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Featured Physician Assisted Suicide

Discussion in 'Ethics & Morality Forum' started by Mayflower, Mar 16, 2019.

  1. Butterfly

    Butterfly Well-Known Member

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    Kind of glad that I am not the only one with different opinions xxxxx
    Medication is a tricky one because we use medicines throughout our lives, and even as babies we are given medical assistent in fighting off many illnesses that could potential take our lives.
    We don't think twice about seeking medical help - how long would our lives be without any of this kind of help.
    However , in many respects, we are merely preserving the body , the shell that we live in - which takes us back to where the soul is !
    Rita
     
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  2. Butterfly

    Butterfly Well-Known Member

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    I was reading a news report yesterday from Utah and it was stating that the law they are passing will allow elderly people to be ' starved ' with or without their will, in order to allow life to end.
    To ' with hold ' food and drink is with holding a basic need. It is a horrible and slow way to die. I have seen many residents who quite naturally do not want to eat and drink in the latter stages of life - it can take weeks.
    If someone chooses not to eat and drink, well that's one thing, but to pass a law the deliberately allows a care giver to with hold it without consent is not a path to go down. Can you imagine the abuse of power it could create, especially when families see their inheritance going down the tube paying for care homes ect.
    Rita
     
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  3. Butterfly

    Butterfly Well-Known Member

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    Ok, much son through this into a debate the other day- did Jesus commit suicide- given the fact that ' he chose to die ' ( he gave up his life ) He could have saved himself, but didn't !
    My argument to him was that it was a sacrifice, which is different. However what does Jesus death teach us about life and giving it up - he chose to do it for us, so what about the person who wants their life to end because of it being a burden to someone else ?
    There are many people suffering because they are carers 24/7. The person who is sick may desire to release the care giver . Or the demands financially on a family who's loved one is on life support , brain dead. People are suffering in so many different ways. So what about laying your life down for another ?

    Did you know that in China if a mother goes to drown herself and her children, and she survives, she would not be had up for murder because she was doing her children a kindness by not wanting to leave them behind.......

    Rita
     
  4. Nancy

    Nancy Well-Known Member

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    True, it all comes back to our soul, which will live on! I once read somebody saying they had a headache could I have an aspirin? The person asked this said: why, is your body lacking aspirin? :D
     
  5. Nancy

    Nancy Well-Known Member

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    That is just evil! Yes it IS a horrible way to die! I will pray against that one, for sure! This country (US) takes horrible "care" of our elderly, it is like they just want to throw them away! This is so so sad :( I have such a heart for the elderly, always have. And to think of all that generation did for this country. What a shame. Seems one needs to be very well off financially to get proper care. God help us!
    Thank you for sharing this Rita, I do not even turn on my tv anymore and have not for years so, the only news I get is from online either, Reuters, Associated Press, C-Span or NPR on the radio...boring but, at least you hear those you voted for and what they actually vote on.
    God Bless!
     
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  6. CoreIssue

    CoreIssue Well-Known Member

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    Study eugenics in places such as ancient Greece, Nazi Germany and the eugenics movement in the US. The health care system in Europe.

    Then look what the liberals want to do to healthcare.

    If you have ever watched house hunters international have you noticed how unfriendly the streets are to seniors than invalids? Asked yourself where do they live?
     
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  7. farouk

    farouk Well-Known Member

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    Sounds macabre...
     
  8. Butterfly

    Butterfly Well-Known Member

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    What's wrong with the health care in Europe- we have an amazing national health service, and it's avaliable to everyone, regardless of age !
    Rita
     
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  9. CoreIssue

    CoreIssue Well-Known Member

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    Restrictions on what services are offered. Age restrictions on receiving many medical services. Huge delays in receiving medical care. Shortage of doctors.

    A lot of the best doctors have moved to the US.

    That is why so many come to the US first serious medical.

    Very high taxes to pay for all the so-called free stuff.
     
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  10. Butterfly

    Butterfly Well-Known Member

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    The NHS is having problems, but it's linked more to the amount being laid in is not lined up with the amount that is being paid out. All the stupid health and safety issues also created problems, too much paper work. However the NHS was established to make medical treatment avaliable to everyone regardless of class - and it worked.
    I never complain about how much national insurence I have to pay- and compared with the system you have in the USA , the NHS is a blessing. Yes, we have to wait, but when you have grown up with that system you kind of get use to it.
    I know that if I have no money, I can get medical care - my dad is 87 years old, he is taken care of - it's not perfect, but at least it's not about whether you are fortunate to have insurence.
    I guess I have lived through the good years with the NHS - and I am so grateful X
    I will defend it for that reason alone- I have heard people complain about tax,but NEVER heard anyone complain about paying into the NHS - we accept it because we value it X
    Rita
     
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  11. farouk

    farouk Well-Known Member

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    Morphine in large enough doses kills, but its primary purpose historically is not to kill but to relieve suffering; in an end of life situation it can lead to someone's life being shortened. The trouble is these days everything is over-lawyered. Years ago things were done in a much more matter of fact, even haphazard, way in hospitals.
     
