The doctrine of the trinity, it's origins

[Dcopymope]

uh huh, i was suspicious about you. For the longest while i thought that you didn't accept Christ's eternality, like myself, but i began to question it in your last few posts.
No, Christ was both the first-born of creation, because all was created for him. And, he was the first-born from the dead, because no one preceded him into heaven.
Well, that's a shame, I was hoping that you didn't subscribe to such a mystical and implausible theory?

I've been very clear about the eternal being of Jesus as the "word of God" from my first few posts.

Link: The doctrine of the trinity, it's origins

Him being the spoken word of God does not make him equal in power with God. This is why John calls him the "Word of God" in the God head and calls the Father "God Almighty", because the Father is above all others. He does what his Father tells him. Only God knows why this is so hard for you to understand.

Creatures bleed, Christ bled.

Yes, because he took on the form of a human as a "living soul", which is a creature that is made lower than the angels. From time immemorial though, he was part of the Godhead as "the word", a living spirit, big difference between the two.

(Hebrews 2:6-9) "But one in a certain place testified, saying, What is man, that thou art mindful of him? or the son of man, that thou visitest him? {7} Thou madest him a little lower than the angels; thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands: {8} Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him. {9} But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man."

 

[DNB]

ERROR, did Jesus have a human Father? NO hence the virgin birth.

PICJAG

Did he have an umbilical chord?

 

[DNB]

The Scripture says that the Father is a Spirit and no one has seen Him at any time.

Paul, for crying out loud, if this is true about the Father, who is God, then it must also be true of the Son, who allegedly is god (yes, lower case).
Spirit is Spirit, and dwells in unapproachable light, which no man has seen, or can see.
Are you showing favouritism to one of the persons of the trinity (yes, lower case)?

 

[101G]

The Scripture says that the Father is a Spirit and no one has seen Him at any time.

let's see if this is true, .. as in seeing the Father.. ..John 14:6 "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
John 14:7 "If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.
John 14:8 "Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
John 14:9 "Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

now, do the Lord Jesus lie? of course not.

Therefore the God who identified Himself as "I AM" is the same God who said "Before Abraham was, I AM." Also at the baptism of Jesus, there was Jesus Himself, the voice of the Father from heaven, and the Holy Spirit descending on Jesus in bodily form.

Jesus is the god who said "I AM" for he is, but you ERROR on the scriptures that say "a voice", not that it was the Father voice, please don't assume that's it the Father voice unless the scriptures say so.

PICJAG

 

[DNB]

Only God knows why this is so hard for you to understand.

So, when you say that only 'God knows why...', who are you referring to, Jesus or the Father, or both, ...or any other entities that you claim are in the godhead?
Thanks for your clarification about your Christology, btw, ...now I don't know who's worse, you or 101G?

 

[101G]

Did he have an umbilical chord?

if one is a partaker of human flesh there was a human father, so your strawman argument (about a umbilical chord), is mute. now unless you can show that the flesh the Lord Jesus came had an earthly father to help "PRODUCE" that umbilical chord. ... now if you have that name, please post the book , chapter, and verse, or else your point is mute...

PICJAG.

 

[101G]

So, when you say that only 'God knows why...', who are you referring to, Jesus or the Father, or both, ...or any other entities that you claim are in the godhead?
Thanks for your clarification about your Christology, btw, ...now I don't know who's worse, you or 101G?

see DNB you have no scripture nor any true doctrine, and that what you been posting is flawed, and as fake as the trinity.

so unless you can address Post #210, or have some constructive answer to the Godhead your posts are just vain babbling. just like your fraud umbilical chord argument.. lol. my.my,my.

so until you can produce aome actual evidence then your posts are muite.

as I said, I don't need any run arounds.

PICJAG.

 

[DNB]

if one is a partaker of human flesh there was a human father, so your strawman argument (about a umbilical chord), is mute. now unless you can show that the flesh the Lord Jesus came had an earthly father to help "PRODUCE" that umbilical chord. ... now if you have that name, please post the book , chapter, and verse, or else your point is mute...

PICJAG.

It's moot point, btw, not 'mute', just saying.
Mary went through labour with contractions and all, her fetus grew across the conventional trimesters, as all human's gestation period demand.
Her egg was impregnated, and all else was as conventional as any human pregnancy.
The only supernatural aspect of Jesus' birth, was Mary's conception, nothing else. I believe that Jesus even had to be burped upon delivery!

 

[101G]

It's moot point, btw, not 'mute', just saying.
Mary went through labour with contractions and all, her fetus grew across the conventional trimesters, as all human's gestation period demand.
Her egg was impregnated, and all else was as conventional as any human pregnancy.
The only supernatural aspect of Jesus' birth, was Mary's conception, nothing else. I believe that Jesus even had to be burped upon delivery!

so? where is the human father, to produce this in Mary, this is the last time, look up the definition of "Partake, and took part.

PICJAG.

 

[Paul Christensen]

let's see if this is true, .. as in seeing the Father.. ..John 14:6 "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
John 14:7 "If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.
John 14:8 "Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
John 14:9 "Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

now, do the Lord Jesus lie? of course not.

Jesus is the god who said "I AM" for he is, but you ERROR on the scriptures that say "a voice", not that it was the Father voice, please don't assume that's it the Father voice unless the scriptures say so.

