Was Mary sinless?

[ChurchAuthority]

-- You call it erroneous.
Perhaps if you showed how or where. Otherwise....

It's erroneous because of all of the backflips you have top perform to arrive at your point.

Here are the FACTS:
The angel called Mary, "Kecharitomene". That's a fact and there is nop getting around it.
As I and others have repeatedly pointed out - this title is the perfect passive participle of charitoo, indicates a completed action with permanent result. It translates as “completely, perfectly, enduringly endowed with grace.”

Anything else you attempt to twist, jump over, invent or hide behind is simply erroneous. I realize that this is a hard pill to swallow for Protestants and Anti-Catholics - but you simply cannot argue with the original Greek text.

 

[Foreigner]

Here are the FACTS:
The angel called Mary, "Kecharitomene". That's a fact and there is nop getting around it.
As I and others have repeatedly pointed out - this title is the perfect passive participle of charitoo, indicates a completed action with permanent result. It translates as “completely, perfectly, enduringly endowed with grace.”

-- And yet one only needs grace if....

 

[aspen]

Everyone and everything needs grace in order to exist - even people who have never sinned personally.

 

[ChurchAuthority]

-- And yet one only needs grace if....

EVERYBODY needs grace, including Mary - and she GOT it.

 

[Episkopos]

It's erroneous because of all of the backflips you have top perform to arrive at your point.

Here are the FACTS:
The angel called Mary, "Kecharitomene". That's a fact and there is nop getting around it.
As I and others have repeatedly pointed out - this title is the perfect passive participle of charitoo, indicates a completed action with permanent result. It translates as “completely, perfectly, enduringly endowed with grace.”

Anything else you attempt to twist, jump over, invent or hide behind is simply erroneous. I realize that this is a hard pill to swallow for Protestants and Anti-Catholics - but you simply cannot argue with the original Greek text.

More Protestants and anti-Catholics??? They're everywhere!

Could the problem be a rabid catholic running loose in the sheep fold?

 

[justaname]

WOW.
Look at all of the Scriptural and linguistic acrobatics you need to oerform to arrive at your erroneous point.

The funny thing is I actually agree more with the RC point of view and you call it erroneous.

 

[ChurchAuthority]

More Protestants and anti-Catholics??? They're everywhere!

Could the problem be a rabid catholic running loose in the sheep fold?

One of the ways you can know that you belong to Christ's Church is by the fact that everybody hates you.
He TOLD us we'd be hated because you hated Him first.

 

[justaname]

One of the ways you can know that you belong to Christ's Church is by the fact that everybody hates you.
He TOLD us we'd be hated because you hated Him first.

You can also be hated because you have a poor attitude.

 

[Episkopos]

One of the ways you can know that you belong to Christ's Church is by the fact that everybody hates you.
He TOLD us we'd be hated because you hated Him first.

The Catholic church is Goliath. The church of Christ is like David! It is very small and unpowerful in this world. It doesn't even have it's own bank!

God is not with the masses. Satan controls the masses...in every sense. The spiritually unaware don't realize how religious Satan is. Satan loves the smell of incense, statuary, pomposity and those pointy hats!!!

Jesus loves simplicity, humility, and quiet grace!

 

[ChurchAuthority]

You can also be hated because you have a poor attitude.

I COULD be but not in this case. Although the truth sets us free - it hurts sometimes.
People lash out because they don't like to be proven wrong.

 

[Alanforchrist]

Catholics are "world famouse for twisting the Scriptures and the Greek"??
Spoken like a true anti-Catholic who lives in denial.

PS - PROVE to me that kecharitomene is not in the original Greek text of Luke 1:28.

If you check out the proper Greek, And not what the catholics say by their twisted greek, You'll find out that the word is,
"Charitoo"..Not kecharitomene.

But whatever the word is, The meaning is Mary had to find favour with God before He could use her,.
Mary was a sinner, She admited that God was her saviour, And only sinners need a saviour.
One of the Greek meaning for, "Low estate", Is "vile".
If Mary was sinless, Then God told us a lie, Because He said everyone has sinned.
Plus, Where does the Bible say Mary was sinless???..You won't find it anywhere in the Bible, Why do you think catholics have to twist the scriptures and the Greek??, Why do you thing catholics have to take scripture out of context??.
The simple answear is, Because they don't believe the Bible.

 

[Mungo]

If you check out the proper Greek, And not what the catholics say by their twisted greek, You'll find out that the word is,
"Charitoo"..Not kecharitomene.

