I never said any such thing. I'm beginning to wonder about your state of mind. Everything I say seems to get twisted into nonsense.
The False Doctrine with key word "COVER"
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I never said any such thing. I'm beginning to wonder about your state of mind. Everything I say seems to get twisted into nonsense.
You still believe the sin is in you, not taken away. You believe it is just covered
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Indwelling sin is not taken away but covered (1 John 1:8, Romans 4:7-8).
Practical sin is taken away...when we are born again we ought to cease from sinning in the practical sense (1 John 3:9; 1 John 3:6, 1 John 2:17).
Let me put it this way, you said,
If its removed is it not covered, did HE not die for "all sins", or is it you are still stuck in the now and not the end. Now if those who believe have put on "His" righteousness. which He imputes upon us, than you calling them sinners is therefore you making the claim that His righteousness is sin. Now if sin is done away with, than its is no longer a problem as we keep stating, it is you that continually insist that it is.
HE either died for all the sins of mankind or He did not, which is it, or are you going to do the religious thing and add the "But" part onto the end.
If its removed is it not covered, did HE not die for "all sins", or is it you are still stuck in the now and not the end. Now if those who believe have put on "His" righteousness. which He imputes upon us, than you calling them sinners is therefore you making the claim that His righteousness is sin. Now if sin is done away with, than its is no longer a problem as we keep stating, it is you that continually insist that it is.
HE either died for all the sins of mankind or He did not, which is it, or are you going to do the religious thing and add the "But" part onto the end.
That has nothing to do with opening the lambs book of life, we are found "worthy" when we beleieve not because of what we do,
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
I hear what you have said, but cannot agree with your conclusions. I won't argue the point nor try to combat scripture with scripture. I will simply strive to follow where God leads. May God bless you as you seek His face.
This is exactly why I made this OP. You are 100% wrong, and are using verses that do not apply to Christians. 1 John 1:8 is before Christ which starts with the next verse. And Romans 4 is about no longer being under the Mosaic law, but that doesn't leave us lawless, only instead of engraved on stone, they are written on our hearts by the Spirit, Romans 8:4-9.
CC: @Randy Kluth and @101G - see why this OP is so important? And we may not have very much time to get this right. With the asteroid that NASA is watching that will arrive on April 13, 2029, which will probably be at the end of the Great Tribulation, the Antichrist may be revealed in a year to18 months! Only those who are already holy (Philadelphians) will be protected during that time, and all struggling Christians will be beheaded. See why I am so concerned for the Church? jbf is a prime example of this false doctrine.
No I didn't have any such conversation with you. You'll have to back-track and show me. But for now, name who?
You do realize that when you came to Christ your PAST sins were taken away. You have a clean slate to no longer get dirty with sin. 2 Peter 1:9 only our old sins from our pre-Christ days were cleansed away, (not covered). Then we are given the divine power of grace to no longer sin in the present, nor in the future. 2 Peter 1:2-4
Read that carefully so you can stop twisting my words into nonsense.
101G
Well-Known Member
I feel your concerns, I was the same way, but the Lord had a talk with me and gave me much relief and when I lay my head down on my pillow, I go to sleep without a care in the world. Just read Revelation 22:11.
and as greyhound say, "and leave the driving to us... "God". for he knows everything. so don't get stress out ok.
PICJAG
101G The "Spiritual Saboteur"
101G
Well-Known Member
well if I'm wrong, then to who do . 1 John 1:8 apply to?
and especially 1 John 1:9
your answer please
PICJAG
101G The "Spiritual Saboteur"
and especially 1 John 1:9
your answer please
PICJAG
101G The "Spiritual Saboteur"
I know Rev. 22:11 by heart, so I don't even have to look it up. lol I'm not stressed out for myself, because I know between the two sets in Revelation 22:11, I am on the right side. But not everyone in the church has a lifetime to get it right!
101G
Well-Known Member
God can do anythin, in a second in a flash of an eyey he can change a heart.
now, who do 1 John 1:8 apply to? and especially 1 John 1:9
PICJAG
101G The "Spiritual Saboteur"
Who are you talking to??? 1 John 1:8 is talking about mankind in general BEFORE Christ. 1 John 1:9 is how to become a Christian and walk in the light. 1 John 1:6, 8 and 10 are all those walking in darkness.
