Was James confused?

[Stranger]

NO. You haven't.
No one who believes as YOU do has ever posted a supporting verse.

WHERE in the bible does it say that we are to do nothing but BELIEVE in Jesus?

And if you're going to use John 6:29, you're going to have to explain what BELIEVE means.

You posted 2 Corinthians.
I explained what it means,
YOU never did...

Concerning (2 Cor. 3) See post #444.

Now you ask for another verse about believing in Jesus. Are you wanting a whole doctrine or a verse? When did I use (John 6:29)? Oh, I get it. You don't want me to.

Stranger

 

[GodsGrace]

I was looking hard for an answer to my question, 'how are we not in the same boat'. And I couldn't see it. Perhaps I missed it. Could you show me.

Stranger

Here's the whole post Stranger.

***********************************************
Stranger says:


Yes, I believe the law has been done away as far as we having to follow it. (2 Cor. 3:11)

Let me ask a question. I say we don't have to follow the law, and I acknowledge that I cannot keep the law. You say you are to follow the law, but acknowledge also that you cannot keep the law.

Are not you and I in the same boat here? If not why?

Stranger


GodsGrace replies:

Here's the difference...

I know that God demands obedience and He's given me a way to obey Him with love.

You claim He no longer demands obedience.

Has God changed?

*******************************************

I'm in a boat that says that God has not changed.
He still requires obedience to His laws.
It's not possible to keep all the laws.
But He's helped me by giving me love for Jesus which makes me WANT to keep the laws. I'm not a slave like the Israelites, I'm a friend.
Galatians 4:7
John 15:15

You're in a boat that says that God has changed.
He no longer requires you to obey.
You flatly stated that you do not obey.

That's quite a different boat.
John 5:28-29
One day Jesus will judge us by our works.
He NEVER said not to do works and to only believe in Him.
God has NEVER changed.
He is the same yesterday, today, and tomorrow.

 

[Helen]

"Yes, I believe the law has been done away as far as we having to follow it."

That's a rather scary sentence to read to be honest.
The law has NOT been done away with.
We are REQUIRED to follow it.

Mathew 5:17-20
What do you believe Jesus is saying here?

I know that you will have seen this posted already...but here it comes again!!

Obviously myself and KBcid are having the same conversation as yourself and @Stranger ..

You are choosing to add to the finished work of Christ! Matt 5 is easy and so clear..Jesus is getting His point across..obviously 4000 years of not being about to keep the 10 commandment and still not penetrated their thick heads...so He loving shows them here , to get through to them by PROVING that we cannot keep the law in ourselves.

if you believe that with all you striving and effort you will end up being perfect,
I am sorry, you are somewhat if not greatly deluded. It is the impossible task.
Just like all the many verses you quoted from the sermon. Impossible. I would have thought that you could see that clearly and get Jesus' message!

Matt 5: 20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
21 Ye have heard that it was said .. Thou shalt not kill; 22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

Can't you see here that Jesus is so obviously showing them how IMPOSSIBLE it is??
He here raised the bar ABOVE the old ten commandments!!

Notice He speaks of- "unless your righteousness" exceeds...etc
We know, because we all can see beyond and after the Cross...these people He was speaking to were still under the old law. We are shown after His death and victory it is no longer a matter of "our righteousness" getting the job of perfection done...BUT HIS!!

As with Abraham it was his FAITH which was imputed to him as righteousness.
Salvation is by grace through faith....never ever ever can be by becoming so righteous that we finally in our own effort reach perfection!!

"But without faith it is impossible to please Him: for he that cometh to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of them that diligently seek Him."
It is all in and by Him...the Institutions are full of people who have driven themselves crazy by "trying" to be perfect.
I know..I have visited those poor people in those places. Sadly I have not managed to convince them the God sent Jesus to take our place and that -
"He was delivered over to death for our sins and was raised to life for our justification." Rom 4

 

[GodsGrace]

Concerning (2 Cor. 3) See post #444.

Now you ask for another verse about believing in Jesus. Are you wanting a whole doctrine or a verse? When did I use (John 6:29)? Oh, I get it. You don't want me to.

Stranger

If you're going to be confused Stranger, we could end the conversation right now.

Please explain HOW 2 Corinthians 3:10-17 tells us NOT to obey.
It just tells us the N.C. is better.

I USED JOHN 6:29, not YOU.
In fact, YOU probably don't like it too much because it speaks of judgement.

 

[Stranger]

Here's the whole post Stranger.

***********************************************
Stranger says:


Yes, I believe the law has been done away as far as we having to follow it. (2 Cor. 3:11)

Let me ask a question. I say we don't have to follow the law, and I acknowledge that I cannot keep the law. You say you are to follow the law, but acknowledge also that you cannot keep the law.

Are not you and I in the same boat here? If not why?

Stranger


GodsGrace replies:

Here's the difference...

I know that God demands obedience and He's given me a way to obey Him with love.

