The False Doctrine of a 7-year Tribulation

  • Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Jay Ross

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2011
6,760
2,523
113
QLD
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Jay Ross wants to make the Bible meaningless by making plain Words, that can happen literally, to be something else; but he doesn't know what.

When a prophecy is presented, showing how it can and will happen literally, this frightens him; thinking he may be involved. Just like Rockytopva, who comfortably places the end in 2060.

Why should we who study the Prophetic Word, be in the dark? 1 Thess 5:3-4

Keraz, I graciously, in my response to @Joseph77, did not ridicule your understanding like you have ridiculed my understanding above where you played the person as a fool rather than to demonstrate from the original scriptural sources the reason why my understanding is flawed. What I said was that you come from a literal reading of the text whereas I also consider the metaphorical context of the same text, which you have repeatedly demonstrated, you chose very deliberately to ignore. You then go on to say the following, "When a prophecy is presented, showing how it can and will happen literally, this frightens him; thinking he may be involved," without providing any evidence to confirm how you actually know that I am frightened because I may secretly believe that your understanding may be right. This is a false argumentative rouse on your part which you know is untrue but you falsely make this claim.

You so passionately believe that what you present is true that you have written much on the fact that the sun will eject a great plasma cloud of particles towards the earth such that the earth will be burned up except for the specially protected area, where God has assemble all of His saints, in the "Promised Land."

My counsel to Joseph77 was to be careful as to what he accepts and agrees with before he shouts out a Hallelujah to what he had read. In another post, I also counselled him to read up on what will happen in our near future and during the End times.

If he comes to the same conclusion as you, well and good, but I left up to him to decide on what he decides without sling any mud towards you. Your slinging of mud at me only confirms that your understanding cannot stand up on its own.

Shalom
 

Joseph77

Well-Known Member
Apr 1, 2020
5,673
1,325
113
Tulsa, OK
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
"conclusion"? ....... Did Simon barjona "come to the conclusion" that Jesus is the Messiah after study, meditation, time ?

NO>

Neither should we who seek to serve Him all the time as permanent disciples,
we who are born again by the Will of The Father in Heaven, not by the will of the flesh, nor by the will of man....
we who are set apart by Him, for Himself, for His Own Purpose, in Christ Jesus.
 

Jay Ross

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2011
6,760
2,523
113
QLD
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
"conclusion"? ....... Did Simon barjona "come to the conclusion" that Jesus is the Messiah after study, meditation, time ?

NO>

Neither should we who seek to serve Him all the time as permanent disciples,
we who are born again by the Will of The Father in Heaven, not by the will of the flesh, nor by the will of man....
we who are set apart by Him, for Himself, for His Own Purpose, in Christ Jesus.

Can I take a ticket from you with your contact details on it so that I can contact you, if I need a word from God to settle my soul, by calling you direct you?

It seems to me that you have a lot of tickets on yourself but I wonder how many people believe what it is that you claim?
 

Joseph77

Well-Known Member
Apr 1, 2020
5,673
1,325
113
Tulsa, OK
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Can I take a ticket from you with your contact details on it so that I can contact you if I need a word from God to settle my soul, I can call you?

It seems to me that you have a lot of tickets on yourself but I wonder how many people believe what it is that you claim?
Every one of the born again Ekklesia, called and chosen and set apart by God the Creator , in Jesus Christ ,

believe God and believe His Word, as God has said He Reveals , He Does,

just as I have posted it, as they all know from God, or are learning from Him.

Where do you think you yourself can ever find life ?
 

Jay Ross

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2011
6,760
2,523
113
QLD
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Every one of the born again Ekklesia, called and chosen and set apart by God the Creator , in Jesus Christ ,

believe God and believe His Word, as God has said He Reveals , He Does,

just as I have posted it, as they all know from God, or are learning from Him.

Where do you think you yourself can ever find life ?

You are coming across as a very nasty judgemental person who I would not chose to rub shoulders with by the attitudes that you demonstrate on this forum even if you think you are of the Ekklesia.