But whatever the word is, The meaning is Mary had to find favour with God before He could use her,.
Mary was a sinner, She admited that God was her saviour, And only sinners need a saviour.
One of the Greek meaning for, "Low estate", Is "vile".
If Mary was sinless, Then God told us a lie, Because He said everyone has sinned.
Plus, Where does the Bible say Mary was sinless???..You won't find it anywhere in the Bible, Why do you think catholics have to twist the scriptures and the Greek??, Why do you thing catholics have to take scripture out of context??.
The simple answear is, Because they don't believe the Bible.

Quite frankly, someone who shows your level of intellectual dishonesty is not worth arguing with.

 

[ChurchAuthority]

If you check out the proper Greek, And not what the catholics say by their twisted greek, You'll find out that the word is,
"Charitoo"..Not kecharitomene.

But whatever the word is, The meaning is Mary had to find favour with God before He could use her,.
Mary was a sinner, She admited that God was her saviour, And only sinners need a saviour.
One of the Greek meaning for, "Low estate", Is "vile".
If Mary was sinless, Then God told us a lie, Because He said everyone has sinned.
Plus, Where does the Bible say Mary was sinless???..You won't find it anywhere in the Bible, Why do you think catholics have to twist the scriptures and the Greek??, Why do you thing catholics have to take scripture out of context??.
The simple answear is, Because they don't believe the Bible.

Apparently, you haven't been reading the posts - so I'll review.

First of all, Charitoo is not the word used in Luke 1:28. It is Kecharitomene, which is a variation of Charitoo - just like swam, swum, and swimming, are variations of the word, Swim.

Secondly, the Catholic Church has NEVER taught that Mary didn't need a Savior. This is an anti-Catholic lie. She indeed needed a Savior just like ALL human beings do. However, she was saved BEFORE she was born - at conception.
One ancient allegory states that whereas, we are all born in the mudhole of sin, we are pulled out of that mudhole by our Savior. Mary was simply kept from falling into that hole in the first place. She was SAVED.

Finally, as to your claim that ALL have sinned because Romans 3 says that ALL have sinned - Paul was using inclusive language, similar to saying, "All of the town came out for the parade." This type of language is used MANY times in Scripture. Here are but a few examples:

[SIZE=small] Romans 15:14[/SIZE]
“I myself am satisfied about you, my brethren, that you yourselves are full of goodness, filled with ALL knowledge, and able to instruct one another.” RSV
[SIZE=small]I thought only GOD has ALL knowledge.[/SIZE] Is Paul telling the Romans that EACH of them knows ALL – like God does?

[SIZE=small]1 Corinthians 15:22
“For as in Adam ALL die, so also in Christ shall ALL be made alive.” RSV [/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]And the Bible tells us that Enoch and Elijah did not die, Genesis 5:24 and 2 Kings 2:11.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]Hebrews 11:5 “By faith Enoch was taken up so that he should not see death; and he was not found, because God had taken him.” [/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]Do ALL choose to follow God?? [/SIZE]

[SIZE=small]Romans 1:29
“Being filled with ALL unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers”[/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]Does every wicked person do ALL things that are wrong? Are they ALL fornicators and murderers and gossips?[/SIZE]

[SIZE=small]Matthew 3:5-6
“Then went out to him [John the Baptist] Jerusalem and ALL Judea and ALL the region about the Jordan, and they were baptized by him in the river Jordan, confessing their sins.”[/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]And yet did “ALL” Jerusalem go out to him? How about the Pharisees? Did THEY go?[/SIZE]
[SIZE=small] [/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]Luke 2:1
“And it came to pass in those days, that there went out a decree from Caesar Augustus, that ALL the world should be taxed.”[/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]Tell me something - did Caesar tax the people from China and India and South Africa? How could he when he did not even control the whole world?[/SIZE]

[SIZE=small]Matthew 2:3
“When Herod the king heard this, he was troubled, and ALL Jerusalem with him”[/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]Was every single person in Jerusalem troubled along with Herod??[/SIZE]

[SIZE=small]Matthew 26:56
“ … Then ALL the disciples left him [Jesus] and fled.”[/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]Ummm, “ALL” the disciples weren’t even there.[/SIZE]

The lesson here:
Don't assume that ALL means every single person.

 

[Alanforchrist]

Quite frankly, someone who shows your level of intellectual dishonesty is not worth arguing with.

There is nothing dishonest about the truth that I give.

Apparently, you haven't been reading the posts - so I'll review.

First of all, Charitoo is not the word used in Luke 1:28. It is Kecharitomene, which is a variation of Charitoo - just like swam, swum, and swimming, are variations of the word, Swim.

Secondly, the Catholic Church has NEVER taught that Mary didn't need a Savior. This is an anti-Catholic lie. She indeed needed a Savior just like ALL human beings do. However, she was saved BEFORE she was born - at conception.
One ancient allegory states that whereas, we are all born in the mudhole of sin, we are pulled out of that mudhole by our Savior. Mary was simply kept from falling into that hole in the first place. She was SAVED.

