Should Christians Always Be Healed?

[marks]

Is the power in your faith or in your God?

Are we thinking that if we are not feeling sufficiently internally "pumped" that we have to work ourselves up more to convince God "we believe"?

What exactly is it we are to believe? I'd answer, we are to believe God can do all things, and can in us do all things.

Is your faith strong enough to be healed by God? I wonder about how valid or worthwhile is that question.

Is your faith strong enough to without reservation to entrust yourself to God? This is the question, this faith is first. First, trust in God for you overall care. And secondly, if at all, break it down to the details, this healing, that healing, is it His will to heal my finger?

But I find I pretty much just need to stay in that first faith, that God will care for my every need, my every concern, and I can cast all my cares on Him. And I'm not getting the sense that there are healings He is withholding because I'm not trusting Him. I have good reason to not think that.

Is the devil making you ill? Resist the devil and he will flee. That is all you need do, resist, and he will flee. Do you have faith to believe that?

Is God allowing sickness to train you in greater faith? Trust Him.

Can we avoid illness by a better lifestyle? Cooperate with Him as He is renewing our minds, it will include healthy living.

In all these things trust Him, allow for whatever He may want to do, and rest in His love.

Much love!

 

[Mayflower]

To me this is the act of faith, the sign of a trusting spirit. No matter what it looks like, just shake it off and keep on with your work.

I suppose we can get all worked up over, Oh will He heal my arm???? Will He?? Won't He?? Should I be faithing for my healing or not?

He just shook it off and went on.

That's more my take on things, I don't need all the dramatics, I can ask, and when God heals, I know it was His will, and when He doesn't, I know it wasn't.

I guess there's the tendency like with so many other things to want to make this all emotional and confrontational, take up those spiritual arms!! I've got a cold!!

In quietness and trust is our strength. I get the feeling some aren't feeling that strength, and need to "get more involved". If He does, He does, and if He doesn't, He doesn't.

It sound's like some people feel the need to get all worked up inside to make sure they are trusting enough, but I see that trusting as the quiet assurance inside. I suppose if that doesn't sound like it's good enough, maybe that's the one who lacks that confidence, and replaces it with fervor?

Maybe this is the winner post for me . . . He just shook it off and continued what he was doing. That to me is faith.

Much love!

I love that. That quiet, confident assurance is important. We don't have to prove anything to anyone, though I think being able to defend things can be important. We have been going through a healing series for the last couple months at my church. I just was excited to read this and find out what actually has stuck with me. We haven't really talked too much about judgement or anything like that. Just different passages of scripture where God has healed, spoke against sickness, how people believed, stepped out in faith. It is all very encouraging to me. I have gained more faith for times of sickness. It really helped when my husband has been sick with covid this last month/beginning of this one. I've been in a word of faith church for a little over a year. Healing is not quite taught here like I have learned in the past. But I am excited, because the in important part is just growing closer to Christ and trusting in God and His Word. When trials come up, the Word is there!

It just kind of urks to hear it part of God's will for someone to be sick, because God's intention is to save. The devil comes to steal, kill, and destroy. He is the snake. Not God.

The snake was fastened on him, hanging off him. Praise God he could just shake it off unharmed.

 

[Paul Christensen]

This is my primary argument on the issue as well. Formulas and absolutes are the problem, as they negate the need for discernment and knowing the specific will of God in each individual situation.

I should be getting back into this thread tomorrow, and I have some responses to some of the things you stated elsewhere. I think you miss the mark in a few other cases, but have some interesting things to say in others. We can get to it then. Thanks for contributing to the thread. I appreciate it.

I think that the conflict is between theory and reality. I am certain that the Bible promises healing for those who ask God for it. There are too many clear promises in Scripture to deny it. These promises are what I define as "theory". Those who believe and teach that God always heals those who have enough faith, usually blame the sick person for not having enough faith for their healing, or that there must be sin in their life that stops the healing happening. They can't accept that God holds back healing for reasons known only to Himself. They would see that as God not being faithful to His own promises. They seem to be blind that there may be other factors that causes a sick person to remain sick, no matter how godly they are, or how believing in God's Word, or how prayerful.

What I define as "reality" is that in the real world, not all sick people get healed. People get sick and die in spite of all the believing, quoting of Scripture and passionate prayer directed to God for their healing.

There is a contradiction where all who came to Jesus were healed, but in our day most who pray for healing, or are prayed for go away still sick. Of course there are testimonies of sick people being miraculously healed, but it seems more of a hit and miss lottery than something that is certain and predictable.

