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Whose government do you defend or speak good about?

Discussion in 'Current Events & Politics Forum' started by Buzzfruit, Oct 18, 2011.

  1. Buzzfruit

    Buzzfruit New Member

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    You have got to be kidding me. Ezekiel 37 is not even a parable, it is a vision of Israel.....it says it plainly......you don't need to interpret it. The reason why anyone would interpret it the way you are is because you believe that if one dies without repenting they are lost and doom. Why would a Godly government say our hope is lost? Do you say that? Do you believe your hope is lost? How many do you know that says that? Why would it say, I will put my Spirit within you? Are you trying to say the Godly government never had His Spirit before? And how does David fit into it because it says David will be their king? The Bible says Jesus is the King of kings of God's government, so how could David by its king?
     
  2. Buzzfruit

    Buzzfruit New Member

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    Well, the Jews by natural birth are just that….Jews of natural birth. But spiritual Jews are those who are born of the Spirit whether they are Jews of natural birth or gentiles.
     
  3. Perspectives

    Perspectives New Member

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    Wow! I don't know what you read, but it wasn't my post. You missed the entire point, which had nothing to do with anything you just said. Don't need to interpret???? David was never brought up???? Godly gov't never had His Spirit before???? It's a simple example of what Paul wrote, first the natural then the spiritual. It points to the future result....the one perfect man of Ephesians 4:13. The body of Christ will not stand without proper gov't. which holds the frame together.
     
  4. Buzzfruit

    Buzzfruit New Member

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    It is in Ezekiel 37


    There will never be a government of this world that will be Godly......the government or system of this world will be destroyed when Jesus returns. You need to study the book of Daniel in particualry the part where Daniel by God's inspiration interpret Nebuchadnezzar’s dream. But it will be the government of God that will take ruler ship over the Nations of this world. It will be the saints that will rule over the world and the saints are already in God's government now.....God's people are now kings.

    Paul was not talking about Godly government. What you are claiming Ezekiel 37 means does not make sense because it is false.....it is your or someone's personal or private interpretation. The fact is, it is a prophecy of the resurrection of those of the house of Israel that are dead......it is dealing with the second resurrection which Jesus also mentioned (Jesus told the Pharisees that Sodom and Nineveh for example would rise up with them - Matthew 12:41-42, Matthew 11:24) and is also mentioned in other parts of the Bible.
     
  5. veteran

    veteran New Member

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    In reality it's not a prophecy about a second resurrection of the dead either.

    John 5:28-29 reveals that ALL are resurrected at Christ's coming, some to life and other to damnation.

    The second inferred resurrection of Rev.20 is actually about a resurrection like the 'first', unto everlasting Life through Christ Jesus.

    When Christ returns, and the "camp of the saints" is established where Jerusalem is today, only His saints of the first resurrection will be there. Everyone else will be... outside... the gates of the Holy City (Rev.22:14-15). That separation will continue throughout Christ's "thousand years" reign with His elect priests and kings.

    The Old Testament prophets reveal that thousand years will be a time for those who erred in spirit to come to understanding, and those who murmured to learn doctrine (Isa. 29). This is why Christ said He will cause those of the "synagogue of Satan" to come worship at the feet of His elect of the Church of Philadelphia (Rev.3).
     
  6. Buzzfruit

    Buzzfruit New Member

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    Still pretty much so far no one has actually say that they trumpet God's kingdom. The preaching of the good news of the kingdom of God is what Jesus told us to announce to the world, but very few Christians are doing that. Telling people about Jesus is not the gospel....it is not what Jesus preached.....it is not Calvary either The gospel or good news is what Jesus preached…..Jesus preached it in the form of parables. And it is this same gospel Jesus said would signal the end of man's Satan inspired system.


    Matthew 24:14 (BBE)
    [sup]14 [/sup]And this good news of the kingdom will be given through all the world for a witness to all nations; and then the end will come.





    So the longer we put off announcing God's government the longer it will take for the end to come.
     
  7. veteran

    veteran New Member

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    Well, I definitely agree we need to be preaching the coming Kingdom our Lord Jesus taught. But at the same time I cannot deny that He setup a temporary kingdom structure for His Church here on earth after His death on the cross. The fact that that temporary kingdom structure for His Church on earth has been under constant attack in the past century, with false ones gaining power over it, is all Bible prophecy that God already warned us about for the end. We're supposed to be recognizing that as a sign for just how close Christ's coming is, and the establishing of His Eternal Kingdom.

    So really, for today, we should be preaching both the coming of Christ's Kingdom upon this earth, along with a grave warning of the near future false one-world kingdom of the coming false messiah He also warned us of. For many brethren, understanding about the coming fake kingdom attempt by the false Christ is going to determine their status with Christ when He returns.
     
  8. Buzzfruit

    Buzzfruit New Member

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    The Church is an extension of God's kingdom......each Christian is a representative of God's kingdom. So the Church is not a temporary government because it is God's government on the Earth. It is what is going to take over all of Satan inspired governments of this world.
     
  9. veteran

    veteran New Member

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    No doubt that God's Kingdom is above and beyond this earth. Not debating that.

