Our Young Earth

[treeoflife]

(Alpha and Omega;52248)
What is the canopy theory? I think I know but want clarification please. Also how thick was this canopy?God's word does not teach that the earth is young. God's word teaches simply that MAN is young around 6000 years old that is all. The Earth's geological history (which, by the way, God also authored), tells us that this planet is very old. Therefore, there MUST be a Biblical explanation that confirms this observation and provides a Biblical reason why these things are so. And the Ruin-Reconstruction interpretation does exactly that. The Bible gives no specific time when God first created the heaven and the Earth (Genesis 1:1), but it does give the time when the Earth is found in this desolate condition and for the start of the seven, literal, 24 hour days. That time was, indeed, geologically very recently. In this respect, only, is the Young Earth Creationist fully correct. This is the context for the "gap" on which Ruin-Reconstruction doctrine is based. Exactly how long that time gap represents nobody can say for sure, but it most certainly could accommodate hundreds of millions of years, or less, but a gap is most certainly there.

Genesis 1:6-7 "And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so. And God called the firmament Heaven."​

We know there are three heavens referred to in God's Word. Atmosphere (where birds fly), Space (where stars are and where our planet orbits), and Heaven (where God is). God is clearly talking about the atmosphere, as he just created the earth, and at the time of creation the atmosphere seperated the waters on earth from the waters above the atmosphere. And, the firmament he called heaven, seperated the waters from the waters.I'm not dogmatic about it, but I do believe strongly that there was a "canopy" of some kind at one time, and it incased the globe in water... until God released it in the flood. There may not be a perfect scientific model for this, and scripture doesn't expand much on it beyond the creation account, but it does tell us enough in the verse above. Such a canopy could account for all kinds of life changes since the flood, and for life on earth before the flood.http://www.thetruthishere.com/canopy.htmlSuch a canopy would greatly increase oxygen pressure, creating a global hyberberic chamber like environment. These "perfect" conditions could easily account for longer life and larger life, pre-flood. Furthermore, it would throw off all kinds of dating systems used to date things today. It has all kinds of implications that are not considered by scientists who do not study God's Word, and the pre-flood creation (or even the flood itself).The water canopy has no argument with the Gap Theory... so you can still believe in a Gap Theory and accept the canopy for what it is with no problem. That being said, I do not believe in the Gap Theory. God's Word does tell us that the Earth is young--less than a week older than humans (when Adam and Eve were created). We can just disagree on that, because I don't believe in a Gap Theory.

 

[Jordan]

(treeoflife;52290)
(Alpha and Omega;52248)
What is the canopy theory? I think I know but want clarification please. Also how thick was this canopy?God's word does not teach that the earth is young. God's word teaches simply that MAN is young around 6000 years old that is all. The Earth's geological history (which, by the way, God also authored), tells us that this planet is very old. Therefore, there MUST be a Biblical explanation that confirms this observation and provides a Biblical reason why these things are so. And the Ruin-Reconstruction interpretation does exactly that. The Bible gives no specific time when God first created the heaven and the Earth (Genesis 1:1), but it does give the time when the Earth is found in this desolate condition and for the start of the seven, literal, 24 hour days. That time was, indeed, geologically very recently. In this respect, only, is the Young Earth Creationist fully correct. This is the context for the "gap" on which Ruin-Reconstruction doctrine is based. Exactly how long that time gap represents nobody can say for sure, but it most certainly could accommodate hundreds of millions of years, or less, but a gap is most certainly there.

