Rapture Ready For Partial Rapture?

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Keraz

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And we have to face the facts that God plans for some of those His children, perhaps even us, to not only endure through the locust things, the cataclysms, the armies of unworldly horsemen with their angels loosed from Euphrates, the sickness and violence and famine and persecutions.

And that somehow for this one generation, these afflictions hold the key that wasn't important for other generations, and that somehow, this will accomplish in these Christians what God was able to do in every other generation, but could not accomplish in this generation.
Our generation has the privilege of being the one alive now; at the edge of the dramatic events prophesied for the end of the Christian era.
We are told to stand up, hold our heads high, for our liberation is near. Luke 21:28

Endurance? Yes, but not the terrible punishments that the Lord will inflict upon the ungodly peoples.
Revelation 12:14 says that those who keep firm in their faith will be taken to a place of safety during the 1260 days of the Great Trib.
Daniel 11:32-35 describes this time.
 

marks

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Jesus told John to the effect that the event to unfold will come quickly. If you consider the scroll as sealed by seven seals and the content of the scroll is not revealed or come into play until all the seals are broken, then you may apply His words differently.
On this part,

I think that the birth pangs in Matthew 24 are escalating conditions leading up to the 70th week. False annointed ones, false prophets, all seeking rule. Wars and rumors of wars, taking peace. Famines and diseases increasing.

I think the seals show those escalating conditions, birth pangs that increase and decrease, when the corresponding seal is opened, that condition is turned up to maximum for the 70th week.

False christs becomes the anti-christ, the beast. Wars and rumors of wars become dwarfed by the violence that takes over society. Famines and pestilence are unleashed.

The 5th seal, souls "under the altar", the Jews who have been martyred under the old covenant, there are more Jews to come, being martyred by the beast.

The sixth seal, sudden destruction. The seventh seal, the 70th week begins.

I see these seals opened in the same amount of time it takes to read the passage.

Much love!
 

Enoch111

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How you do you confirm or correct teachings?
Simple. Let's take just one verse which is specific to the rapture (1 Thess 4:17): Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Now let's focus on the first clause: Then we which are alive and remain...

Does Paul qualify that in any way and say: Then SOME OF US which are alive and remain..." ?

So that one verse thoroughly demolishes your false teaching about a partial rapture etc.
 

marks

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Who are these saints at the end of Revelation 18:23-24 when that event is about the fall of Babylon in detail of what the 2nd angel had announced in Revelation 14:8 which is after the rapture? Did the 144,000 dies off right away, because if you are, you are just applying whom the Lord designated to dispense the gospel from now on as the only believers saved during the great tribulation.
I'm not sure I really understand your question here,

Did the 144,000 dies off right away, because if you are, you are just applying whom the Lord designated to dispense the gospel from now on as the only believers saved during the great tribulation.

Revelation 18:23-24

23 And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived.
24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

Saints are holy ones but which ones? The gentile church which is on earth before the pre-trib rapture? Those who come to faith after the rapture? The Israelites? Does this have to mean "a portion of the pre-tribulation Christians who have been left behind"? I think there are much better answers than that.

Much love!
 

marks

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The falling away from the faith is the signalling of the end of the times of the Gentiles when the dispensation of the gospel will go back to the Jews, the 144,000 witnesses for the duration of the great tribulation which is after the rapture event.
Personally, I see the dispensation returning to Israel in the opening of the 5th seal.

Much love!
 

Enow

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God chastens us for our good, it says. So that God's chastening is effective, not ineffective.

Luke 12:40-49 has Jesus warning believers to be ready or else they will get cut off to have their portions with the unbelievers as in left behind. Jesus goes on to talking about those servants of His that got cut off for not being ready in getting measures of stripes per the knowledge for not being ready.

There will be disobedient children incurring the wrath of God, especially for those who treat communion for more than doing it only in remembrance of Him. Since there are many believers that take that one time sacrifice for sins being made present by certain priests to receive again, that would be the same as treating the blood of the Covenant on par with the blood of goats and bulls where it needs bear repeating again to receive again.

