Rapture 2022: On the Third Day

[amigo de christo]

They do but you won't accept the words as written. You have been taught to trust the faithful discreet slave class.

I remember i once witnessed to a pair of JW .
Many things i was led to say .
Then one evening i had called up one of them
and showed them something , something they had forgotten to remove from their own version of their bible .
That lady was completely speechless . She was silent as a mouse . SHE KNEW . at that moment she knew .
After what seemed like a minute , her voice responds , and it did not sound near as sure as she had been .
But here is what she said , IF GOD wants us to KNOW THIS , HE WILL REVEAL IT TO OUR WATCHTOWER .
That lady KNEW it was true , but would not admit it , but could not fight it , so all she could
muster up was , WELL IF GOD wants us to KNOW THIS , HE WILL reveal it to ...............
Her heart had been pricked , but she chose her TOWER . That is not a good sign .
Many must come out from many a tradition and stop trusting in men and start learning THE TRUE JESUS and very fast .

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I remember i once witnessed to a pair of JW .
Many things i was led to say .
Then one evening i had called up one of them
and showed them something , something they had forgotten to remove from their own version of their bible .
That lady was completely speechless . She was silent as a mouse . SHE KNEW . at that moment she knew .
After what seemed like a minute , her voice responds , and it did not sound near as sure as she had been .
But here is what she said , IF GOD wants us to KNOW THIS , HE WILL REVEAL IT TO OUR WATCHTOWER .
That lady KNEW it was true , but would not admit it , but could not fight it , so all she could
muster up was , WELL IF GOD wants us to KNOW THIS , HE WILL reveal it to ...............
Her heart had been pricked , but she chose her TOWER . That is not a good sign .
Many must come out from many a tradition and stop trusting in men and start learning THE TRUE JESUS and very fast .

Well all we can keep doing is sow the sewed of the word. It is up to the Lord if it will bear fruit! It is one of the hardest fileds to work in, besides professed believers who really aren't saved.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

They do but you won't accept the words as written. You have been taught to trust the faithful discreet slave class.

Yes I've been taught by YHWH God through his Only Begotten Son to exercise faith in God by listening to his Only Begotten Son who the faithful discreet slave is. You don't wish to believe who the faithful discreet slave truly is, that's your choice.
You have the right to believe whatever you want to.
I know that the true God YHWH is working through his Only Begotten Son who is working through the true Church that Jesus is head of. When it comes to the true church, a person can't decide to join because Hebrews 12:23 says that the true church is, " church of firstborn who are written in the heavens." So God is the one who select the members, and as 1 Corinthians12:18 tells us, he sets them in the congregation as he pleases. These will be the ones who will be with Jesus in heaven. Jesus revealed at Luke 12:32 and Revelation 14:1-3 that not all professing to be Christians will be members of this true church, but are limited to 144,000 members. That doesn't mean there are only 144,000 Christians. It means these 144,000 are the Christians that will be the kings, priests and judges with Jesus in that heavenly kingdom(Messianic Kingdom). There will be billions who will be subjects of the kingdom and live on a paradise earth that Jesus Christ and the 144,000 will rule over.
The first members of the true church who were the apostles and disciples of Jesus were all Jews, and circumcised converts. At Pentecost of 33 C.E. ten days after Jesus ascended to heaven, opened the way for others to follow him in due time. Jehovah indicated his selection of these members through the pouring out of holy spirit. Their receiving of the spirit on that occasion bore witness to them that they were now God’s spiritual sons and heirs of the kingdom with Christ. (Acts 2:1-4, 16-21, 33; Romans 8:16, 17) But the members of the true church did not remain all Jewish. Three and a half years after Jesus’ death the way was opened for Gentiles or non-Jews to be included. (Acts 10:30-33, 44; Romans 9:23, 24) So, in time, the true church came to have a international membership.
The true church that Jesus is head of isn't divided into a clergy class and laity class of the "common people." Jesus told his Apostles and disciples at Matthew 23:8-10 "Do not you be called Rabbi, for one is your teacher, whereas all you are brothers. Moreover, do not call anyone your father on earth, for one is your Father, the heavenly one. Neither be called leaders, for your leader is one, the Christ. So Jesus showed there was no divisions among those who make up the true church. Jesus did arrange for men to take the lead in the true church to serve the spiritual needs of their brothers and organized the work of preaching the good news. Jesus said such ones were not to lord it over their brothers but were to be like slaves or servants to their brothers.(Matthew 20: 25-28)
The true church that Jesus is head of isn't divided up into denominations but are united in their worship. The Apostle Paul was inspired to say at 1 Corinthians 1:10, " I exhort you, brothers, through the name of our Lord Jesus Christ that you should all speak in agreement, and that there should not be divisions among you, but that you may be fitly united in the same line of thought." So we cannot scripturally expect to find them scattered among all the conflicting religions of Christendom. The true church is gathered together in just one organization.
People will choose to believe what they choose to believe. Just because you or others don't believe that Jehovah's Witnesses are not true Christians isn't important to me. The people of Jesus day said he was the leader of the demons, a liar, a law breaker. So I expect people today to say the same things about Jehovah's Witnesses and I don't expect the majority in the world will listen to the truth that's in Gods written word. So when it comes to the majority of people they will not listen to what Jehovah's Witnesses say. People have the right to choose what they believe the truth is, that doesn't necessarily mean what they believe is the truth is, is actually the truth.