You claim He no longer demands obedience.

Has God changed?

*******************************************

I'm in a boat that says that God has not changed.
He still requires obedience to His laws.
It's not possible to keep all the laws.
But He's helped me by giving me love for Jesus which makes me WANT to keep the laws. I'm not a slave like the Israelites, I'm a friend.
Galatians 4:7
John 15:15

You're in a boat that says that God has changed.
He no longer requires you to obey.
You flatly stated that you do not obey.

That's quite a different boat.
John 5:28-29
One day Jesus will judge us by our works.
He NEVER said not to do works and to only believe in Him.
God has NEVER changed.
He is the same yesterday, today, and tomorrow.

Sister, you and I are in the same boat. You just don't like my company. I couldn't keep the law, and neither can you.

Stranger

 

[GodsGrace]

Sister, you and I are in the same boat. You just don't like my company. I couldn't keep the law, and neither can you.

Stranger

I like your company or I would not have spoken to you for such a length of time.

NO ONE could keep the Law.

Was it easier to keep in the Sinai desert,
or is it easier to keep today?

Today is the right answer.
Why?

Don't answer. Just think about it.

THIS IS WHAT HAS CHANGED.
NOT the keeping of the Law.
The LAW cannot be kept.
BUT GOD STILL DEMANDS THAT IT DOES.

 

[Stranger]

If you're going to be confused Stranger, we could end the conversation right now.

Please explain HOW 2 Corinthians 3:10-17 tells us NOT to obey.
It just tells us the N.C. is better.

I USED JOHN 6:29, not YOU.
In fact, YOU probably don't like it too much because it speaks of judgement.

No I am not confused, but you did accuse me of basing a doctrine on one verse before. So my question was legitimate.

(2 Cor. 3:7-11) says the law has been done away. Thus it does not exist for you and I to obey. (3:11)

Stranger

 

[GodsGrace]

No I am not confused, but you did accuse me of basing a doctrine on one verse before. So my question was legitimate.

(2 Cor. 3:7-11) says the law has been done away. Thus it does not exist for you and I to obey. (3:11)

Stranger

OK. End of conversation.
We'll meet again.
BUT, I sure would like to know WHICH VERSE in 2 Corinthians 3:7-11
says that we are no longer to obey...
I don't see it.

I see the difference between the O.C. and the N.C.
Peace.

 

[Helen]

THIS IS WHAT HAS CHANGED.
NOT the keeping of the Law.
The LAW cannot be kept.
BUT GOD STILL DEMANDS THAT IT DOES.

If that is not total confusion then I don't know what is!!

 

[Stranger]

I like your company or I would not have spoken to you for such a length of time.

NO ONE could keep the Law.

Was it easier to keep in the Sinai desert,
or is it easier to keep today?

Today is the right answer.
Why?

Don't answer. Just think about it.

THIS IS WHAT HAS CHANGED.
NOT the keeping of the Law.
The LAW cannot be kept.
BUT GOD STILL DEMANDS THAT IT DOES.

The demands of the Law will never change. That is why God had to place you and I in a place where the law has no jurisdiction over us. We are dead in Christ. The law can't reach you or I.

If you want to be found pleasing to God by your 'attempt' to keep the law, Go ahead, but you won't make it. The law doesn't recognize your good intention or effort. And neither does God.

Stranger

 

[Helen]

The demands of the Law will never change. That is why God had to place you and I in a place where the law has no jurisdiction over us. We are dead in Christ. The law can't reach you or I.

If you want to be found pleasing to God by your 'attempt' to keep the law. Go ahead, but you won't make it. The law doesn't recognize your good intention or effort. And neither does God.

Stranger

Can't be said clearer than that. ✟

 

[GodsGrace]

If that is not total confusion then I don't know what is!!

What's not right about it?

This is what I posted:

THIS IS WHAT HAS CHANGED.
NOT the keeping of the Law.
The LAW cannot be kept.
BUT GOD STILL DEMANDS THAT IT DOES.

I'm sure you've studied the Covenants...
So,

Does God demand obedience from us?
John 14:15

Can we keep the law?
Romans 3:23

God still demands obedience from us.
Can we keep the law? No.

So what has changed??

The NEW COVENANT has made the change...
NOT THE KEEPING OF THE COMMANDMENTS.

Could you please tell me what YOU think is the difference between the Old Covenant and the New Covenant...

I think the entire problem lies here.

 

[bbyrd009]

Can't be said clearer than that. ✟

if only it were true, ya.

 

[GodsGrace]

The demands of the Law will never change. That is why God had to place you and I in a place where the law has no jurisdiction over us. We are dead in Christ. The law can't reach you or I.

If you want to be found pleasing to God by your 'attempt' to keep the law, Go ahead, but you won't make it. The law doesn't recognize your good intention or effort. And neither does God.

Stranger

Since the law has not been abolished, as per Jesus who hung on that cross for you and I,
Mathew 5:17 for the umpteenth time

WHY do you tell me that I'm trying to please God by my attempt to keep the law?

