Should members need to disclose their denomination?

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Lifelong_sinner

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Jesus has always existed. Our WCF chpt 2 states;
“In the unity of the Godhead there be three persons, of one substance, power, and eternity: God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Ghost: the Father is of none, neither begotten, nor proceeding; the Son is eternally begotten of the Father; the Holy Ghost eternally proceeding from the Father and the Son.”

Please dont call yourself christian if you deny Jesus’ deity.
 

JohnPaul

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Jesus has always existed. Our WCF chpt 2 states;
“In the unity of the Godhead there be three persons, of one substance, power, and eternity: God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Ghost: the Father is of none, neither begotten, nor proceeding; the Son is eternally begotten of the Father; the Holy Ghost eternally proceeding from the Father and the Son.”

Please dont call yourself christian if you deny Jesus’ deity.
I am not denying the Divinity of Christ simply stating that he is the son of God.
 
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Cristo Rei

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We seem to have a raft of folks arguing against the trinity and the identity of Jesus.

If members were unable to hide behind the term 'Christian' it would save a lot of time.

Thoughts... ???

Understanding the trinity does not define a Christian
If it does in your book then how would you label me?
I still believe in Christ our saviour, doesn't that define me as a Christian?
Perhaps you label me a heretic. I don't care, you don't know me

There are over 40,000 Christian denominations. All disagree about something. Be careful in asserting that your way is the only way because you are most likely in error as everyone else is
 
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Ronald David Bruno

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I am not denying the Divinity of Christ simply stating that he is the son of God.
Begotten means Jesus was physically born. God became flesh ans dwelt among us. So Jesus spirit was not born.
Colossians 1:16, 17
"For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
And he is before all things, and by him all things consist."

From the Biblegateway.com you can read 60 English translations that all say the same.
The NWT is not included in that list. Why? It is the only translation written to conform to a belief system.
Look at these verses in the NWT and John 1:1; they have been changed.
When you read the correct translations, you can conclude that IF Jesus created all things, this can not possibly include Himself.
 

Lifelong_sinner

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Understanding the trinity does not define a Christian
If it does in your book then how would you label me?
I still believe in Christ our saviour, doesn't that define me as a Christian?
Perhaps you label me a heretic. I don't care, you don't know me

There are over 40,000 Christian denominations. All disagree about something. Be careful in asserting that your way is the only way because you are most likely in error as everyone else is

you’re a unitarian too?
 

RedFan

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Begotten means Jesus was physically born. God became flesh ans dwelt among us. So Jesus spirit was not born.

"Begotten" -- as I understand the word -- can refer to the physical birth of a human being, or it can refer to the generation by one being of another being. I have always understood that the Son (I will reserve the name "Jesus" for the incarnate Son who walked the planet 2,000 years ago, and just refer to the pre-incarnate Son here) was "begotten" eternally (i.e., generated from the Father), before Jesus was physically born of Mary. Is that not your view? Is there another way to make sense of John 8:58?
 

Ronald David Bruno

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I never considered myself Born Again, as I never stopped believing, and have always had a relationship with Jehovah and Christ, and am still learning since I've left the RCC.
In John 3:3, Jesus said you must be born again to see the kingdom of heaven, born from above. It is a spiritual transformation. But you are confused about spirituality: your spirit, the HOLY SPIRIT, WHO when you are born from above dwells in you. Or do you nit KNOW that Christians arw the TEMPLE of God. As God dwelt in the Old Temple, which was abolished, we have become the New Temple. The Holy Spirit is God, a person, not a force. That would be disgraceful and degrading to claim He is a force. It is impersonal. You said you believe in the Father and the Son and just seem to leave out the Holy Spirit as if HE (EKEINOS) is a wind that just blows by you or on you and blesses you on occassion.
 

Carl Emerson

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The present situation makes it hard to raise serious theological issues without the topic being hijacked by members pushing fringe theologies. Anyway thanks for all who participated in this discussion.
 

Carl Emerson

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Responses embedded...

Understanding the trinity does not define a Christian

...I agree

If it does in your book then how would you label me?

...I haven't

I still believe in Christ our saviour, doesn't that define me as a Christian?

...I don't know you
personally


Perhaps you label me a heretic. I don't care, you don't know me

...Likewise

There are over 40,000 Christian denominations. All disagree about something. Be careful in asserting that your way is the only way because you are most likely in error as everyone else is

...When did I do that ???
 

charity

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We seem to have a raft of folks arguing against the trinity and the identity of Jesus.

If members were unable to hide behind the term 'Christian' it would save a lot of time.

Thoughts... ???
'And He (God the Father)
.. has put all things under His
feet (the Lord Jesus Christ)
.... and gave Him to be Head
......over all things
........ to the church,
.......... which is His body,
............ the fullness of Him
.............. Who fills all in all.'