Finally, as to your claim that ALL have sinned because Romans 3 says that ALL have sinned - Paul was using inclusive language, similar to saying, "All of the town came out for the parade." This type of language is used MANY times in Scripture. Here are but a few examples:

[SIZE=small] Romans 15:14[/SIZE]
“I myself am satisfied about you, my brethren, that you yourselves are full of goodness, filled with ALL knowledge, and able to instruct one another.” RSV
[SIZE=small]I thought only GOD has ALL knowledge.[/SIZE] Is Paul telling the Romans that EACH of them knows ALL – like God does?

[SIZE=small]1 Corinthians 15:22
“For as in Adam ALL die, so also in Christ shall ALL be made alive.” RSV [/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]And the Bible tells us that Enoch and Elijah did not die, Genesis 5:24 and 2 Kings 2:11.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]Hebrews 11:5 “By faith Enoch was taken up so that he should not see death; and he was not found, because God had taken him.” [/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]Do ALL choose to follow God?? [/SIZE]

[SIZE=small]Romans 1:29
“Being filled with ALL unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers”[/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]Does every wicked person do ALL things that are wrong? Are they ALL fornicators and murderers and gossips?[/SIZE]

[SIZE=small]Matthew 3:5-6
“Then went out to him [John the Baptist] Jerusalem and ALL Judea and ALL the region about the Jordan, and they were baptized by him in the river Jordan, confessing their sins.”[/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]And yet did “ALL” Jerusalem go out to him? How about the Pharisees? Did THEY go?[/SIZE]
[SIZE=small] [/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]Luke 2:1
“And it came to pass in those days, that there went out a decree from Caesar Augustus, that ALL the world should be taxed.”[/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]Tell me something - did Caesar tax the people from China and India and South Africa? How could he when he did not even control the whole world?[/SIZE]

[SIZE=small]Matthew 2:3
“When Herod the king heard this, he was troubled, and ALL Jerusalem with him”[/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]Was every single person in Jerusalem troubled along with Herod??[/SIZE]

[SIZE=small]Matthew 26:56
“ … Then ALL the disciples left him [Jesus] and fled.”[/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]Ummm, “ALL” the disciples weren’t even there.[/SIZE]

The lesson here:
Don't assume that ALL means every single person.

I can tell you are a catholic, They tell lies, Just like you have.

 

[ChurchAuthority]

There is nothing dishonest about the truth that I give.
I can tell you are a catholic, They tell lies, Just like you have.

That's ALL you have?? You can't PROVE me wrong?
Funny how you anti-Catholics are full of inane one-liners but when it comes to evidence - you're all silent.

 

[Episkopos]

That's ALL you have?? You can't PROVE me wrong?
Funny how you anti-Catholics are full of inane one-liners but when it comes to evidence - you're all silent.

Mary never once attended a catholic church.

 

[ChurchAuthority]

Mary never once attended a catholic church.

That's probably because there WERE no churches in the First Century. The Church was being persecuted so they met in homes.
Mary definitely attended Catholic Mass.

 

[Episkopos]

That's probably because there WERE no churches in the First Century. The Church was being persecuted so they met in homes.
Mary definitely attended Catholic Mass.

That IS hilarious! And you don't see why!!! LOL



Are you being ignorant on purpose or do you not know that the church was born at pentecost in the first century (circa 33 AD)

You mean steeple houses (what you call pillars of truth) Are they pillars of truth because they have a cross on top (although some have roosters)

What a laugh! Don't you have anything constructive to do?

 

[ChurchAuthority]

That IS hilarious! And you don't see why!!! LOL

Are you being ignorant on purpose or do you not know that the church was born at pentecost in the first century (circa 33 AD)
You mean steeple houses (what you call pillars of truth) Are they pillars of truth because they have a cross on top (although some have roosters)
What a laugh! Don't you have anything constructive to do?

Ummm, while yo're busy laughing - take a look at what I was responding to. \
YOUR statement:

"Mary never once attended a catholic church."


"Attended a Catholic church" connotes a building, a place, a venue. If you wanted to say that she didn't belong to the Catholic Church - then, you should have said, "She didn't belong to the Catholic Church."

Don't blame me for your poor grammar.
What?? No laughing??

 

[Episkopos]

Ummm, while yo're busy laughing - take a look at what I was responding to. \
YOUR statement:

"Mary never once attended a catholic church."


"Attended a Catholic church" connotes a building, a place, a venue. If you wanted to say that she didn't belong to the Catholic Church - then, you should have said, "She didn't belong to the Catholic Church."

Don't blame me for your poor grammar.
What?? No laughing??

Oh that changes everything....he he hee!

What do you have against Christians? Why are you here? Do you want to cause strife?