Please explain this.

[justbyfaith]

But do you not believe that God is able to get His message across in just about any translation to a person whose heart is hungering and thirsting for the right things?

"Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled." Matt 5:6

If someone is hungry, and eats and eats and eats food that has been stripped of vitamins to make the vitamin pills, I am certain that they will be full when they have finished eating.

They simply will not be as nourished as if they had eaten food that contained all of its natural vitamins.

 

[amadeus]

OK so let's read the passage:


Ephesians 6:10-16
10Finally, be strong in the Lord and in the strength of His might.
11Put on the full armor of God, so that you will be able to stand firm against the schemes of the devil.
12For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places.
13Therefore, take up the full armor of God, so that you will be able to resist in the evil day, and having done everything, to stand firm.
14Stand firm therefore, HAVING GIRDED YOUR LOINS WITH TRUTH, and HAVING PUT ON THE BREASTPLATE OF RIGHTEOUSNESS,
15and having shod YOUR FEET WITH THE PREPARATION OF THE GOSPEL OF PEACE;
16in addition to all, taking up the shield of faith with which you will be able to extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one.
17And take THE HELMET OF SALVATION, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God.
18With all prayer and petition pray at all times in the Spirit


In chapter 6 of Ephesians, Paul is telling everyone how they should behave. Children, parents, slaves, slave owners.

In verse 10 Paul tells everyone, even us, that are strength is to come from God,,,the Holy Spirit inside of us.

And we'll be needing this strength because we are not fighting against flesh and blood,,,IOW, persons, but we are fighting with unseen spirits, satan and the evil ones that follow him (the evil angels) and they are the rulers of the unseen world.

So to fight them off we are to use:
The Truth of God as taught in the N.T.
We need to be approved by God by His breastplate.
We are to preach the good news: That everyone can be saved by God.
We need our faith.
We need our salvation; and to stand firm on it.
We need the sword of the Spirit...which is the word of God.

Remember when Jesus was in the desert right after He was baptized...
Satan attacked Him,,,and how did Jesus respond?
With His faith and the Word of God. (from the O.T.).


I hope that you start reading the bible on your own and start to understand it really well so that you can actually explain verses. This is a good thing to be able to do so that you can test everything anyone says with the word of God.

In addition to all of this or in spite of it Paul warns us with this verse:

"Quench not the Spirit." I Thess 5:19

Why...? Because if we do quench the Spirit of God within us there is no power to wield or hold in position any of the cited parts of the whole armour of God. That is the problem a man has with having "free will". It gives him the ability to hold back God. But, of course when he does, he opens himself up to the ways of the "old man".

 

[amadeus]

If someone is hungry, and eats and eats and eats food that has been stripped of vitamins to make the vitamin pills, I am certain that they will be full when they have finished eating.

They simply will not be as nourished as if they had eaten food that contained all of its natural vitamins.

The point of the verse cited [Matt 5:6] is that when someone has the proper hunger and thirst, God will fill him, whether He uses a Bible to do it, or someone like Philip when the Ethiopian eunuch was unable to understand what he read. We may miss a person's real need, but God will NOT. Sometimes He may even use you or me.

 

[justbyfaith]

The point of the verse cited [Matt 5:6] is that when someone has the proper hunger and thirst, God will fill him, whether He uses a Bible to do it, or someone like Philip when the Ethiopian eunuch was unable to understand what he read. We may miss a person's real need, but God will NOT. Sometimes He may even use you or me.

Most certainly, we bear the edible fruit of the Spirit as Christians; and this fruit contains seeds.

See Luke 8:11.

 

[amadeus]

Most certainly, we bear the edible fruit of the Spirit as Christians; and this fruit contains seeds.

See Luke 8:11.

Did you not understand what I wrote?

"And Jesus said, Are ye also yet without understanding?" Matt 15:16

 

[justbyfaith]

Did you not understand what I wrote?

"And Jesus said, Are ye also yet without understanding?" Matt 15:16

I don't know if I understood or didn't understand.

Why don't you elaborate?

 

[amadeus]

The point of the verse cited [Matt 5:6] is that when someone has the proper hunger and thirst, God will fill him, whether He uses a Bible to do it, or someone like Philip when the Ethiopian eunuch was unable to understand what he read. We may miss a person's real need, but God will NOT. Sometimes He may even use you or me.

I don't know if I understood or didn't understand.

Why don't you elaborate?

What Jesus said in Matt 5:6 is not just a verse to read or memorize but a promise to anyone who is sincerely seeking God and is sincerely seeking to be what God's want them to be. This would have been true when Abraham walked the land; or when Elijah was running away from Jezebel; or when one of us was walking around as an unsaved child wondering about God.

When I was a 10 year old Catholic, I sought God from my heart out in an empty field behind my grandmother's house. He did answer my prayer even though I did not and never had owned a Bible or read one. I did not even really understand what it was I wanted. I presumed it would be found in Catholicism. Of course I was wrong, but God read me right and rightly directed me in His time. What happened to me was what Jesus was saying in Matt 5:6 even though it was many years before I understood what happened. The priests did not know. My mother did not know. I did not know. But... God knew what I was asking and I received. Give God the glory!

