Tongues

[1stCenturyLady]

I've been purchased (saved) by the Blood of the Lamb. That said, it is not possible for me to shed this sin nature while I inhabit this mortal body. I endeavor daily to live in a way that is pleasing to my Savior, but I fail, I know I do. Thankfully, Jesus's sacrifice for us covers us now and always. It will be wonderful to shed this sin nature when we're transformed, hopefully soon. I am a sinner, but justified by Jesus Christ.

No dear, it is not our body that has anything to do with sin, but our nature inside of us. It is our nature that is born again because it was crucified on the cross with Jesus. Romans 6:6-7
6 knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves of sin. 7 For he who has died has been freed from sin.

The "body" of sin is the whole of it - like an author's body of work is the whole of his work. Don't play dumb like some on Christian forums and interpret that to be the author's body.

Now our nature is within. That is where sin would be, not on the outside shell called our body of muscles and bone. Our nature is our mind and heart - our spirit and soul.

Understand? Now we must be born again of the Holy Spirit to be able to stop sinning. It is a supernatural rebirth. I actually felt my sin nature come out of my body on Feburary 9, 1977 when I was born again and filled with the Spirit of Christ. All the adultery left my heart and nature, that had been plaguing me. I couldn't stop on my own, so I was honest with God and told Him I couldn't stop, so if He wanted me to stop, He would have to take the desire away from me. After it happened, I finally knew what it meant to be born again, because I experienced it. It is literal, not positional like those who have never experienced the rebirth teach.

Ask Jesus to take away your sin nature now! And ask Him to fill you with His own divine nature. If you mean it, He'll do it.

 

[Curtis]

Thing is, the KJV translators added the word "unknown" in the 1 Corinthians 14 chapter, that word is not in the Greek texts. Paul was speaking of 'known'... languages of the world, for that... is what those present at Pentecost heard, even in the dialect of their own place of birth!

I’ve set you straight on that before - a tongue that’s never, ever, understood by any man, is so blatantly obviously AN UNKNOWN TONGUE.

Plug your claim into the verse, see if it makes any sense%:

He that speaks in a known tongue understood by everyone, speaks NOT unto man, but unto God FOR NO MAN UNDERSTANDS HIM....

Can you say, CONTRADICTION?

It’s a known tongue but understood by no man...

Please take a remedial course in logic.

 

[Curtis]

No dear, it is not our body that has anything to do with sin, but our nature inside of us. It is our nature that is born again because it was crucified on the cross with Jesus. Romans 6:6-7
6 knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves of sin. 7 For he who has died has been freed from sin.

The "body" of sin is the whole of it - like an author's body of work is the whole of his work. Don't play dumb like some on Christian forums and interpret that to be the author's body.

Now our nature is within. That is where sin would be, not on the outside shell called our body of muscles and bone. Our nature is our mind and heart - our spirit and soul.

Understand? Now we must be born again of the Holy Spirit to be able to stop sinning. It is a supernatural rebirth. I actually felt my sin nature come out of my body on Feburary 9, 1977 when I was born again and filled with the Spirit of Christ. All the adultery left my heart and nature, that had been plaguing me. I couldn't stop on my own, so I was honest with God and told Him I couldn't stop, so if He wanted me to stop, He would have to take the desire away from me. After it happened, I finally knew what it meant to be born again, because I experienced it. It is literal, not positional like those who have never experienced the rebirth teach.

Ask Jesus to take away your sin nature now! And ask Him to fill you with His own divine nature. If you mean it, He'll do it.

And scripture says that without the shedding of blood is no remission of sin:

Heb 9:22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.

Jesus shed His blood for the remission of our sins, and rose in a body without blood, saying His body was flesh and BONES, instead of flesh and blood - Luke 24:39 - thus if what Jesus sacrificed for us has to remain gone, He didn’t take back His blood, but still rose in a physical body.

