Why do some people not like the idea of OSAS?

[BlessedPeace]

What you're saying is true. but only of your spirit when you are born again (In Spirit) and that takes care of your sin, but yor sin is in your soul and not yet justified or perfected. You are the righteousness of God, in Christ...in spirit!

Born again of the Spirit. But the curse of sin upon the earth has done damage to your soul and it is so bad in these last days that it takes some doing over time to repair the damage!

I think if we became perfected in our soul all at once like some are implying, that we would lose our identity and personality of our soul. We wouldn't be "us" anymore.

So the Lord takes His time (with our copperation) with repairing our soul because He loves us as who we are. So He does it (sanctification) slowly and in steps on the inside of us so that we stay who we are, whom He loves. Inside out is the way it is done. What did He say about clean the inside of the cup? What does that mean?

So remember, we are as perfected in spirit alone but the dmage to our soul must be effected too. And our body we are to honor God with our flesh body and resist evil. One can't say, I am Justified and then turn around and willfully sin. That is wrong.

Why does the soul given us by ,of,God need repair?

 

[MA2444]

Precious friend, so what happens to those who die before their "soul gets all it's necessary repairs,"
eh?

That's a good question to ask, he said! Ok, I don't have all of the answers myself, but I am working that way. So I may be right or I may not be right. I'll give it a shot.

So you're saying, what happens to those saved people, who die who have Salvation and have not gotten all the necessary repairs to the soul that I spoke of before?

I think it's in Revelation somewhere. It talks about Heaven and the New Jerusalem (NJ) and the River of Life which leaves are for the healing of the nations...right? I think the trees of Life line both sides of the river of Life and the river starts at God's throne, and goes all the way to the outside of the walls of New Jerusalem, which is where the still damaged souls will live and slowly be healed through the Tree of Life and when they are totally healed, perhaps they will get to live inside the walls of NJ?

The already unblemished ones are taken in the Rapture and get their spiritual bodies and are the Bride of Christ so have cleaned themselves while on earth so were unblemished and Raptured and they get to live within the walls of NJ which is the Fathers house?

That is conjecture by me but it makes sense that the Tree of Life would not be needed by those damaged souls with it's leaves for the healing of the nations if they get magically changed in an instant and if that was so then the scriptures wouldn't talk about further healing in Heaven.

That makes sense to me, though conjecture.

 

[MA2444]

Why does the soul given us by ,of,God need repair?

It goes all the way back to the fall. Not only did man die spirtually, but the earth fell under the curse of sin. And every time that man sinned again he hardens his heart to God and that caused damage to their soul. Nowadays it is worse than ever because sin is accepted. Only a little white lie, it was adultery I guess but it wasnt something worse like being homosexual, and on and on it goes. People justify their sin to different degrees and when they do it plants a bad seed in your heart. A seed of drugs, a seed of Lust, a seed of bitterness or hate. And if it is unchecked it continues to grow in the heart to become trees of bitterness or whatever and this damages the soul.

 

[GRACE ambassador]

That's a good question to ask, he said! Ok, I don't have all of the answers myself...That makes sense to me, though conjecture.

Precious friend, thanks for your conjecture information. You do realize, of course, That,
"In God's Sight," The Bible Teaches This, Correct?:

"Moreover Whom He Did Predestinate, them He also called: and whom He called, ​

them He also justified: and whom He justified, them He also glorified." (Romans 8:30)​

​

So, Biblically, no "soul repair" necessary "In God's Sight", eh?

Please Be Very Richly Encouraged And Edified In The Lord
Jesus Christ, and Biblically, in His Word Of Truth, Rightly Divided!

Grace And Peace!

 

[BlessedPeace]

It goes all the way back to the fall. Not only did man die spirtually, but the earth fell under the curse of sin. And every time that man sinned again he hardens his heart to God and that caused damage to their soul. Nowadays it is worse than ever because sin is accepted. Only a little white lie, it was adultery I guess but it wasnt something worse like being homosexual, and on and on it goes. People justify their sin to different degrees and when they do it plants a bad seed in your heart. A seed of drugs, a seed of Lust, a seed of bitterness or hate. And if it is unchecked it continues to grow in the heart to become trees of bitterness or whatever and this damages the soul.

All God's design .

 

[Hillsage]

we don't resist Grace. We praise the Lord for it. My Bible reads that slightly differently than you quoted it. It doesn't say to resist the grace. Resist the Devil and he will flee from you.

Saying you could resist the ‘grace’ was an error, and a partially deleted sentence.

James 4:6-7
6 But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.

7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you..../KJV

So I agree with some of what you have said, but not all of it. We do have to humble ourselve and there are various ways to do that. One is fasting and another is coming into the presence of God. It's sure humbling to me at least.

