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Featured The Church The Papacy Says You Should Join

Discussion in 'Christian Debate Forum' started by Phoneman777, Jul 4, 2019.

  1. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    And there you go again making FALSE accusations and citing spurious and secondary sources and online rumors.
    You don't even know how to debate. It's like debating with a 2-year-old. - and not a very bright one, at that.

    - Cite PRIMARY sources for your claims.
    - Don't just give the name of a newspaper - give the name of the PERSON being quoted.
    - Cite Catholic Doctrine (i.e., the Catechism) when trying to debunk Catholic teaching.

    Finally - look in your OWN SDA back yard before you go pointing fingers at others about molesting children.
    This garbage is going on in YOUR sect as well . . .

    https://dumaslawgroup.com/finding-justice-for-victims-of-sexual-abuse-in-the-seventh-day-adventist-church/
    Like other religious organizations and institutions of trust, the Seventh-day Adventist Church has a long and disappointing history of child sex abuse . . .

    https://atoday.org/abuse-is-a-challenge-for-the-adventist-church-new-campaign-is-launched-to-counter-it/
    Although the number of cases has not reached the crisis level that it has in some denominations, the Seventh-day Adventist Church does face an incidence of abuse suffered by its children and teens sufficient to result in the launch of a new, world-wide campaign . . .

    https://www.crewjanci.com/sda-abuse/
    The Seventh-day Adventist (SDA) Church . . . SDA pastors, elders, teachers, and Pathfinder leaders have taken advantage of children within the Church’s care, violating their positions of trust and authority in order to exploit vulnerable parishioners who look to the Church for protection and support.


    Your hypocrisy is disgusting . . .
     
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  2. quietthinker

    quietthinker Well-Known Member

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    I'm sorry BoL.....if you were interested in proof you wouldn't be leaning on that broken crutch that has spikes where your armpit sits and oil on the stopper.
     
  3. GodsGrace

    GodsGrace Well-Known Member

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    I don't believe the CC created Sunday worship.
    I do believe it was present already from the time of the Apostles.
    Didn't they meet on the first day of the week?
    That would be Sunday.

    I can't remember right now, but I do believe the CC just carried on the custom.

    I can't believe the CC said such a dumb thing,,,but you posted it so I guess it might be true.

    Wonder if @BreadOfLife or @Marymog had anything to say about that statement?
    In any case, I don't hear the CC saying this these days.

    I do have a problem with Sunday worship in a way because keeping Holy the Sabbath IS one of the 10 commandments and I believe the commandments should never change. I just don't know.
     
  4. GodsGrace

    GodsGrace Well-Known Member

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    LOL
    You shoulda been a poet!
     
  5. GodsGrace

    GodsGrace Well-Known Member

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    I see you DID reply to @Phoneman777 ...
    I'd like to see the source too...the source should always be given.
    It's difficult to believe the CC ever made such a statement....
     
  6. Phoneman777

    Phoneman777 Well-Known Member

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    Papist Dead Bread, I'm happy to break it down for you:

    "To the Law and to the Testimony..." (this phraseology is a common reference to "the Word of God". Moses wrote the "Law" and the prophets wrote the rest. Other similar references to the "Word of God" are "Moses and Elijah", "Moses and the Prophets", "the Law and the Prophets", etc.)

    "...if they speak not according to this word..." (meaning, according to the Word of God.)

    "...it is because there is no light in them."

    Understand, papist? The papacy consistently speaks contrary to the Word of God, thus proving there is NO LIGHT in it.
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2019
  7. Phoneman777

    Phoneman777 Well-Known Member

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    You papists point to Scripture for "proof" that the catholic church - not Scripture - is the final authority, but you're too ignorant to realize that the source of one's authority is by nature and by default superior to whatever authority is derived from it!
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2019
  8. Soverign Grace

    Soverign Grace Well-Known Member

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    I never heard of this until I came on here - I had always assumed that Sunday was the Lord's day. I know that God used "Steps to Christ" a Seventh-day Adventist booklet someone had left at a store to show me that I had been spiritually reborn (I didn't know what had happened to me until I read that booklet) But I don't see why the day is so significant. I know that God commanded man to rest on the seventh day but I don't understand why the Papacy wanted to change it.
     
