Why Study And Do Discuss End Times Prophecy If You Do Not Then Know What To Do About It?

[Jacob28]

Mere curiosity and generic interest is nothing more than part of human folly when used as the reason to handle God's Word of Prophecy about these Last Days. The vast majority of talk about eschatology by Christians is nothing more than speculative chit-chat having no value. Even from the Preachers. And, the academic people just want to sell their books and promote their career.

The only reasons for Real Believers to be aware of eschatology is so they will:

1.) Refuse the mark of the beast.
2.) Become more frightened against sinning.
3.) Pray a little differently.
4.) Stress out less as Hell on Earth approaches.
5.) Rejoice more in God's future vengeance.

If you have other reasons for looking into eschatology, then tell us how understanding Prophecy actually affects your life.

 

[Keraz]

Prophecy is for Believers 1 Corinthians 14:22b

The Bible has plenty of information on how the Lord’s plans have been fulfilled in the past and what we can expect in our future. Also, according to His plan, very few will truly understand the full scope and implications of future events. Daniel 12:10
Some reasons for this are:

1/ Those who may profess to be Christian, but in their hearts are not:

1 John 4:4-6 Believers in Christ, you belong in God’s family and you can discern false prophets because the God who is in you is greater than the one who is in the world. The world listens to the teachings of worldly people, but we belong to God and whoever knows God pays heed to the truth, those who are not His people cannot comprehend the prophetic message.

Isaiah 29:13-14 The Lord says: Because this people worship Me with empty words and pay Me lip service, while their hearts are far from Me and their religion is but human precepts, learnt by rote; therefore I shall shock them and shock again and their wisdom and discernment will be lost. Matthew 7:21-23

2/ Belief in false teaching, leading to a fixed mindset of wrong ideas: Ezekiel 14:3-5

The prime example of a false teaching is the pre-tribulation rapture. This idea denies many Scriptures that say; all will be tested, 1 Peter 4:12, Luke 21:35. This leads to a careless attitude toward prophecy. If you believe you are good enough and sufficiently holy to be taken directly to heaven, then you will be judged for judging yourself.
Humility and trust in the Lord’s saving grace, Isaiah 30:15, must be our attitude, not the pretentious belief of a removal from the earth to avoid any perceived difficulties.
In John 17:15 Jesus asks for protection, not removal and in John 3:13 No one will go to heaven, only He who came from it.

2 Peter 2:1-3 In the past, there were false prophets among the people, just as now you will have false teachers. They will promote their theories and speculations, twisting Scripture to suit their fanciful notions. Many will follow their sheer fabrications and credulous people will make them rich and famous, but judgement waits for them: a long prepared destruction will fall upon their heads.

Jeremiah 23:16-17 The Lord says: Do not listen to your false prophets, who give you false hope and voice their own fancies, it is not the Lord’s Words they speak. They say: ‘prosperity will be yours’ and to all who follow their devious beliefs: ‘No harm will befall you’.

Isaiah 29:9-12 The Lord says: I will place My spirit of misunderstanding upon all those who are ‘drunk, but not with wine’ [that is: who allow themselves to be fooled by false teachings], so it becomes impossible for them to see the truth. Isaiah 8:16

3/ Preterism and non-literal interpretation:

To think that all prophecies have been fulfilled or they are just metaphors and allegories, is a serious error that leaves those who believe that way, without proper knowledge or understanding about the end times.

2 Peter 1:19 We confirm the message of the prophets, to which you will do well to study; it will enlighten your minds, like a lamp shining into a dark place.

4/ Denial or straight out refusal to try to comprehend the prophesies:

Ezekiel 33:31-33 My people will listen to the prophets, but they will not take any action. Fine Words, they will say but with insincerity, for their hearts are set on selfish gain. When disaster strikes, as it will, then they will know the truth of prophecy.

