-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
bbyrd009
Groper
- Nov 30, 2016
- 33,943
- 12,081
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
- Country
- United States Minor Outlying Islands
Will it even bring some back to hopefully understand that staying on God's side is our only hope...?
Man continues to work hard himself at doing the impossible, directing his steps to a better way. Jeremiah's words on this which I have quoted often on this forum still apply as carnal man is essentially still the beast he has always been. Who among us is no longer at all carnal? Who among us is not a beast?
"I said in mine heart concerning the estate of the sons of men, that God might manifest them, and that they might see that they themselves are beasts." Ecc 3:18
"She [Wisdom] hath killed her beasts..." Prov 9:2
God sent Jesus [Wisdom] among us make it possible for a man to kill his beasts, but how many are using the Wisdom of God so wisely as that? Like Solomon of old they fail to apply what God has provided.
"O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps." Jerem 10:23
"Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.
In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths." Prov 3:5-6
Prayer Warrior
Well-Known Member
Do you think that God is pleased with any country that says it's okay to kill babies? I will answer this for you. No, He is not! Abortion is the taking of innocent life, period.
You can write a whole book full of "facts and figures" and hypothetical situations about abortion, and it will not change the truth at all. You need to stop defending something that is so repugnant to God.
Proverbs 6:16--
16 There are six things that the LORD hates, seven that are detestable to Him: 17 haughty eyes, a lying tongue, hands that shed innocent blood,…
Evil is never the answer to the world's problems!
We can care about both--the unborn and the born! It doesn't have to be either/or.
Last edited:
Please stop misrepresenting (lying) about my position.
We should be seeking ways to minimize the number of abortions; but you seem to think Trump is some saint because of some laws being passed which will do very little if anything.
Absolutely we should care about both unborn and born. But alas it's not so. I don't know what the current statistic is; but in 2014, poverty was the big factor behind most abortions.
Characteristics of U.S. Abortion Patients in 2014 and Changes Since 2008
• In 2014, three-fourths of abortion patients were low income—49% living at less than the federal poverty level, and 26% living at 100–199% of the poverty level.
Your focus on abortion laws is missing the mark. I had a vision once of the souls of the aborted. It was so horrible I did not tell anyone about how what I saw, and I doubt I ever will. I doubt anyone would believe it. It may be a lot worse than even you imagine; but thanks be to God, there will be an end to it someday. It will stop someday.
Prayer Warrior
Well-Known Member
I haven't said much about abortion laws at all. I've defended God's position of hating "the hands that shed innocent blood." But a nation that fears God should have laws against things that are so detestable to God.
Considering the vision, why are you defending abortion? You should be speaking against it. You're making no sense.
.
No, all you did was introduce the topic into the thread and then try to paint Hillary Clinton as a devil while patting Trump on the back -- and then posted an article about the laws passed in his administration.
I think you have a screw loose. I have not defended abortion.
I will say something else about the "religious right" and abortion. Ronald Reagan was "for abortion" too when he was governor in California. Then when he ran for President, he was against it. He campaigned on the idea of a constitutional amendment. Hey, it helped get him elected; but once in office, he did nothing about it. Republicans keep campaigning about abortion but have never seriously done much about it; and get this, if they ever did get a constitutional amendment, they'd have one less issue to campaign on. It's to their advantage to have abortion legal so they can keep campaigning on it and raising money from religious people. It's a scam just the way the Democrats scam lower income blacks and Latinos -- if they ever fixed the real problems that plague minorities, what could they run on? So it's to their advantage to keep people poor so they can keep making promises about trying to help them.
It makes me ill. How many Catholics are there on the Supreme Court? Five or six? Catholics have been a majority on the Supreme Court for a long time; and you'd think they'd be anti-abortion enough to overturn Roe v Wade. Oh yes, they ruled that corporations are persons, so they have free speech -- and that means they can spend as much money on elections as they want. Got that? Catholics said corporations are persons with constitutional rights, but they couldn't come around to the idea that maybe fetuses are persons? How evil can you get? So then we can still have Republicans promising to appoint more conservative judges to fix the problem. Good grief, they might have a better chance of fixing it if they got more Protestants in the Supreme Court; but they don't really want to fix it. Again, it's something popular to campaign on -- and people swallowed it hook, line and sinker. Christians would have been better off setting up "unwed mother" centers and the like to help pregnant women instead of donating money to politicians who promise to get more "conservatives" on the Supreme Court to fix abortion.
