Mary the Queen of Heaven?

[BreadOfLife]

Peter is Greek "Petros" (a stone or boulder); rock, in this verse, is Greek "Petra" (massive bedrock or a cliff). The Rock is the Lord Jesus Christ and it is upon HIMSELF that he builds his assembly.

I'm REALLY clad you brought this up.
Time for a Bible Lesson . . .

The problem with your Greek argument is that Jesus and the Apostles didn’t speak Greek. They he spoke Aramaic. The Aramaic word for “Stone” – small OR large, is “Kepha(s).” There is NO other word in Aramaic for stone . . .

What Jesus actually said was, “And so I say to you, you are KEPHA, and upon this KEPHA I will build my church, and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it.”
This is why Peter is referred to as Cephas in many of Paul’s letters, because Cephas is the closest Greek transliteration of the Aramaic, Kepha.

There is another problem for you anti-Catholics . . .
Petra is a feminine Greek noun and could HARDLY be used to describe a man, so the word was translated as Petros in the Greek Scriptures because it was being used in reference to a man. Jesus clearly appointed Peter as earthly head of the Church and Chief Apostle here in Matthew’s Gospel as well as Luke 22:31-32, where He told Peter that he prayed for him (ALONE) to strengthen the other Apostles in his absence. And in John 21:15-19, where he told Peter 3 times to feed his sheep and tend His flock.

If Peter wasn't in charge, then -
a. Tell me WHY Jesus singled out Peter when He gave him the Keys to the Kingdom of Heaven (Matt. 16:18-19) if did not put him in charge.

b. Tell me WHY Jesus asked Peter and Peter alone to feed His lambs and tend His sheep (John 21:15-19) if did not put him in charge.

c. Tell me WHY Jesus said that He prayed for Peter ALONE to strengthen the others and bring them back to faith (Luke 22:31-32) if did NOT put him in charge.

d. Tell me WHY Peter called "Protos" (First) in the Gospel (Matt. 10:2) if he was not in charge nor even the first chosen by Jesus??

e. Tell me WHY Peter's name occurs first in all lists of apostles - even though he was NOT the first chosen (Matt. 10:2; Mk 3:16; Luke 6:14; Acts 1:13), if he was not in charge??

f. Tell me WHY Peter is specified by an angel as the leader and representative of the apostles (Mark 16:7) if he was not in charge??

g. Tell me WHY Peter takes the lead in calling for a successor for Judas (Acts 1:22) if He was not in charge??

h. Tell me WHY Peter is the first person to speak (and only one recorded) after Pentecost, making him the first Christian to preach the Gospel in the Church (Acts 2:14-36) if he was not in charge??

i. Tell me WHY Peter works the first miracle of the Church Age, healing a lame man (Acts 3:6-12) if he was not in charge??

j. Tell me WHY Peter utters the first anathema (Ananias and Sapphira) affirmed by God (Acts 5:2-11) if He was not in charge??

k. Tell me WHY Peter is the first person after Christ to raise the dead (Acts 9:40) if he was not in charge??

l. Tell me WHY Cornelius is told by an angel to seek out Peter for instruction in Christianity (Acts 10:1-6) if he was not in charge??

m. Tell me WHY Peter's name is mentioned MORE often than ALL the other disciples combined if He was not in charge??

The assembly universal is comprised of all those who have genuine faith in the Lord Jesus Christ. It has no headquarters; and its head is the Lord Jesus Christ,

Yup. What it is NOT made up of are untold Millions of people who have faith in Him - but have decided to pick and choose which doctrines they will adhere to, like a BUFFET . . .

Faith is NOT simply “believing” in Christ.
Even the DEMONS believe (James 2:!7) . . .

ot a blasphemously titled "pope"!

"Pope" is simpoly a term of endearment - NOT an official TITLE of the Bishop of Rome.

It's probably best if you take some time off of this forum and do a little HIMEWORK to avoid further embarrassmsnt . . .

 

[David1701]

I'm REALLY clad you brought this up.
Time for a Bible Lesson . . .

The problem with your Greek argument is that Jesus and the Apostles didn’t speak Greek. They he spoke Aramaic. The Aramaic word for “Stone” – small OR large, is “Kepha(s).” There is NO other word in Aramaic for stone . . .

What Jesus actually said was, “And so I say to you, you are KEPHA, and upon this KEPHA I will build my church, and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it.”
This is why Peter is referred to as Cephas in many of Paul’s letters, because Cephas is the closest Greek transliteration of the Aramaic, Kepha.

