What if you lose your faith?

[amigo de christo]

Where is obedience in your recipe?

Obedience demonstrates our faith and trust in God.

Without obedience, there can be no works or outward proof of faith.

You are still pushing hard for a recipe for salvation that involves nothing on the part of the Christian.

Once again, that's just not Biblical.

For the LOVE OF GOD is shed upon the heart of a lamb . SO how do we know one is a lamb
and does love GOD and has that true love upon its heart . HE WHO LOVES ME KEEPS MY TEACHINGS .
IF folks try and find a way around things that JESUS taught and use love as an excuse to do so , THEY NEITHER KNOW GOD
CHRIST , NOR THE LOVE that comes FROM GOD . PEROID . I hope this scares this generation into total repentance
from what many churches have taught and they make a fast exodus from the doctrines of men gone wrong
and an fast entrodus into that BIBLE so as they can truly learn .

 

[amigo de christo]

Yoo hoo church . IF YE LOVE GOD YE WOULD LOVE CHRIST , IF YE LOVE CHRIST YE WOULD OBEY CHRIST . PEROID .

 

[GodsGrace]

My Point would Be That If it * IS* Mandatory to “ be in the Fold” ( or if anything “ Else” is Mandatory) , it is up to God to see that it comes to pass——* HE* was the One that made the Promise To SAVE anybody that ASKED ! I DID just THAT—— I * ASKED* ! Now the Onus is upon Him to fulfill His Promise ! Call me a Fool, but I actually Trust God to Keep His Word—- in SPITE of anything I might do as I “Stumble” along my Walk Of Faith....

Because of the Amazing Grace Of God, this will not be a problem....Because I Simply REST in The Gospel Of Grace God has not only “ Forgiven” my Sins, He has actually “ FORGOTTEN” them.....” Amazing Grace”, indeed.....

Actually BB, it IS necessary to be in the fold.
Jesus said His sheep hear His voice...if someone is not hearing His voice, it means they are not one of His sheep.

As to saving anybody that asks,,,I do understand what you mean.
And I agree. God does save anyone that wishes to be saved.
WISHES TO BE SAVED.
If a person walks away from the fold, do they still want to be saved?

When Jesus told the Apostles in Matthew 28:19...to go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you.

Jesus spent over 3 years with His Apostles teaching them how to be saved and teaching them to obey.

To obey what?
Why did it take over 3 years?
(if all one has to do is believe in Him)

 

[GodsGrace]

People who are "working to earn salvation" do not have God's "GIFT of Salvation".
So,, they are going to hell.
God does not accept anyone's works to accept them.
Read the account of CAIN, in GENESIS, as he tried that TRICK....>He didnt bring the BLOOD, and brought his WORKS to God and God told Cain to GET OUT !!!!!
= "depart from me, i never KNEW YOU">

See that?
Same thing the Legalist is trying today.

Actually Behold, no one knows exactly why God rejected Cain's gift.
Abel didn't bring God any blood...he brought Him one of his best sheep.
Maybe Cain didn't bring his best?

Also, both you and @BloodBought 1953 should stop speaking about hell all the time.
Seems like it's always on your mind. Pretty odd for persons that believe totally in the total grace of God and nothing
else necessary to be saved.

You don't know who's going there and who isn't.
But you sure are not helping those of us that are doing our best to obey the commandments of Jesus and find that
it's not so difficult - just as He promised that they wouldn't be burdensome - this is very bad for some lazy Christians out there
that actually might believe what you're teaching...

I do hope there aren't too many of them and that they instead learn what Jesus expects of His disciple.

 

[GodsGrace]

Salvation is NOT a Race to be Run—— It is a “GIFT” to be Received.....The “ Race” is for Heavenly Rewards..

Could you please post some verses in this regard?

Paul clearly believed that salvation is like a race that needs to be run.
1 Corinthians 9:24-27
24Do you not know that those who run in a race all run, but only one receives the prize? Run in such a way that you may win.
25Everyone who competes in the games exercises self-control in all things. They then do it to receive a perishable wreath, but we an imperishable.
26Therefore I run in such a way, as not without aim; I box in such a way, as not beating the air;
27but I discipline my body and make it my slave, so that, after I have preached to others, I myself will not be disqualified.

