find out what the Catholic Church really teaches? This is just parroting what others have imagined.
The church described in your post doesn't exist. Any 5th grader could argue and feel like a sage if that was a real church.. That's what it's for though. To keep people feeling they're wise while keeping them ignorant.
Enjoy the bash Jim
then why don’t you believe the scripture and submit and obey?
Lk 10:16
He who hears you hears me...
John 13:20
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.
Jesus Christ extends his mission, power, and authority to His church of His apostles!
Even His judging!
Matt 19:28
His teaching authority!
Matt 28:19 and Jn 20:21
His power to forgive sins!
Jn 20:23
His being the light of the world!
Matt 5:14
His ministry of reconciliation!
2 cor 5:18
His authority in governing the church and administering the kingdom!
Matt 16:18-19 & 18:18 Jn 21:17
Lk 22:29
Apart from me you can do nothing. Jn 15:5
So the church is subject to Christ!
Eph 5:24
Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Matt 18:17 Acts 1:17 acts 8:31 & 35 acts 9:4 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20 acts 2:42 1 Tim 3:15
Fundamentalism drives a wedge between Christ and his church, separates Christ from His kingdom, and the authority of Christ from the new covenant!
1 Corinthians 16:22
If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema
Extends to the truth and the church
Cos Christ is the truth and His church teaches the truth without error! Jn 14:6 matt 28:19 matt 18:17 1 Tim 3:15 Jn 29:21-23 Jn 16:13
Christ and His church are one! Acts 9:4 eph 5:32
Authority of the Apostles!
What authority does Christ have?
What power does Christ have?
What mission / ministry does Christ have?
Peter, the apostles and their successors have the same authority, power, and mission! Jn 20:21 as my father sent me, even so send I you!
John 17:18
As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.
The apostles are Christ’s successors!
They have authority to send others as well, apostle means one who is sent!
Therefore the apostles have authority to send more apostles or successors!
Apostolic succession!
The nations still need to be taught, disciples still need to be baptized and the church the new covenant kingdom of christ still needs to be governed!
Hebrews 3:1
Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus;
Christ is an apostle, and has authority to send other apostles, the apostles also have this authority, so the apostles continue down thru the centuries as Christ promised! Matt 28:19-20
Keys of authority! And power to bind and loose! Matt 16:18 and Matt 18:18 matt 28:19 Isa 22:21-22
Moral authority:
(Teaching)
Necessity of being taught by Christ:
Two edge sword: defining truth and condemning errors, and Interpreting scripture.
Jurisdictional authority:
(Governing / administering)
Necessity of Peter and the apostles and their successors to govern the holy church.
Spiritual authority:
(Life of Grace)
Sanctifying thru the mass and Sacraments
The apostles teaching is Christ’s teaching, Christ and His church are one! Acts 9:4
Christian rule of faith is not the Bible alone! But the doctrine of the apostles! Acts 2:42
Spiritual Fathers (apostles) have care for our souls!
Acts 20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.
Jn 21:17 feed my sheep:
Heb 13:7 Remember them which have the rule over you, who have spoken unto you the word of God: whose faith follow, considering the end of their conversation.
Heb 13:17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they care for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.
1 Tim 1:2 Unto Timothy, my own son in the faith: Grace, mercy, and peace, from God our Father and Jesus Christ our Lord.
Gal 4:19 My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you
1 John 2
My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not.
That makes Paul and John spiritual fathers, pastors of our souls!
Jim B
Well-Known Member
I obey the Lord, not your personal, flawed interpretation of the Bible.
Ephesians 6:7, "Obey with enthusiasm, as though serving the Lord and not people"
Romans 14:4, "Who are you to pass judgment on another’s servant? Before his own master he stands or falls. And he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand.
If I wasn't polite I would reply in a stronger manner.
Jim B
Well-Known Member
Mary gave birth to Jesus and His siblings. After giving birth to multiple children, the idea that she was a virgin is ludicrous. It's beyond belief that the Catholic church keeps spouting the idea of a "perpetual" virgin.
Jim B
Well-Known Member
"While Jesus was still speaking to the crowds, his mother and brothers came and stood outside, asking to speak to him. Someone told him, “Look, your mother and your brothers are standing outside wanting to speak to you.” Matthew 12:46-47
"Isn’t this the carpenter’s son? Isn’t his mother named Mary? And aren’t his brothers James, Joseph, Simon, and Judas?" Matthew 13:55
"So Jesus’ brothers advised him, “Leave here and go to Judea so your disciples may see your miracles that you are performing. For no one who seeks to make a reputation for himself does anything in secret. If you are doing these things, show yourself to the world.” (For not even his own brothers believed in him.)" John 7:3-5
"But when his brothers had gone up to the feast, then Jesus himself also went up, not openly but in secret." John 7:10
"All these continued together in prayer with one mind, together with the women, along with Mary the mother of Jesus, and his brothers." Acts 1:14
When will this myth of no siblings be put to rest? Perhaps when the RCC accepts Scripture?
Sola scriptura!
Christ commands us to obey and to submit to men!!!
men have the jurisdictional authority to govern the flock
Jurisdictional authority of Christ in his apostles or spiritual anarchy!
take your pick
There is a big difference between the people, the laity, the nations and the priesthood, the apostles!
Matthew 22:14
For many are called, but few are chosen.
Matt 13:11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
Jn 20:21 as the father sent me, I send you. And Jn 17:18 I send you!
(The apostles with the same mission, power, and authority)
The apostles received the kingdom.
Lk 22:29
The apostles administer the kingdom. Matt 16:18-19 & 18:18
The apostles govern the church.
Matt 28:19-20
The apostles hold office.
Acts 1:15-20
The apostles have authority to forgive sins. Jn 20:23
Apostles are the light of the world!
The church is an extension of Christ in time and space. Matt 5:14
The apostles are Christ’s successors!
They have authority to send others as well, apostle means one who is sent!
Therefore the apostles have authority to send more apostles or successors!
Apostolic succession!
The nations still need to be taught, disciples still need to be baptized and the church the new covenant kingdom of christ still needs to be governed!
Three fold ministry,
Teaching:
Sanctification:
Governing:
Keys of authority! And power to bind and loose! Matt 16:18 and Matt 18:18 matt 28:19 Isa 22:21-22
Moral authority:
(Teaching)
Necessity of being taught by Christ:
Two edge sword: defining truth and condemning errors, and Interpreting scripture.
Jurisdictional authority:
(Governing / administering)
Necessity of Peter and the apostles and their successors to govern the holy church.
Spiritual authority:
(Life of Grace)
Sanctifying thru the mass and Sacraments
God established order and peace and knowledge of truth in a hierarchical authority of Peter and the apostles!
There is a hierarchical authority in all that God has ordained!
The angelic kingdom!
The civil kingdom!
The church kingdom!
The family!
All are ordered with hierarchical and jurisdictional authority!
Jim B
Well-Known Member
What is it about I obey the Lord, not your personal, flawed interpretation of the Bible that you don't/can't/won't understand.
True.
Incorrect. Jesus was the only child born of Mary.
The others were born to Joseph before his marriage to Mary. Numerous scriptures bear that out when studied carefully.
Perpetual virginity is heresy and just plain stupid. Yet though she was to have relations with Joseph in her married life, her womb was forever withheld from any other children after giving birth to Jesus.
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