 

[justbyfaith]

I think that if I know that I am eating food that has been stripped of its vitamins, and am truly hungry for that which will make me healthy, I will switch over to food that has not been stripped of its vitamins.

This is all I am saying.

If I am eating a can of green beans from the store (stripped of vitamins) I will surely be filled.

But I will not be as healthy as if I ate green beans that were out of the produce section.

 

[amadeus]

I think that if I know that I am eating food that has been stripped of its vitamins, and am truly hungry for that which will make me healthy, I will switch over to food that has not been stripped of its vitamins.

This is all I am saying.

If I am eating a can of green beans from the store (stripped of vitamins) I will surely be filled.

But I will not be as healthy as if I ate green beans that were out of the produce section.

Where we differ in our understanding is in what the Word of God is. It is rich and nothing has been stripped from it when it comes directly from the source to us... but the written Bible is not the source but only a vessel full of potential. The potential can become a reality only when quickened [brought to Life] by the Holy Spirit. This does not happen within any book... not even a Bible written under the inspiration of God.

It requires inspiration in the reader or hearer of the written Bible verses to bring them to Life. This is the power of the Holy Spirit. This is why Paul admonishes us NOT to quench the Spirit [I Thess 5:19]. Without the Spirit, that is the Holy Spirit, we cannot correctly understand anything that is written in the Bible. Because people sometimes are led by the Spirit and sometimes lead themselves [that is the old man them is leading] the result is many different mixtures, which we see here on this forum. We also see it in our society with a multitudes of church groups teaching and preaching often from the same Bible translations with conflicting interpretations.

There is no perfect English (or any other language) Bible translation, but THE Word of God is flawless. One preaching man will quote a Bible verse verbatim and it will be the unadulterated Word of God, while another will quote precisely the same verse from the same translation and it will be meaningless babble. The first one was anointed by the Holy Spirit as he spoke while the second one spoke from his own studies alone. Then there are those, which is probably most of them most of the time, who preach a mixture of some truth and some confusion. A hearer led by the Holy Spirit may sift through the mess to bring out a gold nugget.

 

[justbyfaith]

The potential can become a reality only when quickened [brought to Life] by the Holy Spirit. This does not happen within any book... not even a Bible written under the inspiration of God.

This is where we may have to agree to disagree.

I believe that it is more likely for the potential to become a reality through the quickening of the Holy Spirit, if one is reading a Bible that contains the word of the Lord without exception...in other words, it is important that we read a Bible that does not omit important information.

Can a person be filled with righteousness reading a Bible that does omit certain information?

I believe that they most certainly can...but they are eating a can of green beans rather than the beans that have more nutrients for that they were gotten from the produce section of the store.

But I agree with you that we most definitely need the Holy Spirit to illuminate His word to us.

If you don't understand something that is written, but you have a personal relationship with the author of the book, all you need to do is ask the author what He meant by it; and you will have your answer.

The problem is, that many people, while they may indeed have a relationship with the author; they do not ask Him what His word means because they are afraid of what the answer might be. These have still not come to the knowledge of a God who is full of grace towards His children. They do not trust that the answer that might come would be an answer that is good in their own estimation. Yet the true interpretation is always good.

 

[Grailhunter]

Where we differ in our understanding is in what the Word of God is. It is rich and nothing has been stripped from it when it comes directly from the source to us... but the written Bible is not the source but only a vessel full of potential. The potential can become a reality only when quickened [brought to Life] by the Holy Spirit. This does not happen within any book... not even a Bible written under the inspiration of God.

It requires inspiration in the reader or hearer of the written Bible verses to bring them to Life. This is the power of the Holy Spirit. This is why Paul admonishes us NOT to quench the Spirit [I Thess 5:19]. Without the Spirit, that is the Holy Spirit, we cannot correctly understand anything that is written in the Bible. Because people sometimes are led by the Spirit and sometimes lead themselves [that is the old man them is leading] the result is many different mixtures, which we see here on this forum. We also see it in our society with a multitudes of church groups teaching and preaching often from the same Bible translations with conflicting interpretations.

There is no perfect English (or any other language) Bible translation, but THE Word of God is flawless. One preaching man will quote a Bible verse verbatim and it will be the unadulterated Word of God, while another will quote precisely the same verse from the same translation and it will be meaningless babble. The first one was anointed by the Holy Spirit as he spoke while the second one spoke from his own studies alone. Then there are those, which is probably most of them most of the time, who preach a mixture of some truth and some confusion. A hearer led by the Holy Spirit may sift through the mess to bring out a gold nugget.

From a brother in the Lord that rightly understands.

 

[justbyfaith]

From a brother in the Lord that rightly understands.

Although it should be abundantly clear, that @amadeus is unorthodox in some of his views.

 

[Grailhunter]

Although it should be abundantly clear, that @amadeus is unorthodox in some of his views.

Has a mind

 

[Helen]

Although it should be abundantly clear, that @amadeus is unorthodox in some of his views.

As are two thirds of the Site.

