Preaching is worship?
- Thread starter Matthias
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Interesting. Someone else asked the same question on X (Twitter) this afternoon.
129 responses (in 6 hours). 0 responses on Christianity Board (in 21 hours).
129 responses (in 6 hours). 0 responses on Christianity Board (in 21 hours).
There was a time (before I became a pastor) when I would have disagreed with the assertion. Worship to me in those days was limited to singing, praying and the collection plate at church. It later expanded to include recitation of creeds. Later still, it expanded further to include reading, studying, and meditating on scripture.
But the preacher’s sermon? No. Not until I took preaching classes in school.
But the preacher’s sermon? No. Not until I took preaching classes in school.
I think the more favourable statement is "preaching is supposed to inspire worship"
But of course if you are preaching, you can indulge in your own worship to God, just not within the message.
But of course if you are preaching, you can indulge in your own worship to God, just not within the message.
If I preached a sermon where I didn’t worship God within the message, I preached a bad sermon.
Not to discount the Spirit your sermons edify, but I think you are confusing optimism with hope?
If I hope my sermons inspire praise, being optimistic about that praise does not justify my sermon; if I am consistently optimistic about my praise, I may want to preach more, but they stay two different things.
That said, I feel like we are toying with a "formula" or "method" to edifying the Church, when in reality the Holy Spriit leads where He will.
I never delivered a sermon where I was only optimistic or hopeful that I would worship God in the message. I suppose it’s possible that other preachers approached their sermons with only hope or optimism that they might worship God within their message but I’ve not spoken with any who gave that impression.
I didn’t use a formula in my preaching. I was a dialogue preacher. (Few preachers are.)
“Perhaps you have heard this in a corporate worship service: ‘After worship we’re going to listen to some preaching.’ The problem with this statement is that preaching is an act of worship too. In fact, preaching is attempting to do what the entire liturgy should do, namely, proclaim the gospel and exult in Christ.”
solaecclesia.org
Does Preaching Even Matter for Corporate Worship?
Justin Martyr wrote to the emperor to explain what Christians actually did in worship. He provides a beautiful vision of God’s people being gathered together, enjoying the Word and sacrament. —Tony Merida
solaecclesia.org
Behold
Well-Known Member
It depends on what you are preaching..
So, if you are preaching that "mary the queen of heaven, is currently helping Jesus save souls by water baptism" then you are not preaching worship, you are preaching "cult of Mary".
But if you are preaching that " only Jesus Saves" and "God would have ALL people to come and be saved, born again".. and The Cross of Christ is the only Way to Heaven"....John 14:6
If you are in that MINISTRY, then YES.... you are definitely giving God HIGH Praise, and Glory.
A wise observation.
A conditional response.
I remember a professor asking his students early on in the semester in a preaching class: “Who is your favorite gospel preacher?”
Students, coming from a wide variety of Christian backgrounds, gave a wide variety of answers to his question. Being an older student, and the last called upon to give an answer, I asked the professor who his favorite preacher is. His answer: Jesus.
”Now after John had been taken into custody, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of God …”
(Mark 1:14)
Behold
Well-Known Member
Yes, he preached that to Jews., before He died on the Cross.
So, ignore that, and Preach the actual Gospel.
See, In Mark 1, Jesus has not died on the Cross yet, so, its impossible to preach "Jesus saves" when there is no Cross yet.
So, that's the reality.
THere is a Gospel that the CHRISTIAN is to preach, and that is not found in Mark 1, as there is no Jesus on the Cross yet, for us to "preach".
There is only one “actual” gospel. Jesus and the apostles preached it.
Jesus preached about his death on the cross, before and after the cross. It is an essential component of the gospel. You’re suggesting that the rest of the gospel should not be preached. You’re truncating the gospel by separating Jesus from his words, his preaching.
Jesus’ preaching isn’t confined to Mark 1. It continued throughout his earthly ministry and in the earthly ministry of the apostles. It should continue to be preached in the church today.
Your advice to Christians is: 1. ignore what Jesus preached and 2. don’t preach what Jesus preached.
Don’t listen to Jesus preach -> don’t listen to Jesus.
Is it God who doesn’t want people to hear Jesus preach?
Is it Jesus himself, the Messiah, who doesn’t want people to hear him preach?
Is it the apostles who didn’t want people to hear Jesus preach?
