The gospel was preached even to those who are DEAD

[St. SteVen]

No I dont know, other than thinking you will probably not accept what I'm trying to say. And that apparently what I said annoys you.

Very good. - LOL

You mean clarity like the rich man who was in hell and realized his wrong, too late unfortunately.....

Yes, doesn't that support my point? The rich man saw it differently.

and who Abraham told that even if someone rose from the dead they will not believe....?

I think that was Jesus' punchline to the story. Abraham didn't say that.

There is more to this than simply "informing" the carnal mind.

That supports my point as well. But you only want to be contrary when communicating with me.

/

 

[keithr]

What did Peter mean by "spirits in prison"?

They are the angels that Peter refers to in 2 Peter 2:4-5 (WEB):

(4) For if God didn’t spare angels when they sinned, but cast them down to Tartarus, and committed them to pits of darkness to be reserved for judgment;​

(5) and didn’t spare the ancient world, but preserved Noah with seven others, a preacher of righteousness, when he brought a flood on the world of the ungodly;​

The angels are "spirits" (spirit beings, not human beings) that are imprisoned in darkness (in Tartarus, not Sheol) because they sinned by interfering in the gene pool of the human race, as described in Genesis 6:

(2) God’s sons {angels} saw that men’s daughters were beautiful, and they took any that they wanted for themselves as wives.​

(4) The Nephilim were in the earth in those days, and also after that, when God’s sons came in to men’s daughters and had children with them. Those were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown.​

The Nephilim were the offspring of the angels (taking on flesh bodies) and human women. This is why Peter writes, 1 Peter 3:19-20 (WEB):

(19) in which he also went and preached to the spirits in prison,​

(20) who before were disobedient, when God waited patiently in the days of Noah, while the ship was being built. In it, few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water.​

and Jude also mentions them, Jude 1:6 (KJV):

(6) And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.​

Peter was referring to these fallen angels who sinned in the days of Noah, and were largely responsible for God wiping out the whole of mankind, because He needed to eliminate the corrupted human genes. Noah was "perfect in his generations" (Genesis 6:9, MKJV), i.e. his DNA was pure human and had not been corrupted by the disobedient angels (note it says "generations", not "generation", and "perfect" is translated from the Hebrew word tamiym which can mean without blemish, undefiled, unimpaired).

So these spirits are alive (which is why they are in prison - dead people don't need to be imprisoned; they can't go anywhere), but they are prevented from materialising as men. Jesus, in his resurrected spirit being body, went to preach to these angels that were imprisoned in Tartarus - he didn't go to Sheol to preach to dead humans, as that would be pointless because the dead are unconscious and can not think about anything (when we die our "thoughts perish" - Psalms 146:4).

These dead people refer to:

1. The deceased patriarchs and the Old Testament saints. (Papists' Limbus)
2. The people who died in Noah's flood long ago.
3. Those who are alive but spiritually dead. (Amplified Bible)
4. The good Christians who died as martyrs.
5. All the dead and all will head to heaven eventually. (Origen, universal salvation)
6. Some dead people at the time. Some to heaven, others to hell.
7. A selected (or elected) group of dead people who never heard of the gospel when alive but would believe if they heard it.

I think options 6 and 7 are most likely.

I think 1 Peter 4:6 (WEB):

(6) For to this end the Good News was preached even to the dead, that they might be judged indeed as men in the flesh, but live as to God in the spirit.​

is referring to (4) - Christians who had already died when Peter wrote that verse. The passage is talking about suffering for righteousness' sake (WEB):

1 Peter 3:8-9

(8) Finally, be all like-minded, compassionate, loving as brothers, tender hearted, courteous,​

(9) not rendering evil for evil, or insult for insult; but instead blessing; knowing that to this were you called, that you may inherit a blessing.​

1 Peter 3:14

(14) But even if you should suffer for righteousness’ sake, you are blessed. “Don’t fear what they fear, neither be troubled.”​

1 Peter 3:16-18

(16) having a good conscience; that, while you are spoken against as evildoers, they may be disappointed who curse your good way of life in Christ.​

(17) For it is better, if it is God’s will, that you suffer for doing well than for doing evil.​

(18) Because Christ also suffered for sins once, the righteous for the unrighteous, that he might bring you to God; being put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit;​

1 Peter 4:1

(1) Therefore, since Christ suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves also with the same mind; for he who has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin;​

