We really CAN'T answer some of these

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brakelite

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Cool, ty.

What do you make of "go and buy some oil from the vendors?"
Isa 55:1 Ho, every one that thirsteth, come ye to the waters, and he that hath no money; come ye, buy, and eat; yea, come, buy wine and milk without money and without price.
Re 3:18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.
Lu 11:13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?
 
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VictoryinJesus

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The oil on the other hand, which the wise virgins as lambs following the Lamb (Revelation 14:4-5) dedicated their life collecting, are works of mercy* that allow the lambs entrance into the marriage feast (Matthew 25:34-36).

Have a question about the foolish and wise virgins. A few thoughts. Here you said they dedicated their life collecting, oil/works of mercy ...

This oil (works of mercy) can only be obtained in this life by sharing/multiplying the talents given to us by God, which is why the rich man’s merciful concern for his brothers had no value (Luke 16:27-28) and neither the last minute attempt of the five foolish virgins after the second resurrection of all

“The oil (works of mercy) can only be obtained in this life by sharing/multiplying” ...yet the wise virgins did the opposite of mercy in when the foolish (who yes had none of their own oil/mercy) were found without...the wise virgins refused to give or “do.” no sharing of the oil/mercy, no multiplying. the wise mercy-filled virgins who had oil/mercy sent the others away instead to buy mercy from the venders(in the marketplace?). He said blessed are they who when He comes He finds them doing ...doing is not withholding oil/mercy when you have it to give. Yes, foolish were the virgins who were found without oil/mercy but the wise had opportunity otherwise there would have been no opportunity right before the door shut. If the wise virgins were truly following the Lamb would they not have given mercy where mercy is undeserved(as the Lamb of God)? “Collecting and giving mercy” to enter the marriage supper of the Lamb? 2 Corinthians 11:2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.


Oil and mercy are the same word in Greek.

Where is mercy in the parable?
 

Harvest 1874

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Ah, glad this came up, chronology is completely irrelevant in Scripture, which surely proceeds along a temporal axis. Not my idea, so google is prolly the better teacher there though. Ok bye

This has to be the most ludicrous statement I've ever heard you say, the importance of chronology cannot be understated in the study of scripture especially in regards to prophecy.
 

bbyrd009

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This has to be the most ludicrous statement I've ever heard you say, the importance of chronology cannot be understated in the study of scripture especially in regards to prophecy.
I get why you say that, always thought the same myself, still kind of reeling from the revelation too.
I would say note how all of your prophecies relate to yesterday or tomorrow, yes?
Um, getting rushed now, sorry, I'll come back and post some other clues later, can't think of them at the moment, but fwiw it was meant for us to first read a Literal History in order to hide wisdom from the wise imo. Iow so Tomorrow People can read Tomorrow instead of today
 

icxn

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.. If the wise virgins were truly following the Lamb would they not have given mercy where mercy is undeserved(as the Lamb of God)? “Collecting and giving mercy” to enter the marriage supper of the Lamb? 2 Corinthians 11:2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.
And they would have, in fact they did before they slumbered the sleep of death (Matthew 25:5). After death though - the timing of the dialog among the virgins - it's not possible to do so.
Where is mercy in the parable?
The word oil and the word mercy are etymologically related and even pronounced the same in Greek, έλαιον, έλεον.
 

VictoryinJesus

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And they would have, in fact they did before they slumbered the sleep of death (Matthew 25:5). After death though - the timing of the dialog among the virgins - it's not possible to do so.

The word oil and the word mercy are etymologically related and even pronounced the same in Greek, έλαιον, έλεον.

Ok. Thank you that clears up a lot! Never considered the ‘they slept’. Then the questions would be: Does the bridegroom come after ‘they slept’, after death. Does He come and knock after death and open? Why tell the foolish virgins to go buy when if they slept after death there is no going back to buy. The parable says the foolish went to buy and came back and the door was shut(going off memory though...could be wrong). I’m sorry. This parable has always raised questions.
 
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VictoryinJesus

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The word oil and the word mercy are etymologically related and even pronounced the same in Greek, έλαιον, έλεον.