Genesis 1:6-7 "And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so. And God called the firmament Heaven."​

We know there are three heavens referred to in God's Word. Atmosphere (where birds fly), Space (where stars are and where our planet orbits), and Heaven (where God is). God is clearly talking about the atmosphere, as he just created the earth, and at the time of creation the atmosphere seperated the waters on earth from the waters above the atmosphere. And, the firmament he called heaven, seperated the waters from the waters.I'm not dogmatic about it, but I do believe strongly that there was a "canopy" of some kind at one time, and it incased the globe in water... until God released it in the flood. There may not be a perfect scientific model for this, and scripture doesn't expand much on it beyond the creation account, but it does tell us enough in the verse above. Such a canopy could account for all kinds of life changes since the flood, and for life on earth before the flood.http://www.thetruthishere.com/canopy.htmlSuch a canopy would greatly increase oxygen pressure, creating a global hyberberic chamber like environment. These "perfect" conditions could easily account for longer life and larger life, pre-flood. Furthermore, it would throw off all kinds of dating systems used to date things today. It has all kinds of implications that are not considered by scientists who do not study God's Word, and the pre-flood creation (or even the flood itself).God's Word does tell us that the Earth is young--less than a week older than humans (when Adam and Eve were created). We can just disagree, because I'm going to tell you I don't believe in a Gap Theory.Are we going to skim through the Bible on what God says and have our opinion on what we think what God says, or are we going to actually listen to Him?Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2 is completely different than Genesis 1:3-31. The bible has indicted that there is a time gap because God says about the first Earth Age God never create the world starting with sin.Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2 = Isaiah 45:18, Jeremiah 4:22-28, II Peter 3:5-7.

 

[treeoflife]

(thesuperjag;52310)
Are we going to skim through the Bible on what God says and have our opinion on what we think what God says, or are we going to actually listen to Him?Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2 is completely different than Genesis 1:3-31. The bible has indicted that there is a time gap because God says about the first Earth Age God never create the world starting with sin.Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2 = Isaiah 45:18, Jeremiah 4:22-28, II Peter 3:5-7.
A water canopy has no argument with the Gap Theory. You can still believe in a Gap Theory and the canopy is not a problem. I just don't believe in a Gap Theory, and thought I would say that at the end. I'll edit my ending statement to clarify this.

 

[Christina]