Isaiah 48:3-6 Long ago, I announced what will happen, but because of your stubbornness and your refusal to accept instruction, you think everything can be explained by chance or by natural occurrence. You read the Word, consider it well and admit the truth of it.

Hosea 9:7 The Day of punishment and vengeance comes and all Israel will know it. Their prophets are fools and their wise leaders are like madmen, because they are all deep in enmity with God and He will remember their guilt.


Revelation 22:7b…Happy is the person who takes to heart the Words of prophecy in this Book.

Reference: Revised English Bible. Some verses abridged and paraphrased.

 

[Jacob28]

Prophecy is for Believers 1 Corinthians 14:22b

The Bible has plenty of information on how the Lord’s plans have been fulfilled in the past and what we can expect in our future. Also, according to His plan, very few will truly understand the full scope and implications of future events. Daniel 12:10
Some reasons for this are:

1/ Those who may profess to be Christian, but in their hearts are not:

1 John 4:4-6 Believers in Christ, you belong in God’s family and you can discern false prophets because the God who is in you is greater than the one who is in the world. The world listens to the teachings of worldly people, but we belong to God and whoever knows God pays heed to the truth, those who are not His people cannot comprehend the prophetic message.

Isaiah 29:13-14 The Lord says: Because this people worship Me with empty words and pay Me lip service, while their hearts are far from Me and their religion is but human precepts, learnt by rote; therefore I shall shock them and shock again and their wisdom and discernment will be lost. Matthew 7:21-23

2/ Belief in false teaching, leading to a fixed mindset of wrong ideas: Ezekiel 14:3-5

The prime example of a false teaching is the pre-tribulation rapture. This idea denies many Scriptures that say; all will be tested, 1 Peter 4:12, Luke 21:35. This leads to a careless attitude toward prophecy. If you believe you are good enough and sufficiently holy to be taken directly to heaven, then you will be judged for judging yourself.
Humility and trust in the Lord’s saving grace, Isaiah 30:15, must be our attitude, not the pretentious belief of a removal from the earth to avoid any perceived difficulties.
In John 17:15 Jesus asks for protection, not removal and in John 3:13 No one will go to heaven, only He who came from it.

2 Peter 2:1-3 In the past, there were false prophets among the people, just as now you will have false teachers. They will promote their theories and speculations, twisting Scripture to suit their fanciful notions. Many will follow their sheer fabrications and credulous people will make them rich and famous, but judgement waits for them: a long prepared destruction will fall upon their heads.

Jeremiah 23:16-17 The Lord says: Do not listen to your false prophets, who give you false hope and voice their own fancies, it is not the Lord’s Words they speak. They say: ‘prosperity will be yours’ and to all who follow their devious beliefs: ‘No harm will befall you’.

Isaiah 29:9-12 The Lord says: I will place My spirit of misunderstanding upon all those who are ‘drunk, but not with wine’ [that is: who allow themselves to be fooled by false teachings], so it becomes impossible for them to see the truth. Isaiah 8:16

3/ Preterism and non-literal interpretation:

To think that all prophecies have been fulfilled or they are just metaphors and allegories, is a serious error that leaves those who believe that way, without proper knowledge or understanding about the end times.

2 Peter 1:19 We confirm the message of the prophets, to which you will do well to study; it will enlighten your minds, like a lamp shining into a dark place.

4/ Denial or straight out refusal to try to comprehend the prophesies:

Ezekiel 33:31-33 My people will listen to the prophets, but they will not take any action. Fine Words, they will say but with insincerity, for their hearts are set on selfish gain. When disaster strikes, as it will, then they will know the truth of prophecy.

Isaiah 48:3-6 Long ago, I announced what will happen, but because of your stubbornness and your refusal to accept instruction, you think everything can be explained by chance or by natural occurrence. You read the Word, consider it well and admit the truth of it.

Hosea 9:7 The Day of punishment and vengeance comes and all Israel will know it. Their prophets are fools and their wise leaders are like madmen, because they are all deep in enmity with God and He will remember their guilt.