There are those in threads like this who are adamant that it is always God's will to heal. They quote the appropriate Scriptures to prove it and will not entertain that God may choose not to heal someone. So, a sick person reading those posts usually reacts with, "What's wrong with me that I am not healed?" Then they go through an extensive process of ultra-self examination to search out the "sin" that stops them being healed. They confess their sins and faults to all and sundry, increase counsellor's incomes by extended counselling sessions - all to no avail. In the end they become discouraged and depressed, thinking that maybe they have committed the unforgiveable sin which has condemned them to a life of sickness and infirmity.

Although I have attempted to come up with some answers, I still don't know all of them. Perhaps it is because I, like all ordinary believers, have only partial knowledge of how God goes about things - why He heals some, and allows others to remain infirm. Perhaps we will get the full story when we meet Jesus face to face. But then, when we get there, the issues may turn into non-issues.

 

[Paul Christensen]

Duh, the viper never bit Paul; he just shook it off unharmed (Acts 28:5).

The reference says that the viper fastened itself on to Paul's hand. The only way a snake can do that is with its fangs. The observers saw it and knew that he had actually been bitten. They fully expected him to swell up with the poison and fall down dead, thinking it happened to him because he was an evil criminal who, having escaped the shipwreck, retribution was catching up with him for his crimes. Then when Paul shook the creature off into the fire and did not suffer any harm, they decided he was a god. If Paul had just shook the snake off with being bitten, the observers would not have reacted the way they did. Also, Luke would not have said that the snake fastened itself onto Paul's hand.

The event with the snake confirmed Paul's apostleship with the people (200 of them, as well as the Maltese who were there) and opened them to Paul's preaching of the Gospel to them. It also opened the way for Publius, the chief official to be healed of dysentery, as well as many Maltese being healed of their diseases through Paul's ministry to them.

 

[Mayflower]

I merely pointed out the false claim that Paul was bitten by the snake.

The Word of Faith movement, though sadly misguided, draws attention to the main reason why many intelligent skeptics say they reject Christianity--that Christianity doesn't deliver on its promise. The discrepancy between the miracles implied by Jesus' faith promises and the harsh reality that almost none of us have seen the diabetic or the blind healed, etc. must be more effectively addressed. It is woefully inadequate, for example, to say sometimes God says Yes, sometimes He says No, and sometimes He says Wait. That simplistic answer creates the impression that diabetics and the blind are often healed in response to faith-filled prayer. Harsh reality suggests one of 2 regrettable conclusions: either most Christians have no clue on how to exercise effective healing faith or it is rarely God's will to answer petitions that require real miracles. Neither conclusion is conducive to preventing many a faith crisis.

Most Christians can't know how to exercise effective healing faith. Over 70% of "Christians" believe there are ways other then Jesus Christ for a person to be saved. People can't know the will of God if they do not read His Word or know it.

 

[marks]

It just kind of urks to hear it part of God's will for someone to be sick, because God's intention is to save. The devil comes to steal, kill, and destroy. He is the snake. Not God.

I figure that if God allows us to remain sick or infirm there must be a good reason for it.

I've received major healings when I wasn't trusting, wasn't even saved, but God miraculously saved me from death. God gave me a healing a few years ago from depression, but then allowed it back. It's a long story to tell, and it was a difficult few years, but in ways that God did heal me, and in ways He didn't, I see His wisdom and His love woven throughout.

I don't have any thoughts really on whether I should or shouldn't be healed, I've seen too many times where it works out differently from what I thought. I just have leave it up to Him. I've received some serious and life altering gifts from God through suffering and illness, things I wouldn't want to give up, things that I don't know how they could have come another way.

I don't have a problem with afflictions, well, I don't like them any better than anyone else, but I've learned, they bring gifts, and we can welcome them as old friends. Because Jesus is in them.

Much love!

 

[marks]

The event with the snake confirmed Paul's apostleship with the people (200 of them, as well as the Maltese who were there) and opened them to Paul's preaching of the Gospel to them. It also opened the way for Publius, the chief official to be healed of dysentery, as well as many Maltese being healed of their diseases through Paul's ministry to them.

All that, and it sounds like it was nothing to Paul!

Much love!

 

[Enoch111]

I’m not so sure, since it was His first miracle. conSidering the blood on the doorpost and first borns Or the parting of the sea. what wine makes glad, I still ask. What wine helps with being timid?