 

[Oseas]

my point is about the third Day, the Day of JESUS coming, not about the satanic expression "rapture" of you. What will be done now in the third Day or in this beginning of the first century of the third millennium or third Day after Christ, it is strictly what JESUS prophesied, saying what kind of selective process will be applied among the Christians/believers of all nations, as follows:
Before JESUS shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, and unto them on the left hand the punishment is already written.JESUS has already given the written punishment sentence: Depart from me, ye CURSED, into everlasting fire, prepared for the Devil and his angels, (in other words, prepared for the Devil and his TAIL, the Devil with his TAIL -the FALSE PREACHERS OF THE WORD OF GOD-ISAIAH 9:v.15-16- will RAPTURE the third part of the stars of heaven(Christians/believers as wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever), and will cast them from heaven to the earth.

I don't agree with everything you said here. For instance: Matthew 25:41-46 says:
41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.
46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.
I agree this will be going on during Jesus second presence, which is an invisible second presence. However I have found nowhere in scripture that this second presence of Jesus is called a third day. Jesus was resurrected the third day after his death yes, but after 40 days after his resurrection he returned to heaven.

Oh you are confessing by your own words that will not see JESUS in His coming, you imagine it will be "an invisible second presence".
I see that you yet know not my Lord JESUS, and I see also that you have not the Word of GOD in your heart -the Word is GOD- , understand?

Revelation 1:v.7-8
7 Behold, JESUS cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see JESUS, and they also which pierced JESUS: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of JESUS. Even so, Amen.
8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord -JESUS-, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

Once you know not JESUS, also know not GOD, the Father.

JESUS left very clear, saying: John 3:v. 3-5
3 - Jesus said : Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. Yeah, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit - GOD is Spirit -, he cannot enter into the kingdom of GOD.

 

[Oseas]

This destruction of these human unbelievers is when Armageddon is happening.

What do you understand as Ar-mag-eddon?

 

[Oseas]

... a person can't decide to join because Hebrews 12:23 says that the true church is, " church of firstborn who are written in the heavens." So God is the one who select the members, and as 1 Corinthians12:18 tells us, he sets them in the congregation as he pleases. These will be the ones who will be with Jesus in heaven

You say "GOD select the members and sets them in the congregation as He pleases, and these will be the ones who will be with Jesus in heaven".
OK, but in what heaven? I asked because "the heavens ... which are now, by the same Word are kept in store, reserved unto FIRE against this Day of Judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

Tell us what heaven is, of which you are speaking.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

Oseas said:
Oh you are confessing by your own words that will not see JESUS in His coming, you imagine it will be "an invisible second presence".
I see that you yet know not my Lord JESUS, and I see also that you have not the Word of GOD in your heart -the Word is GOD- , understand?[/QUOTE\]

Confessing with my own words Oseas? So you're saying what Jesus said at John 14:19 is a lie, you're saying Jesus is a liar? It's you who are going by your own words Oseas and by going by your own words, you're calling Jesus a liar. That's your choice.