    But you'd make a mistake to think that He did not entrust a temporal literal structure on earth for His Church after Christ's death on the cross and The Gospel was first preached to and received by the western peoples.

    Even though it's quite apparent many here are not studied in that Christian history of The Church here on earth, it is a very important subject to have missed. And I'm not necessarily speaking of the Roman Church either, but the foundation of His Church on earth that sprang up first in Asia Minor and Europe, and then in other nations later.

    That video of that preacher in the Bahamas you posted is very correct that as Christians, we all seek the coming Kingdom of Heaven through Christ Jesus. Yet until the time for that to manifest with Christ's return, His Church was to have a literal structure upon this earth during this present world in the mean time. It was that literal structure through which The Gospel came to the Bahamas, and all other nations outside those first Christian nations established in Asia Minor and Europe.

    This is why Christ compared the Heavenly seven golden candlesticks in Rev.1:20 to the seven Churches in Asia Minor per Rev.2 & 3. In Rev.11 towards the end, during the sixth trumpet, two of those candlesticks which represent two Churches on earth, are to witness along with God's "two witnesses" that will be killed in Jerusalem just prior to Christ's coming.
     
  10. veteran

    veteran New Member

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    More about that temporary structure on earth involving God's people. Some can disagree with the following all they want, but it won't change Bible prophecy that it was to happen.

    In Genesis 49, Jacob gathered his twelve sons around and gave them a prophecy of what would befall them in the last days. That means the Gen.49 chapter is about the children of Jacob (Israel) for the end times, today.

    Gen 49:10
    10 The sceptre shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh come; and unto him shall the gathering of the people be.
    (KJV)

    That was said to Judah. The sons of Judah from Jacob (Israel) were to keep the royal sceptre on earth UNTIL Shiloh (Christ) comes, and then unto Him (Christ Jesus) would be the gathering of the people. Not only is Judah to keep that royal throne on earth, but also as lawgiver to God's people all the way up to the time of Christ's return.

    In many Scriptures about David's throne (like 2 Sam.7), we're shown that God promised David his earthly throne would be a perpetual throne on earth, lasting through all generations, and there would never fail a man of Israel to sit upon it (Ps.89:4).

    Just because the king of Babylon ended the existence of that throne of David in Jerusalem during Jeremiah's day, does that mean God failed to keep His Promise to David about that? That's what many wrongly think today, but they are wrong to think it. God simply moved... that throne of David to somewhere else on earth; He did not remove it from the earth. It is still established today on earth, just not in Jerusalem anymore.

    Per Apostle Paul's commission in The Gospel, he was to preach The Gospel to:

    1. the Gentiles
    2. to kings
    3. to the children of Israel

    Some of the royal family of the Bretons were captive in Rome at the same time when Apostle Paul was captive there and allowed to preach The Gospel to all that came at his house. In 2 Timothy 4:21, Paul addresses certain ones of that royal family. Pudens was a Roman magistrate assigned in Britain, and he married Claudia, a Christian member of the royal family of the Bretons. That was per Paul's calling to preach The Gospel also to kings. This was long prior to any existence of a pope or Roman Church structure, which is why the later Roman Church was forced to admit that Britain was first to acknowledge The Gospel of Jesus Christ as a nation.

    So that reveals a direct relationship to royal families of ancient Breton with Paul's commission to preach The Gospel to kings. His commission to preach The Gospel also to the children of Israel involved the scattered remnants of the ten tribes and of Judah that were also living in the areas where he preached, that of Asia Minor and western Europe.

    With the Irish, Scots, and Brits, they have a history related to The Bible with a curious stone called The Stone of Scone which their kings and queens were coronated upon in the manner of the ancient Israelite kings. Queen Elizabeth II was coronated upon it in 1953, the ceremony including an anointing with oil upon her head just like the ancient kings of Israel. That stone first appeared in ancient Ireland, and then the Scots took it to Scotland to the Abbey of Scone, and then the English conquered Scotland and took it to London and placed it in Edward's chair, where it has remained ever since 1996. No other nations on earth have such a history of that kind of stone, a stone pillar with iron rings in it for carrying on long journeys, a stone that is well worn as if it has been on many more long journeys than just within Ireland, Scotland, and England.

    In the ancient chronicles of the Irish (Four Masters), ancient Ireland was named 'Scotia' after one called Scota, 'daughter of Pharaoh' per the Irish Annals, and she is linked to marriage with a king at hill Tara in Ireland in connection with the royalty of the Milesians from ancient Spain. Scota is also where Scotland would later derive their country's name, as it was originally called Alba.


    A Portion Of Scotlands Declaration of Independence (1320 A.D.)

    "Most Holy Father and Lord, we know and from the chronicles and books of the ancients we find that among other famous nations our own, the Scots, has been graced with widespread renown.

    They journeyed from Greater Scythia by way of the Tyrrhenian Sea and the Pillars of Hercules, and dwelt for a long course of time in Spain among the most savage tribes, but nowhere could they be subdued by any race, however barbarous.
    Thence they came, twelve hundred years after the people of Israel crossed the Red Sea, to their home in the west where they still live today.

