The Natural Sheep and Goats

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Timtofly

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Your living in a biased fantasy, the sheep/goats is a parable, a "Basic" common understanding within Christian theology

Try typing "parable sheep goats" into a Google search and see all the theological organizations that disagree with you
Human theology is always at odds with Scripture. If you follow after human theology that is your problem, as that puts you at odds with God's Word.
 

Timtofly

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Jesus said the weeds and the wheat was a parable. It illustrates the exact same thing in Matt 25.


Matt 13
41 The Son of Man will send out His angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom all things that offend [those things by which people are led into sin], and all who practice evil [leading others into sin], 42 and will throw them into the furnace of fire; in that place there will be weeping [over sorrow and pain] and grinding of teeth [over distress and anger].

43 Then the righteous [those who seek the will of God] will shine forth [radiating the new life] like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. He who has ears [to hear], let him hear and heed My words.



Matt 25
31 “But when the Son of Man comes in His glory and majesty and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him [for judgment]; and He will separate them from one another, as a shepherd separates his sheep from the goats; 33 and He will put the sheep on His right [the place of honor], and the goats on His left [the place of rejection].

34 “Then the King will say to those on His right, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father [you favored of God, appointed to eternal salvation], inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.

41 “Then He will say to those on His left, ‘Leave Me, you cursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels (demons);




Matt 13 has a series of parables as does Matt 25, like the virgins and the talents.


matt 25
“Then the kingdom of heaven will be like ten virgins,

Matt 13

31 He gave them another parable [to consider], saying, “The kingdom of heaven is like a mustard seed, which a man took and sowed in his field; 32 and of all the seeds [planted in the region] it is the smallest, but when it has grown it is the largest of the garden herbs and becomes a tree, so that the birds of the air find shelter in its branches.”

33 He told them another parable, “The kingdom of heaven is like leaven, which a woman took and worked into three measures of flour until all of it was leavened.”

34 All these things Jesus said to the crowds in parables, and He said nothing to them without [using] a parable. 35 This was to fulfill what was spoken by the prophet:

“I will open My mouth in parables;
I will utter things [unknown and unattainable] that have been hidden [from mankind] since the foundation of the world.”

Jesus tells us what we inherit at his coming from the foundation of the world in Matt 25 :31-
Jesus explains His parables later in Matthew 13. Why are you stuck in the Pharisee mode just quoting the parables, and not giving the explanation for the church?
 

jeffweeder

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Jesus explains His parables later in Matthew 13. Why are you stuck in the Pharisee mode just quoting the parables, and not giving the explanation for the church?
o_O

I posted Jesus explanation of the parables. It just so happens Matt 25 speaks of the same thing and I posted them as well.
The less you and me have to say the better.
 
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Timtofly

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o_O

I posted Jesus explanation of the parables. It just so happens Matt 25 speaks of the same thing and I posted them as well.
The less you and me have to say the better.
Except Matthew 25 is dealing with Israel.

Matthew 13 is dealing with humanity in general where Jesus is going to each individual one on one, after the Second Coming, and Jesus is personally on the earth.

Sheep have always been figurative of Israel since king David was a shepherd first and king later. The book of Psalms has lots of personal references from David to that end.

Israel is not seed planted. Israel are lost sheep in need of a shepherd. The church has already been removed while the angels and Jesus are on the earth. Matthew 13 and 25 are not about the church, nor the fulness of the Gentiles. They are about Jesus and His choice of who will be redeemed and who will not.
 

WPM

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Except Matthew 25 is dealing with Israel.

Matthew 13 is dealing with humanity in general where Jesus is going to each individual one on one, after the Second Coming, and Jesus is personally on the earth.

Sheep have always been figurative of Israel since king David was a shepherd first and king later. The book of Psalms has lots of personal references from David to that end.

Israel is not seed planted. Israel are lost sheep in need of a shepherd. The church has already been removed while the angels and Jesus are on the earth. Matthew 13 and 25 are not about the church, nor the fulness of the Gentiles. They are about Jesus and His choice of who will be redeemed and who will not.