 

[GodsGrace]

Who does?
Paul.
So, eject the Early Church Fathers, get out of the "cult of Mary", and get a Bible that has Paul in it.

As why not go to the SOURCE????,........Hes in the NEW TESTAMENT.
He wrote nearly all of it that is not the Gospels or the Revelation.
So, that you talk about the "Catholic Writers"< as if Paul is not in the NT, is really just hard to understand., tho, i know that the Cult Of Mary is not in favor of a member doing much with a bible, unless its their demonic bible.
It was not until '1961 that they authorize their deceived to read a bible.
Till then, you were to go and find a Priest or similar if you had a "question".
Perhaps, all of that is why you have such an issue regarding your understanding of Salvation.

I don't know what you're talking about Behold.
I hear hatred in your voice, and that is not part of being a disciple of Jesus.
He said that we are to love one another.
John 13:35

You should also go to the source and learn all the commandments Jesus left you with.
Jesus said not the smallest letter or stroke shall pass away from the Law.
Matthew 5:17

In fact Jesus said our righteousness would have to SURPASS that of the scribes and Pharisees or we will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven.
Matthew 5:20

Do you have an explanation for the above two verses?

 

[GRACE ambassador]

Do any of you think he still might be saved through that early work of the Holy Spirit?

Do any of us know "What Only God Knows" about someone else?

GRACE And Peace...
https://www.christianityboard.com/threads/gods-very-simple-will-under-his-pure-grace.39214/

 

[GodsGrace]

Working to earn your Salvation and Faith in God are two polar opposites.....You are as Blind as it gets...you will be in my prayers ....you are Lost and don’t know it....

Faith in God requires good works.

James 2:14-17
14What use is it, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but he has no works? Can that faith save him?
15If a brother or sister is without clothing and in need of daily food,
16and one of you says to them, “Go in peace, be warmed and be filled,” and yet you do not give them what is necessary for their body, what use is that?
17Even so faith, if it has no works, is dead, being by itself.


Matthew 7:21
21“Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter.


Ephesians 2:10
10For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.


2 Timothy 3:16-17
16All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;
17so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work.


There are plenty more BB, how many verses do you need to know that God expects good works from you.

 

[GodsGrace]

Prolific author, Michael Schermer, is perhaps the most notorious and popular atheistic defender of skepticism in America. So I was shocked to hear his testimony on Coast-to-Coast this past week. As a young man, he was converted and became a devout evangelical who offended friends and family members by witnessing to Christ's transforming grace and power. He strongly believed in witnessing door-to-door. He wanted to get a doctorate in Scripture so he could become an even more articulate defender of the evangelical faith. But that meant he had to learn Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic and he found language study too difficult and tedious. So he got his degree in psychology instead and became a devotee of the scientific method. This conversion convinced him of the groundlessness of the evangelical biblical faith and he has become one of the foremost champions of skepticism ever since. He is the victim of his intellectual honesty and, I think, of his flawed thinking about spirituality. But it certainly sounds like the Holy Spirit once did a transforming work on his heart. Do any of you think he still might be saved through that early work of the Holy Spirit?

He has abandoned God and rejected Him.
Anyone that rejects God cannot be saved.
If we do not want to be with God...we certainly will not be spending eternity with Him.

 

[GodsGrace]

That verse is symbolic, so let me show you a truth about it..

The "SAP" you are talking about that comes from JESUS......is the Holy Spirit.
So, these Branches, have no SAP....they have never Truly BELIEVED, they are not born again = have no SAP in them......no Holy Spirit.
=if you dont have the Holy Spirit in you, you don't belong to God.
Thats why these unsaved branches are burned.

John 3:36

You're right this time Behold.

You said:
"if you don't have the Holy Spirit in you, you don't belong to God."

Now that I can agree with.