Since you brought up the Exodus, the first major miracle of Moses (not the test case which went before it) was turning water into blood (a judgment) in Egypt. But the first miracle of Christ was turning water into wine (a blessing). When we recall what Jesus said about new wine in new wineskins, that was a reference to the New Covenant and the Gospel. So symbolically and spiritually it is the new wine of the Gospel which gladdens the heart. Gospel means "Glad Tidings of Great Joy".

 

[Mayflower]

I think that the conflict is between theory and reality. I am certain that the Bible promises healing for those who ask God for it. There are too many clear promises in Scripture to deny it. These promises are what I define as "theory". Those who believe and teach that God always heals those who have enough faith, usually blame the sick person for not having enough faith for their healing, or that there must be sin in their life that stops the healing happening. They can't accept that God holds back healing for reasons known only to Himself. They would see that as God not being faithful to His own promises. They seem to be blind that there may be other factors that causes a sick person to remain sick, no matter how godly they are, or how believing in God's Word, or how prayerful.

What I define as "reality" is that in the real world, not all sick people get healed. People get sick and die in spite of all the believing, quoting of Scripture and passionate prayer directed to God for their healing.

There is a contradiction where all who came to Jesus were healed, but in our day most who pray for healing, or are prayed for go away still sick. Of course there are testimonies of sick people being miraculously healed, but it seems more of a hit and miss lottery than something that is certain and predictable.

There are those in threads like this who are adamant that it is always God's will to heal. They quote the appropriate Scriptures to prove it and will not entertain that God may choose not to heal someone. So, a sick person reading those posts usually reacts with, "What's wrong with me that I am not healed?" Then they go through an extensive process of ultra-self examination to search out the "sin" that stops them being healed. They confess their sins and faults to all and sundry, increase counsellor's incomes by extended counselling sessions - all to no avail. In the end they become discouraged and depressed, thinking that maybe they have committed the unforgiveable sin which has condemned them to a life of sickness and infirmity.

Although I have attempted to come up with some answers, I still don't know all of them. Perhaps it is because I, like all ordinary believers, have only partial knowledge of how God goes about things - why He heals some, and allows others to remain infirm. Perhaps we will get the full story when we meet Jesus face to face. But then, when we get there, the issues may turn into non-issues.

This is what happens though when people say it is God's will for sickness. People ask what is wrong with them that God would cause that/allow that. I have many times in the past under this teaching. It is a lie. God does not intend harm for His people.

He can use sickness for correction, Bible shows that, but most of the time, it is the devil or a fallen world. I curse sickness and command sickness to leave in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth and I pray complete healing over me and my family. Whether it works for me or not, I believe by His stripes I am already healed. It is done whether it manifests in this lifetime or not. Sometimes faith is the only thing that gets you through trials in life. It doesn't mean the miracle can't happen.

 

[Mayflower]

I figure that if God allows us to remain sick or infirm there must be a good reason for it.

I've received major healings when I wasn't trusting, wasn't even saved, but God miraculously saved me from death. God gave me a healing a few years ago from depression, but then allowed it back. It's a long story to tell, and it was a difficult few years, but in ways that God did heal me, and in ways He didn't, I see His wisdom and His love woven throughout.

I don't have any thoughts really on whether I should or shouldn't be healed, I've seen too many times where it works out differently from what I thought. I just have leave it up to Him. I've received some serious and life altering gifts from God through suffering and illness, things I wouldn't want to give up, things that I don't know how they could have come another way.

I don't have a problem with afflictions, well, I don't like them any better than anyone else, but I've learned, they bring gifts, and we can welcome them as old friends. Because Jesus is in them.

Much love!

That is a good take on it. Bless you Marks.

 

[Waiting on him]

A miracle of creation. Jesus is the Creator.

Much love!

Interestingly the pots that He chose to transform in, were the pots all the guests had just washed their hands in.

 

[Paul Christensen]

I merely pointed out the false claim that Paul was bitten by the snake.

The Word of Faith movement, though sadly misguided, draws attention to the main reason why many intelligent skeptics say they reject Christianity--that Christianity doesn't deliver on its promise. The discrepancy between the miracles implied by Jesus' faith promises and the harsh reality that almost none of us have seen the diabetic or the blind healed, etc. must be more effectively addressed. It is woefully inadequate, for example, to say sometimes God says Yes, sometimes He says No, and sometimes He says Wait. That simplistic answer creates the impression that diabetics and the blind are often healed in response to faith-filled prayer. Harsh reality suggests one of 2 regrettable conclusions: either most Christians have no clue on how to exercise effective healing faith or it is rarely God's will to answer petitions that require real miracles. Neither conclusion is conducive to preventing many a faith crisis.

