The myth of grace-only & easy-believism shattered forever

[BreadOfLife]

WRONG.
Proverbs 26:4-5.

That's a cop-out, not a valid response to the Scriptural evidence I presented.

 

[Truther]

That's a preposterous claim

Care to show me this teaching in the Catechism?
I didn't think so . . . .

I was a Catholic and was baptized as an infant.
Too late...I know what happened

 

[justbyfaith]

You skipped Acts again.
You are reading the saints mail.
Bad habit.

Only if you're not a saint...

 

[Truther]

Only if you're not a saint...

Think about it.

You avoid Acts 2:38 like a plague.

Why?

 

[justbyfaith]

That's a cop-out, not a valid response to the Scriptural evidence I presented.

I presented my response in a different post.

And if it is a cop-out for me, it is also a cop-out for you.

Just trying to deal with things that are irritating on these boards...

 

[justbyfaith]

Think about it.

You avoid Acts 2:38 like a plague.

Why?

I don't avoid it at all. I just don't emphasize it 24/7. I do mention it however (will post a link shortly).

True Trinity.

 

[justbyfaith]

You skipped Acts again.
You are reading the saints mail.
Bad habit.

Sorry, I butted in to your conversation (with @mjrhealth)..

 

[BreadOfLife]

I believe that the norm is spoken of in Romans 4:5...and this means that the thief on the Cross is not the exception but the rule.

And Romans 10:9-10 is most certainly the rule...and the only work mentioned there is confession of Jesus as Lord.

Uhhhhhh, no, it’s not.

You have to take ALL of Scripture into context – not just cherry-pick the verses you like. Jesus flatly spoke about people who cherry-pick verses like Rom. 10:9-10, when He said:

Matt. 7:21
“NOT everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but ONLY the one who DOES THE WILL OF MY FATHER in heaven.

And THIS is the will of the Father when it comes to having “Faith” in Christ:
- Being baptized (Matt. 28:19-20, John 3:5, Rom. 2:29, Rom. 6:1-11, Col. 2:12-17, 1 Peter 3:21)
- Picking up our cross daily to follow him (Matt. 16:24, Luke 9:23)
- Works of mercy and charity (Matt. 19:21, 25:31–46, Luke 18:22)
- Obeying his commandments (John 14:15, 15:10)
- Doing the will of the Father (Matt. 7:21, James 1:22)
- We must suffer with Christ (Matt. 10:38, 16:24, Mark 8:34, John 12:24, Rom. 8:17, Cor. 1:5-7, Eph. 3:13, Phil. 1:29, 2 Tim. 1:8, 1 Peter 2:19-21, 4:1-2)

Read Scripture in its proper CONTEXT or don't read it at all . . .

 

[Truther]

Sorry, I butted in to your conversation (with @mjrhealth)..

No problem. Butt in any time

 

[justbyfaith]

Uhhhhhh, no, it’s not.

You have to take ALL of Scripture into context – not just cherry-pick the verses you like. Jesus flatly spoke about people who cherry-pick verses like Rom. 10:9-10, when He said:

Matt. 7:21
“NOT everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but ONLY the one who DOES THE WILL OF MY FATHER in heaven.

And THIS is the will of the Father when it comes to having “Faith” in Christ:
- Being baptized (Matt. 28:19-20, John 3:5, Rom. 2:29, Rom. 6:1-11, Col. 2:12-17, 1 Peter 3:21)
- Picking up our cross daily to follow him (Matt. 16:24, Luke 9:23)
- Works of mercy and charity (Matt. 19:21, 25:31–46, Luke 18:22)
- Obeying his commandments (John 14:15, 15:10)
- Doing the will of the Father (Matt. 7:21, James 1:22)
- We must suffer with Christ (Matt. 10:38, 16:24, Mark 8:34, John 12:24, Rom. 8:17, Cor. 1:5-7, Eph. 3:13, Phil. 1:29, 2 Tim. 1:8, 1 Peter 2:19-21, 4:1-2)

Read Scripture in its proper CONTEXT or don't read it at all . . .

Every cherry contains a seed that is capable of producing an entire tree...

Obviously none of the verses you are thinking of can contradict the plain meaning of Romans 10:9-10.

Rom 10:9, That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:10, For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Therefore, real faith/belief amounts to an attitude of obedience that results out of simply confessing Jesus as Lord, while at the same time believing that God hath raised Him from the dead.

Nothing else is required.

The promise is absolutely given. (i.e. "thou shalt be saved"). With absolute terminology.

 

[BreadOfLife]

I was a Catholic and was baptized as an infant.
Too late...I know what happened

And that means that your parents put you on the right track, having you enter into the Family of God through Baptism and (hopefully) raising you in the faith.
Salvation is a LIFELONG PROCESS.