Look at Trump's last Supreme Court pick. He's a drunk and a liar; but he serves the interest of big business. But he says he's a good Catholic, and that pleases Trump supporters who think Catholics are more apt to oppose abortion than Protestants. I can remember when Bush tried to appoint an evangelical woman. Oh the fuss that got raised! She hadn't gone to some hoity-toity Ivy League school. I can say that even if I went to an Ivy League school myself, but I'm no snob. She went to a smaller law school somewhere in the South, I think. She was perfectly qualified; but she got shouted down by the elitists in the Washington establishment -- which included many snobby, snotty Republicans. She wasn't a drunk, and she didn't have a record of molesting people sexually. Ah, but she also wasn't a Catholic or a Jew.
Prayer Warrior
Well-Known Member
I was showing that the Trump administration has a good track record regarding its policies on protecting the unborn! I did this to show that completely vilifying Trump is unfair (even though I don't think he's a saint
).I think we all do.
You implied that abortion is necessary due to circumstances such as poverty.... And you haven't spoken out against the evil of abortion.
You have such a way of conflating issues. What men do, or do not do, doesn't change the truth about abortion. Do you really not see this?? It doesn't matter that some politicians have changed their position about abortion or that some Catholics have failed in this area! It it just a nonissue when it comes to the truth that abortion is the taking of an innocent life.
.
Last edited:
No, his track record is as abysmal as past Republican Presidents since nothing is done to solve the reasons most women have abortions.I was showing that the Trump administration has a good track record regarding its policies on protecting the unborn! I did this to show that completely vilifying Trump is unfair (even though I don't think he's a saint
Do you have a fever or something? In no way did I imply abortion is necessary because of poverty. That would make as much sense as saying stealing is necessary because of poverty. I am a realist however. When I see most abortions are to lower income women, I want to address the poverty issue since I doubt most of those women enjoy or want abortions. They feel pressured, so why not relieve some of the pressure? Why not make it easier for them to keep their babies which is what most really want?
I was pointing out how unreliable politicians are in such matters. I'd say 99% of them are insincere people who don't care about anything except themselves and their careers. I doubt it is going to do much good to trust them to do the right thing in almost any area of life. Most are unreliable liars, and that goes for both parties to be sure. It surely is true for Donald Trump.
Psalm 146:3 Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.
I think prayer is likely to do more about abortion than supporting politicians who keep promising things but never get around to solving anything. I also think contributing to charities like food banks might help.
You seem to have a problem with my not condemning women who have abortions. It is hard for me to feel too harshly about them since I've never been in their shoes, never felt that kind of pressure. Surely it's still wrong, but I can't despise them when I know women can feel desperate. You are coming across as cold and condemning, and thinking that passing laws will fix all the problems.
Proverbs 6:30 Men do not despise a thief, if he steal to satisfy his soul when he is hungry;
31 But if he be found, he shall restore sevenfold; he shall give all the substance of his house.
Wouldn't it better for people who have food to share it with him, so he doesn't feel he must steal because he is hungry?
You may be interested to know I talked a young woman who was feeling desperate into not having an abortion. Her boyfriend was a friend of mine, but he was in jail at the time. She felt isolated and wasn't sure he'd want to be with her after he got out. She didn't want an abortion; she was just desperate. It troubled me to see her in that mental state. I told her she could live with me and he could too when he got out. She had the child; but then things fell apart and he moved out. Then she moved out too when one of her friends offered to let her and the child move in with them; but I count it as a success since I accomplished what I aimed for. Did I care if she then took him to court for child support? No. He was my friend, but it was still wrong for him not to help support the child. Strange I never saw her or the child again. Some day I'd like to see them. Strange too that I didn't see him for years; but a few months ago, he spotted me on the street and gave me several hundreds of dollars that he said he owed me. I had forgotten how much he owed, but he hadn't. So please don't tell me I'm indifferent. Would you let people live with you without paying rent if it could save a life? Or do you think voting for Donald Trump is enough?
Prayer Warrior
Well-Known Member
This implication is completely false rhetoric! I do NOT condemn women who have had abortions!
Edit: And I don't have a problem with you NOT condemning women who have had abortions! What an absurd thing to say!
When I oppose the practice of abortion, I'm constantly aware that women who have had abortions might take what I'm saying as condemnation, and I pray for Christian women who have this on their consciences because I know that the devil tries to condemn us for past sins. But Christian women who have confessed this sin to God have been forgiven, and there is NO condemnation.
I have noticed that you have a tendency to take the moral high ground and engage in dirty fighting. Your arguments about abortion have been characterized by fallacies and false statements, and I was wondering when you would charge me with this.
Here's an example of a false statement. I have NO doubt that the improved economy has helped this situation. I have already addressed this.
It's good that you helped this young woman. I commend you for this!