As to whether or not I am being drawn to God, and I hope and trust that God is also drawing your good self to Him as well, that is something that we should not condemn another soul with by comments like yours above.

If we are brothers in Christ, we should be as humble as possible and offer up encouragement wherever possible remembering that we will be judged by the same measure as we judge our brothers around us.
 

Joseph77

Well-Known Member
Apr 1, 2020
5,673
1,325
113
Tulsa, OK
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
If we are brothers in Christ, we should be as humble as possible and offer up encouragement wherever possible remembering that we will be judged by the same measure as we judge our brothers around us.
COOL!

IF, or if, or hopefully , if you are a brother in Christ, seeking truth in God's Kingdom, this will become apparent, instead of seeing obections to His Kingdom, you will seek to learn the truth, and believe the truth,
instead of whatever it is you were taught in the past, that makes you act like you do, and
instead to learn all IN HARMONY WITH GOD'S WORD, as GOD PERMITS.
 

Jay Ross

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2011
6,760
2,523
113
QLD
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
COOL!

IF, or if, or hopefully , if you are a brother in Christ, seeking truth in God's Kingdom, this will become apparent, instead of seeing obections to His Kingdom, you will seek to learn the truth, and believe the truth,
instead of whatever it is you were taught in the past, that makes you act like you do, and
instead to learn all IN HARMONY WITH GOD'S WORD, as GOD PERMITS.

Sadly, I have, but it is people like you who want to be safe and liked by those who may disagree with me who openly object to what I post.

You are so fixated on saving anyone who thinks differently to your good self, that you do not have time to mediate on whether or not the other person may be right in what they post. It seems that your response is, that person disagrees with me and therefore they are wrong and have not been saved. As another poster has said, your are an arrogant SOB.

Please not that the "SOB" is my addition to what was written in that post
 

Joseph77

Well-Known Member
Apr 1, 2020
5,673
1,325
113
Tulsa, OK
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Sadly, I have, but it is people like you who want to be safe and liked by those who may disagree with me who openly object to what I post.
This is not at all in line with truth. I am fully aware that most people hate Jesus, and most people hate Jesus' Disciples.

We, Ekklesia, do not expect nor seek anyone's approval other than God's.
If you disagree with us, we will pray for you, if God Permits (there is sin that leads to death, that we are not directed to pray for).

Your open objection to truth is quite common, worldwide - not at all unique to you, but just as damnable- subject to being judged , subject to being exposed by God's Word, Plan and Purpose.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Keraz

Jay Ross

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2011
6,760
2,523
113
QLD
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
This is not at all in line with truth. I am fully aware that most people hate Jesus, and most people hate Jesus' Disciples.

We, Ekklesia, do not expect nor seek anyone's approval other than God's.
If you disagree with us, we will pray for you, if God Permits (there is sin that leads to death, that we are not directed to pray for).

Your open objection to truth is quite common, worldwide - not at all unique to you, but just as damnable- subject to being judged , subject to being exposed by God's Word, Plan and Purpose.

What righteous cult do you belong to? The Pharisees?
 

Jay Ross

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2011
6,760
2,523
113
QLD
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
The pharisee's would not have me.

Sorry, but you have butted into a conversation where you were not included. But I understand your sediment. I feel like that sometimes as well.
 

Timtofly

Well-Known Member
Apr 9, 2020
8,272
581
113
Mount Morris
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
There are 3 Triumphant entries into the land of Palastine. All 3 cover 1 week of 7 days.

The first one was Joshua leading the Hebrews around Jericho for 7 days and after the sounds of the trumpets, the walls of Jericho fell down.

The second was Palm Sunday AD 30. Which ended the control of sin and death. Jesus Christ died and rose again completing the Atonement for all humanity.

The last week is the Second Coming of Christ to take over the kingdoms of this earth. There will be a truce with Satan which will be broken by Satan. This leads to the 1260 days, 42 months, or 3.5 year period known as the Great Tribulation.

Are there years of time before this last week of the church age, where we will be warned?

Yes the church will be judged first.

The covid19 virus is the first seal opened, and the church needs to repent and prepare for Christ's return.
 

