Timtofly
Well-Known Member
This is not A Scriptural proof.For a (anything) to be changed or broken mid way, there has to be a mid point. The tribulation is the mid point of the seven years. If you doubt that just double three and a half years and see what the total is.
And...so? Does that tell us where and when it happens?
Actually I think we need a team of translators to interpret this, or at least what you think it might mean.
That does not mean it doesn't exist. Daniel already told us about that. We know that is when the abomination is set up.
I asked for a verse or passage not your logical conclusion. A week of days can be split in half. 3.5 days at the beginning of 42 months. 3.5 days at the end of the 42 months.
The 2 witnesses lay dead for 3.5 days per Revelation 11. That is the last half of a set of days. In the midst of the sounding of the 7th Trumpet, a set of days, the week is cut in half. The week is concluded after the 42 month interruption of desolation and abomination carried out by Satan and the FP per Revelation 13, 17, and 18.
John gives us in the text 42 months and 3.5 days. You argue for two sets of 42 months. I have pointed out two sets of 3.5 days separated by 42 months. For 3.5 days after the 7 Trumpet sounds, all the kingdoms belong to Christ. Then after 3.5 days God allows Satan 42 months.
The reason being; those beheaded during the 42 months do decide to reject Satan and accept being beheaded to follow God, in the act of having their head chopped off. Some souls are still found in the Lamb's book of life that are given this choice. If there are no souls left deemed by God to make this choice then no 42 months will be declared. That is confirming the Atonement Covenant. Jesus as Prince is confirming with God, because God is all knowing. Or you can put it, just confirming with His own all knowing ability as God. Until the Second Coming, and the final harvest, the harvest cannot be declared complete. Confirming with the many, as those who would be beheaded. The Atonement would be extended during a 42 month period to allow many to remain in the Lamb's book of life instead of being harvested in the winepress of the Lamb.
In the Hebrew of Daniel 9:27 this week can be translated as years or days. In fact some translations use years. Some use days. The KJV is neutral.
"And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading"
It does not take a dogmatic stance either way. At least not on the surface. The actual wording should be a "set of". Weeks in Hebrew is referring to sets of. Unless one is going to say it was only 70 literal weeks, 490 literal days, and not years at all. In English one would always associate a week with 7 days. Yet most today as English speakers if told it meant the last week it would be the last week. There is no indication in the Hebrew that "last" should be used as a modifier of this point. That is jumping to assumptions. Many want the verse to say: and this 70th week is when he will..... That is not what the Hebrew says. It is literally a separate thought, a separate week from the 70 mentioned earlier. There is no modifier text that joins this verse with the thoughts of the other 3 verses meaning the same time period. Verse 26 leaves us with Messiah being cut off. The only connection is as Messiah, the Prince is still the subject doing the action. In fact the Prince part is described as "to come". Being Prince would not be part of the Messiah prior to the Messiah being "cut off". The people of the Prince are still the same people of the Messiah. And still the same people of Daniel. Certainly not the same generation, but the same people overall, Israel.
So there are some translations that would not back up your point even in Daniel 9:27. Perhaps you would have to use a version you would for the most part disagree with to prove your point? Just guessing because you have yet to give a proof from Scripture. If you only use the KJV then you have been convinced this week is the 70th week, yet you still cannot place it in the NT Scripture. Nor can you account for all the known variables.
Yes, if you use a translation that says years, it would be their words against a translation that says days. One set of translators agreed with years. One set of translators agreed with days. Then a third set decided to just leave it as the original "week" "set" without defining it as days or years. They left it up to the reader or Holy Spirit. Or thought it was the 70th week, and left it at that. The other two sets may have even voted on it. Within the group of translators there was disagreement. I have no idea, just pointing out an observation. Never felt compelled to follow every reason every translation evolved/came into being.
You seem farely confident you figured something out on your own. Or you were taught something, and nothing has changed the teaching you are convinced is correct.
I never said 42 months cannot be the second half of 7 years. I want to see from Scripture when the first 42 months is declared. Yet even logically how can the last half of years interrupt themselves? Would they not just happen any ways? An interruption by definition, means at some point the last half would have to complete after the interruption. The interruption could even be a random amount of time. A few days, a few years, it could even be a few centuries. The interruption does not change nor define the original set of your alledged 7 years. There is no denying that there could have been 3.5 years leading up to the Cross that was interrupted for the fulness of the Gentiles at the Cross. When Christ returns the last 3.5 years would then be completed. That would explain Daniel 9:26. It would not explain Daniel 9:27. For one reason between the Cross and now has been almost 2000 years. That is definitely not 42 months.
If there is a plausible explanation that Jesus as Prince and Messiah covers a 7 year period, why is there a need to use the same explanation for covering both verse 26 and 27. It is like an algebra equation with missing variables, and known variables. We know of a 7 year period. We know of a 3.5 day period. We know of a 42 month period. We know one period will be shortened, meaning no longer a fixed period of time. We know an interruption by definition cannot change the original, so the interruption itself cannot be used to replace the original set time.
1992 years later we can see one interruption that did indeed interrupt a set time period for Jesus the Messiah the Prince. For the most part we agree that Jesus as Messiah had 3.5 years on earth as the ministry to that effect. The interruption would mean as Prince, the last 3.5 years would be put on hold. Paul explained that as the fulness of the Gentiles. The fulness of the Gentiles is certainly not an interruption equal in scope to the abomination of desolation. Israel was not set aside, Judah, the Jews were set aside. The temple was not turned into an abomination. The OT economy ceased to exist altogether. It was not the OT economy that was put on hold. According to Hebrews it was done away with. The only thing put on hold, interrupted was Jesus as Prince. We still have a 42 month interruption where there will be an abomination of desolation that will corrupt a temple and throne for 42 months. Not the last half of the time interrupted. Because the second interruption is in days, because we have to account for the 3.5 days the 2 witnesses lay dead in Jerusalem. When we read about the 7th Trumpet in Revelation 10, it mentions the days of the sounding. Not the days surrounding or leading up to, but the sound is equated to days. Since Daniel 9:27 can be days or years, Revelation 10 gives us a reason why it could be days. Scripture interprets Scripture. Revelation 10 does not say the years of the sounding of the 7th Trumpet. That would mean the interruption of 42 months would have to be declared. The 7th Trumpet is supposed to sound for one week of days, and then the Millennium would start.
Now we come to the 42 month interruption in Revelation 13, and now we see why Daniel 9:27 calls it an abomination and desolation. The only reason being, during this time for a soul to remain in the Lamb's book of life is that one must fit the definition of being beheaded literally. The choice to literally remain in the Lamb's book of life is to literally have one's head cut off. Now if this is all figurative, why is this interruption an abomination and desolation? Is that also figurative? The mere thought of an alter call that demands one's head to be removed is disgusting. In fact many make up terms not found in Revelation a more agreeable way called martyrdom. They were martyred for their faith. No, these were literally beheaded as an act of faith. To avoid the mark, one must remove the head. If one receives the mark, removing the head will not work. Having the mark already, removed one's name from the Lamb's book of life. Removing the head would just be suicide, not the ability to put one's name back into the Lamb's book of life. Also having belief will not prevent the mark. Having faith in God is not mentioned as a way to escape the mark. The only thing that avoids the mark is the removal of one's head. One can justify and make it sound more pleasant by calling them martyrs, but the fact remains, they have to have their heads cut off, to be resurrected from that physical death. There is no other physical death type they are resurrected from. Just dying is not the point. Being beheaded is the point.