Zechariah 14 . . . Fulfilled? or Future?

[Truth7t7]

Revelation 20 says there is a thousand years inbetween. It literally says, "the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished"

That disproves your position.

the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished

Can you find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) Physical Earthly Kingdom?
2.) Physical Earthly Throne?
3.) Physical Mortal Humans?

The Above Claims (Don't Exist)

Revelation 20:1-6 Is 100% In The Lords (Spiritual) Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ

100% Spiritual Realm, No "Literal" Time

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Revelation 20:1-6KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

 

[Truth7t7]

Revelation 20 says there is a thousand years inbetween. It literally says, "the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished"

That disproves your position.

the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished

Satan is "Currently" bound from "One Specific Purpose", And One Only?

"Deceive The Nations" To Battle

The Non-Literal 1,000 Years (Revelation) 20:1-6 Are Taking Place Now In The Lords Spiritual, And Will Cease At The Future Second Coming

If A Tribulation Saint Were To Die One Day Before The Second Coming, He Enters Into The Non-Literal 1,000 Year Reign

Many That Promote Millennialism Falsely Teach, Satan Cant Be Presently Bound Because Evil Exist In The World?

Satan Is Presently Bound As Is Clearly Seen In (Revelation) 20:7-8 Below That Interprets (Deceive The Nations) Is To Battle, Not General Evil In The World Presently.

Satan Is Loosed At The End Of The Tribulation When The 6th Vial Is Poured Out As Seen In (Revelation) 16:12, The Deception Is Devils In False Miracles Going Forth To The Kings Of The Earth, To Gather Them To The Final Battle

(Revelation) 20:1-9KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

(Revelation) 16:12-14 & (Revelation) 20:7-8 Same Deception In Gathering The Nations To The Very Same Final Battle In "Parallel" Teachings Of The Same Event

(Revelation) 16:12-17KJV
12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.
13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.

 

[Marty fox]

Not in Revelation 20.

The heavens dissolve in Revelation 6.

When did the 144k even go to heaven? They were sealed on earth. You have them staying in heaven, but never claimed they left earth.

I was meaning in Peter

Sorry but I have no idea what your talking about with the 144k I never mentioned them.

All we see about the 144k is that they are sealed from the wrath of God and then them standing before the throne

 

[n2thelight]

Zechariah 14:1-9 KJV
1) Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.
2) For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.
3) Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.
4) And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.
5) And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.
6) And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark:
7) But it shall be one day which shall be known to the LORD, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light.
8) And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be.
9) And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one.

Already fulfilled? Or are we still waiting for these things to happen?

As for me, no, these events have not happened yet.

Much love!

Future

 

[ewq1938]

Can you find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) Physical Earthly Kingdom?
2.) Physical Earthly Throne?
3.) Physical Mortal Humans?

Yes, all three are true.

 

[ewq1938]

Satan is "Currently" bound from "One Specific Purpose", And One Only?

"Deceive The Nations" To Battle

Satan is not able to deceive the nations for a thousand years.

 

[ScottA]

(The Day Of The Lord) is the last day of man and earths existence as seen below, they will be destroyed by the Lords fire (The End)

2 Peter 3:10KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

Ah, now I see the problem. Marks and I were discussing the three days Jesus spent in the heart of the earth...and you took off on one particular aspect of the day of the Lord, that I was not referring to. Not your fault, but it was out of context with our discussion.

There are many things that occur on the day of the Lord, indeed the end as you described it, but also as I described it according to Marks reference (and Paul's, saying "each in his own order.")

Neither is wrong, but should be reconciled...just as is true of Paul saying we "were" crucified with Christ.

 

[Timtofly]

The New Heaven and new Earth happens after the Great White Throne Judgement (GWTJ) not the second coming according to Revelation 20-21. The thousand years happens on this same old Earth.

I am not talking about a new reality. I am talking about a new heaven and earth. After the Flood there was a new heaven and earth, because the old heaven and earth were changed.

After the Second Coming the earth will be restored to pre-Flood heaven and earth. Isaiah 65:17

"For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind."

This happens at the Second Coming and at the start of the 1,000 year reign. Revelation 21:1

"And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea."

Heaven and earth was made new, but did not pass away after the Flood and after the Second Coming. In Revelation 21 after the 1,000 years, current heaven and earth do pass away. This is a totally different reality. This is not just a restored creation.

 

[Timtofly]

I was meaning in Peter

Sorry but I have no idea what your talking about with the 144k I never mentioned them.

All we see about the 144k is that they are sealed from the wrath of God and then them standing before the throne

No verse says they are standing before the throne. Revelation 14:5

"And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God."

This does not say standing. This means just the opposite they have no faults, with no need to stand in Judgment at all. The whole earth is in the presence of the GWT. The issues is we are spiritually blind and cannot see it.