Stranger

Well-Known Member
Oct 5, 2016
8,826
3,157
113
Texas
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Well, no, not really. Main reason is because the majority of Israel are still lost today; the majority of them still don't know who they are. They think they are Gentiles. So how they gonna' call themselves Jews? Only those of the "house of Judah" call themselves Jews.

The "house of Judah" were made up of just the tribes of Judah, Benjamin, Levi, and some small remnants of the ten tribes that refused Jeroboam's golden calf idols, and then Canaanite strangers and leftovers of Edom. The majority of Israelites were made up from the northern ten tribes which God scattered out of the land and caused to lose their heritage as Israel.

As I said all tribes today are lost to present Israel and Gentiles. No one can prove their tribe.

But they are not lost to God. (James 1:1)

Stranger
 

Stranger

Well-Known Member
Oct 5, 2016
8,826
3,157
113
Texas
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Scofield will stand before God in Judgment. like all the rest of us. As a teacher, he will be more severely judged. James 3:1
I would not like to be in his shoes!

If you and many confused people want to call every descendant of Jacob; Jews, then that is your prerogative. But people who have really looked at the anthropology and history of Israel, never will confuse the two tribes of the House of Judah, with the ten tribes of the House of Israel.
They have NOT rejoined as yet. Ezekiel 37 remains to be fulfilled.
The other point to note is that God scattered Israel and He knows where they all are. Amos 9:9 He sent Jesus to offer us His Salvation and He promises to gather them and resettle them back into all of the holy Land. Isaiah 11:11-13

ALL will be faithful believers; but the rebels will die in the desert. Ezekiel 20:34-38, Isaiah 35

I wouldn't want to be in your shoes.

I don't confuse the tribes of Judah with any others. But as I said, you have no ability today to identify who is of the tribe of Judah or of any other tribe.

Point being, none of this gives credence to your effort to call a saved Gentile a Jew.

Stranger
 

Davy

Well-Known Member
Feb 11, 2018
11,466
2,500
113
Southeastern U.S.
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
As I said all tribes today are lost to present Israel and Gentiles. No one can prove their tribe.

But they are not lost to God. (James 1:1)

Stranger

But that's not totally true. Some Israelites have kept their genealogy records through family history. But I'm not going to go into that here.
 

Hobie

Well-Known Member
Jun 11, 2009
2,418
928
113
South Florida
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
"
The False Doctrine of a 7-year Tribulation
^OP


Eh Disagree!

Daniel: gives Prophecy of Days.

Revelations: give Fulfillment of the Prophecy of Days.

Secret Rapture? Nothing Secret about it. Rapture is the Lifting UP OF Christ's Church TO Him, excepting them MADE Whole, from the Wrath of The Lamb and the Wrath of God, that Shall commence upon the Earth.

For: 1,203 days Israel shall be preached to in Jerusalem.
Rev 11:3

For: 1,203 days the Jews shall be preached to in the hills outside of the city.
Rev 12:6

The days are Precise...
But a man trying to "calculate" a precise timeframe...LOL...

There are over 40 calendars worldwide...plus within those calendars, some are lunar calendars, some are solar calendars, some are lunisolar calandars. Some have more or fewer days.

And the fact Is God never gave a "calendar" to mankind.

Nor did God intend for mankind to Know the Precise day or hour Christ would Lift Up His Church, and Exact His Great Tribulation and Wrath upon the Earth.

Humans merely have a general sign of the length of the Great Tribulation and things occurring that length of time.

A general calculation is the Great Tribulation will last approx. 7 years.

That is based on Daniels Prophecy and Revelations Revealing of what particular people are doing and for how long.

Glory To God,
Taken
"General Calculation" from who, nothing precise in that whole statement and need to be more precise at the prophetic time. Lets look at Revelation 11:1-2
1And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.