Yes fasting is also called afflicting the soul in the OT. I also believe that if we don’t humble ourselves God can sovereignly do so after the counsel of His will.

 

[Wick Stick]

I know some people like to pass judgments on others that confess to be sinners. This thread is not about that. And I often wonder why people fight the OSAS idea. I also don't believe in OSAS, but I believe in a version that allows for God to save people if he desires.

John 10:28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand. 30 I and My Father are one.”

I think no one, the devil or man, can snatch God's people out of his hand. But they can reject God by free choice. Let's pray for the sinners that they are given power to overcome sin as well. As God only promotes righteousness in his word.

I'm reminded of the words of Jesus regarding people that would be jealous of God saving sinners:

Luke 18:9 Also He spoke this parable to some who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others: 10 “Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, ‘God, I thank You that I am not like other men—extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I possess.’ 13 And the tax collector, standing afar off, would not so much as raise his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me a sinner!’ 14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted.”

Once-Saved-Always-Saved is built on a flawed foundation. To believe it, you first have to believe that your salvation is complete. It isn't. God may have finished His work, but for us... we still have to walk out that salvation. It won't be past-tense the way people use the words until this life is over.

Basically, we're still a-saving.

 

[GRACE ambassador]

Once-Saved-Always-Saved is built on a flawed foundation.

Precious friend, please advise us then, "Which" Of These Multitude of Plain and Clear Scriptures,
is Exactly "a flawed foundation" For God's Eternal Salvation?:

God's OPERATION On All HIS New-born babes In CHRIST
+ Update
+
God's Eternal Assurance
+
God's Eternal Life Insurance

Amen.

 

[MA2444]

All God's design .

It's not like He wanted it to happen that way. So it's less design I think than He just knew what would happen and how to deal with it. So he can turn bad situations around to good for those who love God and will save everyone He can.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

OSAS is similar to once married always married.

This is emotional security outside relationships or content. It is hollywood "I am your soul mate" "I will love you forever"

I remember when I first met my wife, she was a nice woman, but not anything deeper. Over time I actually fell in love with
her and felt the feelings we would change the world, and this was the most important thing ever except for Jesus.

I have met folk who live in this role play life, where they see everything in a dream state, but miss the fact they do not know
their partner much or have much in common. Sadly when troubles come, often these relationships fall apart, because they
were founded on projections and not truly knowing and loving another with their strengths and weaknesses.

Love is a strange thing, because there is no darkness or hidden things about it. It wants the best for all involved, and is prepared
to let go if that is the best.

OSAS folk have often gone to a place where people have wrecked their lives, in full rebellion against everything yet they will
be with Jesus. The difficulty here is in heaven with the Lord love prospers and everything else dies. So for such folk this would
be a kind of hell, something they would rather destroy than live with.

Jesus describes such folk as grinding and gnashing their teeth awaiting judgement.
In a real way those who know love and Jesus, know salvation and the path of righteousness, not for self justification but for
life and everything our hearts when cleansed truly aspire to.

How often do successful folk end up alone in a room, alone and abandoned, sometimes dying without anyone knowing?
We are built to be loving integrated folk who care for others and who are cared for. Those who see this light do not need
a phrase OSAS to know Jesus walking with them.

God bless you

So OSAS is like 2 married people?

So with God as the husband.. does God fall out of love with his bride?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

What you're saying is true. but only of your spirit when you are born again (In Spirit) and that takes care of your sin, but yor sin is in your soul and not yet justified or perfected. You are the righteousness of God, in Christ...in spirit!

Then I was never saved, I was never redeemed, I was never adopted as his son.

Born again of the Spirit. But the curse of sin upon the earth has done damage to your soul and it is so bad in these last days that it takes some doing over time to repair the damage!

I am born again because I was dead in sin.

I think if we became perfected in our soul all at once like some are implying, that we would lose our identity and personality of our soul. We wouldn't be "us" anymore.

So the Lord takes His time (with our copperation) with repairing our soul because He loves us as who we are. So He does it (sanctification) slowly and in steps on the inside of us so that we stay who we are, whom He loves. Inside out is the way it is done. What did He say about clean the inside of the cup? What does that mean?

So remember, we are as perfected in spirit alone but the dmage to our soul must be effected too. And our body we are to honor God with our flesh body and resist evil. One can't say, I am Justified and then turn around and willfully sin. That is wrong.

Yes he does not make us perfect..

But he has perfected us..

You don;t will full sin? Why would you excuse your sin?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Payment to whom? If Calvary satisfied mankind's debt, who was the debt owed to? And why couldn't that creditor have just forgiven the debt without Christ being nailed to a cross?