I pointed out the 144k are those coming with Christ in Revelation 19. They never leave earth again. They are the camp of the saints in Revelation 20. So Christ is with them on earth. They are on earth. They come to earth at Armageddon. No verse ever states they leave the second time. This is the point:

"These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb."

They were sealed on the earth. Revelation 7:1-4

"And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree. And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea, Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads. And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel."

They were sealed so when the earth was hurt, they are protected on the earth. They are on the earth. Christ is on the earth. At the start of Satan's 42 months, they are on Mount Zion. They are sealed and on the earth in chapter 7 through the Trumpets and Thunders. In the midst of the week of days of the 7th Trumpet, they leave earth for Mount Zion, and always with the Lamb. The Lamb is on earth with them through the Trumpets and Thunders. The Lamb is with them on Mount Zion during Satan's 42 months. The Lamb returns at Armageddon, and they are always with the Lamb. They come back to earth at Armageddon. They and the Lamb stay on earth 1,000 years. They are the camp of the saints with the Lamb surrounded by that last army on the earth. God sends down fire from heaven, not the Lamb. The 1,000 years is on earth, because that is where the 144k are. They don't bounce back and forth like a yo-yo.

Now if Satan does not get 42 months. They never leave earth at all. The Millennium starts when the 7th Trumpet stops sounding. So the only reason they are on Mount Zion is because Satan has control of the throne in Jerusalem. That glorious throne in Matthew 25:31. That is also on earth.

"When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: And before him shall be gathered all nations:"

The Second Coming brings Jesus the Prince to earth, to the Mount of Olives, to sit on His throne in Jerusalem. All the nations will gather during the Trumpets. Because Jesus is calling Israel out of all nations. Those sheep will rule along with the 144k on earth. "Shall come" does not mean "stay in heaven".

 

[ewq1938]

I am not talking about a new reality. I am talking about a new heaven and earth. After the Flood there was a new heaven and earth, because the old heaven and earth were changed.

Explain how an Earthly flood changed heaven.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Okay, but perhaps I need to remind you further: "That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit."...and that which Jesus came to do in the flesh, "It is finished."

As for His three days in the heart of the earth, this is that day of the Lord, the day prior (of the first Adam), and the day after ("Cana", meaning the "double blessing" and "rest") in which He is perfected.

What does this even mean?

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Explain how an Earthly flood changed heaven.

If you wish I can answer this.

 

[ScottA]

What does this even mean?

Marks and I were discussing and looking at the difference between what is physically made manifest of the things of prophecy, and their spiritual counterparts.

In other words, just as Christ was crucified in His time but actually slain before the foundation of the world; and just as Paul knew very well of when Jesus was crucified in His time, but came to say as a part of scriptural truth, that those who are His "were" also crucified with Him--there is both. Both the events in their time, but also...and I would say, more importantly, there is also the timeless truth of those things not in their time, but in God who is greater.

Thus far these differences have only been eluded to in the scriptures--seemingly made manifest first from our perspective, or even more grand when revealed, but then clarified to show them as greater with God. One example is Jesus' clarification of which is actually greater, saying, "Fools and blind! For which is greater, the gold or the temple that sanctifies the gold?" Of which, there are fools and blind that are so far off in their understanding that they would again rebuild the temple after being told that it was only representational of what is greater and spiritual, being made in the presence of God.

It is this difference that I confront here daily, of which every topic and discussion would go to rebuilding the lesser things of God according to their worldly manifestation for our learning about that which is actually greater, because of that same lack of understanding--which has been done now for millennia since Christ came announcing this difference in parables, showing that the kingdom of God is only "like" these things.

So, I continue, to speak for that greater parable meaning of the things of God against the misunderstandings of those bound to their ways and the ways of this world. To say nothing of that topic of which we were discussing--but perhaps the explanation is the greatest need.

Thanks for asking.

 

[ScottA]

Explain how an Earthly flood changed heaven.

If you wish I can answer this.

Please do.

 

[Marty fox]

No verse says they are standing before the throne. Revelation 14:5

"And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God."

This does not say standing. This means just the opposite they have no faults, with no need to stand in Judgment at all. The whole earth is in the presence of the GWT. The issues is we are spiritually blind and cannot see it.

I pointed out the 144k are those coming with Christ in Revelation 19. They never leave earth again. They are the camp of the saints in Revelation 20. So Christ is with them on earth. They are on earth. They come to earth at Armageddon. No verse ever states they leave the second time. This is the point:

"These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb."

They were sealed on the earth. Revelation 7:1-4

"And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree. And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea, Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads. And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel."