Let the Bible speak for itself instead of you always adding unto Scripture. The terms “the sheep,” them on his right hand,” “ye blessed” and “the righteous” are seen to be synonymous in this parable. The wicked on the other hand are simply deemed “the goats,” them on the left handor “ye cursed.” The righteous are seen in Matthew 25:31-45 to “inherit the kingdom” and “life eternal” whereas the wicked are cast “into everlasting fire” and receive “everlasting punishment (Matthew 25:46). The designations and sentences can only relate to the saved and the unsaved. They could not be clearer. There are no exceptions or other groups additional to these two diametrically opposing groupings.

This is the final separation of the wicked from the redeemed of God. It is the climactic assignment of eternal destinies. All mankind is found embodied in one of these two unique groupings. There are no ‘nearly saved or ‘semi-saved’ people or ‘nearly lost’ or ‘semi-lost’ people on this day. One is either clothed with Christ’s robes of righteousness or eternally saved or he is He is clothed with his own filthy rags of righteousness and eternally lost. No one inherits the kingdom through national identity.
 

Timtofly

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Let the Bible speak for itself instead of you always adding unto Scripture. The terms “the sheep,” them on his right hand,” “ye blessed” and “the righteous” are seen to be synonymous in this parable. The wicked on the other hand are simply deemed “the goats,” them on the left handor “ye cursed.” The righteous are seen in Matthew 25:31-45 to “inherit the kingdom” and “life eternal” whereas the wicked are cast “into everlasting fire” and receive “everlasting punishment (Matthew 25:46). The designations and sentences can only relate to the saved and the unsaved. They could not be clearer. There are no exceptions or other groups additional to these two diametrically opposing groupings.

This is the final separation of the wicked from the redeemed of God. It is the climactic assignment of eternal destinies. All mankind is found embodied in one of these two unique groupings. There are no ‘nearly saved or ‘semi-saved’ people or ‘nearly lost’ or ‘semi-lost’ people on this day. One is either clothed with Christ’s robes of righteousness or eternally saved or he is He is clothed with his own filthy rags of righteousness and eternally lost. No one inherits the kingdom through national identity.
I am letting it speak. You are forcing these passages to fit your Amil bias. If you would just listen to the Words of Jesus, you would figure something out other than your narrow tunnel vision.

You claim these are righteous, but these are particular righteous people, not just your single, one size "righteous", fits all humans. These are not the dead standing before the GWT. There is variety in creation. Even in Revelation, John sees 3 sets of events. He called them different, not just one single judgment, you claim is different angles.

God is pointing out the Second Coming has a method and is broken down into time sensitive removal of humans from the earth.

Even the body of Christ has different members, some are teachers, some evangelist, some pastors. Why do you then go and split humanity up into only 2 groups?

When the 7th Seal is removed, God is going to start removing names from the Lamb's book of life. It is really, only at that point, you can even distinguish between those who are lost, and those who are not.

You base your two groups on presumption, because you already separate them by outward appearance. You really have no clue whatsoever who you have known that have passed on, if they are saved or lost. You have pre-judged them in your own human understanding. Only God and each individual know where the soul went after leaving Adam's dead corruptible flesh, and that still, is an unknown, if those in sheol will decide at the GWT to remain in the Lamb's book of life or be finally removed. Do you think that is a decision based on how good one is, or their works? Only on God's choice and not even their own choice? You claim we can freely choose now, why does that "freely" change once the soul leaves the body? Is that not decided at a judgment, and not just a state of being, with or without a body? Obviously those currently in sheol have missed out on thousands of years of blessings, even in the state after Adam's dead flesh. But unless you accept the soul time travels immediately to the GWT, and does not wait in sheol, their names are still in the Lamb's book of life until that judgment at the GWT.

So this two people divide you have is from human theology and does not even correctly show God's Word on the subject, as obviously you have your mind made up, and will not even consider the facts being presented from Scripture. This is not even my interpretation or opinion. These are facts you deny, that clearly are not there on my say so, but on the very words of Jesus Christ.

But you do not even define the first resurrection properly, nor can you separate the first resurrection from the second birth. All because of your narrow minded view of Amil, and an alleged single moment in time, you call the end/GWT/Second Coming.

