Source or Resource? - Understanding the difference

[St. SteVen]

This came up on another topic. Seemed to be worth its own topic.

Understanding the difference between the SOURCE and a RESOURCE.
God should be our SOURCE. Everything else is a RESOURCE. (including the Bible)

Source:
- God

Resources:
- The Bible
- Commentaries
- Preachers/teachers
- Other believers
- Unbelievers (listen)

Other resource ideas?

/ @Spyder

 

[Spyder]

This came up on another topic. Seemed to be worth its own topic.

Understanding the difference between the SOURCE and a RESOURCE.
God should be our SOURCE. Everything else is a RESOURCE. (including the Bible)

Source:
- God

Resources:
- The Bible
- Commentaries
- Preachers/teachers
- Other believers
- Unbelievers (listen)

Other resource ideas?

/ @Spyder

I think that books that teach of the ancient Hebrew culture and history should be included as well as the relevant history of Rome.

 

[St. SteVen]

I think that books that teach of the ancient Hebrew culture and history should be included as well as the relevant history of Rome.

Agree.
Is there anything about the history of Rome that has helped you in your studies?

/

 

[MA2444]

This came up on another topic. Seemed to be worth its own topic.

Understanding the difference between the SOURCE and a RESOURCE.
God should be our SOURCE. Everything else is a RESOURCE. (including the Bible)

Source:
- God

Resources:
- The Bible
- Commentaries
- Preachers/teachers
- Other believers
- Unbelievers (listen)

Other resource ideas?

/ @Spyder

I've heard Children make some pretty profound statements. Not that children are resource but children are closer to God than we are I think. Especially less than 7 years old.

 

[BarneyFife]

This came up on another topic. Seemed to be worth its own topic.

Understanding the difference between the SOURCE and a RESOURCE.
God should be our SOURCE. Everything else is a RESOURCE. (including the Bible)

Source:
- God

Resources:
- The Bible
- Commentaries
- Preachers/teachers
- Other believers
- Unbelievers (listen)

Other resource ideas?

/ @Spyder

.
Only one thing in the lower list is said to have the power to create something from nothing, SS. We're pals, so I know you're not going to make me trot out those verses.

I'm not at all sure that classing the Bible with commentaries and other things in an understandable effort to avoid ultra-literalism and extreme views of inerrancy isn't akin to throwing out the baby with the bath water.
'

'

 

[St. SteVen]

Only one thing in the lower list is said to have the power to create something from nothing, SS. We're pals, so I know you're not going to make me trot out those verses.

No need to cite your SOURCES. - LOL
I see you are referring to the Bible in your quote below.

I'm not at all sure that classing the Bible with commentaries and other things in an understandable effort to avoid ultra-literalism and extreme views of inerrancy isn't akin to throwing out the baby with the bath water.

I suppose I am splitting hairs a bit to differentiate between SOURCES and RESOURCES.
Resources are sources too, on some level. See my first sentence above.

Personally, I look to God (not the Bible) to supply my every need.

Questions:
- How can the Bible be considered a SOURCE when there is no consensus on what it means?
- Would a true source provide contradictory things?
- Can resources disagree?

/

 

[BarneyFife]

Questions:
- How can the Bible be considered a SOURCE when there is no consensus on what it means?
- Would a true source provide contradictory things?
- Can resources disagree?

.
If I didn't think better of you, I'd believe you had some patent objection to the Bible, SS. All of these look like basically the same question to me.

Which I would answer with the question:

What if God's ways, which are not our ways, make it impossible to express His will in human language without sometimes posing some very difficult questions that only seem like contradictions?
'

Personally, I look to God (not the Bible) to supply my every need.

.
How would you know to look to Him in the way that you do today without the Bible, SS?
'

'

 

[St. SteVen]

If I didn't think better of you, I'd believe you had some patent objection to the Bible, SS. All of these look like basically the same question to me. ... What if God's ways, which are not our ways, make it impossible to express His will in human language without sometimes posing some very difficult questions that only seem like contradictions?

Many Christians have made the Bible a holy cow, Holy cows make the best hamburger. IMHO
You're right. It's easy to get the wrong idea about how I view the Bible. (given my frequent attacks)

And contrary to popular belief, I think the contradictions are real. BECAUSE we did in fact find it...
"impossible to express His will in human language". (the source of said contradictions)

How would you know to look to Him in the way that you do today without the Bible, SS?

Another great question. Thanks.

What comes to mind is Saul of Tarsus on the road to Damascus.
He had a Bible. (so to speak) Did he have the right idea about God? (and his Son Jesus Christ) ???
Nope.

He had a VERY extrabiblical encounter with the living God, the true SOURCE,
something WAY beyond the RESOURCE he already had.

But what about me? (you might counter)
I too had a personal encounter with the living God. Something that informed me BEYOND what the
Bible and being raised in a Christian home had provided. (I can post my testimony if need be)

And I know that some have had an encounter with the living God through the Bible.
But I would say that they encountered the SOURCE through a biblical RESOURCE.

Oh wait, you asked how I would "know to look to Him in the way that you do today without the Bible... ?"
The Bible is certainly PART of the picture of how I look at God. But again, it is only a resource.

The SOURCE (god) enlightens the RESOURCE (the Bible) in my mind through the Spirit.
I had to do my part be reading and studying the whole book. (resource) For the Spirit to have something to
activate in my mind. But, without the SOURCE, the RESOURCE would be just another dead book.

Does that make sense?

/ cc: @Hillsage

 

[Mr E]

I've heard Children make some pretty profound statements. Not that children are resource but children are closer to God than we are I think. Especially less than 7 years old.