Hebrews 10:3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year. 4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins....

10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. 11 And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins: 12 But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God; 13 From henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool. 14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.15 Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us:

18 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.


26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, 27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. 28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: 29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people. 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

The sinning willfully part is on having that knowledge that there is no more offering for sin, and yet they practice as if there is still need repeating in the form of communion, hence the Mass. So I read here the consequences for sinning willfully in that manner.

Is there something in the 70th week of Daniel that contains a benefit required by Christians of a single generation?

Much love!

The prodigal son gave up his inheritance for wild living; he cannot get it back; it is lost; but he is still son and can come Home.

The loss is that he will miss out on the firstfruits of the resurrection where he could have been like the angels that never die, that not marry nor given in marriage, could have had a mansion in the Father's house above and could have had a seat at the King's table above.

So what will the prodigal son have? Not the firstfruits' benefits. Resurrected after the great tribulation, the power of the second death will not be over them, meaning they are kept from going to the lake of fire; they will marry and have families in setting examples for the coming generations during the millennium reign as they shall serve the King of kings from all over the world in representing Him and the City of God on earth. They will have access to the tree of life in the City of God for the healing of the nations. Then one day at the great white throne judgment, death and hell will be cast into the lake of fire when no one will physically die then, let alone sin against God. So the benefits are different than being a part of the firstfruits.
 

marks

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Correct because we are not in that great tribulation when there is only one great tribulation as assigned to that time period when the son of perdition reveals himself for why the "Jews" have to flee.



Still consider part of the tribulation of this time in the world we are in. Jesus assigned the great tribulation as a time period of the son of perdition.



The trials of our faith and the temptations of living in this world we are in now can be a snare, but that is the tribulation we are living in now.



The requirement is to run that race by looking to the author & finisher of our faith to help us lay aside every weight & sin to be received by the Bridegroom as that vessel unto honor in His House. If there was no accountability to what we do, then where is the terror?

2 Corinthians 5:7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:) 8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. 9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. 10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. 11 Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

So those unrepentant saints left behind along with new believers after the rapture that die, their spirits will be present with the Lord but their resurrection will not come until after the great tribulation as vessels unto dishonor in His House. 2 Timothy 2:19-21 note verse 20
Hi Enow,

I don't think I'm being understood.

My question for you is this. Your view is that God will rapture some and leave some Christians to endure the Great Tribulation, as this will be necessary for them, this is correct?

My question is, What will this accomplish for them that could not have been accomplished without the "great tribulation", considering that no other generation of Christians needed to endure the great tribulation? What makes one generation of Christians special?

Much love!
 

marks

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The 'rapture' is a false teaching and has fooled many. I can only suggest that 'rapture' believers at least consider the truth of the Lord's protection during all that will take place.
Well of course God will be with us through whatever comes!

My belief in the rapture has nothing to do with escapism.

Much love!
 

Enow

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There is building with wood, hay, and stubble, and in that instance those things get burned, though the person still saved.

And there is corrupting/destroying the temple of God, that is, the union of believers, and that person will be corrupted/destroyed. I think you may be mixing two things here.

Much love!

God commands churches to excommunicate an unrepentant brother for this effect below.

1 Corinthians 5:4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, 5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

As God commands, so will He do in how He judges each believer for not being ready as found abiding in Him to deliver such a one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh since he will be waging war on the saints after the rapture, and yet He is faithful to those left behind in the keeping of their souls.

1 Corinthians 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. 16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.
 

marks

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marks said:

How do you know that those who destroy God's temple are Christians?


I did leave scriptural reference for you to click on to see the verses, but here it is.

1 Corinthians 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

1 Corinthians 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. 16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

Your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit, so don't be joining it to a prostitute.

15 Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.
16 What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh.
17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.
18 Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body.
19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

You all together are the temple of God, so don't defile that temple (context, division)! Any who destroy God's temple, God will destroy!

16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

But these verses do not actually tell us that God will destroy a Christian. And even so, If this is saying that God will cast some of His children into the Great Tribulation, It says that God will destroy them, not that they will be saved though as through fire. Right?