1 Peter 4:3-6

(3) For we have spent enough of our past time doing the desire of the Gentiles, and having walked in lewdness, lusts, drunken binges, orgies, carousings, and abominable idolatries.​

(4) They think it is strange that you don’t run with them into the same excess of riot, blaspheming:​

(5) who will give account to him who is ready to judge the living and the dead.​

(6) For to this end the Good News was preached even to the dead, that they might be judged indeed as men in the flesh, but live as to God in the spirit.​

Despite returning blessing for evil, the Gentiles (non-Christians) judge Christians as strange, and speak against them falsely as evildoers (much like antisemitism, in which people for no logical reason hate Jews). 1 Peter 4:6 is saying that Christians that are now dead, who were wrongly judged and persecuted while they were alive, and may even have been killed simply because they were Christians, despite that judgement by men, according to God, who judges our spirit (intentions) they are judged as worthy of eternal life. Perhaps the TLV translation is a bit clearer:

(6) For this was the reason the Good News was proclaimed even to those now dead, so that though they are judged in the flesh before humans, they might live in the Ruach before God.​

 

[Cassandra]

Jesus, in his resurrected spirit being body, went to preach to these angels that were imprisoned in Tartarus - he didn't go to Sheol to preach to dead humans, as that would be pointless because the dead are unconscious and can not think about anything (when we die our "thoughts perish" - Psalms 146:4).

Why in the world would Jesus go to preach to them?

 

[TonyChanYT]

They are the angels that Peter refers to in 2 Peter 2:4-5

Why did Jesus talk to them?

 

[dev553344]

1 Peter 3:


i.e., those who knew God and those who didn't


What did Peter mean by "spirits in prison"?

Peter continued the explanation in the next chapter, but then he switched to the present tense, 1 Peter 4:


Now, Peter was talking about people who were alive at his time.


When are the preaching and judging performed?

The aorists direct our thoughts to some definite occasion. Time is not indicated. They are done on the last day of a person's life, corresponding to the last day of the current creation for everyone.

Who are these dead people?

These dead people refer to:

1. The deceased patriarchs and the Old Testament saints. (Papists' Limbus)
2. The people who died in Noah's flood long ago.
3. Those who are alive but spiritually dead. (Amplified Bible)
4. The good Christians who died as martyrs.
5. All the dead and all will head to heaven eventually. (Origen, universal salvation)
6. Some dead people at the time. Some to heaven, others to hell.
7. A selected (or elected) group of dead people who never heard of the gospel when alive but would believe if they heard it.

I think options 6 and 7 are most likely.

The dead that were preached in spirit prison are people pre-Jesus' atonement and gospel. They have to accept Jesus as their King and that he made a way to live with God again after the fall of Adam and Eve. And they must live in heaven as God commands them to live.

But you have to ask yourself. Does everyone pre Jesus go to hell awaiting the atonement? Certainly not. They went to paradise if they were good.

The people that were preached to in spirit prison were disobedient sinners, wicked.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Why in the world would Jesus go to preach to them?

Exactly! This doesn't fit because there is no salvation for angels.

And the ones that have rebelled against the Lord already know their goose is cooked.

You can stick a fork in them cause they are done!

 

[keithr]

Why in the world would Jesus go to preach to them?

Why did Jesus talk to them?

Peter doesn't go into detail of what Jesus preached, so we can only guess. The fact that Jesus preached to them could indicate that there is perhaps the possibliity that some of the fallen angels might repent of their disobedience, and refrain from any further disobedience. Having just revealed the great mercy of God towards mankind, by accomplishing the redemption of mankind, perhaps Jesus was revealing the possibility that God might also show mercy to the fallen angels. Peter wrote, 1 Peter 3:18-19 (WEB):

(18) Because Christ also suffered for sins once, the righteous for the unrighteous, that he might bring you to God; being put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit;​

(19) in which he also went and preached to the spirits in prison,​

i.e. it was probably the message of his death and resurrection, in obedience to God, that Jesus preached. The purpose of Jesus going to them, I would suspect, was to give them some hope. God loves all mankind, and there is no reason to suspect that He doesn't love His spirit being sons too (they were created first, and are a higher creation than mankind). God went to great effort and sacrifice to redeem mankind, so I wouldn't be surprised if He has a plan for helping the fallen angels too. There is still a future judgement day for the angels, in which we have a part:

1 Corinthians 6:3

(3) Don’t you know that we will judge angels? How much more, things that pertain to this life?​

Jude 1:6

(6) Angels who didn’t keep their first domain, but deserted their own dwelling place, he has kept in everlasting bonds under darkness for the judgment of the great day.​

I suspect that the angels, like mankind, have up until the end of Christ's 1,000 year reign before they are judged, so maybe God has made provisions for their recovery during Christ's 1,000 year reign. Matthew 25:41 (WEB):

(41) Then he will say also to those on the left hand, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire which is prepared for the devil and his angels;​

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

The people that were preached to in spirit prison were disobedient sinners, wicked.