Oseas quoted Revelation 1:v.7
7 Behold, JESUS cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see JESUS, and they also which pierced JESUS: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of JESUS. Even so, Amen.[/QUOTE\]

Oseas at Acts 1:9-11 it tells us that Jesus will come in the same manner he left. Well what was the manner he left. For one thing it was only the apostles and disciples of Jesus that saw him leave. The world, meaning unbelievers were unaware of it. So Jesus left quietly without public display. This scripture also shows us that a cloud caught Jesus up from their sight. After that cloud caught Jesus up from the apostles and disciples sight they couldn't see him any longer. Clouds represent invisibility.


There's a helpful comment regarding the word "see" which is at Matthew 24:30 and is found in a Greek-English Lexicon by Liddell and Scott. Concerning the greek word for "see" their lexicon (Volume 2, page 1245a) lists this as one of the meanings: Metaphorically, of mental sight, to discern, perceive. So the scriptures not only speaks of seeing with our eyes, but also seeing with our mind and heart. Just think about Romans 1:20, this Scripture shows us that we can perceive things or see things with our mind. In the case of Romans 1:20 we can see or perceive with our mind, Gods invisible qualities. Isn't it true with regard to, "the sign of the son of man" at Daniel 7:1 Daniel saw this with, "visions of his head" and so with the minds eye he saw this instead of literally seeing it with his literal fleshly eyes. It was in a similar vision that the apostle John was transported far into the future and could say: “I saw, and, look! a white cloud, and upon the cloud someone seated like a son of man, with a golden crown on his head and a sharp sickle in his hand.” (Revelation 14:14)
What about the use of “clouds” in all these texts? If you take a look at Daniel chapter 7, where the “sign” is first presented, you see Daniel’s use of symbolisms by which world governments are represented as “beasts” that come up out of the “sea”? (Daniel 7:2,3) Also at Daniel 7:13 he uses “clouds” in a figurative way to contrast with the symbolic “sea” and thus to show the heavenly situation where the authority is given to the “Son of man” whereby he rules and crushes the beastly governments that the sea of humanity has spawned.
In the scriptures, clouds are the accompaniments of the “power and great glory” Jesus mentioned at Matthew 24:30, and also are symbolic of invisibility. 1 Kings 8:10-12
At Mount Sinai it was in clouds and with thunder and lightning that Jehovah God “met” with Moses, and neither Moses nor the people below saw God with their fleshly eyes. (Exodus 20:21; 24:18; 33:20; Deuteronomy 4:11,12) Likewise, when God’s Son, Christ Jesus, took leave of his apostles and began his ascension to the heavens of God’s presence, the record at Acts 1:9 tells us: “While they were looking on, he was lifted up and a cloud caught him up from their vision.” The cloud thus cut him off from their literal eyesight but, on the day of Pentecost, Jehovah God opened their understanding to perceive that Jesus had ascended even to God’s right hand.(Acts 2:33-35) Since the angels, standing by at the time Christ began his ascension, told the disciples that Jesus would “come thus in the same manner,” we can be certain that his ‘coming in the clouds’ will be invisible to fleshly eyes and be perceived only with the ‘eyes of the heart.’ Like his Father, Jesus now “dwells in unapproachable light, whom not one of men has seen or can see.” Acts 1:1; 1 Timothy 6:15,16

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

You say "GOD select the members and sets them in the congregation as He pleases, and these will be the ones who will be with Jesus in heaven".
OK, but in what heaven? I asked because "the heavens ... which are now, by the same Word are kept in store, reserved unto FIRE against this Day of Judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

Tell us what heaven is, of which you are speaking.