This is true..... they have far less filters in place than we, as adults have installed. Have you ever sat and listened carefully to a young child tell about a dream they just had? It's fascinating-- pure and unembellished.

BTW-- I believe dreams are among the best sources. One can say God is the only source, but how does God communicate with us? Some say -the bible- and it's a massive book of stories-- about dreams.

 

[Grailhunter]

If you have ever been in youth Sunday schools you would see that children will come up with some very direct questions. At times it can be very entertaining and at times some of the hardest questions.

 

[Hillsage]

.
How would you know to look to Him in the way that you do today without the Bible, SS?
'

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When there was only 'the church' under the original apostles and the 5 fold ministry and elders at the local levels the gospel went to the world. But when the church of Rome took over and progressively controlled the NT writings I think things went awry. To the point that the people had no access to any writings until the printing press of the 1500's.

My point being, concerning your last sentence, is this;; how did people 'look to Him' without access to a bible which was never in the people's hands for centuries? Did God want it that way?

 

[St. SteVen]

I've heard Children make some pretty profound statements. Not that children are resource but children are closer to God than we are I think. Especially less than 7 years old.

I would consider children as a resource. "... from the mouths of babes and sucklings..." - Matthew 21:16
Jesus said, "... the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these."
Whatever that means.

• Matthew 18:3
  And he said: “Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdomof heaven.
  
  
• Matthew 19:14
  Jesus said, “Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdomof heaven belongs to such as these.”
  
  
• Mark 10:14
  When Jesus saw this, he was indignant. He said to them, “Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these.
  
  
• Luke 18:16
  But Jesus called the children to him and said, “Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these.

/

 

[St. SteVen]

When there was only 'the church' under the original apostles and the 5 fold ministry and elders at the local levels the gospel went to the world. But when the church of Rome took over and progressively controlled the NT writings I think things went awry. To the point that the people had no access to any writings until the printing press of the 1500's.

Yes.
And THAT Gospel that went forth was an oral tradition that was not written down until decades later.
With questionable authorship, I would add. The Epistles were of more certain authorship.

The King James translation of 1611 was the first widely published English language Bible.

My point being, concerning your last sentence, is this;; how did people 'look to Him' without access to a bible which was never in the people's hands for centuries? Did God want it that way?

Indeed.
Great questions.
Certainly no one in the Hebrews 11 faith chapter had their own Bible. (before verse 32)
Nor did the Jews in Israel. The scrolls were the property of the synagogues and the very wealthy.
You had to pay to have a scribe create a copy for you by hand. An enormous task.

/

 

[BarneyFife]

When there was only 'the church' under the original apostles and the 5 fold ministry and elders at the local levels the gospel went to the world. But when the church of Rome took over and progressively controlled the NT writings I think things went awry. To the point that the people had no access to any writings until the printing press of the 1500's.

My point being, concerning your last sentence, is this;; how did people 'look to Him' without access to a bible which was never in the people's hands for centuries? Did God want it that way?

.
This is not personal, believe me, but I'm bewildered by the almost complete general lack of awareness that the apostles and even Christ Himself taught the Gospel from the Holy Scriptures of the Old Testament.

The New Testament Scripture, blessed treasure that it is, was given largely because God's people didn't "get it"—not because more information was needed to understand God's will for His people at that time.

The Old and New Testaments even mention non-canonical prophets that were active at the time.

The vast majority of Scripture is just God basically saying: "Uh, I really meant what I said that other time."
'

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[BarneyFife]

The King James translation of 1611 was the first widely published English language Bible.

.
I'm having some trouble seeing what an English translation has to do with the larger question here, SS.
'

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[St. SteVen]

The vast majority of Scripture is just God basically saying: "Uh, I really meant what I said that other time."

LOL
I love it. That is so funny.
I mean... in a serious kind of way. (not making fun)

/

 

[St. SteVen]

St. SteVen said:
The King James translation of 1611 was the first widely published English language Bible.

.
I'm having some trouble seeing what an English translation has to do with the larger question here, SS.
'

'

Good question.
I'm happy to clarify.

The key thought, as you will recall, is that God is our SOURCE, all else are RESOURCES. (including the Bible)

The RESOURCE of the Bible was not widely available until after 1611.

With the absence of the RESOURCE of the Bible, prior to 1611,
how did humankind learn about the SOURCE? (God)

Earlier you asked me...

How would you know to look to Him in the way that you do today without the Bible, SS?

It seems that lots of folks were getting their view of God from somewhere other than the Bible,
since Bibles weren't readily available to the general public until after 1611.

/

 

[Mr E]

There are two good reasons to consult scripture as a resource....

1. To see what is contained within, to help understand and define what is to be expected. (like a program guide)

2. As a reference to validate whatever you might experience in spirit. (like an analytical tool)

 

[Phil .]

This came up on another topic. Seemed to be worth its own topic.

Understanding the difference between the SOURCE and a RESOURCE.
God should be our SOURCE. Everything else is a RESOURCE. (including the Bible)

Source:
- God

Resources:
- The Bible
- Commentaries
- Preachers/teachers
- Other believers
- Unbelievers (listen)

Other resource ideas?

/ @Spyder

Amen!

 

[St. SteVen]

There are two good reasons to consult scripture as a resource....

1. To see what is contained within, to help understand and define what is to be expected. (like a program guide)

2. As a reference to validate whatever you might experience in spirit. (like an analytical tool)

I like that a lot.

Sometimes an impression we are getting from the SOURCE (God) can be clarified by the RESOURCE. (the Bible)

This may be why some are hesitant to listen to the SOURCE.
An impression we are getting is not always as certain as we would like it to be.
Requires some confirmation.

Gideon is sometimes criticized for laying out a fleece twice when the Lord "seemed"
to have communicated clearly to him. But we weren't there.

/