(Eph. 1:22-23)

Hello @Carl Emerson,

This is the Church of which I am a member by God's grace.

Though I study the Scriptures dispensationally; on the basis of 2 Timothy 2:15, Philippians 1:9-10 and 1 Corinthians 2:13 (MKJV).

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris
 
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Jane_Doe22

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You're talking to a guy who was banned from his original forum and joined up here to start the same trouble, he's a newbee and dare come overhear starting trouble by calling certain faiths cults, put him on ignore.
?
Oh I make very liberal use of the “ignore” function.
I'm Christian and am non-denominational but Christian so according to his philosophy what denomination do I pick?
Denomination do matter a lot. They aren’t what determines salvation, but they do teach different beliefs, sometimes very different. And some also declare others to be lost, for example JW viewing all non-JW as deceived heretics that will be completely destroyed after death.
 
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Pearl

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We seem to have a raft of folks arguing against the trinity and the identity of Jesus.

If members were unable to hide behind the term 'Christian' it would save a lot of time.

Thoughts... ???
I have mentioned that before but none of the admins took any notice. I too think it would save a lot of the arguing that goes on.
 

Ronald David Bruno

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"Begotten" -- as I understand the word -- can refer to the physical birth of a human being, or it can refer to the generation by one being of another being. I have always understood that the Son (I will reserve the name "Jesus" for the incarnate Son who walked the planet 2,000 years ago, and just refer to the pre-incarnate Son here) was "begotten" eternally (i.e., generated from the Father), before Jesus was physically born of Mary. Is that not your view? Is there another way to make sense of John 8:58?
I see both ways.
Man begets man. Animal begets animal. God begets God. Begotten means giving birth to, born of the same nature. Jesus is the God/man, of two natures, one created and one eternal. Upon His resurrection, the Father said "today I have begotten you". His physically dead body came to life.
It has a deep, complex meaning.
MacArthur explains it in sveral ways:
"Son is an incarnational title of Christ. Though His sonship was anticipated in the Old Testament (Prov. 30:4), He did not become a Son until He was begotten into time...The Bible nowhere speaks of the eternal Sonship of Christ...He was always God, but He became Son. Before that He was eternal God. It is therefore incorrect to say that Jesus Christ is eternally inferior to God because He goes under the title of Son. He is no "eternal son" always subservient to God, always less than God, always under God....His Sonship began in a point of time, not in eternity. His life as Son began in this world..."
"To say that Christ is “begotten” is itself a difficult concept. Within the realm of creation, the term “begotten” speaks of the origin of one’s offspring. The begetting of a son denotes his conception--the point at which he comes into being. Some thus assume that “only begotten” refers to the conception of the human Jesus in the womb of the virgin Mary. Yet Matthew 1:20 attributes the conception of the incarnate Christ to the Holy Spirit, not to God the Father. The begetting referred to in Psalm 2 and John 1:14 clearly seems to be something more than the conception of Christ’s humanity in Mary’s womb.

And indeed, there is another, more vital, significance to the idea of “begetting” than merely the origin of one’s offspring. In the design of God, each creature begets offspring “after his kind” (Gen. 1:11-12; 21-25). The offspring bear the exact likeness of the parent. The fact that a son is generated by the father guarantees that the son shares the same essence as the father.

I believe this is the sense Scripture aims to convey when it speaks of the begetting of Christ by the Father. Christ is not a created being (John 1:1-3). He had no beginning but is as timeless as God Himself. Therefore, the “begetting” mentioned in Psalm 2 and its cross-references has nothing to do with His origin.

But it has everything to do with the fact that He is of the same essence as the Father. Expressions like “eternal generation,” “only begotten Son,” and others pertaining to the filiation of Christ must all be understood in this sense: Scripture employs them to underscore the absolute oneness of essence between Father and Son. In other words, such expressions aren’t intended to evoke the idea of procreation; they are meant to convey the truth about the essential oneness shared by the Members of the Trinity."
John MacArthur
 

JohnPaul

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I have mentioned that before but none of the admins took any notice. I too think it would save a lot of the arguing that goes on.
I don’t argue anymore, so you’re saying JW’s and Mormons should be excluded from this forum?
 

JohnPaul

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Oh I make very liberal use of the “ignore” function.

Denomination do matter a lot. They aren’t what determines salvation, but they do teach different beliefs, sometimes very different. And some also declare others to be lost, for example JW viewing all non-JW as deceived heretics that will be completely destroyed after death.
He’s on ignore already, so you being a Mormon believe Jehovah’s Witnesses are a cult?
 

JohnPaul

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to deny that Jesus is God is to deny Jesus’ deity. You believe He was created, you believe basically what both the jews and muslims believe about Jesus.
I believe he is the Son of God, Sons and Daughters don’t just come into existence by themselves.
 
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