The Death of Jesus - Matthew 27:45-54

[face2face]

Sounds like you're describing Kingdom Hall's victims who constantly try to rewrite our Bible.

Na I've come across plenty of water-less clouds in my time...whats another to add to that hopeless list.

 

[face2face]

Are you saying Jesus was a sinner?

Your not the sharpest tool in the shed Jack! Read Hebrews 2:17 for yourself!

 

[Blue Dragonfly's]

Excellent. You cannot post a scripture that states Jesus had a sin nature.
Why is that?

Because he did not have a sin nature.

Correct, Jesus required a nature the same as your to be tested otherwise whats the point? In every respect he had condemned nature - him overcoming now means Romans 8:1 is offered - you should be grateful he had that nature!

 

[face2face]

Excellent. You cannot post a scripture that states Jesus had a sin nature.
Why is that?

Because he did not have a sin nature.

No, we have already posted two.
Can I ask why you have such a problem with Jesus sharing your nature?
He overcame it as the Scripture teaches but you cant overcome something if its not in you to overcome.

 

[Blue Dragonfly's]

No, we have already posted two.
Can I ask why you have such a problem with Jesus sharing your nature?
He overcame it as the Scripture teaches but you cant overcome something if its not in you to overcome.

No, you actually haven't.

1 John 3:9
No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God's seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning because he has been born of God.


There's another verse that tells you Jesus had no sin nature.
I'll help you.
If reborn humans have God's seed in them, and that is why they do not make a habit of sinning, how would God in the likeness of a mortal man have a sin nature?

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.


Jesus was not dead in his trespasses and sins.

Ephesians 2:1-2 And you were dead in the trespasses and sins 2 in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience—

 

[face2face]

No, you actually haven't.

1 John 3:9
No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God's seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning because he has been born of God.


There's another verse that tells you Jesus had no sin nature.
I'll help you.
If reborn humans have God's seed in them, and that is why they do not make a habit of sinning, how would God in the likeness of a mortal man have a sin nature?

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.


Jesus was not dead in his trespasses and sins.

Ephesians 2:1-2 And you were dead in the trespasses and sins 2 in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience—

You blatantly avoided my question.
Why are you so concerned if Jesus had your nature?
What do you lose?
Romans 8:3 & Hebrews 2:17 are conclusive he shared in your nature otherwise you dont have a high priest and you are still in your sins.
But I'm curious - why the resistance - be honest!

 

[face2face]

If ever there was an insight into Jesus being a sacrifice for our sins and it being God's will and purpose its seen in Matthew 27:48.

Matthew 27:48 Immediately one of them ran and got a sponge, filled it with sour wine, put it on a stick (Gk: a reed), and gave it to him to drink.

It's interesting as the request was responded to like a command - probably a Roman Solider.

“Vinegar” - Common drink of Roman soldiers, which they mockingly offered him in Luke 23:36. But now as a result of events it is offered in earnest!

it was offered “On a Reed” see John 19:29 - with hysopp = humility 1 Kings 4:33

Note the echo!

Exodus 12:22 Sprinkle Passover blood – the work is finished!
Numbers 19:6 - Thrown in the fire at the burning of the red heifer.
It now reappears as an anti-type of that offering - “what the law could not do”...is save!

 

[face2face]

Matthew 27:49

Note...“The rest said” - These would be Jews, as they would want to see if Elijah will come to rescue him. It is a Roman who pities him!

When Elijah does come to turn their hearts back to the fathers and their God upon Jesus' second coming, how will they look on Jesus?

Zechariah 12:10!

 

[Jack]

Your not the sharpest tool in the shed Jack! Read Hebrews 2:17 for yourself!

I'm sharp enough to know that Satan loves trying to make Jesus a sinner.

 

[face2face]

I'm sharp enough to know that Satan loves trying to make Jesus a sinner.

You only proved how blunt you are by saying Jesus was a sinner....you don't even understand the subject under discussion. Firstly we are looking at the death of the Lord...him being a sacrifice for the forgiveness of sins. Secondly we have been discussing for months the true nature of Jesus and how God condemned sin in offering our nature on the tree. You are best not to comment if you can't grasp the subjects and arguments being presented. Proverbs 27:17

 

[Jack]

You only proved how blunt you are by saying Jesus was a sinner....you don't even understand the subject under discussion. Firstly we are looking at the death of the Lord...him being a sacrifice for the forgiveness of sins. Secondly we have been discussing for months the true nature of Jesus and how God condemned sin in offering our nature on the tree. You are best not to comment if you can't grasp the subjects and arguments being presented. Proverbs 27:17

That's a LIE! I NEVER said Jesus was a sinner. Jesus was sinless!