You don't even recognize God's timetable.
 

WPM

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I am letting it speak. You are forcing these passages to fit your Amil bias. If you would just listen to the Words of Jesus, you would figure something out other than your narrow tunnel vision.

You claim these are righteous, but these are particular righteous people, not just your single, one size "righteous", fits all humans. These are not the dead standing before the GWT. There is variety in creation. Even in Revelation, John sees 3 sets of events. He called them different, not just one single judgment, you claim is different angles.

God is pointing out the Second Coming has a method and is broken down into time sensitive removal of humans from the earth.

Even the body of Christ has different members, some are teachers, some evangelist, some pastors. Why do you then go and split humanity up into only 2 groups?

When the 7th Seal is removed, God is going to start removing names from the Lamb's book of life. It is really, only at that point, you can even distinguish between those who are lost, and those who are not.

You base your two groups on presumption, because you already separate them by outward appearance. You really have no clue whatsoever who you have known that have passed on, if they are saved or lost. You have pre-judged them in your own human understanding. Only God and each individual know where the soul went after leaving Adam's dead corruptible flesh, and that still, is an unknown, if those in sheol will decide at the GWT to remain in the Lamb's book of life or be finally removed. Do you think that is a decision based on how good one is, or their works? Only on God's choice and not even their own choice? You claim we can freely choose now, why does that "freely" change once the soul leaves the body? Is that not decided at a judgment, and not just a state of being, with or without a body? Obviously those currently in sheol have missed out on thousands of years of blessings, even in the state after Adam's dead flesh. But unless you accept the soul time travels immediately to the GWT, and does not wait in sheol, their names are still in the Lamb's book of life until that judgment at the GWT.

So this two people divide you have is from human theology and does not even correctly show God's Word on the subject, as obviously you have your mind made up, and will not even consider the facts being presented from Scripture. This is not even my interpretation or opinion. These are facts you deny, that clearly are not there on my say so, but on the very words of Jesus Christ.

But you do not even define the first resurrection properly, nor can you separate the first resurrection from the second birth. All because of your narrow minded view of Amil, and an alleged single moment in time, you call the end/GWT/Second Coming.

You don't even recognize God's timetable.

I don't know what you are trying to say. I hope you do. It is gibberish.
 

jeffweeder

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Except Matthew 25 is dealing with Israel.
hmmx1:

Matt 25
31 “But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him; and He will separate them from one another, as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats; 33 and He will put the sheep on His right, and the goats on the left.
 
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Davy

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The doctrine of millennialism must include the judgement of the sheep and goats.

1. First, we rule out that judgment being of His church at His appearing in the air:

The judgment of the church occurs at His second coming to this earth, where only the dead bodies of the faithful, and the faithful remaining alive, will be bodily resurrected to meet with Him.

The hypocrites will remain with the unbelievers on earth.
The separation of Christ's sheep from the goats, per Matthew 25, is about the separation of His Church from the wicked. But in His Book of Revelation, Lord Jesus gave more detail about that in Rev.20.

And per John 5:28-29, all... of the 'dead' are resurrected and go either to the "resurrection of life" or to the "resurrection of damnation". And they all remain in that state throughout Christ's future "thousand years" reign with His elect.

On the day when Jesus returns, all... peoples still alive on earth will be 'changed' at the 'twinkling of an eye' also to the "spiritual body" that Paul taught in 1 Cor.15. On the day Jesus comes, man's works are burned off this earth (2 Peter 3). That will END this present flesh world earth age.

Those still thinking there will be people still living in a flesh body after Jesus returns haven't studied all their Bible.

According to Zechariah 14, and 1 Thessalonians 4, the day when Lord Jesus returns, He will gather His Church from both the resurrected dead saints He brings with Him from Heaven, and His saints still alive on earth that are changed, and they all go to the Mount of Olives east of Jerusalem ON THE EARTH! At that time also, the veil hiding the heavenly dimension will be removed, and every soul will have literal awareness of the heavenly, even while upon the earth. It will like the state of angels that visited this earth.

