The Rapture Is in Olivet Discourse

[No Pre-TB]

This clearly shows that you do not understand what the Resurrection/Rapture is all about. It is a part of the doctrine of salvation, which includes the perfection and glorification of the saints: For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified. (Rom 8:29,30)

And that is exactly what happens at the Resurrection/Rapture, which -- by definition -- must take place before the Tribulation period.

Please read what I said before responding critically. I said Pre-TB is not a church doctrine. The resurrection is a church doctrinal issue. Many eschatological types have the resurrection in them. That doesn’t make them doctrines. That is, specifics we must hold to coming from God without any variation. Things pertinent to our true belief given to us by him and his apostles.

The resurrection is doctrine because failure to believe you will be raised means we have no hope, and if we are not to be raised, then Christ wasn’t raised. But eschatological theories are formulated around various opinions based upon various interpretations.

 

[Christ4Me]

Those who have ears, let them hear.

 

[Enoch111]

I said Pre-TB is not a church doctrine. The resurrection is a church doctrinal issue.

The Resurrection/Rapture is a Christian doctrine. You cannot separate the Rapture from the Resurrection, neither can you insert the Tribulation (damnation) into a doctrine of salvation. This is not about a "church doctrine" but about the teaching of Christ and His apostles.

 

[No Pre-TB]

The Resurrection/Rapture is a Christian doctrine. You cannot separate the Rapture from the Resurrection, neither can you insert the Tribulation (damnation) into a doctrine of salvation. This is not about a "church doctrine" but about the teaching of Christ and His apostles.

Im unsure why you are repeating points. I’ve already stated, the resurrection is doctrinal. But eschatological theories are not. That is the point.
I’m not sure why you bring up the harpazo. When did I say it was separate? Perhaps you misread someone else’s comment.

 

[Timtofly]

That's actually the group I was referring to as naive. Just used different wording.That's fair, BUT those who are correct are those who can prove it with coherent, sound scripture.

Those who are mistaken, or are intentionally misleading, will not be able to do so and will continue to return to points that have already been proven wrong with scripture; and they will continue to make statements and claims, in their own words - or quoting extra-biblical sources as an authority to the Bible, that they cannot confirm with any scripture.

There is always an identifiable difference between those who are not in alignment with scripture and those who are.

As a matter of fact, that's one of the biggest reasons God wrote the Bible. One is either in agreement with its precepts or they are not.

(of a person or action) showing a lack of experience, wisdom, or judgment.

Nope.

These people will be the ones, in charge, people look up to. They will have experience, wisdom and sound judgment. The problem is what they proclaim as truth is just a lie from Satan.

2 Thessalonians 2:10-12

"And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness."

Those who think they know the truth can use God's Word to prove their lies. That is what makes it so difficult. Those listening under their authority will believe the lies, as if they were true.

 

[Timtofly]

Im unsure why you are repeating points. I’ve already stated, the resurrection is doctrinal. But eschatological theories are not. That is the point.
I’m not sure why you bring up the harpazo. When did I say it was separate? Perhaps you misread someone else’s comment.

It is not a separation of rapture and resurrection.

The issue is splitting both from the Second Coming. John does not directly state when the Second Coming will happen. That is why Revelation 19 is not the Second Coming. All will know when that event will happen. Sunday between 5pm and 6pm, the last hour of the week of celebration, the 7th Trumpet. The 7th Trumpet sounds from 6pm on a Saturday until 6pm the following Sunday. Give or take the 42 months that may split the week in half on Wednesday. Just like the week of the Cross started at 6pm Saturday and was finished by 6pm on the following Sunday a week later.

The battle of Armageddon is the one hour, the 10 kings join in with Satan and company, to face Christ in the valley of decision, Megiddo. Satan's 42 months are over. The 2 witnesses lay dead for 3.5 days, and were resurrected 6am on Sunday. The rest of the day was the preparation for a 1 hour battle.

This is the third such week important to Israel. The first one was also from Sunday to Sunday when Jericho fell. For 6 days Sunday to Friday they marched once each day. Sabbath was a day of rest. They did not march, or that would be God breaking His own rules. On Sunday they marched around 7 times. They probably started at 6pm Saturday after the day of rest. By 6pm Sunday the walls had fallen down. They used Trumpets to break down the walls of Jericho. 6 Trumpets preceed 7 Thunders, then the 7th Trumpet is a week long celebration. The nations were in control, then God called out Israel, then God worked through the NT church. The Second Coming removes the church, then Israel, and last the nations themselves in reverse order.

That first week removed Jericho as representative of the Nations. The Cross removed Israel and set up the local church. The Second Coming wraps up all three in reverse order. The 7th Trumpet is the finish and celebration of Daniel's 70th week. The 70th week is the work of Christ the Prince. 3.5 years split by the time given to the fulness of Gentiles. No 3.5 years will be left. They keep getting shorter, because only God knows when the Second Coming will start to finish the 70th week, but the hard date is the end of Adam's punishment itself. It cannot go past 6000 years. The Day of the Lord starts then, and on time. If the last 2000 years started in 30AD, then it cannot go past 2030AD. 30AD is the closest year that puts Passover almost midweek. To split a week in half with 3.5 days left. April of 2033AD also has the same dates for Passover as well as 2030AD.