Payed to whome? Who did we owe a debt to? Was it notthe father?

God is perfect love, but he is also a perfect judge, Gods love can not overrule his justice.

So no.. Our debt could not be paid. Jesus asked that very question, If there is any other way. Take this cup from me, But not my will but yours be done

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Once-Saved-Always-Saved is built on a flawed foundation. To believe it, you first have to believe that your salvation is complete. It isn't. God may have finished His work, but for us... we still have to walk out that salvation. It won't be past-tense the way people use the words until this life is over.

Basically, we're still a-saving.

Jesus said it is finished

He did not say I did my part now you do yours.

If our salvation is not complete. We will never be saved, it would be impossible.

 

[Hillsage]

Precious friend, thanks for your conjecture information. You do realize, of course, That,
"In God's Sight," The Bible Teaches This, Correct?:

Maybe NOT.

"Moreover Whom He Did Predestinate, them He also called: and whom He called, ​

them He also justified: and whom He justified, them He also glorified." (Romans 8:30)​

​

So, Biblically, no "soul repair" necessary "In God's Sight", eh?

You’re adding to scripture something that has purposely been left out. He left the soul out BECAUSE that one is up to you. Just like I've been saying all along.

And just like He left SPIRIT out of another list.

MAT 10:28 'And be not afraid of those killing the body, and are not able to kill the soul, but fear rather Him who is able both soul and body to destroy in gehenna.

 

[BlessedPeace]

It's not like He wanted it to happen that way. So it's less design I think than He just knew what would happen and how to deal with it. So he can turn bad situations around to good for those who love God and will save everyone He can.

The tree of knowledge. Planted by God in the center of Eden, forbidden to man.


Then the LORD God said, “Behold, the man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil. And now, lest he reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life, and eat, and live forever...”
Genesis 3


Millennia later he sends himself to earth as prophesied,planned,to redeem his selected,elected, ones from what they became in Eden.

Because,as with all laws, there is a penalty for non-compliance.

In human circles the penalty is referred to as crime,criminal.
In God terms and his law, non-compliance, the non-compliant, are sin and sinner, respectively.

 

[RedFan]

Payed to whome? Who did we owe a debt to? Was it notthe father?

God is perfect love, but he is also a perfect judge, Gods love can not overrule his justice.

So no.. Our debt could not be paid. Jesus asked that very question, If there is any other way. Take this cup from me, But not my will but yours be done

It's perfect "justice" to punish A for the sins of B? Let's think about that for a moment.

The idea that a just God would ever punish A for B’s sin―whether or not A volunteered for the substitution―is a troubling one. A bloodthirsty God just might decide that “someone has to pay!” and accept such an offer. But a just God―at least as we humans reckon justice―would never do so. It is central to our notions of justice that the guilty, not the innocent, are punished. The guilty may be forgiven as an exercise in mercy (mercy being in effect a suspension of justice), but not at the expense of the innocent.

What restrained God from simply canceling the debt? It is interesting to me that Rom. 6:23 talks about death as the “wages of sin” rather than the “penalty for sin.” Crimes are criminal matters, while debts are civil matters. Payment of wages is a civil rather than a criminal matter, a debt to be paid to a creditor. A civil debt can be forgiven at the whim of the creditor. If the offense to God were deemed criminal and there is imposed a sentence other than a monetary fine, punishment of the wrongdoer is required. No substitutes are allowed; mom or dad, brother or sister may NOT serve my sentence for me, much less go to the gallows for me. If the debt is deemed civil, however, the creditor can cancel it at will, and the matter is then at an end.

I will put it simply: a creditor always has the option to forgive his debtor’s debt. If we deny that such an option was available to God, we ipso facto must deny the premise that the debt was owed to God. We cannot have it both ways. The way out is to stop looking at Calvary as payment of a debt and start looking at it in a different way.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

It's perfect "justice" to punish A for the sins of B? Let's think about that for a moment.

The idea that a just God would ever punish A for B’s sin―whether or not A volunteered for the substitution―is a troubling one. A bloodthirsty God just might decide that “someone has to pay!” and accept such an offer. But a just God―at least as we humans reckon justice―would never do so. It is central to our notions of justice that the guilty, not the innocent, are punished. The guilty may be forgiven as an exercise in mercy (mercy being in effect a suspension of justice), but not at the expense of the innocent.

What restrained God from simply canceling the debt? It is interesting to me that Rom. 6:23 talks about death as the “wages of sin” rather than the “penalty for sin.” Crimes are criminal matters, while debts are civil matters. Payment of wages is a civil rather than a criminal matter, a debt to be paid to a creditor. A civil debt can be forgiven at the whim of the creditor. If the offense to God were deemed criminal and there is imposed a sentence other than a monetary fine, punishment of the wrongdoer is required. No substitutes are allowed; mom or dad, brother or sister may NOT serve my sentence for me, much less go to the gallows for me. If the debt is deemed civil, however, the creditor can cancel it at will, and the matter is then at an end.

