Once Saved Always Saved

[Corlove13]

I am talking about what Saves a man—-2 things to be exact....

#1 Christ’s Blood

#2 Faith in #1

And I am talking about Jesus....
JESUS SAVES

SO TRUST JESUS

We also have the Father and the Holy Spirit

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Oh come on now. Quit basing our salvation on us. Even though we fail, even in believing, God is still able. For by grace are ye saved!!! It has nothing to do with what we do because it's not of, or by us...
Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

It has to do with our believing.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

It doesn't look that way to me. (your post) It does look like a halt between two opinions however.

I know it looks that way to you, because Osas thinks there's only one way to look at it.

 

[The Parson]

It has to do with our believing.

Again buddy, that's depending on our own works. Not God's power to do what He says He'll do.

I know it looks that way to you, because Osas thinks there's only one way to look at it.

Ferris, if any way will do, no way will do just as well...

 

[Taken]

Which is exactly why you should keep believing in God!

Therefore, since we have a great high priest...let us hold firmly to the faith we profess. Hebrews 4:14​

You are not listening.
A man "holding firmly" is a mans power.
A man "Kept by God" is Gods Power.

Mans "power" is NOT secure!
Gods "POWER" IS secure.

Once SAVED...is expressly, revealing, a MAN IS SECURE having GODS POWER "IN" the man.

* A man "holding firmly", IS WARNED to KEEP "holding firmly"........
* UNTL WHAT?
* "Until he IS Converted, Secure, IN Gods POWER!'
* WHY the Warning?...
* BECAUSE a man "holding on to belief", by his own power ... IS VUNERABLE to outside evil and wicked Influences that can "SWAY his belief AWAY from God".

* A man "IN CHRIST", IS "IN" Gods POWER...
* ONCE...IN GODS POWER...
* "NOTHING is more powerful to Sway a man, trick a man, make a man Go Against God, and NOT BELIEVE'.

* A man believing by his own power...
IS NOT SECURE...
* A man believing and IN GODS POWER...
IS SECURE.

You preach ... you are IN Christ, secure...
At the same time...you preach you are VUNERABLE, and can Lose that securety...
"WHICH you preach, can be lost..."IF BY YOUE OWN POWER", you don't keep believing.

When you made your confession to God...
OF BELIEF, do you not know, YOU AUTHORIZED GOD TO KEEP YOU ONCE AND FOREVER?

Preaching Gods acceptance of your confession and changing you and keeping you...is "your job" to KEEP yourself...IS FALSE.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Again buddy, that's depending on our own works.

Do you have a scripture that says my believing is me trying to earn my own salvation? I'm pretty sure believing in Christ is not a work of the works gospel.

 

[Taken]

I know it looks that way to you, because Osas thinks there's only one way to look at it.

OSAS...absolutey IS ALL ABOUT a man having surrendered authorizing God to Change Him AND KEEP Him Changed BY Gods POWER.

You project Sure God can change a man...
But then it is the man who mush KEEP his change intact. That is false.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Ferris, if any way will do, no way will do just as well...

I'm not saying 'any way will do'. I'm saying Osas can't see there is another way to see the scriptures they are sure can only mean Osas.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

OSAS...absolutey IS ALL ABOUT a man having surrendered authorizing God to Change Him AND KEEP Him Changed BY Gods POWER.

I think that's called 'having faith'. So it isn't about a man saving himself by works. It's about a man continuing to trust and believe in that which does the saving.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

You project Sure God can change a man...
But then it is the man who mush KEEP his change intact. That is false.

Man must retain that which has changed him and saved him. 1 John 2:24

 

[Ferris Bueller]

"IF BY YOUE OWN POWER", you don't keep believing.

No. Man can only trust God through the gift of faith that God gives. Some choose to keep that gift and keep believing. Some choose not to keep it and stop believing. This has nothing to do with some inherent ability of man to be able to believe and trust in what he can't see.

 

[Tong2020]

So they are being told to hold fast to a hope they don't really have?

Let us hold unswervingly to the hope we profess... Hebrews 10:23

...let us hold firmly to what we profess. Hebrews 4:14​

As I pointed out, what they profess to hope is what Paul was referring to. And that does not necessarily mean that what they profess, they actually have.

Tong
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[Ferris Bueller]

As I pointed out, what they profess to hope is what Paul was referring to. And that does not necessarily mean that what they profess, they actually have.

Tong
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Why would the writer tell them to hold firmly to and keep believing in a hope they do not have? Wouldn't he rather tell them to be born again?