Does a person LIVING IN SIN have the Holy Spirit in them?
1 John 1:6
6If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth;


Can a person be a slave to God AND a slave to satan?
Romans 6:15-16
15What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be!
16Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?


Anyone that denies the Holy Spirit cannot be saved.
At whatever point that denial takes place.
Before or after salvation.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Lot did not live in sin. If he did he would not be a hero of faith but a lost sinner just like the rest of the world.

Well, nobody sins every hour of every day , but Lot lived a life of disobedience , and while we are at it, check out the sin- filled life of Sampson....he was rotten also—- but he was another man honored because of his FAITH....it appears to trump everything else if you want to be a hero in the Bible....a wise man would learn from theses examples....and for the hundredth time, NOBODY is advocating Sin—- Sampson paid one HELL of a price for his sins ( wanna get your Eyes gouged out!)
The way that many in these Forums carry on, one would think that there should be “ Heroes Of Repentance” or “ Heroes Of Law- Keeping” or “ Heroes Of Willful Sin Avoiders”...... I don’t see them....

The Bible says that “ The Righteous shall LIVE by Faith” , and we are to live “ From Faith to Faith”....This is the approach that I have always taken....when I concentrate on Law - Keeping I immediately realize what a Fool’s Errand that is ( as Believers we are Dead to the Law, anyway) because it takes me about 2 seconds that when I try to keep the Law I simply can’t do it, and the only thing that results is me seeing what a Sinner I am....

Trying to make yourself “ good enough “ by Law Keeping is an utter impossibility....On the other hand, trying to live a Life Of Faith and realizing that the Bible is just as much a Book Of PROMISES as it is “ Rules” presents us with a Christian Walk that can be difficult and sometimes requires a great deal of courage , but at least it is POSSIBLE!

I think that God is still looking for Heroes Of Faith....maybe it would be wise to spend more time looking for Promises Of God to Trust in and Obey ourselves a chance to be “ Heroes”......Maybe—- just “ Maybe” , If we do “ OUR” Part and Practice Faith instead of trying so hard to be “ good widdle boys and girls” ,Perhaps God will do “HIS” Part and Save us .....

Obedience is great and a wise Believer will be as obedient as he can be....but “ obedience” doesn't save....FAITH does ...The Flawed men that turned out to be “Heroes” all received Chastisement from God in their lives ( just like us! we need to try not to sin— WE pay the price !) But because they were men who TRUSTED God, they got their many terrible sins covered by Grace and are in Heaven today....

“ The man that Discovers LIFE will find it by * TRUSTING* God — I do “ that” and I let God and the Holy Spirit That He placed within me * BECAUSE OF THAT TRUST* do the rest....be Obedient but don’t act like your Salvation depends on it—- it doesn’t. It’s defendant on your Faith.....The “ Heroes Of Faith” illustrate that.....

 

[BloodBought 1953]

BB! Stay on point! Your sins and mine put Jesus on the cross, not just the unforgivable sin of your local legalist.

Gee, thanks for that , Captain Obvious ....

Btw....the only “ Unforgivable Sin” is an entire Lifetime Of Refusing to receive a Free Gift From God ...

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Just checking in. Have you found that verse that says continuing to believe in the blood of Christ is a work of the damnable works gospel yet?

Just checking in.....what happened to my fictional Believer that “ stumbled” into a “ Gentleman's Club “ and died suddenly of a heart attack as he was approaching the stage to tip a female dancer —- no chance to repent—-Saved or damned? I failed to find your response to that scenario that I set up....

 

[Michiah-Imla]

the only “ Unforgivable Sin” is an entire Lifetime Of Refusing to receive a Free Gift From God ..

That’s one.

Here’s the other one:

A lifetime of sin after receiving the Free Gift From God; refusing to stop sinning.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Let me fill in the blanks for you.

(Hang in there, I hit the post button by accident before I posted anything, lol.)

Born again people are not willful sinners. The supposedly born again person who has gone back to willfully sinning in his old life has either 1) gone back to unbelief, or 2) never really been born again to begin with. That's why you can substitute 'unbeliever' (not, 'saved unbeliever') in front of 'sin willfully' in Hebrews 10:26.

