Who founded your church?

[Behold]

baptism is necessary for salvation to be in the new covenant in union with Christ.

You are teaching the devil's gospel.

Let me explain.

The "devil's gospel" is what every cult teaches, that tries to exchange the BLood of Jesus, with works or water.

See, the Devil does not want anyone to believe that the Blood of Jesus SHED, is the only reason God will take you and keep you.

The Devil wants to get rid of the Blood of Jesus, by using a Satanic Gospel that tries to SUBSTITUTE Water, Commandments, Self Effort......in PLACE of The Blood of Jesus, as ALL God offers and accepts to save a person, and keep them saved.

That is the CULT's Gospel., that is the Devil's Gospel.

Dont believe that one, as it can cause you to never be born again, thinking you are.....

 

[theefaith]

You are teaching the devil's gospel.

Let me explain.

The "devil's gospel" is what every cult teaches, that tries to exchange the BLood of Jesus, with works or water.

See, the Devil does not want anyone to believe that the Blood of Jesus SHED, is the only reason God will take you and keep you.

The Devil wants to get rid of the Blood of Jesus, by using a Satanic Gospel that tries to SUBSTITUTE Water, Commandments, Self Effort......in PLACE of The Blood of Jesus, as ALL God offers and accepts to save a person, and keep them saved.

That is the CULT's Gospel., that is the Devil's Gospel.

Dont believe that one, as it can cause you to never be born again, thinking you are.....

sorry but your replacing His blood with “faith alone”

does baptism wash away sins?

 

[BreadOfLife]

Oops... you didn't answer my question:

Not biblical. "Show me where it says babies enter the new covenant by being dunked or sprinkled."

I accept that Paul says here that when a person trusts in Christ for salvation, that person is baptized in the Holy Spirit into Christ's death. We die with Him.

Nothing about babies.

The Corinthians verse says raised through faith. Babies who can't understand the gospel can't express faith..

Galatians 3:
Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by believing what you heard? 3 Are you so foolish? After beginning by means of the Spirit, are you now trying to finish by means of the flesh?

Oh, dear, that's inconvenient for people that believe in baptismal regeneration.

"Understand, then, that those who have faith are children of Abraham."

Oh dear, that can't be applied to babies either...

26 So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith, 27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ.

Nope... nothing about babies being dunked causing salvation, but plenty about faith being the necessary ingredient.

Ummmmm, yes, I DID answer your qiestion with the verses I gave you.

NONE of those verses spoke about the necessity of having faithg PRIOR to being Baptized - just as an 8-day-old baby didn't have to exibit faith prior to being circumcised. THAT'S why I chose those verses. in fact, theo only one that DOES speak of faith is Col. 2:11-12 - where it says:
In him also you were circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of flesh in the circumcision of Christ; and you were buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the working of God, who raised him from the dead.

Children who are Baptized are raised in faith by their parents - JUST like circumcized babies were raised in faith by their parents.
Finally - YOU keep referring to works of the Law (Mosaic) which is totally irrelevant.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Let me try again.
You have the responsibility to not be involved with any cult that would teach that water "regenerates the soul" or is the "'means of regeneration".
Do you hear me?
You have the responsibility to recognize a verse that says we are "born again OF water" = as being a Cross rejecting lie of the Devil as found in a bible that is the same..
That is your responsibility to know.
And, its your responsibility to keep yur family safe from any such cult and any such "bible".
Do you hear me?

Thats your responsibility breadolife...., and you are not taking it seriously.
All you take seriously is trying to sound as if you have a clue while being rude.

So, listen to me.
You have the responsibility to protect yourself and your family from any CULT that teaches that Water is necessary for Salvation.

And YOU have a responsibility to read the Word of God and HEED what it says.

John 3:5 are the words of Christ Himself, who is God.
John 3:5 (KJV)
Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be BORN OF WATER AND OF THE SPIRIT, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

The fact that you reject the Word of God exposes your corruption.
The ONLY one rejecting the cross here - is YOU . . .

 

[Renniks]

Ummmmm, yes, I DID answer your qiestion with the verses I gave you.

NONE of those verses spoke about the necessity of having faithg PRIOR to being Baptized - just as an 8-day-old baby didn't have to exibit faith prior to being circumcised. THAT'S why I chose those verses. in fact, theo only one that DOES speak of faith is Col. 2:11-12 - where it says:
In him also you were circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of flesh in the circumcision of Christ; and you were buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the working of God, who raised him from the dead.

Children who are Baptized are raised in faith by their parents - JUST like circumcized babies were raised in faith by their parents.
Finally - YOU keep referring to works of the Law (Mosaic) which is totally irrelevant.

Understand, then, that those who have faith are children of Abraham."



26 So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith,

Yes I know you picked those verses without regard to all the verses around them that prove you wrong...children of God through faith. Not your parents faith, but that individuals faith.

 

[Truther]

not preaching
Apologetics is a lay mans duty Jude 1:3

There is no such thing as a layman in scripture.

All believers are of the royal priesthood.