5 - God is LIGHT
6 - If you walk in DARKNESS
7 - If you walk in the LIGHT
8 - If you say you are without sin when you've never confessed you are a liar
9 - Jesus will cleanse you of ALL YOUR SIN. You are no longer a sinner!
10 - If you say you've never sinned since you were born you are a liar.
6, 8 and 10 are those without Christ.
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1 John 1:8 and Romans 3:23 are alike by two different apostles.
19 Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. 20 Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
21 But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, 22 even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference; 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, 25 whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed, 26 to demonstrate at the present time His righteousness, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.
No one is born sinless. 1 John 1:9 is becoming born again. It is not an endless repeat of sin, repent, sin, repent, sin, repent as someone on one of these forums said today.
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ChristisGod
Well-Known Member
It cannot be what you said for the epistle is written to believers not unbelievers. And look below at WE and US ( John includes himself in the WE and the US)
6 If we claim to have fellowship with him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not live out the truth.
7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus, his Son, purifies us from all sin.
8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us.
You have changed the WE, US and OURSELVES to THEM. You are reading your ideas into the text instead of reading the plain meaning of the text.
hope this helps !!!
101G
Well-Known Member
ERROR, Mankind in General don't have "FELLOWSHIP" in a loving relationship with God. see CL, listen to what John is saying, 1 John 1:5 "This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all."
and, 1 John 1:6 "If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:"
or this, 1 John 1:8 "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us."
John is talking to save folk, christian, NOT to people of the world. sinners know that they are sinners. and as a matter of fact some ... "HATE" God.
so you error ther on that verse.
another ERROR on your part, God never require sinners to confess their sins in order to be save, no, God only requirement of Sinner is to confess his Son JESUS. see CL, you're confused. sinner never confess their sins as a requirement to be save, and hers's why. NOTICE in 1 John 1:9 it says "sins" that's with the "s" at the end, meaning all of them. if you had to be save base on confessing all of one's sins, none of us will be able to be saved. for what if you was sinning on January 5th 2005 at 5 am and you forgot to confess tha one. see the error. many people can't even remember what they was doing last week less five years ago, ... on friday at 3:30 pm. if any is like me, I cain't remember everything I was doing last week, or just two days ago.
no, the bible is clear, listen Joel 2:32 "And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the LORD hath said, and in the remnant whom the LORD shall call."
that word "delivered" is saved. NOW NT, fulfillment, Romans 10:12 "For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him."Romans 10:13 "For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved."Romans 10:14 "How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?"Romans 10:15 "And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!"
BINGO, Romans 10:13 "For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved." not confessing one's sins.
understand, one only have to confess Jesus, listen, Romans 10:9 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."Romans 10:10 "For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation."Romans 10:11 "For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed."
BINGO there it is, a sinner is to confess Jesus. see CL, confession of sins are for CHRISTIAN, and not for sinners. so you ERROR on your assumption, and on sin. what I have presented to you is BIBLE. and not my opinion, read these scriptures for yourself.
so all of 1 John is for save folk.
PICJAG
101G The "Spiritual Saboteur"
You have to know how the apostles write. You are western with a western mindset, and "we" and "I" as in Romans 7, you probably believe are Christians. (This is not my first rodeo.) But Paul is not saying that Christians have the struggle of Romans 7:14-23, and neither is John speaking about Christians who do not have the light of God in them.
I most certainly believe that in 1 John 1:8, the apostle John included himself when he said "we" in that verse.
Romans 4 is about justification by faith, primarily.
So, does that mean that once I become a Christian, if I sin afterwards, the sins that I commit after becoming a Christian are not forgiven (or that they cannot be forgiven)? That only the sins that I committed before becoming a Christian are forgiven through the blood of Christ?
If that is the case, it would be expedient for the unbeliever to delay becoming a Christian for as long as possible; hopefully attaining to a deathbed conversion. Because that way, there won't be as much of a possibility of sinning after becoming a Christian and thus having to pay for sins that I commit after becoming a Christian.
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