The elephant in the room which many don't see is the lack of clear New Testament references that directly promises guaranteed healing for Christian believers.

The Old Testament Scriptures that promise healing were directed to the Israelites coming out of Egypt and during their time in the wilderness before entering the Promised Land. Once they entered Canaan, the promise of healing was on the condition that they remained faithful to God in what He commanded them. There is no doubt that people got healed (Naaman and the widow's son for example) but these were not on demand, but according to the sovereignty of God. It is true that Jesus healed all who came to Him, but these were for the unconverted Jews to confirm that He was their true Messiah. The healing miracles that happened through Paul were in conjunction with the preaching of the Gospel to the unconverted Jews and Gentiles. The only indication that healing was available to church members was what James said about the sick person calling for the elders of the church and that the prayer of faith would raise the person up. But then the early church was quite a different church to the type of churches we have today.

Isaiah 53 does not speak directly of physical healing. It says that the Messiah will carry our griefs and sorrows. Jesus adapted His quote of Isaiah to confirm His Messiahship through His ministry of healing the sick among the unconverted Jews. There is no reference that this extensive ministry of healing was to continue for converted believers in the Christian church. The ministry of healing through Paul was the extension of the sign for the unconverted that the Gospel was true and that they should believe it.

Although gifts of healing is listed among the spiritual gifts, there are no instructions about how these gifts were to be used, or who they were to be directed to. Many presume that the gifts of healing were for any sick person in the church, but in the absence of any clear instruction about it, it has to remain as presumption. So, to say that healing for Christian believers is in God's Word, is not quite true, except for those in churches where there are elders to pray for them, and only in non-judgmental environments where it would be safe for believers to confess their faults to one another. Non-judgmental environments like those are quite rare in many of our modern church situations and it would be inadvisable for anyone to disclose their inner faults for fear of negative judgment from those who would berate them for their faults , shortcomings and failures.

 

[Paul Christensen]

All that, and it sounds like it was nothing to Paul!

Much love!

He knew that God was calling him to preach the Gospel at Rome, and knew that a snake bite was not going to prevent him from doing so. Satan tried to kill him using the snake, but the Holy Spirit stepped in and made the venom inactive. There is no anti-venom like Holy Spirit anti-venom!!

 

[Paul Christensen]

This is what happens though when people say it is God's will for sickness. People ask what is wrong with them that God would cause that/allow that. I have many times in the past under this teaching. It is a lie. God does not intend harm for His people.

He can use sickness for correction, Bible shows that, but most of the time, it is the devil or a fallen world. I curse sickness and command sickness to leave in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth and I pray complete healing over me and my family. Whether it works for me or not, I believe by His stripes I am already healed. It is done whether it manifests in this lifetime or not. Sometimes faith is the only thing that gets you through trials in life. It doesn't mean the miracle can't happen.

I read a good saying that went like this: "When we are well, we prepare for sickness and infirmity. When we are sick we prepare for restoration to health." This means that when we are healthy we use the time to work effectively for the Lord as we are able. When we are infirm, we learn patience under suffering, believing after we have suffered a while, we will be restored and come forth shining as gold. I believe that suffering through sickness and other causes is a calling of God which we will receive honour for our faith in Christ and our patience. Job was one of those people. His friends thought he had sinned in some way and had incurred God's displeasure, but Job knew that he had done nothing wrong and so remained faithful in his attitude to the sovereignty of God. What we know, which Job and his friends didn't, was that Job's suffering had nothing to do with him or anything he had done, but something to do between God and Satan. This can often happen to saints of God when Satan brings misfortune and sickness to try and show the Lord that the believer is not as faithful as he makes himself out to be. When that believer shows faithfulness and patience under the suffering, Satan is defeated and has to retreat with egg on his face.

A healing miracle is for the unconverted, to show them that the Gospel is true, that Jesus is alive today, and that they can have confidence that they will be saved if they believe the Gospel. Faith and patience under sickness and suffering is for the believer's benefit, that he will receive honour and blessing from the Lord as his reward for his faithfulness to the Lord whatever his circumstances may be.