 

[Truther]

It's almost like debating with a 3rd-grader.
But that would be an insult to the 3rd-grader . . .

LOL(good one).

But seriously....you are forcing babies to inherit a covenant.

No wonder they burst out crying when you spray them down in the titles.

Try to get at least quote Acts 2:38 when you make these kids miserable, okay?

 

[theefaith]

There is no such thing as a layman in scripture.

All believers are of the royal priesthood.

same difference

 

[FHII]

why does acts 2:39 explicitly say this promise is to your children???

My understanding is that baptism is necessary, but it is the baptism (immersion) into Christ. Water baptism is ok. It was done in the Bible and it would be wrong to chastise any Christian who does it. It is equally wrong to chastise a Christian who has not gone through the ritual of water baptism.

But let me comment on your question: verse 38 says "repent and be baptized.... in the name of Jesus Christ". So baptizing is only half of it. So on that note if you can get an infant to repent of their sins.... Well then you have something.

Next, verse 39 says, "for the promise is unto you and to your children and to those afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call." Its not to any of the children (infant or not): the promise is to the ones God called. The word "even" in this context means "in other words".

In short, the promise is to the called who have repented and been baptized. Again, I believe we must be baptized into Christ, not water. But if you want to believe water, fine. But they must be called and repent as well.

Do I disapprove of infant water baptism? No. I can give some scripture that supports it indirectly. But I don't see it as necessary nor do I see it as a "saving" event, if anyone is really claiming that.

 

[Illuminator]

My understanding is that baptism is necessary, but it is the baptism (immersion) into Christ. Water baptism is ok. It was done in the Bible and it would be wrong to chastise any Christian who does it. It is equally wrong to chastise a Christian who has not gone through the ritual of water baptism.

But let me comment on your question: verse 38 says "repent and be baptized.... in the name of Jesus Christ". So baptizing is only half of it. So on that note if you can get an infant to repent of their sins.... Well then you have something.

Next, verse 39 says, "for the promise is unto you and to your children and to those afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call." Its not to any of the children (infant or not): the promise is to the ones God called. The word "even" in this context means "in other words".

In short, the promise is to the called who have repented and been baptized. Again, I believe we must be baptized into Christ, not water. But if you want to believe water, fine. But they must be called and repent as well.

Do I disapprove of infant water baptism? No. I can give some scripture that supports it indirectly. But I don't see it as necessary nor do I see it as a "saving" event, if anyone is really claiming that.

Luther largely agrees with the Catholic position on sacramental and regenerative infant baptism, which is anathema to the Baptist / Presbyterian / Reformed branch of Protestantism – the predominant evangelical outlook at present.
Baptismal Regeneration: Central Doctrine, According to Luther & Lutheranism | Dave Armstrong (patheos.com)

 

[Behold]

John 3:5 (KJV)
Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be BORN OF WATER , .

breadoflife..


So, let me quote the Catholic bible correctly, being that you decided not to do it.

"""
Douay-Rheims Bible
Jesus answered: Amen, amen I say to thee, unless a man be BORN AGAIN = of water...."""


So, we are not BORN AGAIN of Water., which is the LIE that the CC teaches and its the LIE found in the CC bible.

Here it is again...

"""
Douay-Rheims Bible
Jesus answered: Amen, amen I say to thee, unless a man be BORN AGAIN of WATER..


Listen..
you live inside a isolated religious mentality, that a false religious situation produces....for many years....and have not learned that the Catholic bible is a totally corrupted situation, that teaches that water causes the new birth.
So, when you dont understand that its the Holy Spirit that performs the new birth (born again) and not the city water supply, you will be found on Christian Forums teaching the Lie that "water saves", (born again OF water)... because you have been deceived.

It would be very difficult for you to find your way free of the cult mentality that teaches that Water is the means of regeneration, as there are a few of the "water cults" out there.......and they ruin all they can...
But here is the good news. With God, all things are possible, and its possible that you can find your way out of the deception.
But to do that, you have to want to know the truth.
You have to really want to know it.


Now about that 'KJV" "born of water"..

That is Jesus explaining to Nicodemus..... who is talking about going back inside His mother, as he didn't understand what Jesus was talking about when Jesus said you must be Born.....=Again...

So, Jesus was telling him......you are born once of your mother... and that water birth (born of water)... is the natural childbirth process where the water breaks and then the baby comes out..
So, that is how you are born of water, and now to be BORN AGAIN, you need to be Birthed SPIRITUALLY, as Jesus is explaining.

 

[BobVance]

My understanding is that baptism is necessary, but it is the baptism (immersion) into Christ. Water baptism is ok. It was done in the Bible and it would be wrong to chastise any Christian who does it. It is equally wrong to chastise a Christian who has not gone through the ritual of water baptism.

But let me comment on your question: verse 38 says "repent and be baptized.... in the name of Jesus Christ". So baptizing is only half of it. So on that note if you can get an infant to repent of their sins.... Well then you have something.

Next, verse 39 says, "for the promise is unto you and to your children and to those afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call." Its not to any of the children (infant or not): the promise is to the ones God called. The word "even" in this context means "in other words".