There is another problem for you anti-Catholics . . .
Petra is a feminine Greek noun and could HARDLY be used to describe a man, so the word was translated as Petros in the Greek Scriptures because it was being used in reference to a man. Jesus clearly appointed Peter as earthly head of the Church and Chief Apostle here in Matthew’s Gospel as well as Luke 22:31-32, where He told Peter that he prayed for him (ALONE) to strengthen the other Apostles in his absence. And in John 21:15-19, where he told Peter 3 times to feed his sheep and tend His flock.

If Peter wasn't in charge, then -
a. Tell me WHY Jesus singled out Peter when He gave him the Keys to the Kingdom of Heaven (Matt. 16:18-19) if did not put him in charge.

b. Tell me WHY Jesus asked Peter and Peter alone to feed His lambs and tend His sheep (John 21:15-19) if did not put him in charge.

c. Tell me WHY Jesus said that He prayed for Peter ALONE to strengthen the others and bring them back to faith (Luke 22:31-32) if did NOT put him in charge.

d. Tell me WHY Peter called "Protos" (First) in the Gospel (Matt. 10:2) if he was not in charge nor even the first chosen by Jesus??

e. Tell me WHY Peter's name occurs first in all lists of apostles - even though he was NOT the first chosen (Matt. 10:2; Mk 3:16; Luke 6:14; Acts 1:13), if he was not in charge??

f. Tell me WHY Peter is specified by an angel as the leader and representative of the apostles (Mark 16:7) if he was not in charge??

g. Tell me WHY Peter takes the lead in calling for a successor for Judas (Acts 1:22) if He was not in charge??

h. Tell me WHY Peter is the first person to speak (and only one recorded) after Pentecost, making him the first Christian to preach the Gospel in the Church (Acts 2:14-36) if he was not in charge??

i. Tell me WHY Peter works the first miracle of the Church Age, healing a lame man (Acts 3:6-12) if he was not in charge??

j. Tell me WHY Peter utters the first anathema (Ananias and Sapphira) affirmed by God (Acts 5:2-11) if He was not in charge??

k. Tell me WHY Peter is the first person after Christ to raise the dead (Acts 9:40) if he was not in charge??

l. Tell me WHY Cornelius is told by an angel to seek out Peter for instruction in Christianity (Acts 10:1-6) if he was not in charge??

m. Tell me WHY Peter's name is mentioned MORE often than ALL the other disciples combined if He was not in charge??


Yup. What it is NOT made up of are untold Millions of people who have faith in Him - but have decided to pick and choose which doctrines they will adhere to, like a BUFFET . . .

Faith is NOT simply “believing” in Christ.
Even the DEMONS believe (James 2:!7) . . .

"Pope" is simpoly a term of endearment - NOT an official TITLE of the Bishop of Rome.

It's probably best if you take some time off of this forum and do a little HIMEWORK to avoid further embarrassmsnt . . .

Pro. 16:18 (MKJV) Pride goes before destruction, and a haughty spirit before a fall.

 

[sondring7]

Did your abomination told you Jesus failed to build his church?

Jesus said in Matthew 16:18, And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it.

Is that the "Body of Christ" church that only Paul mentions ?

 

[Fathom]

Peter is Greek "Petros" (a stone or boulder); rock, in this verse, is Greek "Petra" (massive bedrock or a cliff). The Rock is the Lord Jesus Christ and it is upon HIMSELF that he builds his assembly.

The assembly universal is comprised of all those who have genuine faith in the Lord Jesus Christ. It has no headquarters; and its head is the Lord Jesus Christ, not a blasphemously titled "pope"!

Did the Gospel drop from the sky?

 

[Fathom]

JESUS Says: “Assuredly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they may utter; but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is subject to eternal condemnation”— because they said, “He has an unclean spirit.”

all senseless and gibberish prayers; are blaspheme against the Holy Spirit.

 

[Fathom]

You are once more making assertions that cannot be supported by Scripture. You say that because Paul wrote "as also saith the law" in 1 Corinthians 14:34, this somehow supports your teaching about Jesus judging men and Mary judging women.

But in which place does Paul say that?

Look at the passage. When Paul is speaking about the behaviour of members of the churches, he makes no reference to Mary judging women, or to Jesus judging only men, nor does he speak of Jesus having both male and female aspects.

It is not possible to convert a section dealing with order in the church into a doctrine concerning who judges mankind.

You are now saying that the Father cannot judge His own creation since that would amount to judging Himself.

Well, WHERE DOES THE SCRIPTURES SAY THAT?

Romans 2:16 says, "In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel."

The Father is spoken of in 1 Peter 1:17 as judging each person according to their own work without showing any partiality.

It is certainly within the Father's authority to pass judgment. As Scripture states in John 5:22, all judgment has been entrusted to the Son. That is exactly what the Bible says. Your argument that God cannot judge His own creation is one that you have invented.