After Jesus’ final meal with his apostles on the evening before his death, Jesus promised to reward them with a place in heaven. He said: “In the house of my Father there are many abodes. Otherwise, I would have told you, because I am going my way to prepare a place for you," (John 14:2) and on the day of Pentecost, Jehovah God opened the apostles and disciples of Jesus understanding and they perceived that Jesus had ascended even to God’s right hand.(Acts 2:33-35)
So Jesus is in the heaven where his Father and God is. This is where Gods kingdom is which also is called the Messianic kingdom, God has made Jesus king of the Messianic kingdom.

At

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

What do you understand as Ar-mag-eddon?

Armageddon is the war of Almighty God YHWH when God sends Jesus Christ with his Angels to destroy all those humans on earth that God has judged to be unrighteous.
YHWH's day” refers to “the great tribulation.” (Revelation 7:14) We will know when that tribulation begins because the Bible tells us about a most unusual proclamation. It will serve as a signal announcing the great tribulation. That will be the foretold proclamation of “peace and security.” Then “sudden destruction is to be instantly on them, just like birth pains on a pregnant woman.”

YHWH God first will destroy Babylon the Great, the world empire of false religion. Then, at Armageddon, he will destroy the rest of Satan’s world, including its political, military, and commercial systems.

Babylon the Great has brought much reproach on God’s name. She has taught lies about God. She has prostituted herself spiritually by forming alliances with earth’s rulers. She has used her power and influence to exploit her flocks. And she has spilled much blood, including the blood of God’s servants. (Revelation 19:2) YHWH God will destroy Babylon the Great, the great prostitute” by means of “the ten horns” of “a scarlet-colored wild beast.” That figurative wild beast represents the United Nations. The ten horns represent the current political powers supporting that organization. At God’s appointed time, those political powers will turn on symbolic Babylon. They “will make her devastated and naked” by plundering her wealth and exposing her wickedness. (Revelation 17:3, 16) That swift destruction, as if in one day, will come as a shock to those who supported her.
After the destruction of all false religious organizations, God’s people will stand out like a lone tree that survived a fierce storm. Satan, of course, will be enraged. He will vent that rage by using demonic propaganda, "unclean inspired expressions," to cause a coalition of nations to turn on YHWH servants. (Revelation 16:13, 14) That coalition is called “Gog of the land of Magog.” When the nations launch their attack, they will have arrived at the symbolic place called Armageddon. Revelation 16:16.

 

[Taken]

I heard that airline companies use to insure they hired only atheist pilots due to the rapture prophecy. Whether that's true or an urban legend I'm reminded of that when I read rapture discussions wherein we presume to know the when times.

It's sort of funny really. "Hello, this is your pilot speaking. We'll be flying at an altitude of thirty....."

 

[Taken]

Amen! All our speculations, calculations, stargazing, guessing, etc. are USELESS!

Did you know "Paul actually Expected" Great GRACE Departure "in his DAY"?:
So, should WE not Also "have THE SAME expectation" in OUR day?:

"Then WE which are alive and remain Shall Be CAUGHT UP..."
(1 Thessalonians 4:17)

Therefore, Paul, our apostle, Also Exhorts us to be "looking, watching, And
PATIENTLY WAITING For our Blessed HOPE, The LORD JESUS CHRIST!"
(2 Thessalonians 2:1; Romans 8:18-19; Romans 8:23; Romans 8:25;
1 Corinthians 1:7; Ephesians 6:12-18; Philippians 3:20; Colossians 4:1-3;
1 Thessalonians 1:10; 1 Thessalonians 5:5-11; Titus 2:13)

Amen?

GRACE And Peace...

Sure, men’s MIND’S are curious, and reactive to what a man HEARS and SEES, and then man makes Mindful LOGICAL calculated, speculative conclusions....
And Then shares those calculated, speculative conclusions....