Then Jesus will reign with His elect, ON THIS EARTH, and over the unsaved nations. The new Jerusalem will come down from Heaven to this earth, and will include a Millennial temple meant only for the "thousand years" period, which is described in Ezekiel 40 thru 47.
 

robert derrick

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The Second Coming is not a parable. Christ as King on a throne is not a parable. The lost sheep of Israel is not a parable. Your Amil interpretation is just a feel good parable of human understanding.
Whenever people start making Scripture parables and symbols only, as though that proves an argument, they are not to be taken seriously.

There are plenty of unbelievers through history, that give lip service to Biblical 'principles', while writing it off as just another good and interesting book of myths, legends, tales, and parables like Aesop's Fables.

Adam and Eve, Noah's flood, The Red Sea, the Lord on Sinai, the sun standing still as Joshua's words, etc... are all just parables and symbol's of 'teaching points' only.
 

Truth7t7

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I think these sheep will be those who heeded God's two witnesses, to receive the Jews as God's chosen nation. So these will be people who cared for the Jews as the beast is trying to destroy them. They will have defied the beast empire in order to do this.

Much love!
Sounds like script for a fictional episode in a Lord of the rings series
 

robert derrick

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Jesus didn't say sheep and goats would be there, He said that He would separate the nations (gentiles) as a shepherd separates sheep from goats. He clearly uses a simile, and in no wise gives even a single indication that this is a parable. Are the passages about your salvation also parables? How do you determine what is and isn't a parable? For myself, I just go by whether the Bible says it's a parable or not, like in Matthew 13, for instance. We have no need to wonder whether these were parables, Jesus said they were parables.

But not this. This is prophecy.

Much love!
True. Speaking of Jesus' sheep, where we only hear the voice of the True Shepherd, is not a parable.

Speaking of real sheep and goats being herded together to be judged, is the mocking of Scripture by the naturally minded.
 

robert derrick

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Good works do not determine our salvation they determine our reward. 2 Corinthians 5:10-11 similarly says, “for we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

A careful study of the wording of this passage confirms that we are looking at a general judgment. The inspired text makes clear: we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ.” If we are to take this passage at face value we must assume we are looking at a picture of all mankind being brought to account for its deeds at the coming of Christ. Manifestly, from the wording, it is not just believers that will stand before Christ when He appears, but unbelievers also.

This assumption is reinforced by the fact that both the “good and bad” that has been done by man will be judged. The Greek word for “good” here is agathos which means of good constitution or nature, upright, and honourable. This cannot be speaking about anyone other than the elect. After all, this is accurately describing the moral nature of those who have experienced the new birth. Remember, the believer’s sin has already been judged and paid for at the cross. The word phaulos, on the other hand, means foul, ethically bad, base, wicked or evil. This is undoubtedly speaking of the immoral, the unsaved.

Jesus said in Matthew 16:27, For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.”

We are talking about judgment in the context of mankind being brought to account before the holy bar of God to give an account for their lives. It is the place where God hands out His eternal sentences upon all men. Multiple Scripture locates this at the second coming. We are not talking about the wicked being physically killed when Jesus appears. Even that, you limit and fill your future millennium with countless billions of mortal rebels.

Romans 14:10-12 says, we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ. For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God. So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.”

Here Paul personalizes this by saying, “every one of us shall give account of himself to God.” The judgment for believers is one of rewards, however, we will give account for our talents and giftings on the Judgment day. Our faithfulness to the same will then determine our reward on "that day."

Paul says in 1 Corinthians 3:6-8, every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour.”

1 Corinthians 3:11-15 says, “For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.”

Scripture presents the second coming of the Lord as the day when “every man's work shall be made manifest” (or be revealed). There is no hiding for anyone when Jesus Comes. He is coming to mete out final justice for all. Every man’s works shall be judged as by fire. This day involves the judgement of both the righteous and the wicked. This they will see the righteous rewarded, and the wicked punished (“the day shall declare it”).

Revelation 22:12 says, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.”