(eternalarcadia;52017)
Evidence for a young earth --- Putting all the theories to rest claiming that the earth is millions or billions of years old.Exodus 20:9-11"For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea and all that is in them.Since solar radiation causes the formation of C-14 in the atmosphere, and normal radioactive decay takes it out, there must be a point where the formation rate and the decay rate equalizes. This is called the point of equilibrium. Earth has in fact still not reached equilibrium. There is more C-14 in the atmosphere now than there was 40 years ago [which proves] the earth is not yet 30,000 years old. This fact alone is enough to prove the earth's age.According to astronomical observations, galaxies like our own experience about one supernova (a violently-exploding star) every 25 years. The gas and dust remnants from such explosions (like the Crab Nebula) expand outward rapidly and should remain visible for over a million years. Yet the nearby parts of our galaxy in which we could observe such gas and dust shells contain only about 200 supernova remnants. That number is consistent with only about 7,000 years worth of supernovas.One of Jupiters moons called Ganymede has a strong magnetic field. Magnetic fields are generated by the liquid motion of molten metal inside a body. Billions of years is plenty of time for this moon to have cooled off, reducing it's high-energy magnetic field, indicating that it can't be billions of years old.Saturn's rings are also expanding away from Saturn, indicating that it is impossible for Saturn to be billions of years old, or it wouldn't still have rings. It is mathematically impossible.Comets are flying around space, and are constantly losing material. Since you can't keep losing material, and comets can't live more than about 10,000 years, there is no reason or explanation of why comets are still in existence in our universe. Although some theories have been proposed to explain why we still have comets, none of them can be confirmed with any evidence. The stars of our own galaxy, the Milky Way, rotate about the galactic center with different speeds, the inner ones rotating faster than the outer ones. The observed rotation speeds are so fast that if our galaxy were more than a few hundred million years old, it would be a featureless disc of stars instead of its present spiral shape. Yet our galaxy is supposed to be at least 10 billion years old - and it is still spiral shaped!As the moon rotates around the earth, it's gradually getting further away, a couple of inches a year to be exact. Based on the fact that we are gradually losing the moon, it can be concluded that the moon used to be closer to earth. If you were to bring the moon closer to the earth, it would create a problem. According to the inverse-square law, if the distance from the earth to the moon was 1/3 of it's current distance, the force of attraction between the two will be nine times greater. Hypothetically going back 1.4 billion years, the moon would have been almost making contact with earth. This is a geophysically impossible occurance. Earth has lost 10% of it's magnetic strength in the last 150 years and 40% in the last 1000 years. The earth is also constantly slowing down in it's rotation. This shows that the earth obviously used to be going faster. Going back 6000 years, this wouldn't be a problem. The magnetic field of earth alone limits it to less than 25,000 years old. If you were to go back just millions of years, the wind on earth would have been 5000 miles per hour due to the coriolis effect. It would have been impossible for any kind of land mammal to live in this kind of environment.The Sahara desert has what is known as a prevailing wind pattern. This wind pattern turns nearby land into desert in a process called desertification. A long study conducted on the Sahara Desert concluded that the desert is about 4000 years old. If the earth is billions of years old, there should be a larger desert some place due to the process of desertification. Since it is impossible for a desert to form underwater (via the lood of Noah in the bible), it's reasonable that the oldest desert is 4000 years old. All naturally occurring families of radioactive elements generate helium as they decay. If such decay took place for billions of years, much helium should have found its way into the Earth's atmosphere. The rate of loss of helium from the atmosphere into space is calculable and small. Taking that loss into account, the atmosphere today has only 0.05% of the amount of helium it would have accumulated in five billion years.(19) This means the atmosphere is much younger than the alleged evolutionary age.A study published in the Journal of Geophysical Research shows that helium produced by radioactive decay in deep, hot rocks has not had time to escape. Though the rocks are supposed to be over one billion years old, their large helium retention suggests an age of only thousands of years.(20)The pressure of oil underground is greater than the pressure of the overbearing rock. The rock above the oil can only hold the pressure from the oil for 10,000 years or less. Because of this, there should'nt be any oil still in the ground. The rocks above the oil should have cracked and the oil should have made it to the surface long ago (if the earth is billion of years old).The largest reef in the world is the Great Barrier Reef in Australia. Based off of the rate of growth of this reef, scientists have concluded that it's less than 4200 years old. Billions of years is plenty of time for a larger reef to grow in our vast oceans, which indicates that our oceans, and therefore our earth, is young. As Niagara falls flows one direction, it erodes in the other. The river at the bottom of the falls (created by erosion) runs through a gorge about 7/1/2 miles long. Over a span of millions and billions of years, Niagara Falls should have eroded much farther than it currently has, proving it is fact not million of years old.Actual red blood cells and traces of the blood protein hemoglobin (which makes blood red and carries oxygen have been dicovered fossil bones from a Tyrannosaurus rex, supposedly millions of years old. The sun is shrinking constantly. Based on it's rate of shrinkage, Additional (essential) articles --[url="http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/nab/why-christians-shouldnt-accept-millions]http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/n...accept-millions[/url]http://www.answersingenesis.org/home/area/...k/2006/0303.asphttp://www.answersingenesis.org/creation/v...1/gaptheory.asphttp://www.christiananswers.net/q-aig/aig-c026.htmlhttp://www.answersingenesis.org/home/area/...k/2005/1202.asphttp://drdino.com/articles.php?spec=49http://www.christiananswers.net/q-aig/aig-...y-problems.htmlhttp://www.christiananswers.net/q-aig/aig-c012.htmlhttp://www.users.bigpond.com/rdoolan/gaptheory.htmlhttp://www.allaboutcreation.org/gap-theory.htmhttp://www.bible.org/page.php?page_id=36http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/n...uction-theories
It seems very convient that we do accept mens words about Evoulution but you will accept certain mens words as long as it supports your view point. This is all mens trash excuse my description but Gods Word says differently as do millions of other men and science so picking which group of men you believe proves nothing except you have an opinion. Hebrew language used in Gods Word and common sense will you differntly. Gods word says there was a first earth age, a second in which we no live and a third to come in which he will again make a new Heaven and New earth. That is by melting the Rudiments (elements) To believe in an old earth is perfectly in line with scripture its just not in line with mens teaching that one learned in Sunday school IMHO opinion knowledge has increased we know the earth is old scripture supports it and if that goes against mens teaching so be it. 5 But it is hid from them willing this thing, that heavens were before, and the earth of water was standing by water, by God's word [that heavens were first, and the earth of water and by water being, or standing, together by God's word]; Anyone thinking this is Noahs flood is in error the flood was never hidden and never affected the heavens 6 by which [things] that same world cleansed, then by water perished. 7 But the heavens that now be, and the earth, be kept by the same word, and be reserved to fire into the day of doom and perdition of wicked men. [Forsooth the heavens that now be, and the earth, by the same word put again, be kept to fire into the day of doom and perdition of unpious men.]