2But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

We find two groups of people are mentioned here, “them that worship” and “the Gentiles.” The first group represents God’s true church, spiritual while the second represents a false church that professes to worship God but is not true to him, not hard to figure out who this is. God’s true people are “measured,” or judged, while the others are not. This measurement or judgment is to determine whether those who profess to be Christians are really Christ’s faithful people so He knows who are the ones to be taken to His kingdom at the Second Coming.

“The Holy City” represents God’s true church, also called Jerusalem, and we see in verse 7 its opposite, “the Great City,” or “Babylon", which is this system of false religion or apostate church. This false church is seen to “tread” the true church “underfoot” for “forty and two months.” This refers to the same 1,260 year period of Papal domination seen in Daniel 7 and 8, lets look closely at this.
 

Hobie

Well-Known Member
Jun 11, 2009
2,418
928
113
South Florida
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
The prophetic time periods to be found in scripture is the time, times and half a time which is mentioned in Daniel and Revelation:

Daniel 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.
Daniel 12:7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

Revelation 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

If we look back to Daniel we see the word 'time' in this context refers to a period of a year. In the story of King Nebuchadnezzar, he went crazy for seven years and ate grass as an ox as seen in Daniel 4:32:

Daniel 4:32 And they shall drive thee from men, and thy dwelling shall be with the beasts of the field: they shall make thee to eat grass as oxen, and seven times shall pass over thee, until thou know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will.

So in prophetic reading we see the days equal years, so lets look how many days are in a time, times and half a time, it means time (or 1 year), times (or 2 years) and half a time (or 1/2 year) or a total of 3 1/2 years. Most people who look at it would stop at this point and accept the 3 1/2 years only at face value.

But these are prophetic years so each day is a year and 3 1/2 years would be 3 1/2 times a Jewish year of 360 days (360 x 3.5= 1260) so comes out to 1260 days, and a prophetic day equals a year so using the same methodology as is used for the 70 weeks of Daniel we calculate it to actually represent 1260 literal years. So, Time, Times and half a Time in prophecy is really 1260 years! To confirm this formula we need only to look at the book of Revelation.

Revelation 12:6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

Here the woman represents the faithful church, who flees into the wilderness for 1260 days. Again using the day=year formula, this actually speaks of 1260 years that the church would be persecuted. Now look at verse 14:

Revelation 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

Here the exact same time of persecution is referred to as 3 1/2 times, again meaning the same period of 1260 days/years as found in verse 6. In the book of Daniel, we saw this exact same period of persecution in church history:

Daniel 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

This verse in context is referring to a period of time that the little horn or Antichrist power will persecute the true believers or true church, again for 1260 years. The same is true for the time given "that it shall be for a time, times, and an half" for Daniel 12:7

So why is it not a year equal to 365 days as we hold today? Well in ancient times the year was held to be at 360 days. The fact that the prophets understood a year as 360 days is well attested, and can be seen in the prophecies of Daniel and Revelation as seen in the use of "time, times and half a time" (i.e. 1+2+0.5=3.5), "1,260 days" and "42 months". These references represent a period of 1260 years (based on the 360 day Jewish year multiplied by 3.5). Divide 1,260 days by 42 months and you will get a 30-day month, as 12 months of 30 days equals 360-days in a year

These time periods occur eight times in scripture:
Daniel 7:25, "time, times and a half".
Daniel 9:27, "half one set of seven".
Daniel 12:7, "time, times and a half".
Revelation 11:2, "42 months".
Revelation 11:3, "1260 days".
Revelation 12:6, "1260 days".
Revelation 12:14, "time, times and a half".
Revelation 13:5, "42 months".

We see it in the following Bible verses referring to the period translated, "time".

And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time. Daniel 7:25

And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and a half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished. Daniel 12:7

And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent. Revelation 12:14

The three primary precedents in Scripture:

1.Numbers 14:34. The Israelites will wander for 40 years in the wilderness, one year for every day spent by the spies in Canaan.

2.Ezekiel 4:5-6. The prophet Ezekiel is commanded to lie on his left side for 390 days, followed by his right side for 40 days, to symbolize the equivalent number of years of punishment on Israel and Judah respectively.