Revelation 22:7b…Happy is the person who takes to heart the Words of prophecy in this Book.

Reference: Revised English Bible. Some verses abridged and paraphrased.

 

[Jacob28]

Perhaps my introductory post was not well worded, or I may have touched a preferred answer button in you.

Let's try this approach. Even if all you outlined is accurate, what material difference would it make in yourself? I am asking about "yourself" because, even as doctrine pundits claim to have both expertise upon Scripture and are able to speak a consensus shared with other Believers, they can really only speak for themselves.

How does Prophecy actually guide your life's decisions and actions? I have no reason to think it does.

 

[Pearl]

Trust in God. Let your heart and mind be filled with the Peace that transcends understanding. Wait on God and stay close to him at all times. Do not rely on your own understanding. Fear not, for the LORD your God is with you.

1. Matthew 24:6
   You will hear of wars and rumours of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come.
   
   
2. Mark 13:7
   When you hear of wars and rumours of wars, do not be alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come

 

[Jacob28]

Pearl,

Yes and thank you for that review.

Please share with me exactly how you personally "let" your heart and mind be filled with Peace. By the Power of His Word, I readily understand the importance of Faith in God's promises.

However, I do deny that we can "let" anything happen which comes from Omnipotent God. Using appealing combinations of chatty words will not be an answer.

 

[Pearl]

Pearl,

Yes and thank you for that review.

Please share with me exactly how you personally "let" your heart and mind be filled with Peace. By the Power of His Word, I readily understand the importance of Faith in God's promises.

However, I do deny that we can "let" anything happen which comes from Omnipotent God. Using appealing combinations of chatty words will not be an answer.

Hi Jacob, I'm not sure I understand the second paragraph of your post but I would - and do - let go of my anxiety and ask God for His Peace. Scripture tells us:

"Do not be anxious about anything, but in every situation, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God. And the peace of God, which transcends all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus. Finally, brothers and sisters, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable – if anything is excellent or praiseworthy – think about such things." Philippians 4:6-8

Those are key verses for gaining the peace that transcends understanding.

 

[JohnDB]

Perhaps my introductory post was not well worded, or I may have touched a preferred answer button in you.

Let's try this approach. Even if all you outlined is accurate, what material difference would it make in yourself? I am asking about "yourself" because, even as doctrine pundits claim to have both expertise upon Scripture and are able to speak a consensus shared with other Believers, they can really only speak for themselves.

How does Prophecy actually guide your life's decisions and actions? I have no reason to think it does.

Eschatology is a "practice final exam" of sorts of scripture hermeneutics.
By definition...
Anyone who claims to have all the correct answers to this exam is either lying or misguided. And it gets funny and sad to see two or three misguided people argue it out over their viewpoints.
Because...if you truly do know it, you don't share it.

But...
It requires good knowledge of other scriptures. A LOT of scriptures. More than just a passing knowledge but a really good understanding of them.
Even the "begat" and "skip over" sections.

And the sad truth is that most people have a pet theory they learned from someone else and then go about proving it with the scriptures they "know".
(And if you don't see the glaring flaw in this method I can't help you)

But the true benefit is that firm knowledge from a seemingly absentee God...He is watching and watching each of us closely. He knew us well before we knew of His existence...and He knows our future together...better than you know Him now.

 

[Keraz]

Let's try this approach. Even if all you outlined is accurate, what material difference would it make in yourself? I am asking about "yourself" because, even as doctrine pundits claim to have both expertise upon Scripture and are able to speak a consensus shared with other Believers, they can really only speak for themselves.

How does Prophecy actually guide your life's decisions and actions? I have no reason to think it does.

For me personally, promoting the Prophetic Word is my given task.
As for my life at present, I just get on with trying to be the 'salt and light' as we are told to do.