 

[Tong2020]

Justification is completely and totally by faith in God, completely and totally separate from works. No works needed for justification. What you're not getting is the faith that justifies apart from works is the faith that expresses itself through love (Galatians 5:6). In other words, the faith that justifies all by itself obeys God's commands summed up in 'love your neighbor as yourself'. So, after being justified by faith, if your faith is not being expressed in the obedience to love others in increasing measure you don't have the justification by faith apart from works that you think you have. You have dead faith (faith that doesn't work). The faith that James says can not save you.

That's how and why salvation can never be separated from works the way the church insists it can be, and some even insist must be. The problem is the church can not understand how all this can be true and that not be a works gospel. And so they reject it out of hand. And so back to the false comfort of their dead 'Osas' faith they go.

<<< What you're not getting is the faith that justifies apart from works is the faith that expresses itself through love (Galatians 5:6).>>>

I am not getting that? Why wouldn’t I? I have been telling you even about the faith the comes from God in contrast to faith coming from man. There is a big difference between the two.

And now you seem to be mixed up with faith and love and obedience, all of which are different with each other.

And I see a lot of misuse of scriptures there in your post.

Tong
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[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said: ↑
That’s right. If one does not continue, it means that what faith they said they have isn’t the kind of faith that Jesus is talking about, faith that comes from God that is abiding and that endures to the end.

You're reading it with your Osas bias. All it means is when you live for Jesus you are a disciple of Christ. When you don't live for Jesus you are not a disciple of his. It doesn't mean you will always live for Jesus and be his disciple.

All it means is that Jesus was telling is that true believing is one that is continuing and enduring, not that which comes from man which is not.

Tong
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[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said: ↑
If one does not continue, it means that what faith they said they have isn’t the kind of faith that Jesus is talking about

At the time they fell away it means that. It doesn't mean they never had that faith.

Nope. Apparently it seems you fail to understand what it means that it abides, continues and endures, for you speak of it as one that may cease and not continue.

Tong
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[Tong2020]

@Tong2020 2020, post: 1017901, member: 8685"]Look nowhere else for assurance. The only assurance there is found in Jesus. If that is not more than enough and we still look to be assured by anything else, then we have a problem.

You can look to Jesus...but it is with the intent to trust.
As it is written;

For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day."




@Tong2020

Tong
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[/QUOTE]
I know you know what I meant there.

Tong
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[Corlove13]

Matthew 4:17


From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven(s) is at hand.

He preached the availability of the kingdom
Now!

Think about it......

The kingdom of or from the heaven (s) (skies)
as they probably new it, is Now available on earth.

The Full Gospel is The availability of the Kingdom to anyone who puts their confidence in Jesus.....for in Him there is not merely forgiveness of sin but everything we need that pertains to Life.

So many Osas believers...merely sees Gospel of the atonement..they go directly to Justification as Salvation....and can't understand sanctification by the Spirit.

For the Likely Flow of understanding comes from having the Foundation.....Jesus Christ.

For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ."
1 Corinthians 3:11, KJV

Honestly answer to yourself what were you taught to trust.

Was it something He did to secure your salvation. OR

Were you taught after knowledge of who He is...to put your confidence in Him?

This makes a lot of difference in How you understand scripture.

 

[The Parson]

Do you have a scripture that says my believing is me trying to earn my own salvation? I'm pretty sure believing in Christ is not a work of the works gospel.

Well, believing is a cognitive action, therefore a work. You can't just say it isn't for making your point... Think about it...

 

[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said: ↑
Thank you. I think that was an honest answer, that you don’t take faith as grace but as your believing + action. And I think that explains a lot why you have such view of salvation.

You're welcome. It also happens to be what my congregation teaches.

Anyone can say they believe anything. It is meaningless without action. Action separates real faith from lip service death.

Of course, Jesus is the Savior. However, this is who he is, not what he does (present tense). This is why the Bible says to work out your own salvation, with fear and trembling. While Jesus went to the poor in Spirit in his lifetime, now we have to go to him. Denying our participatory action in the process is not just bad theology, it is a bad grasp of reality.

The Bible constantly requires one's participation in the process. Ask, and you will receive. Knock, and the door will be opened. Even when God delivered the Hebrews from the Egyptian chariots as they were pinned at the Red Sea, the chosen people of God had to walk across themselves.

If you want, I will even look for the verse where Moses asked God what to do. He did not say just wait for me to deliver you. He said walk now, what are you waiting for. This was expanded on in a church service earlier this year.

I have really not much to say about that. For we take faith differently. For me it’s grace. On the other hand, you don’t. So we are not talking about the same thing.

Tong
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