Yes, I would let me live with me without paying rent if that's what God led me to do. Also, I pray about which candidates to vote for....
Last edited:
Like the mafia men who just happen to kill whoever and then repent and go out doing such again and again, or maybe not but support the policy as such hey !
Those same mafia men paid tithes of the drug money, their gambling profits, their extortion to the Vatican treasury, which welcomed it with open hands and knowingly laundered much of it through the Vatican bank.
I'm puzzled why two bankers connected with President Trump apparently killed themselves. It makes me wonder if indeed they did kill themselves. I suppose it could be. I don't want to let my mind race and imagine some nefarious secret plot.
November 27, 2019 Former Deutsche Bank Exec Connected to Trump Loans Dies by Suicide in Malibu
A former Deutsche Bank executive who reportedly signed off on some of the institution’s unorthodox loans to Donald Trump killed himself in his Malibu home on November 19. Thomas Bowers, the onetime head of Deutsche Bank’s American wealth-management division, where he oversaw Trump’s private banker, committed suicide by hanging, according to Los Angeles County Medical Examiner-Coroner’s office. Bowers was 55.
Trump’s relationship with Deutsche Bank—which lent him around $2 billion after most other institutions had forsaken him for his history of defaults and bankruptcies—has come under investigation by two Congressional committees and the New York Attorney General, who are hoping the bank can shed light on Trump’s elusive finances, according to the New York Times. At one point, Bowers had a close connection to those finances.
Rosemary T. Vrablic, a managing director at Deutsche Bank who became Trump’s private banker in 2010 after being introduced by her client, Jared Kushner, reported directly to Bowers. Vrablic reportedly helped Trump secure loans from her bank, which Bowers approved—including more than $100 million to buy his Doral resort in Miami—even after Trump and Deutsche had to settle messy litigation over a Chicago loan that went bad.
“Rosemary is widely recognized as one of the top private bankers to the U.S. ultra high-net-worth community,” Bowers said in a press release when Deutsche Bank hired her in 2006.
Bowers hasn’t been employed by Deutsche since at least 2015, when he joined Starwood Capitol Group as COO, and was then appointed to the Board of Directors of Opus Bank in 2016.
Bowers isn’t the first Trump-connected Deutsche exec to commit suicide. In 2014, Deutsche derivatives analyst William S. Broeksmit, who reportedly had links to Trump and Russia, hung himself from a dog leash at his home in London.
November 27, 2019 Former Deutsche Bank Exec Connected to Trump Loans Dies by Suicide in Malibu
A former Deutsche Bank executive who reportedly signed off on some of the institution’s unorthodox loans to Donald Trump killed himself in his Malibu home on November 19. Thomas Bowers, the onetime head of Deutsche Bank’s American wealth-management division, where he oversaw Trump’s private banker, committed suicide by hanging, according to Los Angeles County Medical Examiner-Coroner’s office. Bowers was 55.
Trump’s relationship with Deutsche Bank—which lent him around $2 billion after most other institutions had forsaken him for his history of defaults and bankruptcies—has come under investigation by two Congressional committees and the New York Attorney General, who are hoping the bank can shed light on Trump’s elusive finances, according to the New York Times. At one point, Bowers had a close connection to those finances.
Rosemary T. Vrablic, a managing director at Deutsche Bank who became Trump’s private banker in 2010 after being introduced by her client, Jared Kushner, reported directly to Bowers. Vrablic reportedly helped Trump secure loans from her bank, which Bowers approved—including more than $100 million to buy his Doral resort in Miami—even after Trump and Deutsche had to settle messy litigation over a Chicago loan that went bad.
“Rosemary is widely recognized as one of the top private bankers to the U.S. ultra high-net-worth community,” Bowers said in a press release when Deutsche Bank hired her in 2006.
Bowers hasn’t been employed by Deutsche since at least 2015, when he joined Starwood Capitol Group as COO, and was then appointed to the Board of Directors of Opus Bank in 2016.
Bowers isn’t the first Trump-connected Deutsche exec to commit suicide. In 2014, Deutsche derivatives analyst William S. Broeksmit, who reportedly had links to Trump and Russia, hung himself from a dog leash at his home in London.
It's also weird that, a forensic pathologist said (in early November) that Jeffrey Epstein's death looks more like a murder by strangulation than a suicidal hanging. What's with all these "suicides" by hanging?
Jeffrey Epstein: Hanging or Strangulation?
This week forensic pathologist Michael Baden opined on a Fox News morning show that Jeffrey Epstein, who died in a New York City jail while awaiting trial for sex trafficking, had injuries to his neck that were "unusual for suicidal hanging and more consistent with ligature homicidal strangulation." Baden also shared with a website called Law & Crime a photograph and diagram, which he claims is from the Epstein postmortem investigation, showing the location of these fractures at the left hyoid greater cornu and bilateral thyroid cartilage cornua.