Not disagreeing. Wasn’t aware the two: oil and mercy were related though, so thank you for sharing that. Psalm 23:5-6
[5] Thou preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies: thou anointest my head with oil; my cup runneth over. [6] Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life: and I will dwell in the house of the Lord for ever.
 
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marks

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Mark, that is two accounts in this post outlining God's intimate involvement, but even after writing the above, I still write that God has various means to achieve His ends. I have no desire to speculate. Interpretation belongs to the Holy Spirit. I thank God for His revelation. The Word of God be glorified!

Peace to you,
Kermos

At the end of the day it seems that for you this is a matter of soteriology, rather than theology.

"Man cannot choose God, because man is dead." And therefore, since man is unable to choose, God will choose for man. For some God chooses righteousness and eternal life, and for others God chooses unrighteousness and eternal death.

So then all good, and all evil, find their direct source in God. Even to the point that God commands - His decretive will - for men to commit sins, even the most grievous.

Is that an accurate restatement of your view?

We can look at the wording of these verses, your assertions, but lets just look at this one for the moment, I think it will show what we'll find throughout.

1) The Savior from the wrath to come knew that Judas would betray Savior and Lord Jesus before Judas betrayed Jesus.

Jesus knew Judas would betray Him. Was it before Judas new? God knew from eternity. When did the Holy Spirit reveal this to Jesus? I don't know. When was Judas firm in his decision? I don't know. Let's say you are right, and Jesus knew before Judas knew.

Knowing what someone is going to do, causing them to do it, and even wanting them to do it are all different things.

Jesus knew Judas would betray Him. But that doesn't mean that Jesus decided for Judas. And to assume that Jesus did would go against Who He is, our Righteous and Holy God, Who desires us to be righteous and holy like He is.

If Holiness it to command sin, and we are to be holy as He is holy, then we are to command sin?

How does a Holy God command sin? That is to me a contradiction of terms.

Much love!
Mark
 

bbyrd009

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This has to be the most ludicrous statement I've ever heard you say, the importance of chronology cannot be understated in the study of scripture especially in regards to prophecy.
So fwiw I prolly should not have tagged you there, and could have put that better, of course chronology is paramount as long as you are reading Literal History, carry on imo

what happened to the Pishon and the Gihon, do you think?
 

Harvest 1874

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So fwiw I prolly should not have tagged you there, and could have put that better, of course chronology is paramount as long as you are reading Literal History, carry on imo

what happened to the Pishon and the Gihon, do you think?

Actually it is believed that the Pishon represents the “Ganges”, Gihon the “Nile”, Hiddekel the “Tigris” and the last river of course the “Euphrates”.

However that said it seems evident that the four rivers mentioned in Gen 2: 11-14 are only mentioned by way of illustration for in no part of the earth do the rivers named, if by them are meant the rivers now existing under their names, meet either in their source or their progress.

Likewise one would wonder, if these had been actual rivers would they have survived the flood?

The conclusion, therefore, to be drawn is, that these rivers were not meant to be taken as the literal rivers that exist today, but by way of illustrating the properties of the literal rivers a comparison can be made. These rivers were chosen to express the same qualities as the four, which went out from the garden in Eden.

What then is the significance of the “river that went out of Eden to water the garden; and from there it was parted, and became into four heads?

What could each of the four rivers represent?

“There is a spiritual significance to this description, the lesson being that all humanity originally stemmed from a single stock or oneriver” namely, Father Adam. Just as the stream, upon its exit from the garden, subsequently parted into four heads, (or “beginnings”, Rotherham’s version) so the human race or seed of man, subsequent to Adam’s fall and banishment from Eden, terminates into four separate salvations (“beginnings”) or destinies between Paradise Lost and Paradise Restored.”

1) The name of the first is “Pishon” (the gusher) it may also carry the meaning “flowing stream” The Pishon is now known by some to be called the “Ganges” which word signifies or express its quality of continual increase in its course, from the great number of tributary streams which flow into it. (“…Of the increase of His government and peace there will be no end…” Isa 9:7), “And the nations shall walk in its light, and the kings of the earth bring their glory and honor into it.” Rev 21: 24).