Sooooooo, where is that false teaching you were talking about??
I asked for a quote from the Catechism . . .


PS - You're STILL a Catholic if you were Baptized. You're just an unfaithful Catholic . . .

 

[Truther]

And that means that your parents put you on the right track, having you enter into the Family of God through Baptism and (hopefully) raising you in the faith.
Salvation is a LIFELONG PROCESS.

Sooooooo, where is that false teaching you were talking about??
I asked for a quote from the Catechism . . .


PS - You're STILL a Catholic if you were Baptized. You're just an unfaithful Catholic . . .

But as a newborn baby, I was unable to repent, then be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ and receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
It was a sham baptism, which I had no clue that it happened to me.

 

[Truther]

I don't avoid it at all. I just don't emphasize it 24/7. I do mention it however (will post a link shortly).

True Trinity.

Well. Just making sure you are thinking about it 24/7.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Every cherry contains a seed that is capable of producing an entire tree...

Obviously none of the verses you are thinking of can contradict the plain meaning of Romans 10:9-10.

Rom 10:9, That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:10, For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Therefore, real faith/belief amounts to an attitude of obedience that results out of simply confessing Jesus as Lord, while at the same time believing that God hath raised Him from the dead.

Nothing else is required.

The promise is absolutely given. (i.e. "thou shalt be saved"). With absolute terminology.

re #368.

Peter says you will be saves at Baptism in Acts 2:3.
In Rom. 9:10, Paul says that you are saved simply by “believing”.
In Matt. 7:21, Jesus says that you ONLY saved when you DO the will of the Father.

Question: WHO is lying?
Answer: NONE of them.

THIS is why you don't cherry-pick Scripture because you pervert its meaning . . .

 

[justbyfaith]

Well. Just making sure you are thinking about it 24/7.

No need. Having received baptism in Jesus' Name, it is not being in water 24/7 that maintains my salvation; but my faith in the operation of God, i.e. the fact that I have died, am buried, and have risen with Christ.

I normally look to the Cross every day; for it is written, "now is the time of salvation" (2 Corinthians 6:2) and "Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth. For I am God, and there is no other." (Isaiah 45:22).

And, "as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of man be lifted up, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish but have eternal life." (John 3:14-15).

 

[BreadOfLife]

But as a newborn baby, I was unable to repent, then be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ and receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
It was a sham baptism, which I had no clue that it happened to me.

Sooooooo, when Peter Baptized the ENTIRE household of Cornelius and Paul Baptized the ENTIRE households of the Philippian Jailer and Stephanas – all of the babies and small children they Baptized were invalid because on YOUVE interpreted Scripture a certain way??

Your arrogance is astounding . . .

 

[justbyfaith]

Peter says you will be saves at Baptism in Acts 2:3.
In Rom. 9:10, Paul says that you are saved simply by “believing”.
In Matt. 7:21, Jesus says that you ONLY saved when you DO the will of the Father.

Question: WHO is lying?
Answer: NONE of them.

THIS is why you don't cherry-pick Scripture because you pervert its meaning . . .

Right. Therefore in simply believing, I become an obedient child; not out of obligation or in an attempt to earn my salvation: but rather out of gratitude for what Christ has done for me.

When I quote a singular scripture, I expect that people will be aware of those scriptures that are complementing and contrasting to them. Every verse of scripture stands on its own as a bastion of scriptural truth.

And I believe that you meant to reference Acts of the Apostles 2:38 and Romans 10:9.

 

[Truther]

Sooooooo, when Peter Baptized the ENTIRE household of Cornelius and Paul Baptized the ENTIRE households of the Philippian Jailer and Stephanas – all of the babies and small children they Baptized were invalid because on YOUVE interpreted Scripture a certain way??

Your arrogance is astounding . . .

Where does it say they baptized faithless,unrepentant people?

 

[justbyfaith]

Where does it say they baptized faithless,unrepentant people?

Indeed, I think that believer's baptism is the only valid baptism, per Mark 16:16.

You must believe and be baptized so that you shall be saved.

 

[Truther]

No need. Having received baptism in Jesus' Name, it is not being in water 24/7 that maintains my salvation; but my faith in the operation of God, i.e. the fact that I have died, am buried, and have risen with Christ.

I normally look to the Cross every day; for it is written, "now is the time of salvation" (2 Corinthians 6:2) and "Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth. For I am God, and there is no other." (Isaiah 45:22).

And, "as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of man be lifted up, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish but have eternal life." (John 3:14-15).

You know something, I thank God always for the remission of my sins, especially the older I get.

Acts 2;38 is my best hope for eternal life, and to Peter was the answer to all those sinners question at Pentecost.