3.Daniel 9:24-27. This is known as the Prophecy of Seventy Weeks. The majority of scholars do understand the passage to refer to 70 "sevens" or "septets" of years—that is, a total of 490 years.

So its clear, the "time, times and half a time" (i.e. 1+2+0.5=3.5), "1,260 days" and "42 months" mentioned in Daniel and Revelation represent a period of 1260 years (based on the 360 day Jewish year multiplied by 3.5).

The "1,260 days" spanned the Middle Ages and historicists throughout history have identified the "1,260 days" as being fulfilled by rise of the Papacy and its temporal power being taken, from 538 AD to 1798, or Napoleon's Roman Republic.

So who is this apostate Antichrist power which persecutes and burns at the stake the true believers.
 

Davy

Well-Known Member
Feb 11, 2018
11,466
2,500
113
Southeastern U.S.
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
"

"General Calculation" from who, nothing precise in that whole statement and need to be more precise at the prophetic time. Lets look at Revelation 11:1-2
1And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.

2But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

We find two groups of people are mentioned here, “them that worship” and “the Gentiles.” The first group represents God’s true church, spiritual while the second represents a false church that professes to worship God but is not true to him, not hard to figure out who this is. God’s true people are “measured,” or judged, while the others are not. This measurement or judgment is to determine whether those who profess to be Christians are really Christ’s faithful people so He knows who are the ones to be taken to His kingdom at the Second Coming.

“The Holy City” represents God’s true church, also called Jerusalem, and we see in verse 7 its opposite, “the Great City,” or “Babylon", which is this system of false religion or apostate church. This false church is seen to “tread” the true church “underfoot” for “forty and two months.” This refers to the same 1,260 year period of Papal domination seen in Daniel 7 and 8, lets look closely at this.
Those of Revelation 11:1 that worship in that temple, which is during the 6th Trumpet - 2nd Woe period, are the orthodox unbelieving Jews in Jerusalem. That temple is the future 3rd temple today's orthodox Jews are ready to build for the end of this present world.

Rev 11:1
11 And there was given me
a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.
KJV

Ezek 43:10
10 Thou son of man, shew the house to the house of Israel, that they may be ashamed of their iniquities:
and let them measure the pattern.
KJV

That "reed" of Rev.11:1 is 'LIKE unto a ROD', which is pointing to a punishing rod. It is not only shown as a simple tool there, but also is symbolic of a punishing rod. So that is definitely NOT about Christ's Church worshiping there.

The "temple of God" phrase in GOD'S WORD always... points to the literal physical historical stone temple in Jerusalem.

That Ezekiel 43:10 verse, along with the command to measure starting in Ezekiel 40, is a link to that Revelation 11:1 event. In Ezekiel, only the idea of a measuring "reed" is mentioned, and not a "reed like unto a rod". It's likely because the pattern in Ezekiel 40 forward that Ezekiel is shown, he is commanded to show it to the rebellious house of Israel (ten tribes), as it is a future view of God's "house" (the very "Father's house" Jesus mentioned in John 14).

Thus the Revelation 11:1 "temple of God" is the new temple which the orthodox unbelieving Jews will build at the end of this world, in which Apostle Paul warned that the coming "man of sin" will sit in, and proclaim himself as GOD. Thus those are about FALSE WORSHIP in Jerusalem for the end.

This is why the next verse, Revelation 11:2, shows the Gentiles treading the holy city for 42 months, with the outer court of that temple left for them. Per Revelation 13:4-8, the "dragon" is given power over all nations for that 42 months. And that 42 months is pointing to the LATTER 3.5 years of Daniel's symbolic "one week" of Daniel 9:27. That... is about the time of "great tribulation" at the end of this world which Jesus warned His servants about.
 

Earburner

Well-Known Member
Feb 2, 2019
6,466
1,537
113
74
South Carolina
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
There is not one verse that says "Trinity" or "Rapture" in exactly those words. That does not make them false doctrines. So your fundamental premise is false, not the doctrine you claim to be false. Lack of comprehension does not make something false.
Nor does it say "Binary".
Half of the problem with the word "trinity" is the concept doesn't exist, AS church-ianity describes it.

