7 Facts: The Rapture and the End of the Age

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GaryAnderson

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Anything found built under 20 feet of other deposits were built after Noah. That was less than 4500 years ago. There are sights in China older than the flood of Noah's day. That Flood literally created the stone age, and Noah and his family started from there. I think life was more advanced prior to the Flood.

Even Peter in 2 Peter 3 explained that point, and Peter had no idea how advanced the 20th century would be. He reminds evolutionist who claim there never was an earth wide flood like The Bible talks about, that there was indeed a Flood. That Flood literally destroyed everything on earth which would mess up trying to date the earth.

The Flood literally buried what was on the surface miles below the current surface in many places. Even the mountains we currently see were produced by the Flood and in the aftermath of the Flood for thousands of years.

What mankind claims, like the continents separating, did not take millions of years. What we see today happened since the Flood. There was only one continent before the Flood.

Of course the only proof other than God's written Word, will be made available at the Second Coming, because at that moment, the world will start to return to the way it was before the Flood, except this time instead of water, it will be via fire and during the events of the GT. And yes, people will live through it sometimes even trying to die, but they cannot.

"And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man. And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them."

Humans will live and die according to God's will and plan, not their own.

I see. So you simply Reject the fact that some sites are 10 or 15,000 years old or older.
 

Timtofly

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I see. So you simply Reject the fact that some sites are 10 or 15,000 years old or older.
I simply accept that man's attempts to date creation will only end in flawed interpretations.

It is not even science totally to blame. They can only work with the information they have. Decay only happened when sin entered the world. If there was no decay for 1000 years, no half life, no death, how does science reconcile those facts, other than dismiss them?

The interpretation via science, we have, demands the Bible is wrong. God's Word tells us science does not have all the facts.
 
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ScottA

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Adam was created around 4,000 B.C. The Millennium comes after the six thousand year reign of Man. This suggests that the End Times are imminent. Let's examine 7 facts about the Rapture and the End of the Age from the words of Jesus.

7 Facts: The Rapture and the End of the Age
Seven misunderstandings :(

1. There will be world-wide signs of Jesus’ coming, and the end of the age:

While He was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples approached Him privately and said, “Tell us, when will these things happen? And what is the sign of Your coming and of the end of the age?”

Then Jesus replied to them: “Watch out that no one deceives you. For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Messiah,’ and they will deceive many. You are going to hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not alarmed, because these things must take place, but the end is not yet. For nation will rise up against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. All these events are the beginning of birth pains. (Matthew 24:3-8)
The whole message here from Jesus is not a put-off of the timing of events to some future mass event, but rather that "All these events are the beginning", not the end. So...it is not correct for you to say that all these things are signs of the end.

Which begs the question: What then is the end? (Rhetorical)
 
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ScottA

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I simply accept that man's attempts to date creation will only end in flawed interpretations.

It is not even science totally to blame. They can only work with the information they have. Decay only happened when sin entered the world. If there was no decay for 1000 years, no half life, no death, how does science reconcile those facts, other than dismiss them?

The interpretation via science, we have, demands the Bible is wrong. God's Word tells us science does not have all the facts.
If I may interject:

The timing of world history is simply a matter of disagreement for lack of understanding what the world actually is.

The world is not natural, but supernatural. It is the manifestation and revelation of the story of Jesus Christ made known to all, the dead and the living. As such, if one or many believe in a world billions of years old, it is manifest; and if others believe that it is as it is written, that too is manifest--that each brings their beliefs to the judgment before God. The world is thereby a witness and a testimony of each. The earth simply crumbles accordingly.

Time is an illusion.
 

GaryAnderson

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If I may interject:

The timing of world history is simply a matter of disagreement for lack of understanding what the world actually is.

The world is not natural, but supernatural. It is the manifestation and revelation of the story of Jesus Christ made known to all, the dead and the living. As such, if one or many believe in a world billions of years old, it is manifest; and if others believe that it is as it is written, that too is manifest--that each brings their beliefs to the judgment before God. The world is thereby a witness and a testimony of each. The earth simply crumbles accordingly.

Time is an illusion.

Hello @ScottA , in science this is called “having no objective reality” and it’s a respectable view. However we do agree on certain things that we see despite the fact that we don’t know and see the full reality.
For example, we all agree that when we see a bus, then it’s a bus.
Or a bird, or a rock, or a site that’s 15,000 years old.
 

ScottA

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Hello @ScottA , in science this is called “having no objective reality” and it’s a respectable view. However we do agree on certain things that we see despite the fact that we don’t know and see the full reality.
For example, we all agree that when we see a bus, then it’s a bus.
Or a bird, or a rock, or a site that’s 15,000 years old.
It is true that most people agree on more things than can be numbered, but also disagree on just as many. But why should we debate what God has made clear is a matter of "creation" suitable for all purposes good and evil? Does it even make sense that their truth is also our truth, when God has revealed that each receives by his own measure?
 

