Why do we hear a different message from neighbor?

[Ally.s.j]

Soooo, you can't refute anything I said.
Next time - just say so . . .

All you want to do is ridicule. Its disgusting to look at. You like stanger have Zero love in you posts nothing that resembles Christ.

 

[BreadOfLife]

No I can I just dont want to. Theres a big difference

On a discussion board, when a person "doesn't want to" give an explanation or a refutation - it usually means that they can't.

 

[BreadOfLife]

BREAD OF LIFE, cap lock sorry,
I'm not part of this thing u have with Ally..so again, pls don' be snotty to me...
Can u show any verses where Jesus says something about the guarantee of the Church opposed to the individual? I have never heard anyone bring this up.
I will try to Google something, also. Thanks.

I'm not being "snotty" to anybody.
As I've said about 100 times on this forum - I am here for ONE purpose: To defend Christ's Church against attacks from anti-Catholics and to set the record straight. Too many people see this as "rude" or "snotty" - but they don't make the same judgements about people who tell lies, myths and fairy tales about the Catholic Church. Seems kind of hypocritical to me . . .

If you're not here to make false statements about the Church - I don't have any problem with you.

As for your question - there general rule of hermeneutics is:
When Jesus taught the crowds - He was speaking to ALL of us.
When Jesus taught His inner circle - He was instructing the leaders of His Church.

Remember - there weren't "multitudes" at the Last Supper - nor were they present when He sent out the 72 elders (Luke 10:16).

 

[Stranger]

I do appreciate your encouragement to continue in His word.

Now that you have clarified your reference to Acts 15:1-5 there are a few questions I have: their difference of opinion was concerning:
Acts 15:1 KJV
[1] And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said , Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved.

They were still speaking law and circumcision. Works. Then the Pharisees bring it up again. Do you believe the Pharisees that rejected Jesus were children of their Father(the devil)? Or were they also believers? How do you know these were all believers that just shared differing opinions? Just because they walked with the disciples or associated with them, doesn't mean they were believers.

1 John 2:19 KJV
[19] They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out , that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

They were pushing circumcision of the flesh rather than realizing it is not through circumcision of the flesh but rather through circumcision of the heart that saves a person. The flesh foreshadowed the removing of the vail over a persons heart. If that is not seen or realized: that it is not by flesh, then how does that person know God? Will they not have to eventually move toward seeing Christ? Same as you advising me to continue in His word that I might see.

2 Corinthians 3:14-15 KJV
[14] But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. [15] But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.


There has to be Christ for the vail to be done away.
Do they(Jews/still preaching works of flesh and law) know Him yet?
I am not sure what you mean "on both sides" are you saying men in the OT were saved by the works of the flesh? And on this side of the Crucifixion by faith? David, Enoch, Moses? Did law give these men life? Did law ever give life eternal?

So, can we all have a different message: some preaching law and works and some preaching faith in Christ? Can we remain uncircumcised of heart and be saved? When God removes the blindness over the Jews. What or who will He show them?

How do you resolve:
1 Corinthians 14:24-26 KJV
[24] But if all prophesy, and there come in one that believeth not, or one unlearned, he is convinced of all, he is judged of all: [25] And thus are the secrets of his heart made manifest; and so falling down on his face he will worship God, and

report that God is in you of a truth.

[26] How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.

Concerning your question of the Pharisees being believers in (Acts 15:1-5), I would say yes they were believers as (Acts 15:5) states. "But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them and to command them to keep the law of Moses."

Whether a Pharisee was a child of the devil or a child of God is not known to us until they make a decision to place faith in Christ. Until Paul was converted, we would not know that he was a child of God. But he was. My point is that Paul nor any other believer were ever children of the devil. They were lost and needed to be saved, but they were not children of the devil. They were the lost sheep that Jesus came to find. So, not all Pharisees were children of the devil, but some were. And Jesus knew who they were and at times pointed them out.

I don't believe (1 John 2:19) concerns the Pharisees. It concerns those who had joined publicly with the believers but were really not believers. They were of a gnostic faith which denied the deity of Christ. Thus they left.

My statement of 'both sides' concerning (Acts 15) was to show that both sides were believers and had the Holy Ghost, yet were in different opinion of the will of God. Meaning, just because we are Christian doesn't mean we will not come to different opinions concerning the Scripture. We all learn and grow.

I don't understand what needs to be resolved in (1 Cor. 14:24-26)

Stranger

 

[BreadOfLife]

Yes, I agree which makes it a miracle that I am able to interpret scripture at all. I wouldn't know what...did you say my 'protestant forefathers" taught. I don't read them. Nor do I read commentaries. If you say I am protestant then it must be true. Church: individual (members) that are under the head which is Christ making up the perfect man, to be revealed. One body. One mind, which is the mind of Christ. Agree or no?

