The Jesuits ... What is their role? Part 1 and 2

[RogerDC]

Ummmm like "Soul Sleep"?

OR, the idea that Hell is not eternal - even though the Bible says it IS . . .
(Isa. 33:11, 14, Matt. 25:31-34, 41, 46, Mark 9:47–48, Luke 3:16-17, 2 Thess. 1:6-9)?

How about FALSE prophecies regarding the Lord's Return??
I've never experienced a "Great Disappointment" with God . . .

Since the SDA church is guided by the Holy Spirit, those false prophesies are the fault of the HS, who evidently made some mistakes.

 

[quietthinker]

There are no contradictions in Catholic doctrine, because the word of God doesn't contain contradictions. If you see contradictions in the CCC, all that means is, you don't understand the truth.

LOL...ohhh dear oh dear oh dear....there is much I can say here but is there any point?....I think all I'll do is laugh at such a short sighted exclamation. On second thoughts this is what Jesus said to those who had a similar view 'you know not the scriptures nor the power of God'

 

[RogerDC]

Based o the information I gave you in post #395 about the CLOSING of the Jewish Canon in the SECOND century and the deletion of the 7 Deuterocanonical Books at that time from the previously OPEN Canon - please show me from Scripture where Jesus "rejected" these 7 Books.

While you're at it - please explain why there are almost 200 references to those books in the New Testament - such as:
Eph. 6:13-17 - The discussion of armor, helmet, breastplate, sword, shield follows Wis. 5:17-20.
Heb 11:35 - Paul teaches about the martyrdom of the mother and her sons described in 2 Macc. 7:1-42.

PLEASE explain this . . .

Stop using the scriptures and inescapable logic to support your argument - it's not fair!

 

[RogerDC]

The Protestants attempt to defend their rejection of the deuterocanonicals on the ground that the early Jews rejected them. However, the Jewish councils that rejected them (e.g., School of Javneh (also called “Jamnia” in 90 – 100 A.D.) were the same councils that rejected the entire New Testatment canon. Thus, Protestants who reject the Catholic Bible are following a Jewish council that rejected Christ and the Revelation of the New Testament. (Enoch's "authority")

Matt. 2:16 – Herod’s decree of slaying innocent children was prophesied in Wis. 11:7 – slaying the holy innocents.

Matt. 6:19-20 – Jesus’ statement about laying up for yourselves treasure in heaven follows Sirach 29:11 – lay up your treasure.

Matt.. 7:12 – Jesus’ golden rule “do unto others” is the converse of Tobit 4:15 – what you hate, do not do to others.

Matt. 7:16,20 – Jesus’ statement “you will know them by their fruits” follows Sirach 27:6 – the fruit discloses the cultivation.

Matt. 9:36 – the people were “like sheep without a shepherd” is same as Judith 11:19 – sheep without a shepherd.

Matt. 11:25 – Jesus’ description “Lord of heaven and earth” is the same as Tobit 7:18 – Lord of heaven and earth.

Matt. 12:42 – Jesus refers to the wisdom of Solomon which was recorded and made part of the deuterocanonical books.

Matt. 16:18 – Jesus’ reference to the “power of death” and “gates of Hades” references Wisdom 16:13.

Matt. 22:25; Mark 12:20; Luke 20:29 – Gospel writers refer to the canonicity of Tobit 3:8 and 7:11 regarding the seven brothers.

Matt. 24:15 – the “desolating sacrilege” Jesus refers to is also taken from 1 Macc. 1:54 and 2 Macc. 8:17.

Matt. 24:16 – let those “flee to the mountains” is taken from 1 Macc. 2:28.

Matt. 27:43 – if He is God’s Son, let God deliver him from His adversaries follows Wisdom 2:18.

Mark 4:5,16-17 – Jesus’ description of seeds falling on rocky ground and having no root follows Sirach 40:15.

Mark 9:48 – description of hell where their worm does not die and the fire is not quenched references Judith 16:17.

Luke 1:42 – Elizabeth’s declaration of Mary’s blessedness above all women follows Uzziah’s declaration in Judith 13:18.

Luke 1:52 – Mary’s magnificat addressing the mighty falling from their thrones and replaced by lowly follows Sirach 10:14.

