The Word

[Stranger]

Again you didn't get what I wrote there....I referred to the four separate accounts in the Bible about the morning of the resurrection, and since God is NOT the author of confusion ( which is most certainly Truth), He could not be responsible for writing them all....I personally believe they are eye witness or hearing witnesses, which was then eventually written down. That was the part i thought could settle it quickly.
Then I went on to answering 'evotel' and wrote about my own personal experience, if he was interested.....
I am astutely aware that I have much much to learn, but I have never given up seeking.......I am not demanding anyone take my word as Truth....I am merely sharing what people can then seek God about themselves.
I have always affirmed, that I cannot make Jesus real for anyone....Only they can do that together with Him....But at least I am sharing with others, that it is indeed possible to have a real relationship with Him, and not only a relationship based on letters long ago written......I still don't understand the hostility toward that.....Oh well, nothing i can do about that.....I'm leaving that part with God and keeping my peace...

I believe I did get what you wrote. And, I did address your comment on the accounts of the resurrection. And based on differences in these accounts, you do not believe the Bible is the Word of God. You apparently believe one can get the Word of God by the Spirit in reading the Bible, but that the Bible is not the Word of God. Am I wrong? Thus you have a ready answer for any 'contradictions' or dissimilar accounts found in the Scripture.

I don't think you got past my first sentence. My point was, your statement that due to the different accounts of the resurrection, the Bible cannot be the Word of God. But, your own method of obtaining the Word of God will produce different accounts also. For another believer led by the Spirit, will be led to see it differently. Thus why shouldn't your method be rejected as you reject the Bible as the Word of God for that same reason?

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

It isn't !!!.....Why do you keep making out that I'm trying to tell others what they MUST accept....I don't...What I do and I make it clear at the time, is to pass along what I have been shown, told or experienced...Isn't that what a witness is supposed to do ? The listener or in this case the reader, should just receive those words and take them to God for confirmation, if they have not already had the same revelation ( which I do encounter a lot) and if they don't get it, well, then either put it on the back burner, or reject it, if that's your choice.....All I can do is pass it on, I will not shrink back from that part....

Well, you said, to settle the argument quickly for those who think God or the Holy Spirit wrote the Bible. You say God has told you the Bible is not His Word. But, He has told me differently. Now what? You are back where you were in the different accounts of the resurrection. You reject the Bible as the Word of God for some supposed differences in the resurrection accounts, yet you open a pandora's box in producing millions of differences all dependent on each believer.

Stranger

 

[mjrhealth]

Not only does your proof text not say that, you completely ignore 2 Tim. 3:16-17 at the same time. What Jesus is saying in John 5:39-40 is quite clear. The very same Scriptures that the Jews search so diligently for eternal life testify of Christ and yet they refuse to come to Christ. They're looking in the right place, but they're missing the boat. I don't know how you're getting such a simple message twisted. I'm afraid it's not me who making silly arguments.

Si please tel me which god do you worship. KJ, NKJ, NIV NSV ASV , God never changes His word never Changes, God the same yesterday today and forever, and we have how many version of "his word". Kids have a game " which of theses things is not the same", If a two year old can understand it, why cant adults.

 

[pia]

For another believer led by the Spirit, will be led to see it differently

Absolutely not ! No way The Holy Spirit, The Spirit of Truth, is going to give two people two different answers to the same question.....wow, do you have the least bit of faith, that God is with us ?

 

[pia]

Actually it's the Apostle Paul who says that "God wrote the book" as you crudely put it. He plainly says "all Scripture is God-breathed.

Ok, but everything Paul refers to as Scripture, as well as when Jesus spoke of them, it was ALWAYS from the old covenant, given to the Hebrews ( and quite obviously they had misunderstood much as well, as Jesus corrected them often)....Are you a Hebrew ? Neither God nor Jesus nor Paul ever told us to wait and expect another 'book' to make us follow.....Jesus said :' Come to Me".......As well as a whole bunch of other written things which show clearly that we are no longer going to have to follow any written code...

 

[pia]

I don't think you got past my first sentence

You know stranger.....You were already at me for some time when I first joined.....Keep going if you must, but I have no interest in either bringing you down nor you trying to bring me down....so I believe we should leave it there.......So so many things you have no read along the way, so you keep on the couple of things you've had a go at me for in the past........I am not going to apologize for sharing what the Lord has shown me......But it is completely up to the listener, is he will take it to God, including you...