 

[Faithbuilders]

That is a dangerous teaching. Many have died needlessly because they were prayed for and then told they were healed. So they stopped taking their medication and did not return to the doctor. As a result, what was a treatable condition caused their deaths. When Jesus or Paul prayed for a sick person, they were totally healed on the spot. They didn't have to tell the people they were healed. The total disappearance of the symptoms or disability spoke for itself.

If you are teaching that people are healed as the result of prayer in spite of the symptoms of the condition still remaining, then what do you do when you have a serious medical condition and prayer doesn't do anything? Do you stop taking medication? Do you keep away from the doctor? What happens when your condition gets worse and life threatening and you end up in hospital fighting for your life? Would you think that your teaching of healing "by faith" is valid, seeing that it doesn't actually work for you?

It is one thing teaching others, and quite another putting your own teaching into practice for yourself.

First faith prayer WILL always come to pass, always! Second, the teaching of being healed when you pray as the bible teaches, is not dangerous, but, it is when people substitute presumption for faith that is dangerous. When I was healed of seizures, I knew I was healed, I wanted to stop taking my meds. My mom convinced me to still take them for the time, I honored her, and still took the meds; but I still said I was healed, even tho I did not feel healed. One day at school, I got so dizzy that I almost fell down the stairs; I went to the doctor, and he told me my meds were to strong, and to stop taking them.

I knew I was healed, not because I felt anything, but just because the bible said I was healed.... but like when Jesus sent the lepers to the priests to show that they were clean, I let the doctor prove what I already knew, and then I stopped taking the pills.

There are 3 main reasons why prayer is not answered.

1) It was not prayed in faith
2) There is something blocking the answer, like unforgiveness...
3) You gave up to soon; often just before the answer arrives.

 

[Faithbuilders]

If you are teaching that Christian believers should automatically be instantly healed as the result of prayer or laying on of hands, how come it doesn't happen to you when you get a cold, a headache, or pull a muscle while digging the garden? Paul said in Romans 3, "If you are teaching others, are you teaching yourself as well?"

Actually it does, at least for me. I have not had a cold in a very long time, but every once in a while a headache tries to attach itself to me. I speak to the headache like Jesus spoke to the fever, and tell it to go in Jesus Name. And it always gos.

 

[Lambano]

The elephant in the room which many don't see is the lack of clear New Testament references that directly promises guaranteed healing for Christian believers.

When my father-in-law was dying of lung cancer, many well-meaning people brought stories of friends and relatives who beat cancer or who God healed of some sickness or other. I can still hear my wife’s plaintive cry, “But why won’t He heal my dad?” Then she broke into tears.

 

[Faithbuilders]

Duh, the viper never bit Paul; he just shook it off unharmed (Acts 28:5).

They were waiting for him to die, so yes, it bit him.

 

[Faithbuilders]

Is the power in your faith or in your God?

Are we thinking that if we are not feeling sufficiently internally "pumped" that we have to work ourselves up more to convince God "we believe"?

What exactly is it we are to believe? I'd answer, we are to believe God can do all things, and can in us do all things.

Is your faith strong enough to be healed by God? I wonder about how valid or worthwhile is that question.

Is your faith strong enough to without reservation to entrust yourself to God? This is the question, this faith is first. First, trust in God for you overall care. And secondly, if at all, break it down to the details, this healing, that healing, is it His will to heal my finger?

But I find I pretty much just need to stay in that first faith, that God will care for my every need, my every concern, and I can cast all my cares on Him. And I'm not getting the sense that there are healings He is withholding because I'm not trusting Him. I have good reason to not think that.

Is the devil making you ill? Resist the devil and he will flee. That is all you need do, resist, and he will flee. Do you have faith to believe that?

Is God allowing sickness to train you in greater faith? Trust Him.

Can we avoid illness by a better lifestyle? Cooperate with Him as He is renewing our minds, it will include healthy living.

In all these things trust Him, allow for whatever He may want to do, and rest in His love.

Much love!

You can't separate the two, God is a God of faith, it is impossible to please God without faith, and the righteous live by faith.

 

[Faithbuilders]

Sorry, I missed a question about judgment that came up.

"Like with Ananias and Sapphira having breathed their last."

First those two did not get sick, they just dropped dead. God does not make us sick as judgment, but sin will open the door for the devil to come in and make people sick.

Remember it is the devil that comes to steal, kill, and destroy; Jesus came to give us an abundant life.