This negates the watchtower claim that His body had to disappear without resurrection because He gave His BODY for remission of sins - because its His blood that did it.

 

[Davy]

I’ve set you straight on that before - a tongue that’s never, ever, understood by any man, is so blatantly obviously AN UNKNOWN TONGUE.

Maybe you think others here don't see how it is you... that is contradicting yourself, but I assure you, those who actually study God's Word for theirselves instead of listening to Church systems from men know you are pushing falsehoods. Anyone can run their mouth with falsehoods on a Christian forum and that proves absolutely nothing. Only by backing it up per God's Holy Writ is something proven, and you have not presented that proof, but only hot air.

Man up and prove me wrong; get out your favorite Greek New Testament Lexicon and look up what the Greek words are in Acts 2 wherever it speaks of a tongue or language.

And while you're at it, look up in a Greek Lexicon of 1 Corinthians 14 and see if you can find the Greek word for "unknown" in the Greek NT texts (I refer to the Textus Receptus Greek text used for the KJV).

And never forget this which proves... what the multitude present heard was NOT... gibberish...

Acts 2:7-8
7 And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, "Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans?
8 And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?"
KJV

 

[Davy]

Let's break down the meaning of the Acts 2:7-8 Scripture for a little lesson to help the new babes in Christ.

Acts 2:7-8
7 And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, "Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans?
8 And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?"
KJV

Acts 2 in the previous verses revealed peoples were present from many different nations. And one among them is who asked the above question.


Break down of verse 8 above:

"And how hear we every man" -- everyone present 'understood' the Apostles speak in their OWN language. The phrase "every man" destroys any idea of one speaking a gibberish speech with only one or two present being able to interpret. Absolutely everyone... present, heard in their own language.

"in our own tongue" -- know what this word "tongue" is per the original Greek? It's the Greek word dialektos, the Greek word where our English word 'dialect' comes from. Everyone knows that even their own language of birth can be a little different depending on which part of the country they are from. Southerners definitely do not sound like someone from Boston or Maine. That's what a dialect means, and thus the Greek word dialektos there in Scripture.

"wherein we were born" -- this phrase goes with that idea of dialektos (dialect). If you were present at Pentecost and heard the Apostles speak English, but it sounded like someone from London, you's still be amazed, but if you heard in the dialect of the very town you were born, now that truly is amazing. And that latter event is exactly what happened on Pentecost. Each individual heard them speak in the language dialect of their own town or village where they were born.

Thus God's Word is very accurate, IF one decides to heed it as written.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

And scripture says that without the shedding of blood is no remission of sin:

Heb 9:22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.

Jesus shed His blood for the remission of our sins, and rose in a body without blood, saying His body was flesh and BONES, instead of flesh and blood - Luke 24:39 - thus if what Jesus sacrificed for us has to remain gone, He didn’t take back His blood, but still rose in a physical body.

This negates the watchtower claim that His body had to disappear without resurrection because He gave His BODY for remission of sins - because its His blood that did it.

What has your post here got anything to do with what I posted? Do you understand that Christ's crucifixion has everything to do with taking away our sin nature? Jesus shed his own blood once, so that is already done. What are you saying? That our blood must also be shed for our remission of sins? That doesn't sound like you.

 

[Mugre Pinzon]

Understand? Now we must be born again of the Holy Spirit to be able to stop sinning. It is a supernatural rebirth. I actually felt my sin nature come out of my body on Feburary 9, 1977 when I was born again and filled with the Spirit of Christ.

You're fortunate, I guess, to have shed your sin nature... So you've never sinned since?

 

[Jim B]

You're fortunate, I guess, to have shed your sin nature... So you've never sinned since?

When one sheds their sin nature it doesn't mean that s/he will never sin again. It means that sin will not have mastery over them. It is no longer in their nature to sin.

 

[Curtis]

You're fortunate, I guess, to have shed your sin nature... So you've never sinned since?

John refutes the sinless Christians claim some Christians spout.