Also left unexplained were Epstein's other injuries.
Jeffrey Epstein had 'unexplained' injuries on wrists and shoulder, brother says
Jeffrey Epstein’s brother Mark says “unexplained” injuries were found on his body during the autopsy and is calling on the Department of Justice to release all forensic medical examiner files – including microscopic slides and autopsy photos – so that he can independently verify how the death occurred.
In August, the New York City Medical Examiner officially listed Jeffrey Epstein’s death as a suicide by hanging.
But Mark, 65, contends there are too many suspicious circumstances and questions to rule out homicide. He is now wondering why investigators have yet to share evidence with him indicating how they ruled out the possibility of murder.
In addition to three bone fractures in Jeffrey’s neck, according to autopsy files provided to Fox News, Epstein had two contusions on both of his wrists, an abrasion on his left forearm, and deep muscle hemorrhaging of his left deltoid or shoulder.
“Those are unexplained. Was he handcuffed and struggled? Was someone holding his wrists? The marks on his wrist are unexplained,” Mark told Fox News.
And of course the only two cameras outside his cell were temporarily disabled. What a pity..
I am reminded also of all the suicides of those involved in the history of the Clintons...56 or something at last count
I also find the suicide of Peter Smith in May of 2017 strange.
Peter W. Smith, GOP operative who sought Clinton's emails from Russian hackers, committed suicide, records show
A Republican donor and operative from Chicago's North Shore who said he had tried to obtain Hillary Clinton's missing emails from Russian hackers killed himself in a Minnesota hotel room days after talking to The Wall Street Journal about his efforts, public records show.
In mid-May, in a room at a Rochester hotel used almost exclusively by Mayo Clinic patients and relatives, Peter W. Smith, 81, left a carefully prepared file of documents, including a statement police called a suicide note in which he said he was in ill health and a life insurance policy was expiring.
Days earlier, the financier from suburban Lake Forest gave an interview to the Journal about his quest, and it began publishing stories about his efforts in late June. The Journal also reported it had seen emails written by Smith showing his team considered retired Lt. Gen. Michael Flynn, then a top adviser to Republican Donald Trump's campaign, an ally. Flynn briefly was President Trump's national security adviser and resigned after it was determined he had failed to disclose contacts with Russia.
At the time, the newspaper reported Smith's May 14 death came about 10 days after he granted the interview. Mystery shrouded how and where he had died, but the lead reporter on the stories said on a podcast he had no reason to believe the death was the result of foul play and that Smith likely had died of natural causes.
However, the Chicago Tribune obtained a Minnesota state death record filed in Olmsted County saying Smith committed suicide in a hotel near the Mayo Clinic at 1:17 p.m. on Sunday, May 14. He was found with a bag over his head with a source of helium attached. A medical examiner's report gives the same account, without specifying the time, and a report from Rochester police further details his suicide.
Peter W. Smith, GOP operative who sought Clinton's emails from Russian hackers, committed suicide, records show
A Republican donor and operative from Chicago's North Shore who said he had tried to obtain Hillary Clinton's missing emails from Russian hackers killed himself in a Minnesota hotel room days after talking to The Wall Street Journal about his efforts, public records show.
In mid-May, in a room at a Rochester hotel used almost exclusively by Mayo Clinic patients and relatives, Peter W. Smith, 81, left a carefully prepared file of documents, including a statement police called a suicide note in which he said he was in ill health and a life insurance policy was expiring.
Days earlier, the financier from suburban Lake Forest gave an interview to the Journal about his quest, and it began publishing stories about his efforts in late June. The Journal also reported it had seen emails written by Smith showing his team considered retired Lt. Gen. Michael Flynn, then a top adviser to Republican Donald Trump's campaign, an ally. Flynn briefly was President Trump's national security adviser and resigned after it was determined he had failed to disclose contacts with Russia.
At the time, the newspaper reported Smith's May 14 death came about 10 days after he granted the interview. Mystery shrouded how and where he had died, but the lead reporter on the stories said on a podcast he had no reason to believe the death was the result of foul play and that Smith likely had died of natural causes.
However, the Chicago Tribune obtained a Minnesota state death record filed in Olmsted County saying Smith committed suicide in a hotel near the Mayo Clinic at 1:17 p.m. on Sunday, May 14. He was found with a bag over his head with a source of helium attached. A medical examiner's report gives the same account, without specifying the time, and a report from Rochester police further details his suicide.
Similar threads