No, their fate had already been sealed.

They did not get any second chances as they lives in darkness in their earthly life, so they will remain in hell.

There's no evidence in scripture than after one dies they get a second chance... only the catholic cult believes that.

 

[Wick Stick]

What did Peter mean by "spirits in prison"?

It's a reference to something in the book of 1Enoch.

I know... 1Enoch isn't part of the Bible. You'll have to take it up with Peter. He made the reference, not me.

 

[TonyChanYT]

some of the fallen angels might repent of their disobedience

See Can angels repent? and follow up there.

 

[JunChosen]

Something happened at the Fall that still affects us today, but I believe will NOT affect us in the afterlife

THAT"S TRUE!

Revelation 21:3-4 reads:

3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God [is] with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, [and be] their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

To God Be The Glory

 

[quietthinker]

The gospel was preached even to those who are DEAD​

Does that include you, Tony?

 

[Lizbeth]

St. SteVen said:
Who told Adam that he was naked?

That's not the point. !!!

Question: Will the same voice that told Adam he was was naked be speaking to us when we meet Jesus face to face in the afterlife?

THAT'S THE POINT !!!!!!!!!!

/

Sorry if I missed your point, but the point I was making still stands. It has to be by FAITH, not by knowledge of the carnal mind.....one can only receive the Spirit of Christ by faith in order to have a new heart and be a sanctified new creature....that is what salvation IS essentially. Our old man can't be saved and rehabilitated....we have to become/receive a new man. Faith is in spirit and of the Spirit, not of the natural carnal mind of the old man.....it's not of our own but is given by God to whomsoever is willing in this life and whomsoever HE chooses. The Jews of the first century believed in God (mental assent/knowledge of the carnal mind) but that didn't save them. Likewise the devil and demons know there is a God but that doesn't save them either.

God just doesn't offer people the gift of salvation after they have died, and that is His perogative I would think......it is just not taught in His word that He does. On the contrary, scripture is everywhere proclaiming and picturing and preaching and warning the opposite. "If it is hard for the righteous to be saved, what will happen to the ungodly and sinner?" Obviously not saved. Anyone saying otherwise is bringing another gospel...one that Jesus and the apostles certainly weren't teaching.

 

[Lizbeth]

THAT"S TRUE!

Revelation 21:3-4 reads:

3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God [is] with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, [and be] their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

To God Be The Glory

Revelation 21 is a reiteration of the gospel and how it will be for those who receive Christ. He is tabernacling right now with those who have received Him. " Christ IN us....". Pictured in the Feast of Tabernacles and already fulfilled. But those wonderful promises won't be true for those who don't receive Christ unfortunately. On the contrary, sadly we are warned that weeping and gnashing of teeth and second death is promised for those who He isn't indwelling.

2Co 5:17
Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

 

[St. SteVen]

Sorry if I missed your point, but the point I was making still stands. It has to be by FAITH, not by knowledge of the carnal mind.....one can only receive the Spirit of Christ by faith in order to have a new heart and be a sanctified new creature....that is what salvation IS essentially. Our old man can't be saved and rehabilitated....we have to become/receive a new man. Faith is in spirit and of the Spirit, not of the natural carnal mind of the old man.....it's not of our own but is given by God to whomsoever is willing in this life and whomsoever HE chooses. The Jews of the first century believed in God (mental assent/knowledge of the carnal mind) but that didn't save them. Likewise the devil and demons know there is a God but that doesn't save them either.

You are still talking about this present life.
We were talking about a FACE TO FACE encounter in the afterlife. None of what you are saying would apply.

God just doesn't offer people the gift of salvation after they have died, and that is His perogative I would think......it is just not taught in His word that He does. On the contrary, scripture is everywhere proclaiming and picturing and preaching and warning the opposite. "If it is hard for the righteous to be saved, what will happen to the ungodly and sinner?" Obviously not saved. Anyone saying otherwise is bringing another gospel...one that Jesus and the apostles certainly weren't teaching.