Is it the church that doesn’t want people to hear Jesus preach?
Is it the devil who doesn’t want people to hear Jesus preach?
Ignore what Jesus preached? That would be unthinkable for me.
”But how can people call on him if they have not believed in him? How can they believe in him if they have not heard his message? How can they hear if no one tells them the Good News?”
(Romans 10:14, GW)
The “Good News,” which is to say “the gospel,” is the message that Jesus and the apostles preached.
”But how can people call on him if they have not believed in him? How can they believe in him if they have not heard his message? How can they hear if no one tells them the Good News?”
(Romans 10:14, GW)
The “Good News,” which is to say “the gospel,” is the message that Jesus and the apostles preached.
Ignore what Jesus preached? That doesn’t fit at all with the parable of the sower (Matthew 13, Mark 4, Luke 8).
Is the suggestion then that the parable of the sower isn’t for Christians? Is it advised that Christian preachers should not preach the parable of the sower?
“Those beside the road are those who have heard; then the devil comes and takes away the word from their heart, so that they will not believe and be saved.”
(Luke 8:12)
Those beside the road aren’t just Jews. Those beside the road are Jews and non-Jews; everyone.
It’s the devil doesn’t want anyone to hear Jesus’ message, his teaching and preaching, his word.
Salvation hinges on it.
Is the suggestion then that the parable of the sower isn’t for Christians? Is it advised that Christian preachers should not preach the parable of the sower?
“Those beside the road are those who have heard; then the devil comes and takes away the word from their heart, so that they will not believe and be saved.”
(Luke 8:12)
Those beside the road aren’t just Jews. Those beside the road are Jews and non-Jews; everyone.
It’s the devil doesn’t want anyone to hear Jesus’ message, his teaching and preaching, his word.
Salvation hinges on it.
Behold
Well-Known Member
Guess again...
Actually Paul Preached it.
The "Gospel" is that Jesus died on the Cross for your sin., and this eternal SIN offering is the Blood Atonement, that is the New Covenant, that is the "Gospel of the Grace of God".
That's Paul's Gospel.
There is no '"rest of the Gospel".
There is no Part 1, part 12, part 345.
There is THE "Preaching of the Cross" = " that is the "Power of God, unto Salvation".
And if you preach or teach that there is "another" gospel, or that there is "more to it"..... then Paul says you are under a curse.
This one.... Galatians 1:8
Paul said, "we preach CHRIST Crucified".
Do you?
Does your Cult?
This is THE Gospel, that Paul teaches as "MY Gospel"., and it was given to Him by Jesus, after Jesus ascended back into Heaven.
He later gave it to all of the Apostles, in Acts 15.
Jesus said that "Paul is a chosen vessel unto me ", who was called by Jesus.... and sent to bring the Gospel of the Grace of God "in the time of the gentiles".
This is the "Gospel of the Grace of God".
This is the "Preaching of THE Cross".
This is "Pauline Theology".
My advice to you is not to be a liar, if you can avoid it.
Start anytime you like.
Thanks. What you’re advising should be a red flag to all of your readers.
Jesus and Paul preached the same gospel.
Setting them against one another is horrific.
Behold
Well-Known Member
Jesus's ministry was 3.5 years. And He was crucified, the last DAY of His Life, prior to The Resurrection.
So, Obviously, He could not preach that He was crucified, for the 3.4999 yrs, before it happened.
Do you comprehend?
Do you understand this?
Does your cult?
Listen,
Paul's Gospel is the "Preaching of the Cross'', So, until Jesus was on it, there was no CROSS of CHRIST that could be given as this MESSAGE that is "The Gospel" that is "Christ CRUCIFIED".
So, Once Christ died on The Cross, and was resurrected from the Dead, you then have The GOSPEL.
However, the way this Gospel is given to be PREACHED....., was delivered to PAUL, after Jesus was back in Heaven.
And Paul gave this "Gospel of the Grace of God" that I preach, and that any real Christian will preach....to the body of Christ, that is to be delivered "in the Time of the Gentiles" as Paul is the "apostle TO THE Gentiles"... and we are still IN "the time of the Gentiles'.
If you own a bible, then read...
2 Corinthians 5:19
John 3:17
As that will explain to you @Matthias in greater detail the meaning of "Preaching THE Cross".
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