Christians don’t sin habitually as the unconverted do, but we can’t keep from sinning sometimes, and need to repent of it when we do.

John wrote to the brethren, if we say we have no sin we lie, but if we confess our sins, He forgives them. 1 Joh 1:8-9

And yes, he wrote to the brethren, 1 Joh 2:7, for those who claim otherwise:

1Joh 2:7 Brethren, I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning.

 

[Curtis]

When one sheds their sin nature it doesn't mean that s/he will never sin again. It means that sin will not have mastery over them. It is no longer in their nature to sin.

But there are those who actually claim they never sin at all as Christians.

 

[Curtis]

What has your post here got anything to do with what I posted? Do you understand that Christ's crucifixion has everything to do with taking away our sin nature? Jesus shed his own blood once, so that is already done. What are you saying? That our blood must also be shed for our remission of sins? That doesn't sound like you.

Nothing I said even hints at your interpretation of it.

 

[Curtis]

Maybe you think others here don't see how it is you... that is contradicting yourself, but I assure you, those who actually study God's Word for theirselves instead of listening to Church systems from men know you are pushing falsehoods. Anyone can run their mouth with falsehoods on a Christian forum and that proves absolutely nothing. Only by backing it up per God's Holy Writ is something proven, and you have not presented that proof, but only hot air.

Man up and prove me wrong; get out your favorite Greek New Testament Lexicon and look up what the Greek words are in Acts 2 wherever it speaks of a tongue or language.

And while you're at it, look up in a Greek Lexicon of 1 Corinthians 14 and see if you can find the Greek word for "unknown" in the Greek NT texts (I refer to the Textus Receptus Greek text used for the KJV).

And never forget this which proves... what the multitude present heard was NOT... gibberish...

Acts 2:7-8
7 And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, "Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans?
8 And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?"
KJV

The definition of the word ‘language’ doesn’t negate the modifier ‘unknown’ which refers to a language that is unknown - and by definition a language not understood by any man IS unknown - thus the 50 scholars from oxford and other top universities in England that translated the KJV and added the word UNKNOWN in that text, indeed knew more than you do.

I’ve heard people at airports speaking in their native language to each other, and it was just gibberish to me - some of the languages I couldn’t make out any distinct syllables at all - thus it was a language I didn’t understand, so it was an unknown tongue - and in that situation, to have some pseudo-scholar wannabe, start citing the definition of LANGUAGE to claim it wasn’t an unknown language, would be as ludicrous as your rhetoric and citing of a dictionary to claim the KJV translators are wrong,

 

[Behold]

Ok then

Back to reality.

Here we go.

If you have a "prayer language", = the NT says, these are "groanings that can't be uttered"......and this is Romans 8.

If you have the least Spiritual Gift, that is not "groanings that can't be uttered".

See this part..>>"Groanings......that ........can't be uttered".......... what does that mean?....Its mean's its not a language, as a language can be "uttered".
So, your "prayer language".....is not the "Gift of Tongues"......and you should get out of the church that has a carnal boob in the Pulpit, who has more useless degrees then a Thermometer, yet can't explain to you in 40 yrs, what i just taught you in the 12 seconds it took you to read this period................... <<<<<<

Now, Paul, who is an Apostle, and you are not, has "signs of an Apostle"...... 2 Corinthians 12:11... and you dont...and neither does your pastor, bishop, pope, minister, or mother.
So, when Paul says......"tongues of Angels"........He is not talking about the "gift of the Spirit".

Next..

Paul told you, to desire the BEST Gift.....not the least on the list.....which is #9........."tongues"

Finally...>"Tongues", is/are a foreign language that you can't speak, unless God gives you this "gift".
And he is not going to do this so that you can stand up in your church service and prove your pride.
Understand?