Borrow somebody’s “ Thinking Cap”—— you constantly prove that you didn’t “OWN” one....lol....
Try to conjure up some Self - Insight here —— 90 % Of The Sins that you commit * ARE* willful Sins....Do you ever “ knowingly “ exceed the speed limit.....you ever say something unkind to somebody and right before you said it you “ knew” that it was not the right thing to do, but you did it anyway? Or are you Super - Human?
Your constant and consistent Ignorance about Hebrews 10 is inexcusable these days....you are too “ stiff- necked” to listen to the dozens of teachers out there that can and do prove that TAKEN IN CONTEXT ( As in READING THE NINE CHAPTERS THAT PRECEDE CHAPTER TEN !!!!!) the “ Willful Sin is OBVIOUSLY referring to the Sin that the Jews were committing by Trusting in their Temple Worship and the Blood Of bulls and sheep to gain forgiveness if sins, instead of Trusting in the Blood Of Jesus...

Born Again Believers sin every hour of every day ( you ever “ worry” .....yeah, That’s a sin) and many of those sins are indeed Willful and you know it and you would admit it if you were not so afraid of a verse of Hebrews that you are too Stubborn it understand....a PROPERLY TAUGHT Ten year old could see it! You behave as if your “WILLFUL” Ignorance were a virtue....

 

[GRACE ambassador]

I myself will not be disqualified.

IF your "disqualified" is the same as God's Preserved Word of
"castaway" then please review this helpful study:

Castaways don't die

GRACE And Peace...

 

[GRACE ambassador]

lol, he thinks a person can confess Christ and then turn right around and continue to live in the pig pen of his life, purposefully and willfully with no thought of righteous living and he will still be saved when Jesus comes back. He does not understand that if that person had really believed in Christ he would have a growing life of righteous living to show for it. The fact that that person stayed right where he was in unrighteousness shows that he did not receive any gift of righteousness from God at all in any way shape or form.

lol? When Scripturally discussing God's Gracious Offer Of HIS ETERNAL
Life, so sinners need not to be ETERNALLY Condemned?

Christ's ALL-Sufficient Precious BLOOD is INsufficient?

God, Through Paul, are liars when Inspired Scriptures teach
UNfaithful believers "Will Be SAVED, yet so as By Fire," receiving
NO rewards, having built, "as CO-laborers With God," wood, hay
and stubble On The "Foundation Paul laid"? (1Co 5:5, 3:8-15)?
The ETERNALLY Faithful LORD JESUS CHRIST, The Saviour?:

Who Has "ALWAYS Known Those That Are His Own"
(2 Timothy_2:19; Ephesians_1:4) And, In Addition:

Who Has "NEVER Known" those that were NEVER His Own!
(Matthew_7:21-23)

Thus, NO SUCH THING as the False doctrine that "jesus ALWAYS
knew those who were once saved, BUT THEN he NEVER knew
them, WHEN they LOST it," Correct?

Just maybe you would ALSO "like SOLID PROOF" that your neighbor,
who is loving and kind to his neighbors, is ETERNALLY SAVED, when
he tells you he "is REALLY an athiest"? Really?

GRACE And Peace...

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Borrow somebody’s “ Thinking Cap”—— you constantly prove that you didn’t “OWN” one....lol....
Try to conjure up some Self - Insight here —— 90 % Of The Sins that you commit * ARE* willful Sins....Do you ever “ knowingly “ exceed the speed limit.....you ever say something unkind to somebody and right before you said it you “ knew” that it was not the right thing to do, but you did it anyway? Or are you Super - Human?
Your constant and consistent Ignorance about Hebrews 10 is inexcusable these days....you are too “ stiff- necked” to listen to the dozens of teachers out there that can and do prove that TAKEN IN CONTEXT ( As in READING THE NINE CHAPTERS THAT PRECEDE CHAPTER TEN !!!!!) the “ Willful Sin is OBVIOUSLY referring to the Sin that the Jews were committing by Trusting in their Temple Worship and the Blood Of bulls and sheep to gain forgiveness if sins, instead of Trusting in the Blood Of Jesus...