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  12. "ByGrace"

    "ByGrace" Well-Known Member

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    @Butterfly

    Well did anyone see the article about the Dutch prime minister trying to push through -
    “No surgeries for anyone over 70 yrs old.” :eek:

    I said to Dave ...1, Does he never intend to be 70 himself?
    .......2, Does he hate his parents or in-laws or something!!,

    But like Hitler who had black hair himself, but wanted only blue eyed , blond hair for Germany
    ...and the rest were ‘not true Germans’....his own rules did not include himself!!
     
  13. CoreIssue

    CoreIssue Well-Known Member

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    Different places have different healthcare.

    British healthcare is not the same as other European healthcare.

    After years of paying social security I am now collecting monthly payments plus receiving Medicare healthcare via Aetna insurance with part D, meaning drugs etc.

    In the US we don't wait. Called an ambulance and go straight to the hospital for care.

    Other things go to the doctor of our choice and get care of there paying a deductible.

    In all the time and now my total taxes, including income tax, has always been lower than you pay in your country. In fact at my age my annual tax, federal and state, is zero.

    But I am not hurting for money, have a very nice house and looked quite comfortable, except for the aches and pains that come with this old body.

    The US has always had the top-rated medical system in the world.

    Putting that aside I do believe Brexit is a very smart move.

    When I lived in Scotland I really love the country and the people. But now I could not afford to live there.

    I am glad things are going well for you in this arena and hope they continue to do so.

    Things are going to get harder for Christians in this world. But we in the US will not get slammed as hard as Europe, which I believe is anti-Christian.

    God bless you and yours.
     
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  14. Nancy

    Nancy Well-Known Member

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    Amen...seems only the rich in this country can afford REAL healthcare...it's a business. It should be called "Healthcorp". Although, I am blessed that if I wanted to, I could use the VA for free. God will hold so many accountable who put money before the health of a human being.
     
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  15. farouk

    farouk Well-Known Member

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    Odd logic...o_O
     
  16. Butterfly

    Butterfly Well-Known Member

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    That's awful, it will be interesting to see if that goes through- 70 is not exactly ' old ' these days, and most people are round about that age when they need hip replacements ect- blimey, I am only 9years off that age, my work colleague is 72, still doing 30 hours a week on housekeeping. I guess I could understand if the age limit was 90 !! ( surgery is always a risk at that age anyway )
     
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  17. Butterfly

    Butterfly Well-Known Member

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    Yes, weird isn't it, but it was the cultural norm at the time whenI did a course with the open university on cultural context ( about 10years ago )
    Rita
     
  18. Butterfly

    Butterfly Well-Known Member

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    I have many friends in the US, and some can not get access to the medical care they need because they cannot get insurence - or don't earn enough, and I am pretty sure that many poorer people do not qualify either.
    You do get ambulances in an emergency , but in some areas there are delays - but the ambulance service gets a lot of calls that could be handled elsewhere, same as the casualty departments- many go along for minor things when they could see a doctor in a surgery, that is a downside of the NHS- but I still believe it's a good service, and admire everyone that works within it. I have been fortunate, had many surgeries but always had good care.
    My Twin brother lives in Germany, the health care there is brilliant - but they pay a lot for it.
    I do not earn that much, so my tax is not to bad - but my sons pay pay quite a bit, not sure what percentage goes to the NHS though, it use to be the national insurence that went to the NHS , but I know this proberbly changed.
    Rita
     
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  19. farouk

    farouk Well-Known Member

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    I guess in various Western countries the issue is the balance between medical service availability and taxes.
     
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  20. "ByGrace"

    "ByGrace" Well-Known Member

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    @Butterfly

    What frost me is...people pay in taxes all their life...'serve their countries' ,many in wars ..many work until 70'ish Dave was 72...but still did odd jobs after that...to be told.." Oh sorry, you are now 70, so no use to the world any more..so no surgery for you".

    What an attitude!!!:eek:
     
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