  9. Phoneman777

    Phoneman777 Well-Known Member

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    There were only two things to come out of the garden of Eden: marriage and the Sabbath. Satan hates both because both demonstrate the two most important things about God:

    1) His desire for a covenant relationship with us as depicted by the marriage covenant
    2) His desire for us to know Him as the Creator which by default makes Him deserving of our love and worship

    Therefore, Satan has since time immemorial worked above all else to destroy both institutions by leading men to relegate women to second class citizenship to to be exploited and abused...and by leading men to venerate the creation instead of the Creator, which paramount achievement was the veneration of the Sun as god.

    The reason today for why there are both people who worship millions of gods and those who deny His existence altogether is that early on mankind ceased to "remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy" - because how could anyone get confused at all about God if once a week, we're all bowing down remembering that God? The final message to Earth before the Second Coming in Revelation 14:6-12 is a call from God back to worshiping Him as defined in the Fourth commandment...and this commandment will be the pivotal issue in the near future. Are we going to keep God's commandments or the "commandmtns of men" as taught by the papal Antichrist?
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2019
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  10. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

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    Sunday is indeed the Lord's Day, but since SDAs were compelled to reject it in favor of the 7th day Sabbath, they created their own fantasy about the Papacy as Antichrist and the Mark of the Beast as Sunday worship. That truly messed up the proper interpretation of Bible prophecy.
     
  11. Soverign Grace

    Soverign Grace Well-Known Member

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    I'm still in the early stages of understand Revelations but I do believe that the Papacy is evil. I recall reading that the illuminati wanted to infiltrate the Papacy and one can see that they have.
     
  12. Jane_Doe22

    Jane_Doe22 Well-Known Member

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    That doesn't make any sense. I've never met a Christian who was actually sola scriptura. Instead they:
    - Hold in their hands a collection of books (ranging from 66-81 books therein) which was defined by tradition.
    - The invite divine persons to aide in their reading of that collection, and guiding them throughout their everyday lives.
    - They include studies of historical and cultural context in studying that collection of books.
    - They gather with other Christians and preach between each other, adding in their understanding of the book collection and divinity.

    And those are all good things! But clearly it doesn't remotely result in everybody being Catholic :)
     
  13. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    TRANSLATION:
    "I don't have ANY Scriptural proof for my claims."

    That's what I thought . . .
     
  14. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    No - @quietthinker should have been truthful.
    Evidence - not poetry in a debate . . .
     
  15. Jane_Doe22

    Jane_Doe22 Well-Known Member

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    All Christians agree that it's important to honor God in the Sabbath and have a day of rest.

    Originally this was done on what we now call Saturday. After Christ's resurrection was on Sunday, culturally majority of Christian moved their day of honoring God and rest (aka their Sabbath day) to Sunday, and still honor Him every 7 days. The focus was on the spirit and remembering to honor the Lord. All of this was done before the pre-Orthodox/Catholic Church came really to organized.

    The Christian denomination, Seventh Day Adventists, have a tenet of their beliefs that this day should still correlate to Saturday. Some SDA folks are quite adament about this / hostile to others. Such is their beliefs / practices.
     
  16. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    One big problem for you, Phoney - the Jews NEVER promoted Sola Scriptura.
    They understood that the Word of God was revealed ORALLY and in the written form.

    Here are a few examples of this ORAL Tradition . . .
    Matt. 2:23 - the prophecy "He shall be a Nazarene" is ORAL TRADITION. It is not found in the Old Testament. This demonstrates that the apostles relied upon oral tradition and taught by oral tradition.

    Matt 23:2 - Jesus relies on the ORAL TRADITION of acknowledging Moses' seat of authority (which passed from Moses to Joshua to the Sanhedrin). This is not recorded in the Old Testament.

    1 Cor. 10:4 - Paul relies on the ORAL TRADITION of the rock following Moses. It is not recorded in the Old Testament. See Exodus 17:1-16 and Num. 20:2-13.