What I tried to say in #2, was that knowing what God has planned will make it so much easier to pass through all that must happen.
There is no doubt, from scripture and from the state of the world at present; we are close to the end times. We believe the Bible for our Salvation; why not for the clearly told God's plans for the future?

 

[Jacob28]

Eschatology is a "practice final exam" of sorts of scripture hermeneutics.
By definition...
Anyone who claims to have all the correct answers to this exam is either lying or misguided. And it gets funny and sad to see two or three misguided people argue it out over their viewpoints.
Because...if you truly do know it, you don't share it.

But...
It requires good knowledge of other scriptures. A LOT of scriptures. More than just a passing knowledge but a really good understanding of them.
Even the "begat" and "skip over" sections.

And the sad truth is that most people have a pet theory they learned from someone else and then go about proving it with the scriptures they "know".
(And if you don't see the glaring flaw in this method I can't help you)

But the true benefit is that firm knowledge from a seemingly absentee God...He is watching and watching each of us closely. He knew us well before we knew of His existence...and He knows our future together...better than you know Him now.

Yes, God sees every sparrow fall, but the sparrows still fall dead.

No place in Scripture states "If you truly do know it [eschatology], you do not share it." That attitude comes from the Godless Gnostics. They err unto their death.

 

[Jacob28]

For me personally, promoting the Prophetic Word is my given task.
As for my life at present, I just get on with trying to be the 'salt and light' as we are told to do.

What I tried to say in #2, was that knowing what God has planned will make it so much easier to pass through all that must happen.
There is no doubt, from scripture and from the state of the world at present; we are close to the end times. We believe the Bible for our Salvation; why not for the clearly told God's plans for the future?

 

[JohnDB]

Yes, God sees every sparrow fall, but the sparrows still fall dead.

No place in Scripture states "If you truly do know it [eschatology], you do not share it." That attitude comes from the Godless Gnostics. They err unto their death.

No it doesn't...
you are pulling that from the emanations of the penumbra as the float by.

Gnosticism is about Jesus not being true flesh...Which He was.

 

[Jacob28]

For me personally, promoting the Prophetic Word is my given task.
As for my life at present, I just get on with trying to be the 'salt and light' as we are told to do.

What I tried to say in #2, was that knowing what God has planned will make it so much easier to pass through all that must happen.
There is no doubt, from scripture and from the state of the world at present; we are close to the end times. We believe the Bible for our Salvation; why not for the clearly told God's plans for the future?

You are neither adequately informed nor commissioned to be able to speak for others by using to the word "We." Repent of your presumptuousness.

Did you know Jesus never commanded anyone to "Try" to do anything? People either do or do not obey His Commands.

 

[Jacob28]

No it doesn't...
you are pulling that from the emanations of the penumbra as the float by.

Gnosticism is about Jesus not being true flesh...Which He was.

Lol. Lifting up the lid of what is said certainly reveals the character inside. Emanations of any penumbra exist only within Satan's realm.

Satan indeed knows Jesus is true flesh, and Satan works to use, corrupt, and consume all flesh to prevent Divine Glorification. Gnostics try to hide everywhere within their Satanic words.

 

[Randy Kluth]

Mere curiosity and generic interest is nothing more than part of human folly when used as the reason to handle God's Word of Prophecy about these Last Days. The vast majority of talk about eschatology by Christians is nothing more than speculative chit-chat having no value. Even from the Preachers. And, the academic people just want to sell their books and promote their career.

The only reasons for Real Believers to be aware of eschatology is so they will:

1.) Refuse the mark of the beast.
2.) Become more frightened against sinning.
3.) Pray a little differently.
4.) Stress out less as Hell on Earth approaches.
5.) Rejoice more in God's future vengeance.

If you have other reasons for looking into eschatology, then tell us how understanding Prophecy actually affects your life.

I somewhat agree with you. Much of modern prophetic interest is mythical in quality, and focuses on future history as if it is a TV drama. It feeds speculation, curiosity, as well as the imagination. It also creates a sense of excitement that is not the same as God's peace.