 

[Jackie D]

if He be the Ancient of Days, why do our puny minds want to limit Him to time?

 

[Christina]

(jtartar;52287)
Alpha & Omega, May I give you something to think about? The Bible actually gives no indication of the age of the earth. The earth can be very old or young and it does not disagree with what the Bible says. There is a term called Gap Theory. This is the theory of how many years there were between Gen 1:1 and Gen 1:2. It could be millions, or billions or even trillions and it would not disagree with what the Bible says. At Gen 1:1, God CREATED the heaven and the earth. Notice this happened, In the Beginning. According to Hebrew this scripture should day, In A beginning. Why?? Because this was the beginning of God's creating matter, visible things. God had already created Angels, with the FIRST of God's creation being His Only Begotten Son, who is called, by us Jesus,Col 1:15, Rev 3:14. After God created Jesus He then used Jesus as His master worker in the creation of everything else, Prov 8:22-31. When God started to prepare the earth for mankind the angels shouted in applause, Job 38:7. Many of the angels may have been in existence billions of years before God created man. Gen 1:1 is the announcement of the creation of the heavens and the earth. Other scriptures speak about making things, but only God is Omnific. Gen 1:2 is speaking about the time that God began preparing the earth for man. Since God is totally unconcerned with time, there is not a logical reason to believe that God created the heavens and then speeded up the travel of light in the universe so as to make things appear older than they are. Since science has determined that some stars are billions of lightyears away from earth, and that light has reached us, it is logical to believe that the heavens are billions of years old. There are terms called DOCTRINAIREISM and FIDEISM, and also DOGMATISM. These terms explain why some people unreasoninglt hold to beliefs that have been proven untrue, because THEY BELIEVE the Bible says something it really does not say. The Bible and true science agrees completely. The trouble lies in the fact that people do not understand exactly what the Bible says.
I Agree with this there is absoultly NO biblical reason to belief in a Young earth other than the church decided to teach it this Way There is not a anything in scripture to go against an old earth it strickly mens teaching. A young earth does not contradict God it contradicts men.

 

[Christina]

(Jackie D;52324)
if He be the Ancient of Days, why do our puny minds want to limit Him to time?
Amen Jackie

 

[DONNIE]

Thanks to all of you for the education. I read it in my Bible the you open my eyes to it. It's really helping me learn to use all my resources to study on my own.Donnie

 

[Jackie D]

nice signature DONNIE...