It is believed to represent the Very Elect class, the “Little Flock”, the reasons we believe this to be so are given in its description it is said to surround all the land of Havilah which means “the circle or crown” it speaks of the good (perfect) gold of the land, gold is associated with divinity. There is also Bdellium (the heavenly food or manna) thus is given the reminder of the hope of immortality, the future reward to the faithful.

It is also stated that the “onyx stone is found there”. The black onyx indicates the humble origin of the exalted Christ Company. The Christ in glory will ever be mindful of the pit whence they were dug and the rock whence they were hewn. (See Isa. 51:1; Rev.1: 4).

2) The name of the second river is “Gihon” (the bubbler) now known to some as the “Nile” it is said to surround all the land of Cush (Ethiopia) the land of servitude. “…They are before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His temple.” (Rev.7: 15) Thus is pictured the Great Company Class.

3) The name of the third river is “Hiddekel” (the encircler), (possibly representing the ones whom the Lord has sent to walk to and fro throughout the earth Zec 1:10) known to some as the “Tigris” that which goes toward the east or in front of Assyria (Assyria??? possibly Babylon, see Mich 5: 5, 6) The Ancient Worthies.

The Ancient Worthies or "Princes in all the earth" (Psa.45: 16) shall come to the forefront (east) of Assyria or Mystic Babylon which is situated on the banks of the Euphrates andThey shall waste with the sword the land of Assyriaalso see Zec 1:8-11

4) The name of the forth river is the “Euphrates” (waters, the fertile river) known as the good and abounding river, “Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth…” Gen 1:28, thus representing the World of Mankind when Perfected.”
 
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Enoch111

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Actually it is believed that the Pishon represents the “Ganges”, Gihon the “Nile”, Hiddekel the “Tigris” and the last river of course the “Euphrates”.
The Nile and the Ganges could not possibly be found in Iraq, no matter how hard you tried.

The Garden of Eden was located somewhere in modern Iraq, and we know that the Tigris and Euphrates continue to flow over there.

upload_2019-4-17_12-38-45.png
 
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Harvest 1874

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The Nile and the Ganges could not possibly be found in Iraq, no matter how hard you tried.

The Garden of Eden was located somewhere in modern Iraq, and we know that the Tigris and Euphrates continue to flow over there.

View attachment 5920

No one said they were, if you had taken the time to actually read our post you would have noted we said that these rivers were not meant to be taken as the literal rivers that exist today, but by way of illustrating the properties of the literal rivers a comparison is made.
 

bbyrd009

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No one said they were, if you had taken the time to actually read our post you would have noted we said that these rivers were not meant to be taken as the literal rivers that exist today, but by way of illustrating the properties of the literal rivers a comparison is made.
It amounts to a bad guess wadr
 

bbyrd009

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It's up to me how I physically leave this world...I'm thinking you meant Spiritually? :)
As the "world" in this sense meaning the "unsaved" (as some of us see as? without the only WAY?)
...stop smoking cigarettes, stop using drugs, stop having fornication's, stop gluttony, gossip, lying, drunkenness...so on and so forth. So yes, many ways to "leave the habits of the world" ♥
Imo I would keep doing all or any of those for now, and do what Jesus said literally. And then those will disappear anyway I guess.

fwiw I see a big parallel in people's health complaints, I get them after doctors and other therapies have failed, usually, usually pre-diabetic, etc, long lists of symptoms and complaints, lots of numbers about themselves that they have become intimate with, a1c whatever that is, cholesterol numbers that are completely meaningless except to them or some phd--and I mean they are into it, you can tell--but when I ask them what their chief source of plant based omega 3 is I usually get a blank stare. Within the last five years I have just started to get some on fish oil, which btw is crap
 
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bbyrd009

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Isa 55:1 Ho, every one that thirsteth, come ye to the waters, and he that hath no money; come ye, buy, and eat; yea, come, buy wine and milk without money and without price.
Re 3:18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.
Lu 11:13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?
ya, I'm leaning more this direction too :)