God is not in the business of you showing off, or trying to sound spiritual, or behave as if ..>"well, i have this, and you dont"...which is the fleshy nonsense that you find with Charismatics and Pentecostals..
Here is something you can discover about baby christians.
They want GIFTS......just like babies want GIFTS.
Reader, the most CARNAL GROUP in the entire New Testament is the Church at Corinth. (1&2 Corinthians) And they all chased GIFTS of the SPIRIT< as babies want Gifts.
They all wanted to run the show......as that is how a child behaves...they need all the attention.
Paul was always dealing with their endless carnality.....constantly, as that is what you find with these types of believers and their denominations.

Here is the bottom line...
If all you can do, is sit in a pew and watch......... for 50 yrs......then you dont have to concern yourself with a Gift of The Spirit, as God does not waste those on people who only turn into Christians during a service and the other 6 days a week they are not involved in God's work.
You want "tongues"?...then get up, get out, and go to a mission field on a trip and find a group that can't speak your language....
You'll need the gift then....as then you are actually soul winning and that is WHY YOU WOULD GET IT.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

Nothing I said even hints at your interpretation of it.

Okay, I'm lost. I have no idea what you are saying and in answer to what was it that I said. LOL Never mind. Ask me a question if you like and let's start over.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

You're fortunate, I guess, to have shed your sin nature... So you've never sinned since?

Not intentionally. But that doesn't mean I had not more to learn to cause my conscience to grow in sensitivity to God's will. But I did live up to the knowledge that I had. Philippians 3:16. For instance, I thought because my husband was already a Christian that the check I was getting in my spirit to not marry him was just nerves. It wasn't. It was God's voice, which I disobeyed. That was sin, but unintentional. He's helped me discern His voice more now so I don't even sin unintentionally. Understand?

 

[JunChosen]

People read Romans Chapter 7 about a person who's been saved that still sin!

And

1 Corinthians 14:22:
"Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe."

 

[1stCenturyLady]

it doesn't mean that s/he will never sin again

If you don't want to sin, why would you?

Do you like not getting any sleep because your conscience won't shut up? LOL Personally, I like peace and quiet within.

CC: @Mugre Pinzon

 

[Davy]

The definition of the word ‘language’ doesn’t negate the modifier ‘unknown’ which refers to a language that is unknown - and by definition a language not understood by any man IS unknown - thus the 50 scholars from oxford and other top universities in England that translated the KJV and added the word UNKNOWN in that text, indeed knew more than you do.

I’ve heard people at airports speaking in their native language to each other, and it was just gibberish to me - some of the languages I couldn’t make out any distinct syllables at all - thus it was a language I didn’t understand, so it was an unknown tongue - and in that situation, to have some pseudo-scholar wannabe, start citing the definition of LANGUAGE to claim it wasn’t an unknown language, would be as ludicrous as your rhetoric and citing of a dictionary to claim the KJV translators are wrong,

Nice try, but that doesn't work. The word "unknown" in the KJV of 1 Corinthians 14 is NOT in the Greek manuscripts. That word was added.

The reason why that word "unknown" is NOT in the Greek is because some unknown gibberish tongue is NOT what Apostle Paul was talking about. Paul was talking about glossa, the Greek word that is... there in the manuscripts, which means 'known languages of the world'. This is why Paul said, "divers kinds of tongues" in 1 Corinthians 12 when he began speaking of the various spiritual gifts by The Holy Spirit.

 

[Curtis]

Ok then

Back to reality.

Here we go.

If you have a "prayer language", = the NT says, these are "groanings that can't be uttered"......and this is Romans 8.

If you have the least Spiritual Gift, that is not "groanings that can't be uttered".

See this part..>>"Groanings......that ........can't be uttered".......... what does that mean?....Its mean's its not a language, as a language can be "uttered".
So, your "prayer language".....is not the "Gift of Tongues"......and you should get out of the church that has a carnal boob in the Pulpit, who has more useless degrees then a Thermometer, yet can't explain to you in 40 yrs, what i just taught you in the 12 seconds it took you to read this period................... <<<<<<

Now, Paul, who is an Apostle, and you are not, has "signs of an Apostle"...... 2 Corinthians 12:11... and you dont...and neither does your pastor, bishop, pope, minister, or mother.
So, when Paul says......"tongues of Angels"........He is not talking about the "gift of the Spirit".