Much love!
 

Enow

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Keraz said:
Why DO people believe in a rapture to heaven?


But the Bible never says that God will take His people to heaven.
The 'rapture' to heaven of the Church theory is just a construct made up from a few scriptures that people make out to mean a removal from the earth. John 14:1-3 is a prime example, it plainly says; ...I will come again and where I am you will be with Me....

Hardly a few and you have yet to share your rightly dividing the word of truth on all the scriptures shared in this thread that does testify to it.

This is plainly a reference to the Return of Jesus, as described in Acts 1:11 and Revelation 19:11, when He comes accompanied by the angel army and commences His Millennium reign.
The place He has prepared comes to the earth after the Millennium, as per Revelation 21:1-7

The 'rapture' is a false teaching and has fooled many. I can only suggest that 'rapture' believers at least consider the truth of the Lord's protection during all that will take place.

Since you do provide Bible studies and the like, are you sure the foot of pride is not keeping you from learning scripture that testifies otherwise?

Which is better? To deny the correction by scripture or keep selling those things that say otherwise? Would it not be better to correct any literature put out to be more fruitful as Hid disciple than to continue teaching otherwise?

John 15:1I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman. 2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

Pray about it, brother.
 

marks

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Since it is judging every man's work for what it is laid on that foundation laid by Jesus Christ, then it goes beyond church assembly to the actual physical body of the believer that will be destroyed with death for defiling the temple of God.
In that case this is happening now, and has, and will continue to, and therefore has nothing to do with the 70th week, and therefore has no bearing on the rapture. This is just a normal and standard process with God towards this sort of believer.

Much love!
 

Enow

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The church still sees it.

Remember, these letters were to a church at that time, that was experiencing a certain issue, in this case, Jezebel. And when the other churches saw what Jesus did with this church, they would know that Jesus is the One Who searches everything out.

That church suffered Jezebel and did after her works. He addressed those in that city that did not have her doctrine nor speak as she did, to hold fast.

That warning is to all churches that fall in like manner to repent or else as God will judge the churches in according to their works.

In a partial rapture? In a judgment after death? In tribulations during the 1st century? I don't see any reference to rapture here, and if we were to suppose that was what was meant, then, again, we have huge issues with 1 Thessalonians 4, and the doctrine of justification by faith in Christ.

And we have to face the facts that God plans for some of those His children, perhaps even us, to not only endure through the locust things, the cataclysms, the armies of unworldly horsemen with their angels loosed from Euphrates, the sickness and violence and famine and persecutions.

And that somehow for this one generation, these afflictions hold the key that wasn't important for other generations, and that somehow, this will accomplish in these Christians what God was able to do in every other generation, but could not accomplish in this generation.

I just can't make sense of that idea.

Much love!

The warning in Revelations is a warning to all believers that are at risk for not being ready nor found abiding in Him when the Bridegroom comes. The tribulation of our times is not applicable for the events of the great tribulation that is coming.

The church at Philadelphia are promised to be kept from the hour of temptation that shall try all upon the earth as that would mean a removal from the earth at the rapture event. That promise is only contingent if they hold fast just as the consequence for the believers at Thyatira if they do not repent.
 

friend of

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So not every saved believer will be rapture ready when the Bridegroom comes for why God will judge His House first.

Those who aren't ready are like the 5 foolish virgins

I think
 
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Enow

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The reprobate are not God's children, they are reprobate. As you say, disqualified. Rejected as a result of testing.

The pure, and the defiled, who are rejected. They profess to know God, buthey don't.

This says nothing about the pure becoming defiled and reprobate, rather, it speaks of them separate and distinct.

1 Timothy 4:1Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

The preaching of a baptism of the "Holy Ghost" with the evidence of tongues to already saved believers to seek after, the slain in the spirit, the holy laughter movement, the Pensacola Outpouring, the Toronto's Blessings, Ernest Angeley's Healing Crusade, and etc. is the hypocrisy whereby saved believers with the Holy Spirit already in them are seeking to receive spirits after a sign in committing spiritual fornication/adultery against Jesus.