Luke 2:29 – Simeon’s declaration that he is ready to die after seeing the Child Jesus follows Tobit 11:9.

Luke 13:29 – the Lord’s description of men coming from east and west to rejoice in God follows Baruch 4:37.

Luke 21:24 – Jesus’ usage of “fall by the edge of the sword” follows Sirach 28:18.

Luke 24:4 and Acts 1:10 – Luke’s description of the two men in dazzling apparel reminds us of 2 Macc. 3:26.

John 1:3 – all things were made through Him, the Word, follows Wisdom 9:1.

John 3:13 – who has ascended into heaven but He who descended from heaven references Baruch 3:29.

John 4:48; Acts 5:12; 15:12; 2 Cor. 12:12 – Jesus’, Luke’s and Paul’s usage of “signs and wonders” follows Wisdom 8:8.

Luke 1:52 – Mary’s magnificat addressing the mighty falling from their thrones and replaced by lowly follows Sirach 10:14.

Luke 2:29 – Simeon’s declaration that he is ready to die after seeing the Child Jesus follows Tobit 11:9.

Luke 13:29 – the Lord’s description of men coming from east and west to rejoice in God follows Baruch 4:37.

Luke 21:24 – Jesus’ usage of “fall by the edge of the sword” follows Sirach 28:18.

Luke 24:4 and Acts 1:10 – Luke’s description of the two men in dazzling apparel reminds us of 2 Macc. 3:26.

John 1:3 – all things were made through Him, the Word, follows Wisdom 9:1.

John 3:13 – who has ascended into heaven but He who descended from heaven references Baruch 3:29.

John 4:48; Acts 5:12; 15:12; 2 Cor. 12:12 – Jesus’, Luke’s and Paul’s usage of “signs and wonders” follows Wisdom 8:8.

John 5:18 – Jesus claiming that God is His Father follows Wisdom 2:16.

John 6:35-59 – Jesus’ Eucharistic discourse is foreshadowed in Sirach 24:21.

John 10:22 – the identification of the feast of the dedication is taken from 1 Macc. 4:59.

John 10:36 – Jesus accepts the inspiration of Maccabees as He analogizes the Hanukkah consecration to His own consecration to the Father in 1 Macc. 4:36.

John 15:6 – branches that don’t bear fruit and are cut down follows Wis. 4:5 where branches are broken off.
more here
Furthermore, there is no historical evidence of a 66 book Bible before the 14th century.

Great post!!

 

[RogerDC]

LOL...ohhh dear oh dear oh dear....there is much I can say here but is there any point?....I think all I'll do is laugh at such a short sighted exclamation. On second thoughts this is what Jesus said to those who had a similar view 'you know not the scriptures nor the power of God'

Believe that or not, I used to hold similar anti-Catholic views to yours .. but then the Holy Spirit opened my eyes and mind to the truth of the Catholic Church - the apostles' Church.

 

[Brakelite]

Ummmm like "Soul Sleep"?

OR, the idea that Hell is not eternal - even though the Bible says it IS . . .
(Isa. 33:11, 14, Matt. 25:31-34, 41, 46, Mark 9:47–48, Luke 3:16-17, 2 Thess. 1:6-9)?

How about FALSE prophecies regarding the Lord's Return??
I've never experienced a "Great Disappointment" with God . . .

Let us deal with the above scriptures one at a time shall we? Remember, just in case you decide to revert back to your rugby playing days and side step the issue, I would remind you that we are talking about Eternal torment in flames for sinners yes? So, first quote of yours was Isaiah 33:11-14. Isaiah, or God through Isaiah, is speaking...
KJV Isaiah 33
11 Ye shall conceive chaff, ye shall bring forth stubble: your breath, as fire, shall devour you.
12 And the people shall be as the burnings of lime: as thorns cut up shall they be burned in the fire....

Let us pause there a moment for a moment because the above verse reminds me of others very similar to that bearing the same message... For example....
KJV Malachi 4
1 For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch....
And yet another with a similar theme found in the gospel spoken by Jesus Himself...
KJV John 15
6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
The picture we are being given is the likeness between burning dry dead branches in a rubbish fire and the destiny of the wicked. What I see is at the end of the process, there is nothing left but ashes. There is no help for you here BoL in your claim that people burn forever, in fact, quite the opposite. But let us continue with Isaiah 33 shall we...