    2 Timothy 3:8 - Paul relies on the ORAL TRADITION when speaking of Pharoah’s magicians, Jannes and Jambres. Their names are not recorded in the Old Testament.

    Heb. 11:37 - the author of Hebrews relies on the ORAL TRADITION of the martyrs being sawed in two. This is not recorded in the Old Testament.

    Jude 9 - Jude relies on the ORAL TRADITION of the Archangel Michael's dispute with satan over Moses' body. This is not found in the Old Testament.

    Jude 14-15 - Jude relies on the ORAL TRADITION of Enoch's prophecy which is not recorded in the Old Testament.



    Keep studying, sparky - you'll get there, eventually . . .
     
  17. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely.

    Also, just because one person who is a member of the Church has an opinion - that doesn't mean that this is what the Church teaches.
    I'm sure you understand that as well.
     
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  18. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    No - the Authority of the Church if GOD-given, not man made.

    Christ Himself
    transferred this supreme Authority to His Church - that WHATEVER it binds or looses on earth will also be bound and loosed oin Heaven (Matt. 16:18-19, Matt. 18:15-18, Luke 10:16, John 16:12-15, John 20:21-23).

    If you have a problem with that - take it up with God, not me.
    I'm sure Satan has a problem with it, too . . .
     
  19. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    The more you anti-Catholics whine about pedophilia - the more you need to be reminded that the problem is FAR WORSE in your own back yards . . .
    Evangelical Sex Abuse Record ‘Worse’ Than Catholic, Says Billy Graham’s Grandson
    Protestant Churches Grapple With Growing Sexual Abuse Crisis : NPR

    Protestants can no longer dismiss abuse as a ‘Catholic problem’
    Child Sex Abuse More Prevalent Among Protestants Than Among Catholics
    There Is More Sexual Abuse In The Protestant Churches Than Catholic
    Catholic priests no guiltier of sex abuse than other clergy
    Data Shed Light on Child Sexual Abuse by Protestant Clergy

    As for Jesus stating, "It is written" - HOW does this "prove" Sola Scriptura?? He was simply showing that Scripture is the written Word of God and is Authoritative - which it IS.

    I asked YOU to show me where the Bible lists the Books that belong in it and you failed - proving the fallacy of Sola Scriptura. Here are some examples of ORAL Tradition that was just as binding as Scripture:

    Matt. 2:23 - the prophecy "He shall be a Nazarene" is ORAL TRADITION. It is not found in the Old Testament. This demonstrates that the apostles relied upon oral tradition and taught by oral tradition.

    Matt 23:2 - Jesus relies on the ORAL TRADITION of acknowledging Moses' seat of authority (which passed from Moses to Joshua to the Sanhedrin). This is not recorded in the Old Testament.

    1 Cor. 10:4 - Paul relies on the ORAL TRADITION of the rock following Moses. It is not recorded in the Old Testament. See Exodus 17:1-16 and Num. 20:2-13.

    2 Timothy 3:8 - Paul relies on the ORAL TRADITION when speaking of Pharoah’s magicians, Jannes and Jambres. Their names are not recorded in the Old Testament.

    Heb. 11:37 - the author of Hebrews relies on the ORAL TRADITION of the martyrs being sawed in two. This is not recorded in the Old Testament.

    Jude 9 - Jude relies on the ORAL TRADITION of the Archangel Michael's dispute with satan over Moses' body. This is not found in the Old Testament.

    Jude 14-15 - Jude relies on the ORAL TRADITION of Enoch's prophecy which is not recorded in the Old Testament.


    Finally - NOT everything was written down, as I have PROVEN to you by asking you to provide the Canon of Scripture - FROM Scripture.
    Paul, writing under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit to the Thessalonians put Oral Tradition ON PAR with Scripture:

    2 Thess 2:15

    "Stand firm and hold fast to the Traditions you were taught, EITHER BY an ORAL STATEMENT - OR BY a letter from us."

    He DIDN'T say, "ONLY" a letter . . .


     
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  20. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

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    The Papacy is a manifestation of apostate Christianity. But it has nothing to do with the reign of the Antichrist, other than succumb to his rule. Some say that a future pope will be the False Prophet, but that has no solid biblical basis.
     
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