And After those LOGICAL calculated, speculative conclusions are shared by the time they reach the ears of the third listener ...
those Mindful Logical, calculated, speculative conclusions ....
Have become magical FACTS... lol

Ever watch the TV History Channel? In one hour what begins as a speculation of words, magically ends with words and convincing images of supposed facts.

Much of Scripture covers “WARNINGS”, about the power of Words and the power of Seeing is Believing, and evil spirits and wicked men everywhere ready to convince the MINDS of men that lies are truths.

Scripture flat out reveals the MIND is AGAINST God.
The MIND can easily be manipulated.
Observe...Today’s society advocacy...encouragement...birth a babe and immediately separate that babe from the parents, for hours each day to a government sanctioned organization...day cares, schools, universities...
Mindful indoctrination.

** Jesus’ message HINGES on the “thoughts of the HEART”...
His Way, His Words, His Truth, His Power, His Keeping, His Promise...
** THE DAY, The Lords Heavenly (archangel) Servant CALLS UP the Lords (earthly) servants..... is of no matter to the Lords (earthly) servants.
** THE Lord has already PREPARED His (place) for His (earthly) servant.
** THE Lord has already PREPARED His (earthly) servant...(soul, spirit, body)... to BE Received unto Him.

** Jesus didn’t come to CHANGE MENS MINDS.
** Jesus CAME to CHANGE the HEARTS (of men willing to Have their Heart’s thoughts changed).

** THE BONUS -
A man who WILLINGLY elects to Have the Lord CHANGE his hearts thoughts.....
IS NOW PREPARED WITH Gods POWER IN that man:
to MAKE HIS “minds thoughts”, subservient to his “hearts thoughts”.

What an Awesome God we Serve. Nothing can “undermind” His Plan!

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[GRACE ambassador]

Did you know "Paul actually Expected" Great GRACE Departure "in his DAY"?:
So, should WE not Also "have THE SAME expectation" in OUR day?:

"Then WE which are alive and remain Shall Be CAUGHT UP..."
(1 Thessalonians 4:17) = Departure Readiness Plea!

What do you think?

I believe WE "in OUR day," Should have the same
Expectation as Paul "in his day" had, since, As IT Is Written:

1Co_4:16 Wherefore I beseech you, be ye followers of me.
1Co_11:1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also am Of CHRIST.
Eph_5:1 Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children;

GRACE And Peace...

I heard that airline companies use to insure they hired only atheist pilots...

This May be of interest to you:

Departure Readiness Plea!

 

[Oseas]

I believe WE "in OUR day," Should have the same Expectation as Paul "in his day" had, since, As IT Is Written:

1Co_4:16 Wherefore I beseech you, be ye followers of me.
1Co_11:1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also am Of CHRIST.
Eph_5:1 Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children;

GRACE And Peace...

This May be of interest to you:

Departure Readiness Plea!

But you and all cannot forget that "the Lord Himself shall descend from heaven with a SHOUT, with the VOICE of the archangel, and with the trump of GOD: and the dead in Christ shall rise first".

The question for you and all is: Are you hearing the voice of the archangel? The archangel comes before JESUS. What is his message? What is his preaching? By the way, every one that shall be found written in the book shall be delivered, understand? And MANY (not all) of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

Have you ears to hear the voice of the archangel? I MUST say that all the recent and current happenings in the earth are a consequence of his presence among us or with us, and the worst of the happenings will yet come. There time arrived and is only starting in which there will be a strong trouble, even a great distress and suffering such as never was, since there was a nation even to this current time, the heavens and the earth shall shake, but the Lord will be the hope of His people.

Get ready

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I know that the true God YHWH is working through his Only Begotten Son who is working through the true Church that Jesus is head of. When it comes to the true church, a person can't decide to join because Hebrews 12:23 says that the true church is, " church of firstborn who are written in the heavens." So God is the one who select the members, and as 1 Corinthians12:18 tells us, he sets them in the congregation as he pleases. These will be the ones who will be with Jesus in heaven. Jesus revealed at Luke 12:32 and Revelation 14:1-3 that not all professing to be Christians will be members of this true church, but are limited to 144,000 members. That doesn't mean there are only 144,000 Christians. It means these 144,000 are the Christians that will be the kings, priests and judges with Jesus in that heavenly kingdom(Messianic Kingdom). There will be billions who will be subjects of the kingdom and live on a paradise earth that Jesus Christ and the 144,000 will rule over.