13 Hear, ye that are far off, what I have done; and, ye that are near, acknowledge my might.
14 The sinners in Zion are afraid; fearfulness hath surprised the hypocrites. Who among us shall dwell with the devouring fire? who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings?

So, here we have God asking us a question. Who among us shall dwell with the devouring fire? who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings?
Now the beauty of scripture... Particularly progress scripture as above, is that scripture answers it's own questions. Isn't that cool? We don't need to go to the church magisterium to decipher things we are confused about, God Himself supplies all our needs. The answer to that question is in the very next verse... Take a look...
KJV Isaiah 33
15 He that walketh righteously, and speaketh uprightly; he that despiseth the gain of oppressions, that shaketh his hands from holding of bribes, that stoppeth his ears from hearing of blood, and shutteth his eyes from seeing evil;
16 He shall dwell on high: his place of defence shall be the munitions of rocks: bread shall be given him; his waters shall be sure.

This is so exciting. The righteous, the saints, who by their works are judged righteous ( he that doeth righteousness is righteous 1 John 2:29;3:7) shall dwell safely in the midst of the very fire you claim is the everlasting abode of the wicked. Now I'm not confused by this BoL. Are you? Can you offer an explaination for this seeming apparent contradiction that satisfies your claim that the wicked burn forever in this everlasting fire?
Please?

 

[BreadOfLife]

Ohhh BOL.....you dig your hole deeper with every retort but you do not see it anymore than those who condemned Jesus saw their own situation.

Thanks for that NON-answer.
Now - maybe you can actually address an issue??

 

[BreadOfLife]

yes, this is what you get off on....this is in your own words where your love is anchored.

Call it a guilty pleasure . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Let us deal with the above scriptures one at a time shall we? Remember, just in case you decide to revert back to your rugby playing days and side step the issue, I would remind you that we are talking about Eternal torment in flames for sinners yes? So, first quote of yours was Isaiah 33:11-14. Isaiah, or God through Isaiah, is speaking...
KJV Isaiah 33
11 Ye shall conceive chaff, ye shall bring forth stubble: your breath, as fire, shall devour you.
12 And the people shall be as the burnings of lime: as thorns cut up shall they be burned in the fire....

Let us pause there a moment for a moment because the above verse reminds me of others very similar to that bearing the same message... For example....
KJV Malachi 4
1 For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch....
And yet another with a similar theme found in the gospel spoken by Jesus Himself...
KJV John 15
6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
The picture we are being given is the likeness between burning dry dead branches in a rubbish fire and the destiny of the wicked. What I see is at the end of the process, there is nothing left but ashes. There is no help for you here BoL in your claim that people burn forever, in fact, quite the opposite. But let us continue with Isaiah 33 shall we...

13 Hear, ye that are far off, what I have done; and, ye that are near, acknowledge my might.
14 The sinners in Zion are afraid; fearfulness hath surprised the hypocrites. Who among us shall dwell with the devouring fire? who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings?

So, here we have God asking us a question. Who among us shall dwell with the devouring fire? who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings?
Now the beauty of scripture... Particularly progress scripture as above, is that scripture answers it's own questions. Isn't that cool? We don't need to go to the church magisterium to decipher things we are confused about, God Himself supplies all our needs. The answer to that question is in the very next verse... Take a look...
KJV Isaiah 33
15 He that walketh righteously, and speaketh uprightly; he that despiseth the gain of oppressions, that shaketh his hands from holding of bribes, that stoppeth his ears from hearing of blood, and shutteth his eyes from seeing evil;
16 He shall dwell on high: his place of defence shall be the munitions of rocks: bread shall be given him; his waters shall be sure.

This is so exciting. The righteous, the saints, who by their works are judged righteous ( he that doeth righteousness is righteous 1 John 2:29;3:7) shall dwell safely in the midst of the very fire you claim is the everlasting abode of the wicked. Now I'm not confused by this BoL. Are you? Can you offer an explaination for this seeming apparent contradiction that satisfies your claim that the wicked burn forever in this everlasting fire?
Please?