Born Again Believers sin every hour of every day ( you ever “ worry” .....yeah, That’s a sin) and many of those sins are indeed Willful and you know it and you would admit it if you were not so afraid of a verse of Hebrews that you are too Stubborn it understand....a PROPERLY TAUGHT Ten year old could see it! You behave as if your “WILLFUL” Ignorance were a virtue....

As usual, you do not understand what the willful sinning is in Hebrews 10:26. It’s purposely choosing to go back to sin in a rejection of Christ and the gospel. It does not mean the failures of the believing, born again saint.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Just checking in.....what happened to my fictional Believer that “ stumbled” into a “ Gentleman's Club “ and died suddenly of a heart attack as he was approaching the stage to tip a female dancer —- no chance to repent—-Saved or damned? I failed to find your response to that scenario that I set up....

BB, we’ve been over this before. The only sin that can condemn you is the sin committed while in unbelief. The believing person’s sin is instantly atoned for the second they commit it through the ministry and sacrifice of Jesus they believe in. Their failures don’t remove them from the grace of God in salvation. Their unbelief does.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

As usual, you do not understand what the willful sinning is in Hebrews 10:26. It’s purposely choosing to go back to sin in a rejection of Christ and the gospel. It does not mean the failures of the believing, born again saint.

You are saying exactly what I have been saying all along...”YOU” have been the one saying there is no Forgiveness for the Believer That Sins On purpose—- the “ willful” type of Sin....You claim that a True Believer NEVER Sins on purpose anyhow, and if he does, Their is no forgiveness for it— your Confused interpretation of “ No more Sacrifice For Sin”

I don’t recall you ever attaching the “ willful Sin” to the rejection of the Gospel and proving it by continuing to put their Faith in Animal Blood as opposed to the Blood Of Christ— which is the True Context Of the entire matter....

Maybe I give you too much credit...maybe I misunderstand....Do you STILL think that a Believer can never sin knowingly or on purpose ( willfully) and if he does he is lost or was never Saved to begin with...please clarify one more time....your latest response seems to indicate that you have Repented and now agree with yours truly....

Let me clarify “ my” stance, hopefully for the last time ....Everybody Sins “ willfully”, Believers and Unbelievers alike .....you can’t admit this fact because if you do, it’s tantamount on your mind to saying that you are damned because you are ignorant about the context and true meaning of Heb .10 —— Grace covers Any and ALL Sins Of the Believer—- Willful Sins included.....The willful sin in Hebrews 10 is referring to the exact SAME THING that was being discussed in the Nine chapters proceeding it....
The Bible is not some kind of “buffet” where you go over here and pluck out one item and then you go over here and just pluck out something else —- CONTEXT actually “ DOES” Matter! Text without context is Error and this is where you go off the rails because you are too “ stiff- necked” and Proud to even “ consider” listening to somebody that might understand the Bible better than you—-

For all those with the honesty and the intelligence to at least ATTEMPT to be like the Bereans and check out things for yourself and not letting yourself be “ spoon-fed” by Stiff-Necked , stubborn Religionist who are scared to death to admit they might be “ poor students of the word” ( this is what daddy’s church taught so it must be right! ) , please do yourself a favor and “ Google” Andrew Farley Or A.W. Tozer and Hebrews 10.... ( there are many others) Newbies especially—- don’t let yourselves be a victim to a false interpretation of one single verse that has caused needless fear in Believers that should know that they are “ Eternally Secure” and don’t make the mistake of basing your entire Biblical Doctrine around a Falsehood....
Hebrews 10, when properly explained , make so much sense a ten year old can understand it.....When Mr. Bueller comes out crying that it is a sin or a sign of weakness to try to learn from others—- please feel free to ignore him.....” Prove yourself to be a Good Student Of The Word” ..... a good student at least “ looks at” all sides —— THEN make up your own mind...