    The Britons they first drove out, the Picts they utterly destroyed, and, even though very often assailed by the Norwegians, the Danes and the English, they took possession of that home with many victories and untold efforts; and, as the historians of old time bear witness, they have held it free of all bondage ever since.

    In their kingdom there have reigned one hundred and thirteen kings of their own royal stock, the line unbroken a single foreigner.
    The high qualities and deserts of these people, were they not otherwise manifest, gain glory enough from this: that the King of kings and Lord of lords, our Lord Jesus Christ, after His Passion and Resurrection, called them, even though settled in the uttermost parts of the earth, almost the first to His most holy faith.

    Nor would He have them confirmed in that faith by merely anyone but by the first of His Apostles - by calling, though second or third in rank - the most gentle Saint Andrew, the Blessed Peter's brother, and desired him to keep them under his protection as their patron forever."

    This is the temporal structure for Christ's Church on earth that I mention. This is what the enemies of Christ have worked so long through the centuries to attack and destroy.
     
  11. Buzzfruit

    Buzzfruit New Member

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    I stand by what I said. There is no scripture in the Bible that supports what you have been saying. The Church and the individual IS an outpost of God's kingdom/government. And it will continue to expand until it finally takes over the government of this world.
     
  12. aspen

    aspen “"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few

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    What government did Jesus defend or speak good about?
     
  13. Buzzfruit

    Buzzfruit New Member

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    The kingdom of God.
     
  14. Episkopos

    Episkopos Well-Known Member

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    Exactly!

    ;)
     
  15. veteran

    veteran New Member

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    It's pretty obvious He was speaking (indirectly) to those nations in Asia Minor and western Europe which first believed on Him, and where He sent His disciples to preach The Gospel. Elementary. Next question.
     
  16. Prentis

    Prentis New Member

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    'Touché' as they say! ;)
     
  17. veteran

    veteran New Member

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    To hate what the western Christian nations have represented historically with The Gospel of Jesus Christ, is actually to hate Christ's Blessings upon those nations per history, and still today.

    It's the people that make up a nation, not corrupt haughty rulers placed in power over His people which God may at times ordain. Nor does a whole nation represent fringe minorities which corrupt rulers may listen more to.

    Some here who claim to believe on Christ Jesus need to do a 'check' of the political and philosophical doctrines they hold to, for Communism-Socialism are directly opposed to God's Word The Bible, and also against the founding principles of the western Christian nations which Christ established through His disciples for the western nations.

    This ultimately means a claimed believer who allies with the Communist Leftist's against the western Christian nations which Christ established per His Gospel, are aiding the coming of the Rev.13:1 world beast system and its fake god that is soon to appear.
     
  18. Buzzfruit

    Buzzfruit New Member

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    Anyone who claims to be a Christian and promotes any other government other than the kingdom of God is denying the gospel that Jesus preached. Because Jesus never preached about man's government.....Jesus' massage only about His Father's kingdom.
     
  19. rjp34652@yahoo.com

    [email protected] Choir Loft

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    This is a question that most Americans dare not ask.

    We have rejected public prayer and made it illegal. Instead we worship the flag. Have you been to a major sports contest lately? Public adoration of the flag escorted by a squad of armed soldiers and sometimes graced with a fly over of stealth jets is standard practice. Even more. I attended a baseball game a few weeks ago and during the 7th inning stretch the crowd was expected to stand and worship the flag AGAIN.

    Americans expect the blood of its enemies to save us, not the blood of Jesus.

    Amber waves of grain and purple mountain majesties have been replaced by computer directed precision bombing and robot aircraft.

    Righteousness before God has been replaced by American war crimes and theft of public monies by corporate executives on a historic scale.

    And all the while the gospel is ridiculed and scorned. Morality has been turned on its head, wickedness is good and righteousness is despised.

    All these things we know, yet we go to church and salute the flag anyway. Christians have abdicated the Kingdom of God for the dominion of man and we shall pay a terrible price for our lack of vision.
     
  20. Buzzfruit

    Buzzfruit New Member

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    In a sense it’s good that these things are happening because as it gets worse Christians who are not speaking to people about God's kingdom might begin to start thinking about doing it. The longer we preach something else, (even telling people about Jesus is not the gospel because that was not what Jesus preached)the worse God is going to cause this world to became. We either do it lovingly and gladly or God will put us in a position where we will have no other choice but to do it. But one way or the other that neglected message will be preached.



    And I am here begging and pleading to all Christians to start doing it. Stop believing and telling people if they want to go to Heaven when they die,(even telling people about Jesus and that He loves them is not the gospel that He preached) and start telling them about the good news of God’s kingdom and what the world will be like. Stop trying to scare people into repentance by telling them that if they don’t repent they are going to Hell, because that too is not the gospel. Let them know that God is inviting as many of those who believe and repent into His kingdom, that will make a positive impact on the world, starting today and even more so when it is fully set up on the Earth. You will be surprised at how many people who would say that they have never heard of that before….never heard that message before.


    But in order to tell others this gospel we need to study the Bible(the Old and the New Testament) that deals with the kingdom of God.
     
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