Your problem - besides denial - is that you utterly FAIL to understand Biblical CONTEXT.

The Holy Spirit who inspired Isaiah to write about an eternal Hell is the SAME Holy Spirit who inspired Matthew, Mark, Luke and Paul to write about it.

Isa. 33:11, 14
"My spirit shall consume you like fire . . . On Zion sinners are in dread, trembling grips the impious: 'Who of us can live with the consuming fire? Who of us can live with the everlasting flames?'"

Matt. 25:31-34, 41, 46
"He will separate them one from another . . . Then the king will say to those on his right, 'Come, you who are blessed by my Father. Inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. . . .' Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you accursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels . . .' And these will go off to ETERNAL punishment, but the righteous to eternal life"

Luke 3:16-17
"He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire. His winnowing fan is in his hand to clear his threshing floor and to gather the wheat into his barn, but the chaff he will burn in UNQUENCHABLE fire"

Mark 9:47–48
"It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than with two eyes to be thrown into hell, where the worm does not die, and the fire is not quenched."

2 Thess. 1:6-9
"For it is surely just on God's part to repay with afflictions those who are afflicting you . . . at the revelation of the Lord Jesus from heaven with his mighty angels, in blazing fire, inflicting punishment on those who do not acknowledge God and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. These will pay the penalty of ETERNAL ruin, separated from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his power."

 

[Brakelite]

Isa. 33:11, 14
"My spirit shall consume you like fire . . . On Zion sinners are in dread, trembling grips the impious: 'Who of us can live with the consuming fire? Who of us can live with the everlasting flames?'"

Yep. Nothing to argue about there, it's all very clear. Sinners are consumed. Destroyed. Burnt up. And it's true that none can live in the midst of fire... Except the righteous... Which is revealed in the next verse. (Which for the second time you completely ignore). But yeah, something cannot live in that fire. So they die. It's called the second death. More on that next....

And these will go off to ETERNAL punishment, but the righteous to eternal life"

Once the sinner dies the second death, well, it's forever. Just like the verse says. Eternal. And it is most assuredly a punishment. Am eternal punishment. An eternal death from which there is no second chance... No Resurrection.

UNQUENCHABLE fire"

You think I'm going to argue against that? You think I would claim that someone could put the fire out? If course it's unquenchable. It says so.

and the fire is not quenched."

See above.

These will pay the penalty of ETERNAL ruin, s

Uh huh. So Eternal death is Eternal ruin. What I've been saying. Death. No life. No Resurrection. No hope. Ashes. None of the above actually say what you want them to. Certainly nothing about a continuing ongoing torment. Nothing.

 

[Illuminator]

This discussion is illogical and pointless. "continuing on going torment" doesn't mean eternal?

 

[Brakelite]

This discussion is illogical and pointless. "continuing on going torment" doesn't mean eternal?

Illogical and pointless from your perspective certainly seeing it is impossible to harmonise the term endless death with the assumed doctrine, endless torment. Yes, completely illogical concept to create a doctrine that demands eternal life from a scripture that demands eternal death.
I wonder however if you have the nous to understand what I'm getting at. Or if you do, the humility to admit it.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Yep. Nothing to argue about there, it's all very clear. Sinners are consumed. Destroyed. Burnt up. And it's true that none can live in the midst of fire... Except the righteous... Which is revealed in the next verse. (Which for the second time you completely ignore). But yeah, something cannot live in that fire. So they die. It's called the second death. More on that next....

Once the sinner dies the second death, well, it's forever. Just like the verse says. Eternal. And it is most assuredly a punishment. Am eternal punishment. An eternal death from which there is no second chance... No Resurrection.

You think I'm going to argue against that? You think I would claim that someone could put the fire out? If course it's unquenchable. It says so.

See above.

Uh huh. So Eternal death is Eternal ruin. What I've been saying. Death. No life. No Resurrection. No hope. Ashes. None of the above actually say what you want them to. Certainly nothing about a continuing ongoing torment. Nothing.