But you're not "One Body".
There are literally tens of thousands of perpetually-splintering Protestant sects and offshoots of offshoots that ALL teach different doctrines because they ALL believe that the Holy spirit guided them to have different interpretations of Scripture. How do you reconcile this as being "one" Body, "one" mind??

God is not the author of this confusion - MAN is.

 

[BreadOfLife]

All you want to do is ridicule. Its disgusting to look at. You like stanger have Zero love in you posts nothing that resembles Christ.

I have plenty of love.
What I don't have is tolerance for lies, myths and fairy tales.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Ahh right the Holy Ghost said I will not teach you anything did He not? No He never. He said I will teach you all things. Paul said you have the mind of Christ. Obviously it is far harder to understand the absoloute tritpe that is discused in here lol. Why you think its easy to understand the blind leading the blind and you are one of them? Flaunting your knowleaged like a right fellow. Stop it. You sit under catholic doctirne and tripe. Then try and teach the same tripe here. stop it . For petes sake man. Gop and learn the basics. and stop looking down your nose like a mighty prophet. and not that nice to look at.

Soooo, I should be "nice" by telling lies like some of YOU?
Ummmm, no thanks - I'll stick to the truth . . .

 

[bbyrd009]

But you're not "One Body".

sure he is

 

[BreadOfLife]

sure he is

Sure - one of tens of thousands that claim to be "One" in Christ.

 

[bbyrd009]

Sure - one of tens of thousands that claim to be "One" in Christ.

ha well that is a function of his confession, not his doctrine
and we can all witness his confession, i guess
same as we can yours.

i notice the witnesses all pretty much lining up where his confession is concerned,
same as they are with yours, too
or mine, anybody's

 

[BreadOfLife]

ha well that is a function of his confession, not his doctrine
and we can all witness his confession, i guess
same as we can yours.

i notice the witnesses all pretty much lining up where his confession is concerned,
same as they are with yours, too
or mine, anybody's

What are you talking about, bbyrd??
Your responses are usually confused, garbled rants.

 

[DPMartin]

I woke this morning with this question for God: why do we all hear a different message in His word? How can we read the same verses and not agree on the meaning?

What distorts?
What divides?


1 Corinthians 14:24-26 KJV
[24] But if all prophesy, and there come in one that believeth not, or one unlearned, he is convinced of all, he is judged of all: [25] And thus are the secrets of his heart made manifest; and so falling down on his face he will worship God, and report that God is in you of a truth. [26] How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.

Here are those verses I always add in that possibly have nothing to do with the question but seem relevant to me.

Isaiah 19:14 KJV
[14] The Lord hath mingled a perverse spirit in the midst thereof: and they have caused Egypt to err in every work thereof, as a drunken man staggereth in his vomit.

1 John 4:6 KJV
[6] We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.


Spirit of truth
Spirit of error
??? Who decides? The Word says God is not the author of confusion.

well in questions of scriptural meaning its said to seek out at least three places in scripture that state the same meaning. which is a way to start, also make sure you are using both OT and NT.

but many are brought up in and or introduced to Christianity via different theologies, which are of men, when attending most popular denominations. and these teachings become a preconceived notion so to speak when reading scripture hence one believes what was taught rather than what the scripture actually says. (the serpent did the same thing to Eve in reference to God's commandment) a good example is the six days of creation, there are those out there that believe that creation happened in six 24 hr. days where as 24 hr. days didn't exist on the face of the earth until the fourth day, and that is if when God created the sun that a full revolution of the earth was 24 hr's. this is also a reason why non-believers exposed to Christianity believe that scripture is contradictory.

there is also world history of religious influence with the public and the use of scriptural interpretation to manipulate the public, for example going to war, and demonizing the enemy, or demonizing a public figure. there are other uses for public manipulation with religion, just not thinking of them.

in the case of Christianity we got almost 2000 years of the Lord leaving the Ministry of Grace in the hands of men. and in the case of large and influential denomination one must take into consideration too that men promote their own kind. so corruption can prevail within an organization. and if a denomination have great influence with the public it would also behoove the opposition to put forth an effort to corrupt the church.

there are many factors that go into why so many different theologies, it takes a lot of study of the history of the church to get a grasp on it.


but in all of this which is SOP in the world, who is thy teacher?