Many Scriptures tell us that Jesus brings His reward with Him when He becomes. All men will be judged then. Both the saved and unsaved will be brought to account and will receive their due eternal reward at the second coming.
I have learned, that when someone speaks of making "A careful study" of something, they are only diverting attention away from their glaring errors, with longwinded displays of scholarship. They also always include the learned words of great theological dissertation, such as passages, assumptions reinforced, holy bar of God, eternal sentences, mortal rebels, giftings, and unnecessary dives into original languages.

It is nothing but cover for missing the obvious, like swallowing camels while straining at gnats:

There is no way anyone can honestly mistake the second coming of the Lord to earth, with the final day of the earth's destruction by fire.

The first is prophesied with:
1. The Lord coming as lightening from one end to the other.
2. The Lord comes with clouds and every eye shall see Him.
3. The Lord comes on a white horse with His armies.
4. The Lord destroys the armies of the nations gathered at Armageddon, with the brightness of His come.
5. The fowls of the air from all the earth eat their flesh.
6. The Lord comes from Bozrah with the blood of His enemies covering His garments.
7. The Lord rules them of the nations not gathered with the armies.
8. Many inhabitors over all the earth will be hiding in caves and dens of rocks from the wrath of the Lamb.

The last day of earth is prophesied with:

1. All nations of God and Magog gather around the holy city on earth, not at Armageddon.
2. Fire comes down from God in heaven and destroys them all at once, and scorches the whole earth.

It is impossible to conflate the two, either by expanded theological arguments of other things, or by writing off many Scriptures as symbol and parable only.

Or by showcasing a smattering of both:

We are not talking about the wicked being physically killed when Jesus appears.

You are not, but Scripture plainly is, both at His return to earth in personal bloodshed, and at the last day of earth, with Gog and Magog being scorched by fire.

I'm thinking one of the main reasons some people are so vehemently against the Lord and King reigning over His kingdom on earth, is that it's much more intellectually stimulating and fun to spend countless hours perfecting pseudo-scholarship, rather than just take Scripture as written and believe it.

O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called.
 

WPM

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I have learned, that when someone speaks of making "A careful study" of something, they are only diverting attention away from their glaring errors, with longwinded displays of scholarship. They also always include the learned words of great theological dissertation, such as passages, assumptions reinforced, holy bar of God, eternal sentences, mortal rebels, giftings, and unnecessary dives into original languages.

It is nothing but cover for missing the obvious, like swallowing camels while straining at gnats:

Ad Hominem seems to be the Premil default when they have no answer to the biblical text. I will try and ignore this nonsense. If you would actually take the time to do "careful study" instead of swallowing what you have been taught you might see what the biblical text is teaching.

There is no way anyone can honestly mistake the second coming of the Lord to earth, with the final day of the earth's destruction by fire.

The first is prophesied with:
1. The Lord coming as lightening from one end to the other.
2. The Lord comes with clouds and every eye shall see Him.
3. The Lord comes on a white horse with His armies.
4. The Lord destroys the armies of the nations gathered at Armageddon, with the brightness of His come.
5. The fowls of the air from all the earth eat their flesh.
6. The Lord comes from Bozrah with the blood of His enemies covering His garments.
7. The Lord rules them of the nations not gathered with the armies.
8. Many inhabitors over all the earth will be hiding in caves and dens of rocks from the wrath of the Lamb.

The last day of earth is prophesied with:

1. All nations of God and Magog gather around the holy city on earth, not at Armageddon.
2. Fire comes down from God in heaven and destroys them all at once, and scorches the whole earth.

It is impossible to conflate the two, either by expanded theological arguments of other things, or by writing off many Scriptures as symbol and parable only.

Or by showcasing a smattering of both:

How about dealing with the text at hand instead of repeating what the Left Behind novels teach? Where is all this in the text I presented? Nowhere! You force it into the inspired text. When Premils are cornered they just rabbit what they have been taught. Deal with the text at hand (Matthew 25) that describes the one-and-only climactic coming of Christ.

You are not, but Scripture plainly is, both at His return to earth in personal bloodshed, and at the last day of earth, with Gog and Magog being scorched by fire.

That was a typo. I meant to say: We are talking about the wicked being physically killed when Jesus appears.