PICJAG

I think that you are pretty committed to your view about this, so I won't continue flogging a dead horse with a tit for tat pointless exchange. You have the choice to believe what you choose and so I will leave you to it and allow others to continue arguing the point with you.

 

[Dcopymope]

So, when you say that only 'God knows why...', who are you referring to, Jesus or the Father, or both, ...or any other entities that you claim are in the godhead?
Thanks for your clarification about your Christology, btw, ...now I don't know who's worse, you or 101G?

(John 1:1-5) "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. {2} The same was in the beginning with God. {3} All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. {4} In him was life; and the life was the light of men. {5} And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not."

(Hebrews 1:1-2) "God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, {2} Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;"

(Revelation 19:11-13) "And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war. {12} His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself. {13} And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God."

.....Who is the creator of all things DNB? I shouldn't even have to point this out to you, his place in the Godhead as the "word", as well versed in the Bible as you pretended to be all this time.

 

[DNB]

see DNB you have no scripture nor any true doctrine, and that what you been posting is flawed, and as fake as the trinity.

so unless you can address Post #210, or have some constructive answer to the Godhead your posts are just vain babbling. just like your fraud umbilical chord argument.. lol. my.my,my.

so until you can produce aome actual evidence then your posts are muite.

as I said, I don't need any run arounds.

PICJAG.

Well, I don't have to answer that because my Christology already states that Jesus is not God. Thus, the union of the Spirit of both the father & Son, is already based on a false predicate, to me. It's absurd to call Jesus God or deity. There is only one Almighty God, and that is the Father. The Holy spirit is just a gift from the Father, in order to empower the Elect for diverse salvific activities, that compel others to the Faith.
Thus, your question is moot to me, Jesus is not God to begin with!

 

[101G]

I think that you are pretty committed to your view about this, so I won't continue flogging a dead horse with a tit for tat pointless exchange. You have the choice to believe what you choose and so I will leave you to it and allow others to continue arguing the point with you.

no just committed to the truth. and no argument, just facts of scriptures.

so thanks for the comments.

PICJAG

 

[DNB]

so? where is the human father, to produce this in Mary, this is the last time, look up the definition of "Partake, and took part.

PICJAG.

It wasn't required, Mary was impregnated by the power of the Holy Spirit upon her, sent by God (as always).
Like I said, and this is the last time, the only supernatural aspect about her pregnancy was her conception. Thus, this does not disqualify Jesus from being 200% human. Sperm is not divine, if you are implying that this makes Jesus divine.

 

[101G]

Well, I don't have to answer that because my Christology already states that Jesus is not God

that's what I figured... you're more lost that the trinity believers. Oh well. all unitarians make that mistake.

There is only one Almighty God, and that is the Father

well tell me who is this? Revelation 1:8 "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

is not the Lord Jesus? yes or No...

looking to hear your answer on this.

PICJAG.

 

[DNB]

.....Who is the creator of all things DNB? I shouldn't even have to point this out to you, his place in the Godhead as the "word", as well versed in the Bible as you pretended to be all this time.

There were not two creators DCM. For, if so, how did they accomplish that? They both counted to three and said 'go!'. The Father took one hemisphere, and the Son created the other hemisphere? The Father created on the first 3 days, while the Son created on the latter 3 days? Did they split their work by solar system, constellation or galaxy?

All things were made by him, and through him, meaning 'via', by the way of him, or, with him in mind and in purpose.

 

[DNB]

that's what I figured... you're more lost that the trinity believers. Oh well. all unitarians make that mistake.

well tell me who is this? Revelation 1:8 "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

is not the Lord Jesus? yes or No...

looking to hear your answer on this.

PICJAG.

No, to me, it's God the Father. Although, the referencing back and forth between the Father and Son, within the first 10 or so verses, is partially ambiguous, but due to the attributes and appellations, I would have to say the Father.

 

[Dcopymope]

There were not two creators DCM. For, if so, how did they accomplish that? They both counted to three and said 'go!'. The Father took one hemisphere, and the Son created the other hemisphere? The Father created on the first 3 days, while the Son created on the latter 3 days? Did they split their work by solar system, constellation or galaxy?

All things were made by him, and through him, meaning 'via', by the way of him, or, with him in mind and in purpose.

Sigh......the apostles are not saying there were two creators. God Almighty created all things through his son, the spoken "word of God". When God Almighty says "let there be" in the creation account, it means that he spoke the world into existence, and that spoken word is Jesus. The apostles make this very clear on no uncertain terms. Even before he became known as Jesus, his position as a type of mediator, a bridge between the Father and the creation is evident. This isn't as hard to understand as you make it out to be, that is unless you would rather not believe who the Bible plainly says Jesus really is and lean unto your own personal interpretations. I am entirely fine with that, it will be between you and God when the time comes, not me.

 

[101G]

All things were made by him, and through him, meaning 'via', by the way of him, or, with him in mind and in purpose.

ERROR, I see you don't read the bible. Isaiah 44:24 "Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself".

that's a big ERROR on your part about the Lord Jesus going through him, meaning 'via', by the way of him,. how can someone go throught someone else when there is no one else present... lol. my, my,my.
so your knowledge in Christ is flawed.

PICJAG.

 

[DNB]

it will be between you and God when the time comes, not me.

This was the best part!