 

[face2face]

That's a LIE! I NEVER said Jesus was a sinner. Jesus was sinless!

You said that I said that. So just to prove who is the lier go and find a post where I've said those words.

 

[Jack]

You said that I said that. So just to prove who is the lier go and find a post where I've said those words.

Jesus NEVER sinned. If you understand and believe that you're doing well.

 

[face2face]

Jesus NEVER sinned. If you understand and believe that you're doing well.

That's not what I asked...so you cant find where I said that Jesus sinned! What I said is he had a nature which could sin, like yours. He was condemned to die regardless of his crucifixion. Romans 8:3 & Hebrews 2:17

 

[BeyondET]

Since my time here it has become apparent many who hold the doctrine of the trinity struggle to understand the Masters humanity and as such, rob him of his suffering in the flesh. This consideration of Matthew 27:45-54 aims to show the Lord's death, providing insights into this incredible act of love, both for His Father and toward us who he died to save.

Before we start considering these words, we have two important verses which set the scene of this study.

1 Peter 2:24 He (Jesus) himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, that we may cease from sinning and live for righteousness. By his wounds you were healed.

How were our sins represented in his body of the Lord on the tree?
How was his representative sacrifice an example of how we put the flesh and its lusts to death as per Galatians 5:24.

What ever you take from these thoughts I hope the blue text is where you find encouragement for nothing is more important to the Lord Jesus Christ than we cease from sin and live for righteousness. It was true of his mortal life, as it will be when he returns John 16:8

The other aspect of the Lord's death is his willingness to do His Father Will.

John 10:17 This is why the Father loves me—because I lay down my life, so that I may take it back again. 10:18 No one takes it away from me, but I lay it down of my own free will. I have the authority to lay it down, and I have the authority to take it back again. This commandment I received from my Father.

We see Jesus here using his own free will denying the will of the flesh and choosing as he did through his whole life to freely allow himself to be taken by cruel hands and be crucified.

So in summary of the above, we state two truths concerning his death:

- We see the measure of "our" own sins represented in the nature of Jesus Christ on a tree
- We see the voluntary death of the Son of man at Passover time.

So lets begin...

Are you saying Jesus didn't do his Father will 100% all the time, but sometimes his own free will?

 

[face2face]

Are you saying Jesus didn't do his Father will 100% all the time, but sometimes his own free will?

Not at all...he did His Fathers will perfectly which enabled God to remove the condemned nature he bore. Romans 8:3 & Hebrews 2:17

 

[face2face]

Cont...

Matthew 27:50

Jesus “Cried with a Loud Voice” “To shout” (‘mega’).

It was a shout of triumph as per Psalms 47:1-5.

A note on Mark 15:37 The Grk: “Send forth” - is the same word as “yielded up the spirit” in Matthew 27:50 as per Luke 23:46 “I commend my spirit”. Grk: “to place alongside” - from Psalms 31:5 “commit my spirit”, “deposit”.

Jesus required redemption as per Hebrews 5:7.

The Father accepted his Son as per Ephesians 5:1-2, Romans 1:4

Jesus was a sacrifice offered by God for us
Jesus required redemption from his condemned nature

Both of these facts preclude Jesus from being God.

 

[BeyondET]

Cont...

Matthew 27:50

Jesus “Cried with a Loud Voice” “To shout” (‘mega’).

It was a shout of triumph as per Psalms 47:1-5.

A note on Mark 15:37 The Grk: “Send forth” - is the same word as “yielded up the spirit” in Matthew 27:50 as per Luke 23:46 “I commend my spirit”. Grk: “to place alongside” - from Psalms 31:5 “commit my spirit”, “deposit”.

Jesus required redemption as per Hebrews 5:7.

The Father accepted his Son as per Ephesians 5:1-2, Romans 1:4

Jesus was a sacrifice offered by God for us
Jesus required redemption from his condemned nature

Both of these facts preclude Jesus from being God.

Is Ephesians 5 saying Jesus was a imitator of God but not God.

 

[face2face]

Is Ephesians 5 saying Jesus was a imitator of God but not God.

And we are to be imitators of Jesus as we are of the Apostle Paul also....it's called God manifestation.

 

[BeyondET]

And we are to be imitators of Jesus as we are of the Apostle Paul also....it's called God manifestation.

So you believe Jesus is a imitator?