 

[treeoflife]

(Jackie D;52324)
if He be the Ancient of Days, why do our puny minds want to limit Him to time?
I'm not sure I understand what this statement is in response to? I'll assume it is in response to a young earth argument, since that is the thread topic. Correct me if I'm wrong... but either way, I'll just throw this out there.A young-earth doesn't limit God to time. It simply is what it is. I don't believe the earth being a billion years old, a million years old, or 7,000 years old limits God to time, one more than the other. I believe that a billion years is equally insignificant to God as 7,000 years, because God is not restrained by time. God is infinitely outside of a billion years, He is infinitely outside of a million years, and He is infinitely outside of 7,000 years.A young-earth has nothing to do with limiting God to time. He is indeed the "Ancient of Days". God places limits on men, however, and His Word dictates where we should and should not go. It is simply about believing the truth, and if it is the truth as all young-earth creationists believe... we should all believe it.But, it doesn't limit God in any sense of how that word is intended. A young-earth no more limits God to time than an "old-earth" believe limits God to time. It is what it is.

 

[treeoflife]

(DONNIE;52327)
Thanks to all of you for the education. I read it in my Bible the you open my eyes to it. It's really helping me learn to use all my resources to study on my own.Donnie
Amen. Hopefully we are all sharpening eachother, even if we disagree. I pray the Lord directs you (and all of us) into all truth.

 

[DONNIE]

(Jackie D;52330)
nice signature DONNIE...

Thanks. I borrowed it from Kellers "A Shepherd Looks at Psalm 23". It kinda brought a bunch of things together for me so I thought I would share it.Donnie

 

[Jackie D]

DONNIE, have you ever read the book "Hinds Feet on High Places"it is very very good, I have a feeling that anyone who reads it will get MUCH out of it.

 

[Christina]

(treeoflife;52331)
I'm not sure I understand what this statement is in response to? I'll assume it is in response to a young earth argument, since that is the thread topic. Correct me if I'm wrong... but either way, I'll just throw this out there.A young-earth doesn't limit God to time. It simply is what it is. I don't believe the earth being a billion years old, a million years old, or 7,000 years old limits God to time, one more than the other. I believe that a billion years is equally insignificant to God as 7,000 years, because God is not restrained by time. God is infinitely outside of a billion years, He is infinitely outside of a million years, and He is infinitely outside of 7,000 years.A young-earth has nothing to do with limiting God to time. He is indeed the "Ancient of Days". God places limits on men, however, and His Word dictates where we should and should not go. It is simply about believing the truth, and if it is the truth as all young-earth creationists believe... we should all believe it.But, it doesn't limit God in any sense of how that word is intended. A young-earth no more limits God to time than an "old-earth" believe limits God to time. It is what it is.
It absoulty does so limit God is that not what you are saying ignore what the scriptures really say's Men have said it isnt so. God could not have have made the World millions of years old because Men say. Are you not saying God couldnt have made a first earth age ?????????Tell me where do you think he foreknew some from????????

 

[DONNIE]

(Jackie D;52334)
DONNIE, have you ever read the book "Hinds Feet on High Places"it is very very good, I have a feeling that anyone who reads it will get MUCH out of it.
I added it to my list. Thanks!

 

[Jordan]

(kriss;52322)
It seems very convient that we do accept mens words about Evoulution but you will accept certain mens words as long as it supports your view point. This is all mens trash excuse my description but Gods Word says differently as do millions of other men and science so picking which group of men you believe proves nothing except you have an opinion. Hebrew language used in Gods Word and common sense will you differntly. Gods word says there was a first earth age, a second in which we no live and a third to come in which he will again make a new Heaven and New earth. That is by melting the Rudiments (elements) To believe in an old earth is perfectly in line with scripture its just not in line with mens teaching that one learned in Sunday school IMHO opinion knowledge has increased we know the earth is old scripture supports it and if that goes against mens teaching so be it. 5 But it is hid from them willing this thing, that heavens were before, and the earth of water was standing by water, by God's word [that heavens were first, and the earth of water and by water being, or standing, together by God's word]; Anyone thinking this is Noahs flood is in error the flood was never hidden and never affected the heavens 6 by which [things] that same world cleansed, then by water perished. 7 But the heavens that now be, and the earth, be kept by the same word, and be reserved to fire into the day of doom and perdition of wicked men. [Forsooth the heavens that now be, and the earth, by the same word put again, be kept to fire into the day of doom and perdition of unpious men.]
You're right Kriss, scriptures does say that the Earth is older than 6,000 years old due to mankind trying to calculate the Earth by finding Adam's timeline (6,000 years old, aka Young Earth)And Kriss, I know you know this part, but in my opinion, it shouldn't be an opinion to you at all but a fact. And opinion shall stay as an opinion forever. But if an opinion became a fact (after much studying) then it no longer an opinion but became a fact.Daniel 12:4 - But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.(Kriss;52326)
(Jackie D;52324)
if He be the Ancient of Days, why do our puny minds want to limit Him to time?
Amen JackieAmen! x 2