GaryAnderson

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It is true that most people agree on more things than can be numbered, but also disagree on just as many. But why should we debate what God has made clear is a matter of "creation" suitable for all purposes good and evil? Does it even make sense that their truth is also our truth, when God has revealed that each receives by his own measure?

Okay fair and I agree with this view. This is why I don’t engage further when I see someone holding an extreme position. In their view, they’re right.
 
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ScottA

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Okay fair and I agree with this view. This is why I don’t engage further when I see someone holding an extreme position. In their view, they’re right.
I don't want to hijack the thread, but Time is a big subject, and yet it is at the heart of most misunderstandings about the world and about God. Including these seven.
 

GaryAnderson

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I don't want to hijack the thread, but Time is a big subject, and yet it is at the heart of most misunderstandings about the world and about God. Including these seven.

Believe me, with everything that I’ve seen here you’re not hijacking anything and we’re having a fluid conversation but I appreciate your respect and consideration.
Time is indeed a fascinating topic and if you have more to share I’ll be happy to read it.
All I know about Time in this universe is that it’s relative to the person depending where they are and how fast they’re going.
Outside of this universe, a place where I imagine God resides who kicked off the Big Bang, Time may have completely different properties.
 

ScottA

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Believe me, with everything that I’ve seen here you’re not hijacking anything and we’re having a fluid conversation but I appreciate your respect and consideration.
Time is indeed a fascinating topic and if you have more to share I’ll be happy to read it.
All I know about Time in this universe is that it’s relative to the person depending where they are and how fast they’re going.
Outside of this universe, a place where I imagine God resides who kicked off the Big Bang, Time may have completely different properties.
A quick synopsis of the reality of Time:
doc-clock.jpg
Within the context of this famous movie scene, we would not look at our own watch to see what time it is. That would be ridiculous. Fact is the movie only seems to have a timeline, when there is actually no such thing within the physical film sitting on a shelf. Actually, that would-be timeline is better described as a storyline.

In the case of God looking from outside the context of eternity into the context of world time, God doesn't have a watch, because he is not subject to that context. "No shadow of turning." And just as a movie timeline is better understood as a storyline, so is our story...which is of course bigger than just us, but is rather the complete revelation of Jesus Christ: Namely, from the "Beginning" to the "End." History is not so much our story, but his story. ... But there is no actual timeline, just as there is no actual timeline to a movie or a book sitting on a shelf in the timeless realm of God. Therefore, he says, "I am", and only within the storyline is it correct to say, "yesterday, today, and forever." From God's timeless perspective--the only actual reality, a timeline of a timeless God...would also be ridiculous.

Time rather, is a form of godly media, a written creation, and a means of revelation, the revelation of Jesus Christ and all who are in him, the living and the dead.
 
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GaryAnderson

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Thanks @ScottA , I appreciate your explanation and yes I’ve thought of time as some sort of film tape instead of a one-way direction.
I do have to ask though regarding your media comment, you do realize that people have always had a sense of time before media existed correct?
 

ScottA

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Thanks @ScottA , I appreciate your explanation and yes I’ve thought of time as some sort of film tape instead of a one-way direction.
I do have to ask though regarding your media comment, you do realize that people have always had a sense of time before media existed correct?
Well...I would credit God for media before the media of men :)
 

GaryAnderson

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Well...I would credit God for media before the media of men :)

Oh I’m sorry, you used it in That sense. Again I’m sorry, there’s a lot of conspiracy theory folks here so that seemed strange to me but you’ve used in a different sense.
Thanks again.
 

Davy

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I simply accept that man's attempts to date creation will only end in flawed interpretations.

It is not even science totally to blame. They can only work with the information they have. Decay only happened when sin entered the world. If there was no decay for 1000 years, no half life, no death, how does science reconcile those facts, other than dismiss them?

The interpretation via science, we have, demands the Bible is wrong. God's Word tells us science does not have all the facts.

True, man's science doesn't have all the facts. But there's a pseudo-science by man that one must realize that is out to disprove The Bible, while man's 'true' science actually supports... what God's Word reveals.

The other problem is that the majority are not aware how God's Word declares a previous world earth age prior to Adam and Eve, a time when Satan was perfect in his ways and serving God as a covering cherub guarding the Mercy Seat. That time is where many of the earth's ancient fossil remains comes from, including tropical fossils of plant and animal life at both of the earth's poles.
 

ScottA

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The other problem is that the majority are not aware how God's Word declares a previous world earth age prior to Adam and Eve, a time when Satan was perfect in his ways and serving God as a covering cherub guarding the Mercy Seat. That time is where many of the earth's ancient fossil remains comes from, including tropical fossils of plant and animal life at both of the earth's poles.
The problem with considering even that possibility, is that it all just ends in more conjecture.

