Not a sinner.

[Prayer Warrior]

Great points.

And then we have sola scripture:
Only the scriptures should be the authority.

And then we have solo scripture:
Some sit at home and interpret scripture their very own way.

I like that—sola v. solo.

Of course, the Holy Spirit gives us understanding. Some of the best understanding of scriptures has been given to me while I’m doing housework or taking a shower, lol.

 

[Giuliano]

What does it mean that Jesus isn't going to pay for such sins?

Jesus paid for ALL THE SINS of everyone in the world from beginning to end.

1 John 2:2
2and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world.

We have free will and can reject that deal.

The context is informative too:

1 John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.

 

[mjrhealth]

And then we have sola scripture:
Only the scriptures should be the authority.

And then we have solo scripture:
Some sit at home and interpret scripture their very own way.

Actually we have His Spirit and since we have the Spirit of God like God He is teh final authority because they all agree as one.

[MKJV] John 14:26
But the Comforter, the Holy Spirit whom the Father will send in My name, He shall teach you all things and bring all things to your remembrance, whatever I have said to you.

[MKJV] I John 2:27
But the anointing which youreceived from Him abides in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as His anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true and no lie, and as He hastaught you, abide in Him.

 

[justbyfaith]

Cos a person isn't sinless if he commits sins.

No one is sinless; while it is possible to cease from committing sins.

Well yes that is true but the problem is that there are different interpretations of scripture.

Pro 1:6, To understand a proverb, and the interpretation; the words of the wise, and their dark sayings.

Maybe it is possible to become sinless.

No, not possible. We all have indwelling sin. While it is possible to cease from sinning (repent).

YEs they keep demanding that God agree with the bible and not the bible with God I get it.

God will never contradict what He has said in His word; for He has magnified His word above all his name (Psalms 138:2).

Some sit at home and interpret scripture their very own way.

There is only one interpretation to any scripture, Proverbs 1:6 (kjv). While perhaps there is more than one application.

Also, we can compare scripture with scripture to come to a biblical conclusion about something (1 Corinthians 2:13 (kjv)).

 

[GodsGrace]

I like that—sola v. solo.

Of course, the Holy Spirit gives us understanding. Some of the best understanding of scriptures has been given to me while I’m doing housework or taking a shower, lol.

Ditto for me.

But understanding scripture is different from interpreting it.
Sometimes we understand a verse right away.
Sometimes we don't get it.
But that doesn't give us the right to interpret it however we wish it to be....
We wait for a while....but sometimes a commentary is necessary.
I had to use one for the scripture where Jesus spoke about throwing crumbs to the dogs!!!!
Wha?????
But I just instinctively knew it couldn't be bad....
But who knew anything about the Samaritans back then??

 

[GodsGrace]

We have free will and can reject that deal.

The context is informative too:

1 John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.

Right.
Thanks for adding to my post.

 

[mjrhealth]

God will never contradict what He has said in His word; for He has magnified His word above all his name (Psalms 138:2).

Yes God will never contradict what He said, so therefore if the bible is Gods word should it not agree with Him????. It doesnt say it made the "bible" greater than God, but I suppose it gives some an assumed authority that they do not have,

 

[GodsGrace]

Actually we have His Spirit and since we have the Spirit of God like God He is teh final authority because they all agree as one.

[MKJV] John 14:26
But the Comforter, the Holy Spirit whom the Father will send in My name, He shall teach you all things and bring all things to your remembrance, whatever I have said to you.

[MKJV] I John 2:27
But the anointing which youreceived from Him abides in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as His anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true and no lie, and as He hastaught you, abide in Him.

In John 14:26 Jesus was speaking to the Apostles.
He also gave them the Great Commission in
Matthew 28:19-20
19“Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,
20teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.”

When Jesus set up His church, He meant for elders to teach the others.
What else could have been the reason for His teaching the Apostles and giving them
this commission? It was so that others could learn from them....and so on.
Think of the telephone game....we'd be in a mess by now!

In 1 John 2:27 read just a few verses before:
There were already false teachers at this time...the gnostics.
John is saying to let what the Christians have HEARD FROM THE BEGINNING abide in them.
They were taught what to believe and they were to hold on to that.
In verse 27, which you posted, John is telling the Christians that the Holy Spirit will help them to know the truth regarding Jesus being the Son of God (verse 22).

It's good to learn in an organized way...this is what Jesus meant for us to do.

 

[GodsGrace]

There is only one interpretation to any scripture, Proverbs 1:6 (kjv). While perhaps there is more than one application.

Also, we can compare scripture with scripture to come to a biblical conclusion about something (1 Corinthians 2:13 (kjv)).

Can't there legitimately be two?

Check out John 3:5
5Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

I always believed WATER meant natural child birth.
Now I'm not so sure --- many scholars believe it means baptism.

Can't both be proven to be correct? Can we choose? There are verses that support each.
Must log off now....tomorrow.

 

[mjrhealth]

What else could have been the reason for His teaching the Apostles and giving them
this commission? It was so that others could learn from them....and so on.

Yes we see what that did dont we.

Luk 22:24 And there was also a strife among them, which of them should be accounted the greatest.
Luk 22:25 And he said unto them, The kings of the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and they that exercise authority upon them are called benefactors.
Luk 22:26 But ye shall not be so: but he that is greatest among you, let him be as the younger; and he that is chief, as he that doth serve.

1Jn_2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

As Paul put it

Gal_1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

But thats for an on going saga of men leaving God out of everything.