I'm thinking one of the main reasons some people are so vehemently against the Lord and King reigning over His kingdom on earth, is that it's much more intellectually stimulating and fun to spend countless hours perfecting pseudo-scholarship, rather than just take Scripture as written and believe it.

O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called.

Again, more ad hominem to support your error. I am not going to return evil for evil. Keep your venom, insults and frustration to yourself.

Hello! He is reigning now over creation and His new creation. Your fight is with Scripture. When the truth is presented or time is taken to study the Book you mock it. Thank God we are not all clones like you want us to be.

Jesus testified after His resurrection: “All power [or authority] is given unto me in heaven and in earth” (Matthew 28:18).

Jesus rules and reigns today over all creation. There is nothing that is not under His feet. What He says goes! This is biblical bedrock! This is a foundational Christian truth.

I mean, how much more power than “all power ... in heaven and in earth” does He need to exercise power and authority over His enemies?


Romans 9:5 confirms, in an often-overlooked passage: “as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all.”

This proves that Christ has already come and now exercises kingship today over all mankind. It means: He carries the Father’s divine authority. He is currently enthroned. This is Sovereign power! He holds this today upon His Father’s throne as God and upon David’s throne as Messiah. Him and the Father are one spiritually in authority.

In our main text this morning, Jesus is described in Revelation 3:7 as, he that hath the key (or authority) of David, he that openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth.


He holds all power (without qualification). After all, He is God! God either causes or permits - as He is God and He is sovereign. Simple! That is an explicit biblical truth and a Christian fundamental. The powerful language that accompanies the mention of Christ holding the key of David proves that this is referring to His majestic power and might. It says, “he that hath the key of David, he that openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth.” This speaks of spiritual power. The key allows Christ to sovereignly open and shut in a way that no man can thwart or override.

He reigns today over the seen and the unseen world making every power and every authority “subject unto him.”

Heaven’s authority is bestowed upon Christ. He is God! Colossians 2:9-10, 14-15 confirms: "For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; And having spoiled (or divested or disarmed) principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.”


He rules intimately over His spiritual kingdom as Messiah and sovereignly over the physical kingdoms of the world and over all mankind as God.

He rules intimately over His spiritual kingdom as Saviour and sovereignly over the physical kingdoms of the world and over all mankind as Lord.

1 Peter 3:22 says, that Christ, “who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God (now!!!); angels and authorities and powers being (currently!!!) made subject unto him.”


Without a doubt Christ is reigning over His enemies since the resurrection, waiting for their final predetermined put down. Those who question Christ’s current reign do great assault upon the truth of God’s Word and undermine the current sovereign kingly position that He now assuredly holds. They also circumvent clear New Testament writings that teach Christ is reigning now.

1 Timothy 6:13-16 says, “I give thee charge in the sight of God, who quickeneth all things, and before Christ Jesus, who before Pontius Pilate witnessed a good confession; That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukeable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ: Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate (dunastes or ruler, great authority or mighty), the King of kings, and Lord of lords; Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.”


He is going to reveal to mankind, time, and to the natural, what He is now in heaven, the invisible realm and in eternity. He "is (indeed) the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords.”

This all confirms my previous contention after years of debating this matter in my 13 major reasons why I abandoned the Premil doctrine: Premil is constantly exalting the power and influence of Satan and diluting the sovereign power and influence of Christ. That is nowhere more evident than in their constant rubbishing of Christ’s current kingship over His enemies at the right hand of majesty on high. Whether they mean to or not, Premils are always highlighting what Satan is doing in our day instead of what Christ is doing. Premil portrays a BIG devil and a small god, Amil has a small devil and a BIG God. In Premil, Satan seems sovereign in this age and God is curtailed. Premils are always lauding the ability of Satan since the cross. In Amil, Christ is sovereign and Satan is curtailed. Amils are always lauding the ability of Christ since the cross. As a consequence, Premil portrays an impotent beat-down New Testament Church, whereas Amil sees a victorious potent New Testament Church invading the nations with the good news of Christ and subjugating the powers of darkness as they do so. In Amil Christ reigns over all creation as God and His new creation as Saviour.

If Christ is not already King of kings, then neither is He already Lord of lords. But Revelation 17:14 tell us: "These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful."
 