The only answer to these age old questions is in knowing just what the world is. By God's word and revelation, the world is the manifest revelation of everything good and evil brought to light. Period. "Then comes the end."

In which case, all manner of conjecture is to be revealed--not because it is true, but because it is in the hearts of men, to be revealed.
 

Timtofly

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If I may interject:

The timing of world history is simply a matter of disagreement for lack of understanding what the world actually is.

The world is not natural, but supernatural. It is the manifestation and revelation of the story of Jesus Christ made known to all, the dead and the living. As such, if one or many believe in a world billions of years old, it is manifest; and if others believe that it is as it is written, that too is manifest--that each brings their beliefs to the judgment before God. The world is thereby a witness and a testimony of each. The earth simply crumbles accordingly.

Time is an illusion.
Hinduism is not the answer to this point raised. God will hold accountable all who know the truth and reject it, for human understanding.
 

Davy

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Adam was created around 4,000 B.C. The Millennium comes after the six thousand year reign of Man. This suggests that the End Times are imminent. Let's examine 7 facts about the Rapture and the End of the Age from the words of Jesus.

7 Facts: The Rapture and the End of the Age

Let's see then...

What I gather from that article link is the proposing of a Pre-tribulational Rapture theory, a leaven doctrine first preached in a Church by Edward Irving and John Nelson Darby in 1830s Great Britain.

They wrongly believe that Lord Jesus is coming to gather us to Heaven PRIOR to the tribulation He taught. They like to play up the idea of wars and rumors and war, while omitting the last phrase Jesus gave with that, to not be troubled by those wars, because the END IS NOT YET (Matthew 24:6). That time of wars and rumors of wars is NOT how the "great tribulation" is going to be like. It's going to be a time opposite of wars. But those Pre-trib doctors like play that war idea up for shock value, in hopes you'll be scared and want to escape by their fake pre-trib rapture.

Another idea in their false doctrine is the idea that Jesus comes suddenly, "at any moment". This is why that pre-trib doctrine has traditionally been also called, the "Any Moment" doctrine, and the "Fly Away" doctrine. Their followers even have an old Gospel song about it, "I'll Fly Away". And those like Hal Lindsay, and Tim LaHaye's "Left Behind" series have made it a pop doctrine among many, even though there is NO such idea as a Pre-tribulational Rapture written in God's Word. Those are the ones Apostle Paul said are 'drunken' in the night (spiritually). They are literally 'drunk' on that false doctrine from men.

Can Jesus come 'at any moment, suddenly'? NO! Anyone with just a little common sense reading His Olivet discourse of Matthew 24 and Mark 13 ought to be able to fathom that ALL those Signs He gave there must happen leading up to His future return.

So we cannot just say, well, He comes suddenly before that LAST SIGN He gave, which is what those on a false Pre-trib Rapture theory teach, i.e., PRIOR to the tribulation.

Here is when Jesus said He comes to gather His Church, the last Sign He gave there in Matthew 24 about His coming...

Matt 24:29-31
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:


30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
KJV


You tell me brethren, can those on the false Pre-tribulational Rapture Theory not read?? You'd think so, since Lord Jesus showed emphatically there that His coming to gather His Church is AFTER that tribulation He mentioned.

And if you read that article in the above OP link, you'll find they don't let you know about this above section of that Matthew 24 chapter. They skip over it. They even stop at Matthew 24:28 for support, and then pick back up at Matthew 24:36. Now why would they do that? It is because they are in support of men's doctrine of a Pre-tribulational Rapture Theory which falsely teaches that Jesus comes to rapture us BEFORE the tribulation of those days, not AFTER like Jesus said.

So why would anyone who loves the Truth want to listen to those false deceivers?
 
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GRACE ambassador

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that Matthew 24 chapter. They skip over it.
False accusation that even got "a like." Then please tell me how I read, and
studied Prayerfully and Carefully, and came to an erroneous Conclusion,
skipping over any of God's Words in God's Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided:

Part I

God’s PRE - TOJT Great GRACE Departure!:

----------------------------------------------------------------------

LORD JESUS, we beseech Thee Now For Thy Divine Understanding
In This Thy Most Important Doctrine For our Comfort And Consolation.
Amen. (1 Thessalonians 4:18)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Time Of JACOB’s {Israel's} Trouble (TOJT), Ending With The
Second Coming
, is found in God's Context:

God's Prophetic Program, Under LAW, gospel of the kingdom
(“ages” past/future) (Genesis-John; Hebrews-Revelation)

God’s “Earthly Kingdom” Purpose From “the foundation of the world”
(Matthew 25:34)

God's Purpose Prophesied “since the world began”
(Luke 1:68-70; Acts 3:21!)

Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15!) From Things That DIFFER:

Great GRACE Departure!

Pre-TOJT Resurrection/Departure of The Body Of CHRIST,
Ending God’s Age Of GRACE, Is Found In:

God's Revelation Of The Mystery, Under The Gospel Of The GRACE Of God!
{ Current = “But NOW!” } (Romans through Philemon!)

God’s “Heavenly Hidden” Purpose Before “the foundation of the world”
(Ephesians 1:4; 2 Timothy 1:9!)

God's Heavenly Purpose Kept Secret “since the world began”
(Romans 16:25; Ephesians 1:4-11, 3:5-9!)

-------------------

The Second Coming, According to Prophecy:

(1) Immediately After tribulation/4 signs, CHRIST, In His
Prophesied Second Advent, As KING Of kings, And LORD Of lords,
Is Coming From Heaven! (Matthew 24:29; Revelation 19:16, 11!)

(2) CHRIST Is Coming On a white horse, With Crowns On
His Head, And A Sword In His Mouth! (Revelation 19:12-15)

(3) CHRIST Is Coming With, (which Were In Heaven!),
His armies * on white horses! (Revelation 19:12-15)

(4) CHRIST Is Coming To earth With ONE army *, “All Of His holy angels,”
In Order To Judge/Make war/Smite And Rule the nations…
(Matthew 25:31; Revelation 19:11, 15)

(5) With Another trumpet (AFTER "the 7th angel trumpet” in heaven), on
the earth, Angels Are SENT, By The KING, TO:gather the elect”...
(Matthew 24:31; Mark 13:27!)

(6)...for the “judgment of the Earthly Nations” By The Son of man, The King!
(Matthew 25:31-46!)

(7) Those Judged as righteous then enter the kingdom! And the UNrighteous
then Depart into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels!
(Matthew 25:34-46!)

Precious friend, "skipped over Matthew_24"???

To be continued...

 
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GRACE ambassador

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Part II

The Second Coming, According to earthly Prophecy:
Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15!) From Things That DIFFER:

The Great GRACE Departure, According to The Heavenly Mystery!:

(1) Immediately After GRACE Has ENDED/ZERO signs!:
CHRIST, As Head Of His Body, The Church, Will Descend From
Heaven! (Ephesians 1:19-23; Colossians 1:18; 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17!)

(2) CHRIST Is Coming With A Shout, With the voice of an archangel,
And With The Trump of God! (1 Thessalonians 4:16!)

3) God (JESUS CHRIST) Will Bring With Him {those who Were With
Him In Heaven}, part Of His Own, those who are “asleep In JESUS!”
(2 Corinthians 5:8; Philippians 1:21-23; 1 Thessalonians 4:13!)

(4) CHRIST Descends With One archangel, Will resurrect those
asleep {in 3)} First, and Then, we “which are alive and remain,” {which
Is A Mystery!}, will be changed/all “incorruptible, And Caught Up”
together to meet The LORD in the air, in the “twinkling of an eye!”
(1 Thessalonians 4:16-17; 1 Corinthians 15:52-53!)

(5) CHRIST “Gathers His Body” To Himself, to Take them To Heaven...
(2 Thessalonians 2:1-3; 1 Corinthians 15:49; 2 Corinthians 12:2, 5:1-2;
Ephesians 1:3, 20, 2:6; Philippians 3:20; 2 Timothy 4:18!)


6)...For The Judgment Seat Of CHRIST, For HIS Heavenly Body,
By The Head Himself!... (Romans 2:6, 16, 14:10-12;
1 Corinthians 3:8-15, 4:5, 6:20; 2 Corinthians 5:10;
Ephesians 6:8; Colossians 3:24-25!)

(7a) ...After Judgment, the GRACE assembly Is Then Presented as
A Glorious Church, To CHRIST Himself!... (Ephesians 5:27!)

(7b) ...And, Then CHRIST Will Present His Body, holy and
unblameable and unreproveable, In His Sight, To His Father,
In Heaven
, Where we Live * Forever And Ever! Amen!
(1 Thessalonians 3:13; Colossians 1:5, 22;
1 Corinthians 6:3; 2 Corinthians 5:1-2 KJB!)

* Note, The ONE army Of The Body Of CHRIST, Must "have been
assigned our Heavenly positions" for ruling and reigning! Amen?

---------------------------------------------------------------

LORD JESUS, thank You so much for Your Precious BLOOD,
Gift Of Eternal Salvation, And for Your Blessed Hope of
Glorification
When You Come To Finally Gather us Home! Amen.

---------------------------------------------------------

Please Be Very Richly Blessed, Encouraged, And Comforted! And:

Precious friend(s), see you In God's Great GloryLand!!:)

Of course, Davy, you can "skip over" This "deceit," IF you wish...
 
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