1Jn 2:24 Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. If that which ye have heard from the beginning shall remain in you, ye also shall continue in the Son, and in the Father. 25 And this is the promise that he hath promised us, even eternal life. 26 These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you. 27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

 

[aspen]

BREAD OF LIFE, cap lock sorry,
I'm not part of this thing u have with Ally..so again, pls don' be snotty to me...
Can u show any verses where Jesus says something about the guarantee of the Church opposed to the individual? I have never heard anyone bring this up.
I will try to Google something, also. Thanks.

The Church is the Bride of Christ
Pauls description of the Body working together

Just two ideas that come to mind

 

[VictoryinJesus]

I don't understand what needs to be resolved in (1 Cor. 14:24-26)

Honestly, I've lost the point. Verse 25: "And thus are the secrets of his heart made manifest; and so falling down on his face he will worship God, and report that God is in you of a truth." I don't see this happening in the church today and I want to. The disciples were of one accord. Are we? Is the body of Christ still of one accord?

You seem to suggest (forgive me if I have misunderstood) that division and difference of doctrine is a given amongst believers. Jesus prayed the Father: let them be one as we one. Can we be one and disagree? When Jesus said: you must eat my flesh and drink my blood. How many ways can "eat my flesh" and "drink my blood" be understood? Is there one correct meaning, or many meanings? Does it even matter without love or is the necessary part to be understood of (1Corinthians 14: 24-25) is "Let all things be done unto edifying."

 

[VictoryinJesus]

But you're not "One Body".
There are literally tens of thousands of perpetually-splintering Protestant sects and offshoots of offshoots that ALL teach different doctrines because they ALL believe that the Holy spirit guided them to have different interpretations of Scripture. How do you reconcile this as being "one" Body, "one" mind??

God is not the author of this confusion - MAN is.

I have never been in a roman catholic church other than once for a sprinkling of water baptism of an infant. I can't tell you the format of the worship service or what the preacher (or priest?) preaches on. I don't know what that looks like. All I know is what I have seen on television. I am sure you have heard it all before and have been asked it all before. You can answer or not.

Within the Church:
If you agree the head is Christ...
Is Mary considered a part of the head or a part of the body?
Is the Pope considered a part of the head or a part of the body?

And you say RCC is not splintered but this water baptism I attended was a branch that had splintered off from the main church. It was a more relaxed version of RCC but still with the tall hats and under the Pope's authority. A woman was the Priest that performed the baptism.

 

[Miss Hepburn]

... A woman was the Priest that performed the baptism.

She was "something", but not a priest...that's for sure !
Ha! (Easy mistake, tho)

 

[Helen]

"Let's agree to disagree". sound good don't it. one think it keep the peace right? wrong, why the confusion then? if one agree to disagree one is still in disagreement. and the scriptures are clear, Amos 3:3 "Can two walk together, except they be agreed?". and if one keep on agreeing to disagree, then confusion will always stay.

I for one often use the phrase "Le us agree to disagree"..I do believe it is a better place to be than name calling and arguing.

On many things I agree to disagree...I probably do with you!
Agreeing to disagree maintains the unity of the Spirit...and the relationship is not broken. You maybe one who believes that all the things you believe are 100% right. I believe that is impossible ...( back to someone possessing all truth. ) I do not agree.
As we are not at 'the end' yet...it is impossible to know 100% which one of us real has truth on his side...therefore, I maintain we should 'agree to disagree' continue to walk side by side...and stay teachable to the Lord.
Even my husband and I do not see everything the same...we enjoy a good discussion...on some things....we just agree to disagree.

Just saying..

 

[Miss Hepburn]

All you want to do is ridicule. Its disgusting to look at. You like stanger have Zero love in you posts nothing that resembles Christ.

Have you considered using the Ignore option...I have many on it...and do I have way more peace !

 

[Helen]

Sure - one of tens of thousands that claim to be "One" in Christ.

I don't think God gives a fig what we think...if He says we are One..then we are..those that are his children, those that love Him and strive to serve Him ..blood washed and made clean. Like it or not, we are One family.
I have many cousins back in England..we are 'splintered' as it were..we lost touch over years...but still are in the same family.

Now I do agree that as ONE Church we do not all "keep the unity of the Spirit"...but that does not un-One us!! There are indeed squabbles amongst us...as there are with kids...but really...you are stuck we me like it or not.

This is just how I see it.

 

[Helen]

Have you considered using the Ignore option...I have many on it...and do I have way more peace !

I could see it being some good if the posts themselves were blocked also, but don't the posts still show up, yet you just don't know who wrote what or to whom!
Don't you find that confusing?
I have never blocked anyone for that reason...
I don't wish to be more confused than I already am!!