Ahh yes treh gross misinterpretation of the 144,000! I am so saddened that satan is revealing rightr before your eyes that teh Watchtower gives you no opportunity obe born again! So you will not see the kingdom if you die in your present state!

But yesw, when Jesus establishes his physical kingdom on earth for 1,000 years there will be massive populations. Then after that 1,000 years god destroys the present universe, sneds the lost to the lake of fire to be tormented forever and ever and the rest of us live on the new earth with the New Jerusalem being on earth.

The first members of the true church who were the apostles and disciples of Jesus were all Jews, and circumcised converts. At Pentecost of 33 C.E. ten days after Jesus ascended to heaven, opened the way for others to follow him in due time. Jehovah indicated his selection of these members through the pouring out of holy spirit. Their receiving of the spirit on that occasion bore witness to them that they were now God’s spiritual sons and heirs of the kingdom with Christ. (Acts 2:1-4, 16-21, 33; Romans 8:16, 17) But the members of the true church did not remain all Jewish. Three and a half years after Jesus’ death the way was opened for Gentiles or non-Jews to be included. (Acts 10:30-33, 44; Romans 9:23, 24) So, in time, the true church came to have a international membership.

the very fact that in near 2,000 years God could not find 144,000 righteous ones and now there have been very many in the WATCHTROWER WHO CLAIM TO BE ONE OF THE TWELVE TRBIES THAT COMPRISE THE 144,000 IS TRULY LAUGHABLE!. THEN THE ORGANIZATION GETS TO BOOT OUT PARTS OF THE 144,000 WHEN God was the one who supposedly put them there in the first place. As PT Barnum said: "There is a sucker born every minute."

The true church that Jesus is head of isn't divided up into denominations but are united in their worship. The Apostle Paul was inspired to say at 1 Corinthians 1:10, " I exhort you, brothers, through the name of our Lord Jesus Christ that you should all speak in agreement, and that there should not be divisions among you, but that you may be fitly united in the same line of thought." So we cannot scripturally expect to find them scattered among all the conflicting religions of Christendom. The true church is gathered together in just one organization.
People will choose to believe what they choose to believe. Just because you or others don't believe that Jehovah's Witnesses are not true Christians isn't important to me. The people of Jesus day said he was the leader of the demons, a liar, a law breaker. So I expect people today to say the same things about Jehovah's Witnesses and I don't expect the majority in the world will listen to the truth that's in Gods written word. So when it comes to the majority of people they will not listen to what Jehovah's Witnesses say. People have the right to choose what they believe the truth is, that doesn't necessarily mean what they believe is the truth is, is actually the truth.

Yes we are united in our worship! And we don't need threats of disfellowhipping to have unity of faith and charity amongst ourselves even though we are from different denominations!

I am truly scared for you! You are lie me in the winter of our lives and you are approaching death sometime soon as I am. All teh gobbledy gook about the 144,000, one true channel, Gods discreet slave is all garbage! What matters is that because you reject the physical resurrection of Jesus from among teh dead in teh body He died in- you will never seen the kingdom.

YOu refuse to be born again as the bible commands (because the Watchtower won't let you ) so you will not even get to see the kingdom of God! These are things you need to ponder very v ery very carefully.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

People all choose what they believe the truth is in their study of the scriptures. Some say the the 144000 being a literal number is a misinterpretation, that's their right to believe that, doesn't necessarily mean they're correct.