Should I go and sin as much as I can?

Are you telling me God does not recognize my good deeds?
Have you not understood John 5:28-29?
Is it too scary for you?

Have you not understood Mathew 7:21-23

Is that too scary for you too?

How about James 1:22

I know James is not liked by some, but it IS in the New Testament.
It IS inspired. It was written by the brother of Jesus. Who better to know?

Please post some verses that say the law has been done away with.
2 Corinthians does NOT say this.
It just proposes a new and better way of keeping it.
Please go through verse by verse as I've done and show me where it says we are no longer to follow the law, or commandments of God.

 

[Helen]

The LAW cannot be kept.
BUT GOD STILL DEMANDS THAT IT DOES.

Could you please tell me what YOU think is the difference between the Old Covenant and the New Covenant...

I think that we are probably just wasting our time here. I wish there were some new threads going on.

As I read your posts , You seem to have a mixture of old and new.
You say that you know that we cannot keep the law..and your next breath you are saying that God demands that we do.
As I see it..God demands nothing but 100% Faith in Him and the finished work of His Son ...ALL the demands of God, were found in Jesus.
I have already mentioned to you that our work "is the labour to enter into rest."...and ABIDE there.

As you mentioned to Stranger a few posts back...I think this conversation is over, because it just goes in circles because no one is going to change their mind.
...hopefully see you in a different conversation.
If I posted anything more in this thread it would only be a repeat of what I have already said in this thread.
God bless

 

[Helen]

if only it were true, ya.

Haha! I will just have to add you to my prayer list, that your eyes may be opened to everything that Jesus did 'for you'.

 

[GodsGrace]

I think that we are probably just wasting our time here. I wish there were some new threads going on.

As I read your posts , You seem to have a mixture of old and new.
You say that you know that we cannot keep the law..and your next breath you are saying that God demands that we do.
As I see it..God demands nothing but 100% Faith in Him and the finished work of His Son ...ALL the demands of God, were found in Jesus.
I have already mentioned to you that our work "is the labour to enter into rest."...and ABIDE there.

As you mentioned to Stranger a few posts back...I think this conversation is over, because it just goes in circles because no one is going to change their mind.
...hopefully see you in a different conversation.
If I posted anything more in this thread it would only be a repeat of what I have already said in this thread.
God bless

How is explaining the difference of the O.C. and the N.C.
repeating?
We've never touched on this and THIS is the problem.
We like to hear sweet words about how Jesus has done it all and how we don't need to do anything.

I know you're not one of these persons just by having been here a few weeks, however, there are new Christians reading along and that's exactly how it sounds to them.

Try teaching a kid what you and Stranger believe. It's a concept. Kids don't understand concept, only concrete learning. I am not confusing anything... I'm saying we MUST OBEY GOD.
GOD.

You and Stranger are in some way saying we don't have to!!
From Genesis 1 God has demanded obedience.
When did God change His mind and decide Jesus did it all?

When Jesus said IT IS FINISHED, He meant HIS work, not YOURS.

Can you tell me another reason why Jesus died besides atonement?
What else did He do by dying on the cross?

 

[GodsGrace]

Haha! I will just have to add you to my prayer list, that your eyes may be opened to everything that Jesus did 'for you'.

No need to add him to your prayer list.
Jesus did a lot for us didn't He?
Are we so displeased to do anything for HIM?
Is it absolutely necessary to say that He finished everything and we're to do nothing?

I hear our works are as dirty rags.
Then why did Jesus say He was going to judge us on our works?

 

[Helen]

Is it absolutely necessary to say that He finished everything and we're to do nothing?

This is just the same old Mulberry bush said in a different way.

You know very well if you have read any of my posts that I have never said that we do "nothing".
That is stupid. Last week I posted a Thread ...about overcoming...Revelation 3 clearly show what our work of overcoming is....

Jesus overcame sin and fulfilled the law... FACT.

But repeating conversations is getting us nowhere.
Bless you.

 

[Armadillo]

The law doesn't recognize your good intention or effort. And neither does God.

Could you please tell me what YOU think is the difference between the Old Covenant and the New Covenant...

Some have a hard time letting go, abiding and resting because faith isn't trusted as much as they trust themselves.

Some have been fed a steady diet of a misinterpretation of scripture from pastors, family, etc and are told to follow the stone cold law of The Ten Commandments instead of following the hot ministry of the Spirit or they are doing both, and it's a mixture of law and grace and it's lukewarm, Jesus spits it out.

You can't put new wine into old wineskins, the new wine being the New Covenant and the old wine being the Old Covenant. Some prefer the old wine and like hearing the law preached, embracing law which leads to failure instead of embracing grace which leads to freedom.

When I read the law being preached in the comments, it sickens me and it sickens God too.

 

[Armadillo]

I think that we are probably just wasting our time here. I wish there were some new threads going on.