We were told not to prepare for the Kingdom by trying to anticipate times and seasons. Rather, we were told to face the fact that God is a Judge, and is holding mankind accountable every day, although tempered by His patience.

The only way to get ready is by recognizing that He is a holy God holding us responsible for ones created in His image, able to perform works like His. We need to live with Him and do works through Him so that His virtue flows through what we say and do.

Most of all, we must know that He is love, so that we conform our sense of righteousness to His love. Eschatology is all about knowing God's plan to hold the whole world accountable. We must live like children of God, created in His image and likeness.

 

[Jacob28]

I somewhat agree with you. Much of modern prophetic interest is mythical in quality, and focuses on future history as if it is a TV drama. It feeds speculation, curiosity, as well as the imagination. It also creates a sense of excitement that is not the same as God's peace.

We were told not to prepare for the Kingdom by trying to anticipate times and seasons. Rather, we were told to face the fact that God is a Judge, and is holding mankind accountable every day, although tempered by His patience.

The only way to get ready is by recognizing that He is a holy God holding us responsible for ones created in His image, able to perform works like His. We need to live with Him and do works through Him so that His virtue flows through what we say and do.

Most of all, we must know that He is love, so that we conform our sense of righteousness to His love. Eschatology is all about knowing God's plan to hold the whole world accountable. We must live like children of God, created in His image and likeness.

We are indeed to use Prophecy to prepare us for the Kingdom. 2 Peter 3:11-12,

"Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought you to be in all holy conversation and Godliness looking for and hasting into the coming of the day of God."

Peter asks the question here, but expects us to fill in the answer. There is no clear answer given, and that is the topic of this thread.

Tell me, do you personally "perform works like His," as you just said "We" should do? Or, do you just hand out advice which you do not perform? Yes?

 

[Randy Kluth]

We are indeed to use Prophecy to prepare us for the Kingdom. 2 Peter 3:11-12,

I did not say otherwise.

"Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought you to be in all holy conversation and Godliness looking for and hasting into the coming of the day of God."

Peter asks the question here, but expects us to fill in the answer. There is no clear answer given, and that is the topic of this thread.

Tell me, do you personally "perform works like His," as you just said "We" should do? Or, do you just hand out advice which you do not perform? Yes?

Yes, I perform works like those of Christ every day because I've chosen to let him reside in me. He helps me to do things by his Spirit so that what I do comes out looking a lot like him. I don't always do this, of course. But that's the challenge.

 

[David H.]

Mere curiosity and generic interest is nothing more than part of human folly when used as the reason to handle God's Word of Prophecy about these Last Days. The vast majority of talk about eschatology by Christians is nothing more than speculative chit-chat having no value. Even from the Preachers. And, the academic people just want to sell their books and promote their career.

The only reasons for Real Believers to be aware of eschatology is so they will:

1.) Refuse the mark of the beast.
2.) Become more frightened against sinning.
3.) Pray a little differently.
4.) Stress out less as Hell on Earth approaches.
5.) Rejoice more in God's future vengeance.

If you have other reasons for looking into eschatology, then tell us how understanding Prophecy actually affects your life.

For me personally, studying Prophecy has led me to the Point of trusting in the providence of God which is beyond our understanding and comprehension. Those who have prophecy "figured out" have missed the whole point and blessing of Prophecy. You see this with people who present endless timelines and explanations of events, some even set dates and what not, only to be disappointed. That is because they are trying to approach prophecy with the carnal mind as opposed to the mind of Christ, the Holy Spirit.

So for me personally this was a hard lesson to learn, to "turn off" my carnal mind and to be taught by the Mind of Christ. There is a great peace, one that surpasses understanding when this is applied, and Christ Jesus reveals himself to you. Read 1 Corinthians chapters 1-3, before you begin Revelation. Get the right mindset and he will teach you!