 

[pia]

Well, you said, to settle the argument quickly for those who think God or the Holy Spirit wrote the Bible. You say God has told you the Bible is not His Word

You're quite full of it, aren't you.........I most certainly did not say that....As a matter of fact He confirmed for me, that indeed there is much Truth to be gleaned from the Bible, which could have only come from above, as men do not get revelation of Truth any other way..So yes, God instructed men at times, what to write....

 

[Nomad]

Ok, but everything Paul refers to as Scripture, as well as when Jesus spoke of them, it was ALWAYS from the old covenant...

Wrong. Paul wrote 2/3 of the New Testament. Peter refers to Paul's writings as Scripture.

2Pe 3:15 And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him,
2Pe 3:16 as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures.

Paul refers to Luke as Scripture.

1Ti 5:18 For the Scripture says, "You shall not muzzle an ox when it treads out the grain," and, "The laborer deserves his wages."
Luk 10:7 And remain in the same house, eating and drinking what they provide, for the laborer deserves his wages. Do not go from house to house.

That should be sufficient to demonstrate to our resident Bible bashers that "all Scripture" refers to much more than the Old Testament.

 

[pia]

That should be sufficient to demonstrate to our resident Bible bashers that "all Scripture" refers to much more than the Old Testamen

You may have it the way you wish for your walk.......I will stick to mine, thank you.

 

[Stranger]

Absolutely not ! No way The Holy Spirit, The Spirit of Truth, is going to give two people two different answers to the same question.....wow, do you have the least bit of faith, that God is with us ?

​

Your really shouldn't isolate one phrase and try and build upon that without giving the context from which it is taken. You said you don't believe the Bible is the Word of God due to the different accounts of the resurrection. Because there are different accounts then it must not be the Word of God. The Word of God is something that God speaks to you by His Spirit. Ok. But, God has told me that the Bible is the Word of God. Which of us is God talking to?

So, because your method has resulted in different interpretations, different accounts of what God has said, why shouldn't you reject your method as you have rejected the Bible?

I have faith that God is with us. I have faith that the Bible is the written Word of God. You have faith that God is with us, yet we differ in regard to the Bible. Now what? It is only you that must be believed? That is what you must believe with your position.

And that is the danger of removing the Bible from the place God has put it. You cast yourself upon a sea with out any motor or rudder. You use the Bible when it agrees with you.

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

You're quite full of it, aren't you.........I most certainly did not say that....As a matter of fact He confirmed for me, that indeed there is much Truth to be gleaned from the Bible, which could have only come from above, as men do not get revelation of Truth any other way..So yes, God instructed men at times, what to write....

All I am doing is trying to show you the danger of your position. Your phrases 'much Truth to be gleaned from the Bible' and 'yes, God instructed men at times, what to write', is a far cry from declaring the Bible is the written Word of God. So, how is my statement wrong that you have said God has told you that the Bible is not His Word?

I have a question for you and others who believe as you do. What is the benefit of not believing the Bible is the written Word of God?

Stranger

 

[Nomad]

You may have it the way you wish for your walk.......I will stick to mine, thank you.

And there we have it folks. Therein lies the problem. Scripture as whole stands in the way of a Frank Sinatra style Christian “walk.” Sing it everybody. “I did it my way.”

 

[amadeus]

...the words of the devil. So Im a little confused why religious people call it the Word Of God, clearly it isn't.

I believe it is very apparent this stoning of a daughter or the other murderous,
savage, barbaric, childish, jealous, primitive things in the Bible are not of God.

Not their fault...they came up basically from campfires and
and thinking God was a mean Guy in the Sky throwing lightning bolts at them...
being satisfied by virgins thrown into volcanoes!


It was the prophets that were inspired, not what they wrote.

when some insist that God Himself wrote the bible.

Compare the above statements about Scripture (the Word of God), with what the Bible proclaims about the Word of God, below:


Hebrews 4:12. For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

2Timothy 3:16. All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, 17. that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.

God gave all of the increase, that is, all of His own Word, which is all of Jesus. The men inspired to write the scriptures were anointed by God or led to write by the Holy Spirit... but while the Bible contains the truth, who is able to discern the truth?

"Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.
Pilate saith unto him, What is truth? And when he had said this, he went out again unto the Jews, and saith unto them, I find in him no fault at all." John 18:37-38

Only those able to hear Jesus' voice are able to hear the "truth" which Jesus is. Pontius Pilate heard the man speak but he did not know what the truth was. He was blind and deaf and so are many who read the scriptures [the Bible].