I will put it simply: a creditor always has the option to forgive his debtor’s debt. If we deny that such an option was available to God, we ipso facto must deny the premise that the debt was owed to God. We cannot have it both ways. The way out is to stop looking at Calvary as payment of a debt and start looking at it in a different way.

I am not sure you quite understand the legal system.

When a person is charged with a crime, they are brought before the judge, If they are found guilty, a judgment is passed on what the guilty person owes.

God said the wage of sin is death, so for every sin we have ever committed. Each one adds up to a death penalty. So first thing we need to ask ourselves. Is how many death penalty convictions do I have.

A perfect Judge will demand the guilty pay his debt on judgment day. Which means that person will be executed.

But the Bible shows a way (the only way) for that guilty person to be freed from his or her debt. Animal sacrifice. A Lamb without spot. Would she it blood and die int he persons place for those sins. Once this was done, the persons guilt was removed. It passed from one to the other. This is called redemption.

This is the only means we can be freed from t he certificat of debt we owe to God. God can not just forgive us, His justice will not allow it. But he can pay the way, by suffering our debt in our place, purchasing our salvation.

if our debt is not payed, we will have to pay up on judgment day. There will be no forgiveness.

 

[RedFan]

I am not sure you quite understand the legal system.

When a person is charged with a crime, they are brought before the judge, If they are found guilty, a judgment is passed on what the guilty person owes.

I have been a lawyer for nearly 45 years, and understand the legal system quite well. And a criminal verdict of guilty does not result in payment of a "debt." It results in incarceration and/or fines and/or sometimes payment of restitution to victims of financial crimes. A debt is a civil matter. A civil judgment can recognize that a debt was owed. A criminal verdict is different.

 

[WalkInLight]

So OSAS is like 2 married people?

So with God as the husband.. does God fall out of love with his bride?

That unfortunately does not answer the point.

A marriage is founded on a good relationship with understanding from both sides.
A marriage only exists when both parties stay faithful to the agreement.

What is obvious is for some the arrangement is somehow forever even when one side hates the whole arrangement.

Love by its nature is mutual appreciation and its expression from both parties.

God loves everyone but will still judge sinners for their sin.

I suspect this rejection of sinners is too painful to accept, and any hope is the only thing that brings an answer to despair.
But the answer to loneliness and rejection is opening ones heart to Jesus and letting love no matter how painful be
expressed openly.

God loves the prodigal son because he returns home and is prepared to work as a servant for the father.
It is not the prodigal continuing in the world in their pig pen and still being accepted home. No that prodigal
is still lost and without hope, who has inherited friends who only were friends because of money.

Repentance is stopping living for oneself but rather living for Jesus and others using what one has for that end.
The hardest thing is to accept ones own limitations and weaknesses and to encourage others in their ways.

I have interacted with believers who claimed they did not have to love others.
This is odd because to follow Jesus is to follow His example and He loved others, so we likewise must love from the
heart but that is only possible if we are cleansed and forgive others despite their lostness and slavery to sin.

Paul expressed this a blessing those who curse you, forgiving those who hurt you and praying for those who persecute you.
This is the hardest thing, because it can only be empowered by Jesus's love working through us, as we see and know who
He actually is and embrace the meaning of the reality He has brought to creation.

If one step of faith establishes an eternal loving relationship, then a root and branch when going to see Jesus will be
needed. In scripture the only root and branch change is spiritual new birth from heaven. If it does not show in life here
and now it simply does not exist. And sadly few appear to know what this actually means,

God bless you

 

[WalkInLight]

Precious friend, respectfully disagree; God's Eternal Salvation Is, Well, All About
"God's Work" On those who trust Him:

God's OPERATION On All HIS New-born babes In CHRIST
+ Update
+
God's Eternal Assurance
+
God's Eternal Life Insurance

God's Work, not like "human/failing marriages", and no one is required to "like" God's Truth...
eh?

Amen.

We are required to love Gods truth, for Gods truth is Jesus.

Love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength.
Deut 6:5

27 He answered: "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind'; and, 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'"
28 "You have answered correctly," Jesus replied. "Do this and you will live."
Luke 10:27-28

What I find a puzzle is the idea that "no one is required to like God's truth"
We are commanded to love God, so that there is nothing else in us.

And the reason I love God is because God is love, the highest and best part of everything in life itself.
Just listen to popular culture, "Love" is everything.