Some argue that since Revelation contains highly symbolic language, all numbers found in this book, including the number 144,000, must be symbolic. (Revelation 1:1, 4; 2:10) I don't agree with that though, is clearly not correct. I agree, Revelation contains numerous symbolic numbers, but it also includes literal numbers. For instance, John speaks of “the twelve names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.” (Revelation 21:14) Clearly, the number 12 mentioned in this verse is literal, not symbolic. Further, the apostle John writes about “the thousand years” of Christ’s reign. That number is also to be taken literally, as a careful consideration of the Bible shows.(Revelation 20:3, 5-7) Hence, whether a number in Revelation is to be taken literally or symbolically depends on its background and setting.

That the number 144,000 is literal and refers to a limited number of individuals, a relatively small group when compared with the “great crowd,” also harmonizes with other Bible passages. For instance, later in the vision that the apostle John receives, the 144,000 are described as those who “were bought from among mankind as firstfruits.” (Revelation 14:1, 4) The expression “firstfruits” refers to a small representative selection. Also, while Jesus was on earth, he spoke about those who will rule with him in his heavenly Kingdom and called them a “little flock.” (Luke 12:32; 22:29) Indeed, those from among mankind who will rule in heaven are few in comparison with those of mankind who will inhabit the coming Paradise earth.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Some argue that since Revelation contains highly symbolic language, all numbers found in this book, including the number 144,000, must be symbolic. (Revelation 1:1, 4; 2:10) I don't agree with that though, is clearly not correct. I agree, Revelation contains numerous symbolic numbers, but it also includes literal numbers.

No you just accept teh lie that while the number 144,000 is true, the descritpion of who makes up that 144,000 is symbolic. If you thought that through, you would see how insane believing that is.

 

[ScottA]

Amen! All our speculations, calculations, stargazing, guessing, etc. are USELESS!

Did you know "Paul actually Expected" Great GRACE Departure "in his DAY"?:
So, should WE not Also "have THE SAME expectation" in OUR day?:

"Then WE which are alive and remain Shall Be CAUGHT UP..."
(1 Thessalonians 4:17)

Therefore, Paul, our apostle, Also Exhorts us to be "looking, watching, And
PATIENTLY WAITING For our Blessed HOPE, The LORD JESUS CHRIST!"
(2 Thessalonians 2:1; Romans 8:18-19; Romans 8:23; Romans 8:25;
1 Corinthians 1:7; Ephesians 6:12-18; Philippians 3:20; Colossians 4:1-3;
1 Thessalonians 1:10; 1 Thessalonians 5:5-11; Titus 2:13)

Amen?

GRACE And Peace...

Paul wasn't wrong...nor are we if we do the same. "Each in his own order."

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

No you just accept teh lie that while the number 144,000 is true, the descritpion of who makes up that 144,000 is symbolic. If you thought that through, you would see how insane believing that is.

I understand what others believe I just disagree with them, there are others who are not even Jehovah's Witnesses that agree that the 144000 are literal not symbolic. There are other's who believe the 144000 are symbolic, that's their prerogative.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I understand what others believe I just disagree with them, there are others who are not even Jehovah's Witnesses that agree that the 144000 are literal not symbolic. There are other's who believe the 144000 are symbolic, that's their prerogative.

Well you accept the biblical number 144,000 to be true and then the detailed description of who comprises the 144,000 to be completely symbolic. there is absolutely no warrant to accept either as symbolic.

 

[Oseas]

Armageddon is the war of Almighty God YHWH when God sends Jesus Christ with his Angels to destroy all those humans on earth that God has judged to be unrighteous.

Ar - Mag - eddom - (eddon means red) is a WAR pre-determined to occur in this current time, or in this current decade, against three unclean spirits like frogs that come out of the MOUTH of the dragon - red dragon, and out of the MOUTH of the Beast (the Gentile Beast of sea), and out of the MOUTH of the false prophet (the false messiah of the Jews-John 5:v.43-47 and 2 Thes. 2, the future ruler of Israel and as a master versed in Torah he will be the main guide of the esoteric, and kabbalistic, and spiritist Judaism).
THREE UNCLEAN SPIRITS LIKE FROGS - WHY FROGS? | Pure Bible Forum (and see www.sinaiticus.net )

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