The Bible alone is a dead book. It is like Jesus hanging dead on the cross: dead. Then Jesus resurrected. He came to Life. Similarly the dead words of scripture contain it all as the dead book, the Bible contains it all. It must also be resurrected... in a person filled with the same anointing Spirit as the ones who were inspired to write it down in the beginning. Does a person have to understand the original Greek or Aramaic or Hebrew to understand God's message? No, understanding those original languages might be useful, but with only that knowledge those readers of the scriptures would also be without understanding. They would be reading the dead body of Jesus. Jesus did no miraculous works while he was dead.

The simple answer I give people I see in this verse written by the Apostle Paul:

"[God] Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life." II Cor 3:6

Many will say that speaks of the old covenant and the new and so it does, but a primary difference between the two covenants was between the letter and the spirit... the spirit being the Spirit, or the Holy Spirit. Those folks following Moses and Joshua had God's Word written with His finger on those tablets, but they needed a man who was able to communicate with God to get the real meaning of what was written.

Now, no priests or other interpreters are needed, if we have our own communication link with God. We do, or at least it is available to whosoever will through the Holy Spirit in us. That is the Spirit in us that gives Life to the dead words of Scripture in us if we are not always quenching the same Spirit...

 

[bbyrd009]

all you gotta do is understand what is meant at "stoning daughters," which should not be taken literally, except by those who want to stone their own children out of false pride and vanity anyway; a prevalent practice then, and now.

as long as this is read literally one is seeing and not seeing
there are no male and female in the kingdom

 

[bbyrd009]

For another believer led by the Spirit, will be led to see it differently.

nice

 

[bbyrd009]

Ok, but everything Paul refers to as Scripture, as well as when Jesus spoke of them, it was ALWAYS from the old covenant

both Christ and Paul refer to much extra-Biblical Scripture, as Quoted in the Bible

 

[amadeus]

... But, your own method of obtaining the Word of God will produce different accounts also. For another believer led by the Spirit, will be led to see it differently. Thus why shouldn't your method be rejected as you reject the Bible as the Word of God for that same reason?

The problem is in the two people reading the Bible and then drawing their different even contradicting conclusions. First question is do both of the people really have the Holy Spirit in them? If they both really do but still disagree than one or both of them at times is likely quenching the Holy Spirit in them. How can we tell who is right and who is wrong? God always can. Other people may say they can, but they may have the same problem as the first two who disagreed. I include myself in the group that may be wrong unless I never quench the Holy Spirit...

 

[Stranger]

The problem is in the two people reading the Bible and then drawing their different even contradicting conclusions. First question is do both of the people really have the Holy Spirit in them? If they both really do but still disagree than one or both of them at times is likely quenching the Holy Spirit in them. How can we tell who is right and who is wrong? God always can. Other people may say they can, but they may have the same problem as the first two who disagreed. I include myself in the group that may be wrong unless I never quench the Holy Spirit...

OK. How do you discern which of the two, who have different conclusions concerning God and the Bible, have the Holy Spirit? You say, only God can tell. Well, if only God can tell, and you can't, what is to prevent you from believing a lie?

Stranger

 

[amadeus]

OK. How do you discern which of the two, who have different conclusions concerning God and the Bible, have the Holy Spirit? You say, only God can tell. Well, if only God can tell, and you can't, what is to prevent you from believing a lie?

Stranger

What prevents us from believing a lie is staying in regular touch with God and always loving the Truth... even when we not know exactly what it is. Apostle Paul wrote: Pray without ceasing and rejoice in the Lord always. Remember what Jesus said?

"My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:" John 10:27

If we are not hearing His voice and following Him, it is certainly our own fault, isn't it?

 

[Stranger]

What prevents us from believing a lie is staying in regular touch with God and always loving the Truth... even when we not know exactly what it is. Apostle Paul wrote: Pray without ceasing and rejoice in the Lord always. Remember what Jesus said?

"My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:" John 10:27

If we are not hearing His voice and following Him, it is certainly our own fault, isn't it?

Whose 'fault' it is, is not the point. The point is that if your understanding of what is the Word of God or what not is the Word of God depends on no differing accounts, no difference of opinion, then your or pias method is no different than believing the Bible is the Word of God. Because you have differing accounts. Different opinions. So, why trash the Bible as 'not the Word of God' , when your method of determining the Word of God results in the same?

Stranger