Where was Jesus for three days before his resurrection? The Apostles told us. Jesus too.
Preaching to those in Hades. Then he took captivity captive and led them out of there.
If it happened once, it can happen again.

/

 

[amigo de christo]

Exactly! This doesn't fit because there is no salvation for angels.

And the ones that have rebelled against the Lord already know their goose is cooked.

You can stick a fork in them cause they are done!

We can actually find this in the Bible too . HAVE YE COME TO TORMENT US BEFORE THE TIME .
THEY ALL KNOW JUDGMENT DAY AWAITS THEM .
And the devil does too . Having great wrath because HE KNOWS HIS TIME IS SHORT . they know
and they gonna decieve too . satan wants all of humanity going down with him .
So he invented the all inclusive rainbow many path accepting false love lie so as all who buy it will be damned with HIM .

 

[amigo de christo]

Sorry if I missed your point, but the point I was making still stands. It has to be by FAITH, not by knowledge of the carnal mind.....one can only receive the Spirit of Christ by faith in order to have a new heart and be a sanctified new creature....that is what salvation IS essentially. Our old man can't be saved and rehabilitated....we have to become/receive a new man. Faith is in spirit and of the Spirit, not of the natural carnal mind of the old man.....it's not of our own but is given by God to whomsoever is willing in this life and whomsoever HE chooses. The Jews of the first century believed in God (mental assent/knowledge of the carnal mind) but that didn't save them. Likewise the devil and demons know there is a God but that doesn't save them either.

God just doesn't offer people the gift of salvation after they have died, and that is His perogative I would think......it is just not taught in His word that He does. On the contrary, scripture is everywhere proclaiming and picturing and preaching and warning the opposite. "If it is hard for the righteous to be saved, what will happen to the ungodly and sinner?" Obviously not saved. Anyone saying otherwise is bringing another gospel...one that Jesus and the apostles certainly weren't teaching.

many are already to some degree under the influence of another gospel WHICH IS NO GOSPEL .
it offers up false hope by pumping out false love . It has made the way to GOD VERY BROAD and BROADER BY the DAY .
Many have no idea what has come within Christendom to seduce and conform it to a love that will not save them or the world .
But they see it as love , as a loving GOD who desires so much good for us all , THAT HE TRODS THE DIRE NEED
to believe on JESUS right under foot . ONLY THOUGH GOD DOES DESIRE GOOD FOR US
HE WONT BE TRODDING THE GOSPEL OF HIS SON under foot . RATHER its why HE SENT THE SON
so as all who would BELIEVE would not perish but have ever lasting life .
But the all inclusive gospel says , NAY , NAY if ye believe not , surly ye shall not perish
BELIEVE as thou wilt , just hug love and get along and do some good works and all shall be well with thee,
ONLY LETS NOT FORGET the serpent is A LIAR . BUT NOT GOD , NOT CHRIST . GOD cannot lie , but men who even use HIS NAME
CAN LIE and can seduce . THUS ITS GOOD WE GET DUG IN THE BIBLE to test all by THEM WORDS.

 

[Lizbeth]

They are the angels that Peter refers to in 2 Peter 2:4-5 (WEB):

(4) For if God didn’t spare angels when they sinned, but cast them down to Tartarus, and committed them to pits of darkness to be reserved for judgment;​

(5) and didn’t spare the ancient world, but preserved Noah with seven others, a preacher of righteousness, when he brought a flood on the world of the ungodly;​

The angels are "spirits" (spirit beings, not human beings) that are imprisoned in darkness (in Tartarus, not Sheol) because they sinned by interfering in the gene pool of the human race, as described in Genesis 6:

(2) God’s sons {angels} saw that men’s daughters were beautiful, and they took any that they wanted for themselves as wives.​

(4) The Nephilim were in the earth in those days, and also after that, when God’s sons came in to men’s daughters and had children with them. Those were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown.​

The Nephilim were the offspring of the angels (taking on flesh bodies) and human women. This is why Peter writes, 1 Peter 3:19-20 (WEB):

(19) in which he also went and preached to the spirits in prison,​

(20) who before were disobedient, when God waited patiently in the days of Noah, while the ship was being built. In it, few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water.​

and Jude also mentions them, Jude 1:6 (KJV):

(6) And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.​

Peter was referring to these fallen angels who sinned in the days of Noah, and were largely responsible for God wiping out the whole of mankind, because He needed to eliminate the corrupted human genes. Noah was "perfect in his generations" (Genesis 6:9, MKJV), i.e. his DNA was pure human and had not been corrupted by the disobedient angels (note it says "generations", not "generation", and "perfect" is translated from the Hebrew word tamiym which can mean without blemish, undefiled, unimpaired).