Yes, I jokingly refer to that as the “Wizard of Oz” argument – “Pay NO attention to the man behind the curtain!!”

Unfortunately for YOU – the Scriptures are clear that there is ETERNAL TORMENT (Matt. 25:46, 2 Thess. 1:9) – not just eternal flames ((Isa. 11:33:14, Luke 3:17, Mark 9:48).

Remember what I said - the SAME Holy Spirit authored ALL of these verses . . .

 

[Illuminator]

It's like playing chess with a pigeon, they poop all over the board and strut around like they won.

 

[quietthinker]

It's like playing chess with a pigeon, they shit all over the board and strut around like they won.

I suppose it's easy to recognise!

 

[Brakelite]

Yes, I jokingly refer to that as the “Wizard of Oz” argument – “Pay NO attention to the man behind the curtain!!”

Huh?????

Unfortunately for YOU – the Scriptures are clear that there is ETERNAL TORMENT

Maybe to someone indoctrinated by tradition and bound through solemn oath to over and believe everything their masters tell you, but unfortunately for you, though you say the above, you have this far failed to show me those scriptures. You can pretend to all you want... But you don't have to answer to me for your deceit...

 

[BreadOfLife]

Huh?????
Maybe to someone indoctrinated by tradition and bound through solemn oath to over and believe everything their masters tell you, but unfortunately for you, though you say the above, you have this far failed to show me those scriptures. You can pretend to all you want... But you don't have to answer to me for your deceit...

In 2 Thess. 1:9, the phrase Paul uses to describe the penalty for the wicked is "ὄλεθρον αἰώνιον" (eternal destruction).
This punishment is described as "NEVER-ENDING".

Similarly, in Matt. 25:46 - Matthew uses the term "κόλασιν αἰώνιον" (eternal punishment)l.
As I have warned you TWICE now - the very SAME Holy Spirit authored BOTH verses.

Your feeble attempts at altering Scripture are duly noted . . .

 

[Brakelite]

In 2 Thess. 1:9, the phrase Paul uses to describe the penalty for the wicked is "ὄλεθρον αἰώνιον" (eternal destruction).
This punishment is described as "NEVER-ENDING".

Why do you keep supporting my entire theological worldview by explaining the very scriptures that certify it, while pretending to oppose it with your own bombast?
I agree with you. It says ever lasting punishment. And that punishment is death, as can be verified with hundreds of scriptures from Genesis to Revelation... And that death is everlasting... There is no Resurrection.

Similarly, in Matt. 25:46 - Matthew uses the term "κόλασιν αἰώνιον" (eternal punishment)l.
As I have warned you TWICE now - the very SAME Holy Spirit authored BOTH verses.

And no where in either of the above examples is there any mention of torment. They both say punishment. Yay for scripture that can be relieved upon for truth. God does not lie. Punishment... Eternal. No end. Absolutely. One final death due to the ultimate destruction and annihilation of the wicked by the fire which burns them up leaving neither root nor branch, but just ashes under your feet. A punishment from which there is no escape. No hope. No future life or awareness of anything. Forever. Nothing in scripture suggests anything BoL about everlasting punishing.

Your feeble attempts at altering Scripture are duly noted . . .

I have no need to alter scripture when all the scriptures you present support my beliefs. All of them.

 

[RogerDC]

Let's take just one GLARING EXAMPLE from the CCC.

THE CATECHISM OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH
IV. The Canon of Scripture
120 It was by the apostolic Tradition that the Church discerned which writings are to be included in the list of the sacred books.90
This complete list is called the canon of Scripture. It includes 46 books for the Old Testament (45 if we count Jeremiah and Lamentations as one) and 27 for the New.91
The Old Testament: Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy, Joshua, Judges, Ruth, 1 and 2 Samuel, 1 and 2 Kings, 1 and 2 Chronicles, Ezra and Nehemiah, Tobit, Judith, Esther, 1 and 2 Maccabees, Job, Psalms, Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, the Song of Songs, the Wisdom of Solomon, Sirach (Ecclesiasticus), Isaiah, Jeremiah, Lamentations, Baruch, Ezekiel, Daniel, Hosea, Joel, Amos, Obadiah, Jonah, Micah, Nahum, Habakkuk, Zephaniah, Haggai, Zachariah and Malachi. [Note: the seven books in red are apocryphal books NOT FOUND in the Hebrew Tanakh]