And...WHY would anyone wish to be otherwise...?
I did not come to faith by orthodox teaching, I came to faith through the power of the Holy Spirit opening my spiritual eyes.so that I could see the truth in that God sent His Son to die for me because I was a sinner , yet I thought I was a believer in God!

We are not saved by being orthodox.
When you worship at the feet of , and 'feel safe' by believing that only orthodox is the path...you by default are rejecting being lead by the Spirit.

Orthodox= "conforming to what is generally or traditionally accepted as right or true"

Where there is 'conforming' to the masses...or most things traditionally accepted ...I will not be there.

THIS is the only conforming that we are called to:-
Romans 8:29 " For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren." Not what a group of men decided for us.

Bless you....Helen

 

[bbyrd009]

Most certainly, we bear the edible fruit of the Spirit as Christians

ha well certainly someone does anyway, let us hope. Commending ourselves to each other though, i dunno

 

[bbyrd009]

I think that if I know that I am eating food that has been stripped of its vitamins, and am truly hungry for that which will make me healthy, I will switch over to food that has not been stripped of its vitamins.

This is all I am saying.

If I am eating a can of green beans from the store (stripped of vitamins) I will surely be filled.

But I will not be as healthy as if I ate green beans that were out of the produce section.

hmm, but i note here that green beans from your back yard are not even considered as an option? Point being see green beans "from the produce section" are now considered the epitome, yeh? Roundup and all?

 

[bbyrd009]

Where we differ in our understanding is in what the Word of God is. It is rich and nothing has been stripped from it when it comes directly from the source to us... but the written Bible is not the source but only a vessel full of potential. The potential can become a reality only when quickened [brought to Life] by the Holy Spirit. This does not happen within any book... not even a Bible written under the inspiration of God.

It requires inspiration in the reader or hearer of the written Bible verses to bring them to Life. This is the power of the Holy Spirit. This is why Paul admonishes us NOT to quench the Spirit [I Thess 5:19]. Without the Spirit, that is the Holy Spirit, we cannot correctly understand anything that is written in the Bible. Because people sometimes are led by the Spirit and sometimes lead themselves [that is the old man them is leading] the result is many different mixtures, which we see here on this forum. We also see it in our society with a multitudes of church groups teaching and preaching often from the same Bible translations with conflicting interpretations.

There is no perfect English (or any other language) Bible translation, but THE Word of God is flawless. One preaching man will quote a Bible verse verbatim and it will be the unadulterated Word of God, while another will quote precisely the same verse from the same translation and it will be meaningless babble. The first one was anointed by the Holy Spirit as he spoke while the second one spoke from his own studies alone. Then there are those, which is probably most of them most of the time, who preach a mixture of some truth and some confusion. A hearer led by the Holy Spirit may sift through the mess to bring out a gold nugget.

amen, Word is always heard yeh?

 

[GodsGrace]

Where we differ in our understanding is in what the Word of God is. It is rich and nothing has been stripped from it when it comes directly from the source to us... but the written Bible is not the source but only a vessel full of potential. The potential can become a reality only when quickened [brought to Life] by the Holy Spirit. This does not happen within any book... not even a Bible written under the inspiration of God.

It requires inspiration in the reader or hearer of the written Bible verses to bring them to Life. This is the power of the Holy Spirit. This is why Paul admonishes us NOT to quench the Spirit [I Thess 5:19]. Without the Spirit, that is the Holy Spirit, we cannot correctly understand anything that is written in the Bible. Because people sometimes are led by the Spirit and sometimes lead themselves [that is the old man them is leading] the result is many different mixtures, which we see here on this forum. We also see it in our society with a multitudes of church groups teaching and preaching often from the same Bible translations with conflicting interpretations.

There is no perfect English (or any other language) Bible translation, but THE Word of God is flawless. One preaching man will quote a Bible verse verbatim and it will be the unadulterated Word of God, while another will quote precisely the same verse from the same translation and it will be meaningless babble. The first one was anointed by the Holy Spirit as he spoke while the second one spoke from his own studies alone. Then there are those, which is probably most of them most of the time, who preach a mixture of some truth and some confusion. A hearer led by the Holy Spirit may sift through the mess to bring out a gold nugget.

You know, Catholics don't read the bible enough.
In Protestantism, I sometimes fear that persons are trusting on their bible to save them insead of trusting on Jesus to save them.

My story is the same as yours.
Not only those that read the bible are saved...although it sure does help.
God is everywhere and if we have an inkling that He is there and want Him...
we will get Him.
Revelation 3:20

He who seeks finds...
Mathew 7

 

[justbyfaith]

And...WHY would anyone wish to be otherwise...?
I did not come to faith by orthodox teaching, I came to faith through the power of the Holy Spirit opening my spiritual eyes.so that I could see the truth in that God sent His Son to die for me because I was a sinner , yet I thought I was a believer in God!

We are not saved by being orthodox.

I would say that a person cannot be saved apart from sound doctrine.

1Ti 4:16, Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee.

 

[Grailhunter]

I would say that a person cannot be saved apart from sound doctrine.

1Ti 4:16, Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee.

Sound Gnostic to me.