Next..

Paul told you, to desire the BEST Gift.....not the least on the list.....which is #9........."tongues"

Finally...>"Tongues", is/are a foreign language that you can't speak, unless God gives you this "gift".
And he is not going to do this so that you can stand up in your church service and prove your pride.
Understand?

God is not in the business of you showing off, or trying to sound spiritual, or behave as if ..>"well, i have this, and you dont"...which is the fleshy nonsense that you find with Charismatics and Pentecostals..
Here is something you can discover about baby christians.
They want GIFTS......just like babies want GIFTS.
Reader, the most CARNAL GROUP in the entire New Testament is the Church at Corinth. (1&2 Corinthians) And they all chased GIFTS of the SPIRIT< as babies want Gifts.
They all wanted to run the show......as that is how a child behaves...they need all the attention.
Paul was always dealing with their endless carnality.....constantly, as that is what you find with these types of believers and their denominations.

Here is the bottom line...
If all you can do, is sit in a pew and watch......... for 50 yrs......then you dont have to concern yourself with a Gift of The Spirit, as God does not waste those on people who only turn into Christians during a service and the other 6 days a week they are not involved in God's work.
You want "tongues"?...then get up, get out, and go to a mission field on a trip and find a group that can't speak your language....
You'll need the gift then....as then you are actually soul winning and that is WHY YOU WOULD GET IT.

1. speaking in tongues is a gift for the church, not the apostles. The gift of tongues fell on 120 people in the upper rom at Pentecost, and in Acts 2:38-39 Peter said that the gift of the Holy Spirit is for “you, your children, all afar off, even to as MANY AS GOD SHALL CALL”.

2. There are several different types of tongues, not just 1. Paul said there are DIVERSITIES of tongues.
Romans 8:26 is one of them, and Jesus Himself groaned in the spirit. It’s an audible sound.
There’s the Acts 2 tongue for missionary work, there’s an unknown tongue never understood by anyone, and there’s the message to a church congregation in tongues, that needs interpreted.

3. What did Paul think about the least of the gifts, tongues?
A. He wanted everyone to speak in tongues
B. He thanked God he spoke in tongues more than anyone
C. He told the church to forbid NOT speaking in tongues
D. Paul told them TO DESIRE SPIRITUAL GIFTS:
Co 14:1 Follow after charity, and desire spiritual gifts, but rather that ye may prophesy.

3. Tongues are of course not a sign for unbelievers, because they are a sign that FOLLOWS them that believe, Mark 16.

Paul said that in church speaking in tongues should be limited to three messages to the congregation, and that they need interpreted by someone with that gift, or they should keep silent.

Since Paul wants everyone to speak in tongues and speaks in them more than anyone, that means he's speaking in tongues the most when not in a church service, and we should too.

Paul also wrote that prophesy is a better gift than tongues UNLESS THEY ARE INTERPRETED.
This means a message in tongues that’s interpreted is equal to prophecy.

That answers of most of your wrong assertions regarding tongues.

 

[Curtis]

Nice try, but that doesn't work. The word "unknown" in the KJV of 1 Corinthians 14 is NOT in the Greek manuscripts. That word was added.

The reason why that word "unknown" is NOT in the Greek is because some unknown gibberish tongue is NOT what Apostle Paul was talking about. Paul was talking about glossa, the Greek word that is... there in the manuscripts, which means 'known languages of the world'. This is why Paul said, "divers kinds of tongues" in 1 Corinthians 12 when he began speaking of the various spiritual gifts by The Holy Spirit.

I’ve more than adequately answered that - if you can’t grasp it, that’s not my problem.