 

[Jackie D]

(treeoflife;52331)
I'm not sure I understand what this statement is in response to? I'll assume it is in response to a young earth argument, since that is the thread topic. Correct me if I'm wrong... but either way, I'll just throw this out there.A young-earth doesn't limit God to time. It simply is what it is. I don't believe the earth being a billion years old, a million years old, or 7,000 years old limits God to time, one more than the other. I believe that a billion years is equally insignificant to God as 7,000 years, because God is not restrained by time. God is infinitely outside of a billion years, He is infinitely outside of a million years, and He is infinitely outside of 7,000 years.A young-earth has nothing to do with limiting God to time. He is indeed the "Ancient of Days". God places limits on men, however, and His Word dictates where we should and should not go. It is simply about believing the truth, and if it is the truth as all young-earth creationists believe... we should all believe it.But, it doesn't limit God in any sense of how that word is intended. A young-earth no more limits God to time than an "old-earth" believe limits God to time. It is what it is.
I am surprised that you would consider that because some popular new-age group of people who have created another 'ism' and you believe it, that all should. That just doesn't seem logical...Science HAS proven the existance of the earth long before the "young-earth creationsist" would like to limit God to.

 

[treeoflife]

(kriss;52335)
It absoulty does so limit God is that not what you are saying ignore what the scriptures really say's Men have said it isnt so. God could not have have made the World millions of years old because Men say. Are you not saying God couldnt have made a first earth age ?????????Tell me where do you think he foreknew some from????????
You misunderstand. I responded to the statement that insinuated that a young-earth "limits God" to time. Which, it in no way does. Believing the Earth is a billion years old or 7,000 years old is not more limiting to God's inifinite quality, being outiside of time, one more than the other. God is outside of time. As the old hymn says, "When we've been there 10,000 years... we no less days to sing His praise than when we first begun."What a young-earth belief *does do* is *limit the Earth to time*. As well it should, if that is in fact what God tells us about the world He created. God remains outside of His creation, as "time" is just one of the demensions we exist in, but He does not. Whether the Earth be a billion or 10,000 years old is of no consequence to how God opperates outside of time.With that said... I must say this, since you once again accuse me directly of "believing what men say." I must say, on the contrary, I make it a point to believe whatever God's Word says, regardless of what men are saying. You are the one, however, who has been persuaded by "scientists" and society into believing the Earth is older than what the Bible clearly states. And, a Gap Theory, also "taught by men."The belief that the Earth was millions upon millions of years old was not believed or taught by anyone (other than perhaps the lunitic fringe) until the Theory of Evolution entered man's mind. It certainly has never been a Christian belief until Evolution and the teaching that the world MUST BE millions of years old was interwined with Christian belief. Now we have lots of Christians who believe what men say, over the simplicity of what God says.The Earth is young.

 

[Jackie D]

ya and people used to believe it was flat until someone did some research and study and found that 'lo and behold' the earth is actually spherical(globular)in shape...hmmm

 

[treeoflife]

(Jackie D;52346)
ya and people used to believe it was flat until someone did some research and study and found that 'lo and behold' the earth is actually spherical(globular)in shape...hmmm
Apples and oranges. The Bible doesn't teach that the Earth is flat. So, if people believed it, they had no Biblical reason to do so.