This is about Sin and @Truther pretty much nailed that one

 

[Waiting on him]

Cos a person isn't sinless if he commits sins.
We usually think of actions when we think of sin. But some feelings and thoughts that are sins too



Hmm very true, subjective interpretation is something that I see a lot. That's one good thing about Catholicism
We can rarely make that mistake, most of scripture is interpreted by people who are closer to God, the ordained



Well yes that is true but the problem is that there are different interpretations of scripture.

People are at risk when interpreting scripture themselves.
When the bible isn't conclusive about something its then all too easy to make up the rest to suit.
Or when it appears to contradict itself like with the verses i cited above, it's all to easy to make a subjective choice.

I don't claim to know the truth or that the RCC is always true.
I only first heard of this sinless concept 6 months ago and since then i've heard it more and thought about it more...

Maybe it is possible to become sinless.
The apostles that wrote books in the NT rarely speak about dealing with sin apart from Paul.
He talks about it a lot. So i thought to myself why.

Well, the apostles were always with Christ and never left him... Paul was never with Christ, furthermore, Paul persecuted the followers of Christ thus persecuting Christ himself. I was also away from Christ, i had rejected and persecuted God in my heart...

I think this might be the reason why i really feel Paul's struggle with sin.
I understand his spiritual warfare, a topic that isn't spoken about much.
See when I was away from God i disregarded what the Holy Spirit was saying and would act on that other instinct, that other voice.
The problem is that other voice was of the evil one. It is the evil one that controlled us for all that time we rejected God.

When we finally find God and can hear the Holy Spirit we find that Satan built a home within us, a home with deep foundations.
This is what Paul means when he says that evil is always with him. This is what Paul is talking about when he says he is a slave to sinful temptations and all his other struggles with sin.

This is the thorn in the flesh that Paul talks about when he prays to God 3 times to remove it. It's kind of like a punishment, it's the cross that we are made to bare as we follow Christ.

Now, for some people that were always with Christ it might be different.
But I think time away from God might be the reason why me, Paul and many other people know this battle against sin...

Anywayz God Bless

The thorn in Paul's flesh was judaizers in the church at Corynth.

 

[GodsGrace]

Yes we see what that did dont we.

Luk 22:24 And there was also a strife among them, which of them should be accounted the greatest.
Luk 22:25 And he said unto them, The kings of the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and they that exercise authority upon them are called benefactors.
Luk 22:26 But ye shall not be so: but he that is greatest among you, let him be as the younger; and he that is chief, as he that doth serve.

1Jn_2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

As Paul put it

Gal_1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

But thats for an on going saga of men leaving God out of everything.

This is about Sin and @Truther pretty much nailed that one

Please see my post no. 173 re 1 John 2:27

Galatians 1:12 --- Yes,,, Paul received it straight from Christ. But we haven't seen Christ.

What did Truther say?
Will check it out tomorrow.

I'm not saying we shouldn't depend on the Holy Spirit....
just that what we hear has to be biblical.
Acts 17:10-11
10The brethren immediately sent Paul and Silas away by night to Berea, and when they arrived, they went into the synagogue of the Jews.
11Now these were more noble-minded than those in Thessalonica, for they received the word with great eagerness, examining the Scriptures daily to see whether these things were so

 

[mjrhealth]

But we haven't seen Christ.

Than you are missing out.

 

[Cristo Rei]

No one is sinless; while it is possible to cease from committing sins.

Well that's what i mean then

 

[quietthinker]

The order of Melchizedec is simply a priestly order other than the priesthood of Levi that Jesus was a part of; because He was not of the tribe of Levi but of Judah (Hebrews 7:13-14). It also has to do with, not a carnal commandment but the power of an endless life (Hebrews 7:16). And, because there was a change in priesthood there was also a change in the law (Hebrews 7:12) from the letter to the spirit (Romans 7:6).

You haven't answered the question jbf.....you've just repeated.
My guess is, you don't have a clue but have thrown in the quote re Melchizedec to appear informed.

 

[Cristo Rei]

The thorn in Paul's flesh was judaizers in the church at Corynth.

Paul doesn't say anything about that is the passage im referring to or in it's context

Therefore, in order to keep me from becoming conceited, I was given a thorn in my flesh, a messenger of Satan, to torment me. Three times I pleaded with the Lord to take it away from me. But he said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.” 2 Corinthians 12:7-9

 

[Waiting on him]

Paul doesn't say anything about that is the passage im referring to or in it's context

Therefore, in order to keep me from becoming conceited, I was given a thorn in my flesh, a messenger of Satan, to torment me. Three times I pleaded with the Lord to take it away from me. But he said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.” 2 Corinthians 12:7-9

Just my opinion, Paul tells us here who the messenger of Satan is.

2 Corinthians 11:12-15 KJV
But what I do, that I will do, that I may cut off occasion from them which desire occasion; that wherein they glory, they may be found even as we. [13] For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. [14] And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. [15] Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

 

[quietthinker]

Just my opinion, Paul tells us here who the messenger of Satan is.

2 Corinthians 11:12-15 KJV
But what I do, that I will do, that I may cut off occasion from them which desire occasion; that wherein they glory, they may be found even as we. [13] For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. [14] And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. [15] Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

Interesting that Paul should note that their 'end will be according to their works'.....hmmmm

 

[CharismaticLady]

A Christian should NEVER think of themselves as a 'sinner".

Is your righteousness a theory, or a reality and manifested in your life as a witness to others? If you preach that grace covers your sin while you fornicate, and have sex with another man's wife, then grace can do nothing for you. You would be living and believing a lie. It is quite a tragedy for someone to believe his own lies, and influence others to do the same as others who also commit the sin of the Nicolaitans which God HATES.

 

[Heart2Soul]

This thread is not glorifying God in any way whatsoever....
Please tone it down or I will close it.