God the Father and God the Son, both together are One together, being Holy Spirit together.

When we follow through with Rev. 3:20 by faith, and invite the Spirit of Lord Jesus into our life, the Father who is now IN Jesus first, comes within him, to be in us. Jesus Himself is the "living veil" for both God the Father and us.

Now, we shall discover not what His Father's house is, but rather Who it is that is "my Father's house."
"To be IN Jesus, is to be IN the KoH,
To be IN the KoH, is to be IN Jesus."


Search the KJV scriptures that testify WHO Jesus REALLY is FOR GOD THE FATHER, as well as for us, and you will discover who the Holy Spirit actually is.

To get started, here are some KJV words, that will help you find those scriptures:
1. Doeth the works.
2. In my Father's House
3. The Veil ...His flesh.
4. Many mansions
5. Garnished.
6. We
will make our abode.
7. Hath the Son,
hath the Father
8. Treasure in earthen vessels.
9. Wherein
dwelleth [His] righteousness (not ours).
10. New creature [creation].
11. Shall be changed.
12. New earth.
13.
In His likeness.
14. the KoG is with you, and shall be in you.
15. Firstborn
from the dead.
16. Firstborn among many brethren.
17. He that hath part in the First resurrection.
18. Partakers of the divine nature.
19. I and my Father are one.
20. None of his.
21. hath seen me,
hath seen the Father;
23. When the doors were shut.
24. As thou, Father, art in me,
25. in the likeness of his resurrection.
26. Observation.
The list goes on....

1 John 5
[5] Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?
[6] This is he that came by water and blood,
Jesus the Christ, not in water only, but in water [G5204] and blood [G229] and the spirit,[G5151] they testify that the spirit is the truth
[7] For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are ONE.

Maybe, you shall find more scriptures by God's Holy Spirit, being God the Father Himself dwelling within God the Son first, and now both together dwelling within you and I, being themselves the Holy Ghost.
Now that really is a "Holy trinity" as one
. :)
 
Last edited:

Zao is life

Well-Known Member
Oct 3, 2020
3,053
1,206
113
Africa
zaoislife.blogspot.com
Faith
Christian
Country
South Africa
Keraz, I graciously, in my response to @Joseph77, did not ridicule your understanding like you have ridiculed my understanding above where you played the person as a fool rather than to demonstrate from the original scriptural sources the reason why my understanding is flawed. What I said was that you come from a literal reading of the text whereas I also consider the metaphorical context of the same text, which you have repeatedly demonstrated, you chose very deliberately to ignore. You then go on to say the following, "When a prophecy is presented, showing how it can and will happen literally, this frightens him; thinking he may be involved," without providing any evidence to confirm how you actually know that I am frightened because I may secretly believe that your understanding may be right. This is a false argumentative rouse on your part which you know is untrue but you falsely make this claim.

You so passionately believe that what you present is true that you have written much on the fact that the sun will eject a great plasma cloud of particles towards the earth such that the earth will be burned up except for the specially protected area, where God has assemble all of His saints, in the "Promised Land."

My counsel to Joseph77 was to be careful as to what he accepts and agrees with before he shouts out a Hallelujah to what he had read. In another post, I also counselled him to read up on what will happen in our near future and during the End times.

If he comes to the same conclusion as you, well and good, but I left up to him to decide on what he decides without sling any mud towards you. Your slinging of mud at me only confirms that your understanding cannot stand up on its own.

Shalom
The poster you're talking to has said and confirmed to me that (in his belief) we have not been brought into the New Covenant yet. We have not received the New Covenant. It did not come with the death and resurrection of Christ.

He believes that we will be brought into the New Covenant only when we all - Jewish and Gentile believers in Christ - are literally gathered into a literal Israel on this earth - the one which the Jews now inhabit and according to him, occupy illegally because it's "ours" (move over Palestinians, there's a new claim here).

That explains his literalization of all prophecy. Bear in mind that he's in his 80's so when he's rude it's because he no doubt sees all of us as children who need to be corrected.