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marks

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Jesus said the weeds and the wheat was a parable. It illustrates the exact same thing in Matt 25.


Matt 13
41 The Son of Man will send out His angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom all things that offend [those things by which people are led into sin], and all who practice evil [leading others into sin], 42 and will throw them into the furnace of fire; in that place there will be weeping [over sorrow and pain] and grinding of teeth [over distress and anger].

43 Then the righteous [those who seek the will of God] will shine forth [radiating the new life] like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. He who has ears [to hear], let him hear and heed My words.



Matt 25
31 “But when the Son of Man comes in His glory and majesty and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him [for judgment]; and He will separate them from one another, as a shepherd separates his sheep from the goats; 33 and He will put the sheep on His right [the place of honor], and the goats on His left [the place of rejection].

34 “Then the King will say to those on His right, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father [you favored of God, appointed to eternal salvation], inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.

41 “Then He will say to those on His left, ‘Leave Me, you cursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels (demons);




Matt 13 has a series of parables as does Matt 25, like the virgins and the talents.


matt 25
“Then the kingdom of heaven will be like ten virgins,

Matt 13

31 He gave them another parable [to consider], saying, “The kingdom of heaven is like a mustard seed, which a man took and sowed in his field; 32 and of all the seeds [planted in the region] it is the smallest, but when it has grown it is the largest of the garden herbs and becomes a tree, so that the birds of the air find shelter in its branches.”

33 He told them another parable, “The kingdom of heaven is like leaven, which a woman took and worked into three measures of flour until all of it was leavened.”

34 All these things Jesus said to the crowds in parables, and He said nothing to them without [using] a parable. 35 This was to fulfill what was spoken by the prophet:

“I will open My mouth in parables;
I will utter things [unknown and unattainable] that have been hidden [from mankind] since the foundation of the world.”

Jesus tells us what we inherit at his coming from the foundation of the world in Matt 25 :31-
These are all good passages to look to in order to see what is and what is not presented as parables.

If the sheep goats is parable, is this also parable?

Matthew 24:29-31 KJV
29) Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30) And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31) And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

I would say "no".

Is this a parable?

Matthew 24:32-33 KJV
32) Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
33) So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

I would answer, yes.

Jesus told parables about the end of the age, certainly! He also prophesied concerning the end of the age. His discourse there includes both similes and parables, introduced in the normal way to introduce parables.

I don't see any reason to not accept the prophetic portions in just that way.

Much love!
 

Timtofly

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hmmx1:

Matt 25
31 “But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him; and He will separate them from one another, as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats; 33 and He will put the sheep on His right, and the goats on the left.
Yes, Israel has been scattered throughout the Nations for thousands of years. Do you think they have all returned in the last 80 years?

If you think that means every single human, then your version of Amil is as gibberish as the other poster's view.

Jesus is gathering His kingdom out of the Nations.
 

Timtofly

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Jesus rules and reigns today over all creation. There is nothing that is not under His feet. What He says goes! This is biblical bedrock! This is a foundational Christian truth.
If that is your fact, then Matthew 25 happened in the first century. It is not a future Second Coming. It is already happening over time. Jesus has been separating the sheep from the goats for 1992 years.
 

Truth7t7

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What I'm saying is that this is prophecy that contains similes.

Much love!
Matthew 25:31-42 is a "Parable" regarding the second coming and final judgment

Are literal sheep and goats going to be at a future Judgement "No" its a "Parable"

Your continued claims of a "Simile" is foreign to the Bible and its language, as you invent your own private interpretation in the word "Simile", you have nobody fooled but yourself

Jesus Is The Lord
 

Truth7t7

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What I'm saying is that this is prophecy that contains similes.

Much love!
It's a "Parable" that contains prophecy, the word "Simile" is your invented word found no place in the english scripture, KJV, NIV, NASB, NKJV, ESV

The word "Simile" that you add, in desperate attempts to change the Biblical word "Parable" of the Sheep/Goats in Matthew 25:31-46

Try running a Google search on Matthew 25:31-46 Sheep/Goats, you stand alone in your claims, its 100% a "Parable"!
 
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