They were sealed so when the earth was hurt, they are protected on the earth. They are on the earth. Christ is on the earth. At the start of Satan's 42 months, they are on Mount Zion. They are sealed and on the earth in chapter 7 through the Trumpets and Thunders. In the midst of the week of days of the 7th Trumpet, they leave earth for Mount Zion, and always with the Lamb. The Lamb is on earth with them through the Trumpets and Thunders. The Lamb is with them on Mount Zion during Satan's 42 months. The Lamb returns at Armageddon, and they are always with the Lamb. They come back to earth at Armageddon. They and the Lamb stay on earth 1,000 years. They are the camp of the saints with the Lamb surrounded by that last army on the earth. God sends down fire from heaven, not the Lamb. The 1,000 years is on earth, because that is where the 144k are. They don't bounce back and forth like a yo-yo.

Now if Satan does not get 42 months. They never leave earth at all. The Millennium starts when the 7th Trumpet stops sounding. So the only reason they are on Mount Zion is because Satan has control of the throne in Jerusalem. That glorious throne in Matthew 25:31. That is also on earth.

"When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: And before him shall be gathered all nations:"

The Second Coming brings Jesus the Prince to earth, to the Mount of Olives, to sit on His throne in Jerusalem. All the nations will gather during the Trumpets. Because Jesus is calling Israel out of all nations. Those sheep will rule along with the 144k on earth. "Shall come" does not mean "stay in heaven".

You had the wrong verse

Rev 14:3
3 And they sang a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders. No one could learn the song except the 144,000 who had been redeemed from the earth.

This refers back to the throne room with the four creatures in chapter 4

The battle of Armageddon is not in chapter 19 chapter 19 is the defeat of the two beast. The only reference to Armageddon is in chapter 16 when the beast defeats Babylon the great.

The 7th trumpet is at the end of our world at the judgement day

Rev 11:15-18
15 The seventh angel sounded his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven, which said:

“The kingdom of the world has become
the kingdom of our Lord and of his Messiah,
and he will reign for ever and ever.”

16 And the twenty-four elders, who were seated on their thrones before God, fell on their faces and worshiped God,17 saying:

“We give thanks to you, Lord God Almighty,
the One who is and who was,
because you have taken your great power
and have begun to reign.
18 The nations were angry,
and your wrath has come.
The time has come for judging the dead,
and for rewarding your servants the prophets
and your people who revere your name,
both great and small—
and for destroying those who destroy the earth.”

If Jesus is on the earth when satan is released and revelation is literal then why does it only say that satan and his armies surround the camp of Gods people and not surround Jesus and the camp of Gods people? That is a huge difference.

Again not once in rev 20 does it mention Jesus is on the earth.

 

[Timtofly]

Explain how an Earthly flood changed heaven.

There was water above the firmament. Now there is not.

 

[Timtofly]

You had the wrong verse

Rev 14:3
3 And they sang a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders. No one could learn the song except the 144,000 who had been redeemed from the earth.

This refers back to the throne room with the four creatures in chapter 4

The battle of Armageddon is not in chapter 19 chapter 19 is the defeat of the two beast. The only reference to Armageddon is in chapter 16 when the beast defeats Babylon the great.

The 7th trumpet is at the end of our world at the judgement day

Rev 11:15-18
15 The seventh angel sounded his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven, which said:

“The kingdom of the world has become
the kingdom of our Lord and of his Messiah,
and he will reign for ever and ever.”

16 And the twenty-four elders, who were seated on their thrones before God, fell on their faces and worshiped God,17 saying:

“We give thanks to you, Lord God Almighty,
the One who is and who was,
because you have taken your great power
and have begun to reign.
18 The nations were angry,
and your wrath has come.
The time has come for judging the dead,
and for rewarding your servants the prophets
and your people who revere your name,
both great and small—
and for destroying those who destroy the earth.”

If Jesus is on the earth when satan is released and revelation is literal then why does it only say that satan and his armies surround the camp of Gods people and not surround Jesus and the camp of Gods people? That is a huge difference.

Again not once in rev 20 does it mention Jesus is on the earth.

If you know where Mt. Zion is, you can say.

If they are ruling with Christ, then why does John have to keep repeating that fact for all you who need such proof?

 

[Marty fox]

If you know where Mt. Zion is, you can say.

If they are ruling with Christ, then why does John have to keep repeating that fact for all you who need such proof?

Hebrews 12:22
But you have come to Mount Zion, to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem. You have come to thousands upon thousands of angels in joyful assembly,

So we’re are the 144K?

They are reigning with Jesus in heaven and on earth

 

[ewq1938]

There was water above the firmament. Now there is not.

That's not the 3rd heaven.

 

[ScottA]

There was water above the firmament. Now there is not.

There is a much bigger answer to the waters above the firmament. It's still there. It is a physical parable defining the spirit realm.