In short, the promise is to the called who have repented and been baptized. Again, I believe we must be baptized into Christ, not water. But if you want to believe water, fine. But they must be called and repent as well.

Do I disapprove of infant water baptism? No. I can give some scripture that supports it indirectly. But I don't see it as necessary nor do I see it as a "saving" event, if anyone is really claiming that.

The criminal on the Cross who acknowledged Jesus as his Savior was not water baptized, but was/is with Jesus in Paradise.

 

[theefaith]

The criminal on the Cross who acknowledged Jesus as his Savior was not water baptized, but was/is with Jesus in Paradise.

the new covenant was not in effect until the death of Christ so the initiation required (baptism) was not in required

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ

 

[Truther]

The criminal on the Cross who acknowledged Jesus as his Savior was not water baptized, but was/is with Jesus in Paradise.

That was pre- Pentecost.

The rules changed.

We don't have to die on a cross to meet Jesus now.

Nor do we have to climb a tree to be saved(Zachaeus).

We must obey Acts 2:38 since Pentecost occurred.

 

[Behold]

That was pre- Pentecost.

The rules changed.

Here is how the rules Changed.

When Peter was preaching in Acts 2:38, he only knew of John The Baptist's message, "repent and be baptized".
Peter knew nothing else....so, he was preaching all that he KNEW....at that Time.
= John the Baptist's, water baptism, = House of ISREAL.
So, Peter is preaching this same John The Baptists, message, to JEWS, at a JEWISH Feast (Pentecost).

Later, in Chapter 10, (The Acts of the Apostles), God wakes Peter up, and starts to explain to him the Gospel that Paul gave to us.
This is because Peter didnt yet have the revelation that Paul gave us..
IN Acts 2:38, Peter didnt even know that Gentiles would be or could be saved.
He learned all this YEARS LATER.

So that is why Acts 2:38, is not the Gospel, as the Gospel came from PAUL, much later then Acts 2.

See Peter can't preach in Acts 2, what he didn't know yet. = Acts 2:38 is not the Gospel.

 

[Truther]

Here is how the rules Changed.

When Peter was preaching in Acts 2:38, he only knew of John The Baptist's message, "repent and be baptized".
Peter knew nothing else....so, he was preaching all that he KNEW....at that Time.
= John the Baptist's, water baptism, = House of ISREAL.
So, Peter is preaching this same John The Baptists, message, to JEWS, at a JEWISH Feast (Pentecost).

Later, in Chapter 10, (The Acts of the Apostles), God wakes Peter up, and starts to explain to him the Gospel that Paul gave to us.
This is because Peter didnt yet have the revelation that Paul gave us..
IN Acts 2:38, Peter didnt even know that Gentiles would be or could be saved.
He learned all this YEARS LATER.

So that is why Acts 2:38, is not the Gospel, as the Gospel came from PAUL, much later then Acts 2.

See Peter can't preach in Acts 2, what he didn't know yet. = Acts 2:38 is not the Gospel.

How clever!

You extracted "be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins" from Acts 2:38.

Are you a magician?

 

[Behold]

How clever!

You extracted "be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins" from Acts 2:38.

Are you a magician?

No im just a good teacher.
Are you a good learner?

Look..

38 Peter replied, “Repent and be WATER baptized,

See that? ????
That is not the Gospel of the Grace of God that I preach, or that Paul preached, or that anyone who is called to preach, will preach.

"believe on the Lord Jesus, and you shall be saved".
"as many as received Jesus (by faith) God gave to them the Power to become the Sons of God".
"justification by FAITH"

Do you see those verses?
Do you see any water in them?
Be sure you look again.

 

[Truther]

No im just a good teacher.
Are you a good learner?

Look..

38 Peter replied, “Repent and be WATER baptized,

See that? ????
That is not the Gospel of the Grace of God that I preach, or that Paul preached, or that anyone who is called to preach, will preach.

"believe on the Lord Jesus, and you shall be saved".
"as many as received Jesus (by faith) God gave to them the Power to become the Sons of God".
"justification by FAITH"

Do you see those verses?
Do you see any water in them?
Be sure you look again.

You did it again, good teacher!

You extracted "in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins".

Only magicians can make that disappear mentally.

You have skills!

 

[theefaith]

You did it again, good teacher!

You extracted "in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins".

Only magicians can make that disappear mentally.

You have skills!

faith? Yes
Faith alone? No
Mark 16:16 he who believes and is baptized shall be saved
Acts 8:36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?

37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.

38 And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Rom 13:11 Salvation nearer than when fist believed, how can salvation possibly be by faith alone???

 

[theefaith]

The promise (sacred oath or sacrament) of the father acts 2:38-39 with reference to ez 36:25-27

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Ez 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

Hebrews 8:6
But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises. Based on Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

A promise is a sacred oath or sacrament!
Baptismal regeneration is the promise of the Father for union in the new covenant!

The church and the seven sacraments are necessary for salvation

Better covenant on better promises

An oath to sacramental life