NOW THE TRUTH OF THE MATTER ON THE AUTHORITY OF CHRIST
And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, He [Christ] expounded unto them in all the Scriptures the things concerning himself... And they said one to another, Did not our heart burn within us, while He talked with us by the way, and while He opened to us the Scriptures?... And He [Christ] said unto them [the apostles], These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the [1] Law of Moses, and in [2] the Prophets, and in [3] the Psalms, concerning me. Then opened He their understanding, that they might understand the Scriptures (Luke 24:27,32,44,45)

The Lord Jesus Christ -- who said that He had supreme authority in Heaven and earth -- authoritatively called the Hebrew Bible (the Tanakh) "the Scriptures", "all the Scriptures", "Moses and the Prophets", and "the Law of Moses, the Prophets, and the Psalms". That body of Scriptures consists of ONLY 24 BOOKS (39 in our OT). Not 46 books as alleged by the Catholic Church in the CCC.

NOW THE TRUTH OF THE MATTER AS FOUND IN THE HEBREW
1. The Tanakh = the Protestant Old Testament (39 books because several were split)

2. The Tanakh has three major divisions as stated by Christ:
TORAH = the Law of Moses (5 books)
NEVIIM = the Prophets = (8 books)
KETUVIM = the Psalms (or Writings) = 11 books
TOTAL = 24 BOOKS

TORAH = Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy
NEVIIM = Joshua, Judges, Samuel (1 book), Kings (1 book), Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, The Twelve (all 12 minor prophets in 1 book).
KETUVIM = Psalms, Proverbs, Job, Song of Songs, Ruth, Lamentations, Ecclesiastes, Esther, Daniel, Ezra-Nehemiah (1 book), Chronicles (1 book).

As you can see, those seven apocryphal books are NOT INCLUDED. Since Scripture is foundational, we need not even go into all the other errors of the Catholic Church.

Your argument is amateurishly flawed and fails. First of all, you make the assumption that Jesus mentioned every book that refers to him in the OT, which is not necessarily what Jesus said.

Secondly, you assume that only the books that Jesus mentions are the totality of the OT canon. Says who? Certainly not Jesus - he refers to the “the law of Moses, the Prophets and the Psalms” as “the scriptures” - he doesn’t say that they are ALL the scriptures.

Thirdly, Jesus mentions the “Psalms”, not the entire Ketuvim - so he doesn’t mention the other 10 or so books that belong to the Ketuvim.

 

[RogerDC]

First, I didn't say that the catechism taught that persecution was okay. Church policy and erroneous interpretations of scripture and a wrong understand of the character of God led to wrong decisions which became traditions which affected church policy. Some of the writings of the church fathers can be blamed for that... Such as those of Thomas Aquinas.

Please provide an example of what you mean from the writings of Thomas Aquinas.

Incidentally, did you know that the opinions of individual Catholics and Catholic doctrine are not necessarily the same thing?

Second, to claim that the state was solely responsible for the persecutions... The crusades... The inquisitions... Is simply evidence that you haven't progressed at all past the mental gymnastics exhibited by Adam and Eve in the garden... She gave me to eat... He fooled me... The state took my clothes off and made me naked.

So when the blood-thirsty, antichrist religion of Islam invaded Christian Europe, what do you think the Pope should have done? Let the Muslim armies overrun and enslave Europe and wipe out Christianity? Or was the Pope right to oppose the Muslims with the sword of the Crusades?

As for the persecution and killing of heretics, I don’t know if such actions were just in the eyes of God or not. But if such actions were not just in the eyes of God (and therefore sinful), it doesn’t mean such actions are Catholic doctrine. A Pope is “infallible”, but is not “impeccable”, so can still sin or make serious errors of judgement. Furthermore, what was culturally acceptable hundreds of years ago may not be culturally acceptable today.

By the way, Henry VIII persecuted the Catholic Church, stole or destroyed much of her property and killed tens of thousands of Catholics, but I don’t see you condemning the Anglican Church - how come?