The rudiment which is the lie that they can receive the Holy Spirit "again" in the life of a saved believer is why God permits that strong delusion to occur as that damnation is to be left behind in becoming vessels unto dishonor in His House. It was already at work in Paul's days.

2 Thessalonians 2:1Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, 2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. 3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first....

7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, 10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: 12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

The reproof for that lie is below where there is only one tine that believers shall receive the promise of the Holy Spirit and it was at our salvation moment at the calling of the gospel when we had first believed.

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: 14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. 15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

Oh . . . what makes you think the marriage supper is in heaven? Who comes from "the east and the west"?

Luke 13:24-30

Luke 12:40-49

40 Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not.
41 Then Peter said unto him, Lord, speakest thou this parable unto us, or even to all?
42 And the Lord said, Who then is that faithful and wise steward, whom his lord shall make ruler over his household, to give them their portion of meat in due season?
43 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.
44 Of a truth I say unto you, that he will make him ruler over all that he hath.
45 But and if that servant say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; and shall begin to beat the menservants and maidens, and to eat and drink, and to be drunken;
46 The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers.
47 And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes.
48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.
49 I am come to send fire on the earth; and what will I, if it be already kindled?

Who are the servants here? The gentile church? That didn't exist yet? That was still a hidden truth, a mystery? Or was it the same as all the rest of Jesus' parables, the servants are of Israel?

Verse 40 is addressing believers even though Peter was not sure for why he had asked the question and it was in relations to the topic of being ready when He comes to receive and cut off, as in leave behind saved believers that were found in iniquity and thus were not ready for why they were getting stripes and facing that fire that is coming on the earth that Peter was talking about in 2 Peter 3:3-15

The Lord will appoint his portion with the unbelievers . . . because . . . he is an unbeliever. If he were a believer, he would have done differently.

Much love!

The consequence for not being ready, is to be cut off; you cannot be a part of the vine to be cut off unless you are a believer.

And unbelievers do not get measures of stripes per the knowledge of not being ready. There is no point. The stripes is to make sure those servants never do that again, especially during the millennium reign of Christ when they serve the King of kings on earth after the great tribulation.
 

marks

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2 Peter 2:20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.

1 John 2
18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

They knew the truth, and even were in the church. They looked like us. We didn't know who they were, they looked so much like us! But when they left, then we could see, they never really were of us.

Much love!
 

marks

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Revelation 12:14 says that those who keep firm in their faith will be taken to a place of safety during the 1260 days of the Great Trib.
Really?

Revelation 12:14
14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

If you equate this woman with the church, OK, but I don't see that. This woman gave birth to Christ. This woman is clothed with the sun, crowned with 12 stars, the moon under her feet, this woman is Israel.

Much love!
 

Enow

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Hi Enow,

I don't think I'm being understood.

My question for you is this. Your view is that God will rapture some and leave some Christians to endure the Great Tribulation, as this will be necessary for them, this is correct?

My question is, What will this accomplish for them that could not have been accomplished without the "great tribulation", considering that no other generation of Christians needed to endure the great tribulation? What makes one generation of Christians special?

Much love!

Granted, those not found abiding in Him that are in the grave, will not be resurrected just as those not found abiding in Him in the land of the living will not participate in the first fruits of the resurrection.

The accomplishment for those living saints that were not found abiding in Him? That is when the Father chastens them as that is when God judges His House with stripes for not being ready. They are with the Lord by their spirits under the altar, but they missed out on the firstfruits of the resurrection.
 

marks

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The consequence for not being ready, is to be cut off; you cannot be a part of the vine to be cut off unless you are a believer.

And unbelievers do not get measures of stripes per the knowledge of not being ready. There is no point. The stripes is to make sure those servants never do that again, especially during the millennium reign of Christ when they serve the King of kings on earth after the great tribulation.
My question is . . . how do any of these things that you've mentioned apply to those who live during this last generation of this age, how do these things apply to them but not to every other generation?

Much love!