You also state that Jesus founded a church, not a book; of course He did build His church! Nobody is denying what Matthew 16:18 says.

He also said, "Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.”" (John 17:17).

As Paul states, "All scripture was given by the inspiration of God and is of benefit for teaching, for reproof, for correction and for instruction in righteousness" (2 Timothy 3:16).

Are you then saying that since Christ founded His church we should accept everything that religious leaders teach, even though their doctrines are not to be found in God's Word?

Jesus points out that very situation in Mark 7:7 by saying, "They worship me in vain, for they teach human commandments as if they were divine doctrines."

You are accusing me of condemning the Catholic Church and of positioning myself as a great teacher; yet I have never said that I was a great teacher, and all I am asking is that you prove your doctrines on the basis of Scripture.

I do not mind where a teaching comes from—whether it is from Catholics, Protestants, or anyone else—if it goes against the Word of God then it is wrong.

You mention the Sacrament of Penance now, but that still doesn't explain why you required me to say a Hail Mary before you would give me Scripture.

The Bible in First Timothy 2:5 states that "There is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus."

What does the Scripture say that Christians should pray to Mary? And where does it grant Mary the authority to judge women?

Those are the questions I've been asking, and you have still not answered them.

Mary was considered to be blessed compared with other women, and the Scriptures certainly regard her as the mother of Jesus; but the fact that she has been blessed by God does not make her a judge of men or a mediator between God and mankind.

I have no intention of defending one denomination or launching an attack against another; what I am interested in is exactly what God has actually said.

If the teachings referred to are based on the Bible, then prove from the Bible where they are taught. It does not suffice simply to quote passages that have nothing to do with the matter and to appeal to the authority of the Church.

I demonstrate why Mary is essential, and I use that identical logic to claim your god is an abomination.

I’m not here to teach or guide you; I’m here to defend the Catholic Church, using the works of the early Church Fathers. If you want a deeper understanding, go read what the early Church Fathers wrote.

 

[sondring7]

Did the Gospel drop from the sky?

The 1 Cor 15:1-4, Eph 1:13 Gospel came from Christ Gal 1:11-12 via Paul

 

[sondring7]

I demonstrate why Mary is essential, and I use that identical logic to claim your god is an abomination.

I’m not here to teach or guide you; I’m here to defend the Catholic Church, using the works of the early Church Fathers. If you want a deeper understanding, go read what the early Church Fathers wrote.

+++++I’m here to defend the Catholic Church
List the verses that CONFIRM and CLEARLY teach that Mary NEVER had sex with Joseph

 

[David in NJ]

all senseless and gibberish prayers; are blaspheme against the Holy Spirit.

This is now your second time accusing the Holy Spirit of evil.

For with stammering lips/gibberish and another tongue
He will speak to this people,
To whom He said, “This is the rest with which
You may cause the weary to rest,”
And, “This is the refreshing”;
Yet they would not hear.

 

[David1701]

Did the Gospel drop from the sky?

The gospel was first declared in Gen. 3:15. It has since been declared, in various ways, throughout the O.T.; then, in clearer form, it was declared by the Lord Jesus Christ and his earliest disciples.

We now have the God-breathed, inerrant and sufficient declaration of the gospel, in the Holy Bible.

 

[David in NJ]

Did the Gospel drop from the sky?

YES

When was the last time you read the Bible?

 

[BreadOfLife]

Pro. 16:18 (MKJV) Pride goes before destruction, and a haughty spirit before a fall.

And, as I told you, in a previous post . . .
"Great verse – but completely irrelevant to the evidence presented . . ."
Ummm, maybe you should try a different verse when you don't have a valid response . . .

 

[Grailhunter]

If you want to believe in tongues, that is fine.
If you do not want to believe in tongues, that is fine.
It is not a salvation thing, but insulting the Holy Spirit is a serious thing.
Unforgivable.
I worship with several different denominations.
Theologians generally do not indorse a particular denomination, most have errors even though they may be wonderful. But as I say, my favorites are Holy Ghost churches, not that they are perfect either. But it is where I have seen the most miracles and the presence of God. I have never spoke in tongues, but I have seen a lot of it, and the miracles associated with them.

A lot of the people that do not believe in tongues are successionist, as in they do not believe modern miracles. A lot of them are arm chair Christians that do not go to or support a church. The miracles of Christianity are a blessing for those that believe.

 

[David1701]

And, as I told you, in a previous post . . .
"Great verse – but completely irrelevant to the evidence presented . . ."
Ummm, maybe you should try a different verse when you don't have a valid response . . .

I could have replied to the great majority of your claims, off the top of my head; but, when I prayed for wisdom, the Lord instead led me to address the underlying reason why this would be a waste of time. Without humility and openness to the truth, I would just be casting pearls before swine.