So these spirits are alive (which is why they are in prison - dead people don't need to be imprisoned; they can't go anywhere), but they are prevented from materialising as men. Jesus, in his resurrected spirit being body, went to preach to these angels that were imprisoned in Tartarus - he didn't go to Sheol to preach to dead humans, as that would be pointless because the dead are unconscious and can not think about anything (when we die our "thoughts perish" - Psalms 146:4).


I think 1 Peter 4:6 (WEB):

(6) For to this end the Good News was preached even to the dead, that they might be judged indeed as men in the flesh, but live as to God in the spirit.​

is referring to (4) - Christians who had already died when Peter wrote that verse. The passage is talking about suffering for righteousness' sake (WEB):

1 Peter 3:8-9

(8) Finally, be all like-minded, compassionate, loving as brothers, tender hearted, courteous,​

(9) not rendering evil for evil, or insult for insult; but instead blessing; knowing that to this were you called, that you may inherit a blessing.​

1 Peter 3:14

(14) But even if you should suffer for righteousness’ sake, you are blessed. “Don’t fear what they fear, neither be troubled.”​

1 Peter 3:16-18

(16) having a good conscience; that, while you are spoken against as evildoers, they may be disappointed who curse your good way of life in Christ.​

(17) For it is better, if it is God’s will, that you suffer for doing well than for doing evil.​

(18) Because Christ also suffered for sins once, the righteous for the unrighteous, that he might bring you to God; being put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit;​

1 Peter 4:1

(1) Therefore, since Christ suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves also with the same mind; for he who has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin;​

1 Peter 4:3-6

(3) For we have spent enough of our past time doing the desire of the Gentiles, and having walked in lewdness, lusts, drunken binges, orgies, carousings, and abominable idolatries.​

(4) They think it is strange that you don’t run with them into the same excess of riot, blaspheming:​

(5) who will give account to him who is ready to judge the living and the dead.​

(6) For to this end the Good News was preached even to the dead, that they might be judged indeed as men in the flesh, but live as to God in the spirit.​

Despite returning blessing for evil, the Gentiles (non-Christians) judge Christians as strange, and speak against them falsely as evildoers (much like antisemitism, in which people for no logical reason hate Jews). 1 Peter 4:6 is saying that Christians that are now dead, who were wrongly judged and persecuted while they were alive, and may even have been killed simply because they were Christians, despite that judgement by men, according to God, who judges our spirit (intentions) they are judged as worthy of eternal life. Perhaps the TLV translation is a bit clearer:

(6) For this was the reason the Good News was proclaimed even to those now dead, so that though they are judged in the flesh before humans, they might live in the Ruach before God.​

Thank you , this is good teaching here in my opinion - makes sense. Good news for those OT saints who had died in faith.......but not so good news for the fallen angels who had just been defeated and dethroned by that gospel. Amen, and judgment begins with God's house, in the sufferings we suffer in this life, chastised as sons.

 

[Lizbeth]

You are still talking about this present life.
We were talking about a FACE TO FACE encounter in the afterlife. None of what you are saying would apply.

In fewer words, what I'm trying to say is that salvation must be by faith, not merely by sight.

Faith necessarily involves receiving/having the Spirit of Christ/God, without which one isn't saved. We don't consider that the devil and fallen angels have the Holy Spirit do we, even though they know by sight that there is a God. This is why Jesus said BLESSED are you who haven't seen and yet believe. After death everyone will know by sight, so to speak, that God and Jesus are true. But that doesn't mean they will have His Spirit (faith)....without which they do not have eternal life. Hope that explains it better.

 

[St. SteVen]

After death everyone will know by sight, so to speak, that God and Jesus are true. But that doesn't mean they will have His Spirit (faith)....without which they do not have eternal life. Hope that explains it better.

How does one declare their faith, in this life or the next?
Every knee will bow and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus is Lord. (in the afterlife)
On earth, in heaven and under the earth. (in the realm of the dead) See Philippians 2:10-11

1 Corinthians 12:3
Therefore I want you to know that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, “Jesus be cursed,”
and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit.

Romans 10:9
If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart
that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Romans 14:9
For this very reason, Christ died and returned to life so that
he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living.

/