Let's discuss..cessation after death?

[BarneyFife]

Highlighter send me a link with over 500 pages

Yeah, he's nothing if not a veritable storehouse of information. He's new but I picked that up real quick. He seems happy to have a place to freely express his great affinity for the King James Bible (I love it, myself).

 

[Johann]

Yeah, he's nothing if not a veritable storehouse of information.

...till there's a disagreement then you see the "other" side..
J.

 

[David H.]

Well then, we have circled back around to every man is born eternal rather than there being only one way to eternal life.

Adam and Eve would have lived forever had they not sinned? Do you believe this? Man was created an eternal being to begin with, Death was introduced by sin, correct? If death and hell are cast into the lake of fire that means to me that there is no more death, even for the wicked who are eternally tormented.

Good point here "stunned", What Jesus did on the cross redeemed all humankind But there is only one way to enter LIFE, abundant life in the eternal realm (Kingdom of God). All the rest who reject the free gift of the cross go into eternal torment or outer darkness. Our Catholic Brethren here would say outer darkness refers to purgatory, I think it is a place of torment that none would want to be in, being able to see what they missed out on never to be allowed to enter into... a place of weeping and gnashing of teeth as scripture says.

 

[Johann]

Adam and Eve would have lived forever had they not sinned?

Excellent point David

 

[Johann]

a place of weeping and gnashing of teeth as scripture says.

500 pages will tell you otherwise brother.
J.

 

[Johann]

Do you believe this? Man was created an eternal being to begin with,

Another good point brother Aorist Tense.
J.

 

[Johann]

King James Bible (I love it, myself).

I love to read various versions and to do an in depth study on words.
J.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

First, we need to understand that once we have come to faith in Jesus, we abide in Him and always will. Abiding is our default mode. It is just like breathing, it’s what we do naturally in Christ. Do you walk around focusing on your breathing all day? Hopefully not, that sounds tiring. In the same way, we do not have to go around every minute of the day questioning ourselves, “Am I abiding? Am I abiding?” If you are in Christ, you are abiding. It’s as simple as that. What glory this is!

I was following along with your post until this paragraph. This paragraph is troubling. It doesn’t help me. I call bull on this paragraph. It’s not going to help anyone.

Abiding means to remain. Telling a man to “remain in Him” just puzzles the man. He may nod his head and pretend he understands but he doesn’t. Also, abiding is not our default mode. At all!

Abiding means remaining in trust or continuing to trust Him. His Spirit always remains in us, even when we don’t remain in trust in Him and all He has said. He does not abandon us. He knows our frame our fright and our weakness and He has great patience as we learn to run our race of trust and to endure in trust for longer and longer periods of time without stumbling in our trust. We do not suddenly have a default mode of continuing to continually trust Him. If anything, our default mode is worry and worry some more. Israel in the desert describes us. Temporal worries and cares replace continuing and growing trust.

So He is faithful to remain in us but we are not faithful and we stumble many times and stop trusting and start worrying and complaining.

 

[marks]

I am neither a JW, nor SDA, it's just the concept of eternal hell has never made sense to me, so much so that it inspired me to write a book on the subject; but then only devoted two chapters to it. That was enough. It has a nice ring to it: "Hell ... If I Know". Don't bother - it is out of print, so this isn't a plug. It did not do well for several reasons, one of which is the title - too scary ... along with the cover as well. A woman would not pick it up. What was I thinking? Oh well, it detoured a few people and I loved the research and enjoy writing
I had a year off during the 2008-09 recession, so I dove in 8-10 hours/ day for ten months. Needless to say, I am familiar with the nature of hell, having examined it in every which way. It is a good study. It is important- it is what we are saved from.

It turns out . . . your book is available on Amazon.

https://www.amazon.com/HELL-IF-KNOW/dp/1609579836

Way cool!

Much love!

 

[Johann]

So He is faithful to remain in us but we are not faithful and we stumble many times and stop trusting and start worrying and complaining.

Just checking also remember those who don't have the Spirit of Christ are none of Christ.
This was not my post but it shows you how worldly oratory spoils everything.
what is the sealing of the Holy spirit?
J.

 

[Johann]

I was following along with your post until this paragraph

Not my post but from Stunned by Grace.

 

[David H.]

500 pages will tell you otherwise brother.

? Not sure what you are referring to here?

 

[David H.]

500 pages will tell you otherwise brother.

Outer darkness, whatever you think that means, is a place of weeping and gnashing of teeth according to scripture.
See link:
KJV Search Results for "weeping" AND "and" AND "gnashing" (blueletterbible.org)

 

[Johann]

So He is faithful to remain in us but we are not faithful and we stumble many times and stop trusting and start worrying and complaining.

IF we stop trusting, start worrying you think it is over for the teknon of God?
After all, it is a covenant, a relationship with our Father through Christ Who is well aware of our vacillating nature/character.
J.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Adam and Eve would have lived forever had they not sinned? Do you believe this? Man was created an eternal being to begin with, Death was introduced by sin, correct?

mmm…it’s a great question…He might give us more understanding. It’s a lot of spiritual stuff, which is definitely NOT, as johann put it, our “ default mode.”

Satan seems, to all appearances, to have eternal life in his horribly fallen state. He seems to have been created eternal somehow.

Adam was not given the option to eat of the tree of eternal life after his state became fallen. God blocked the way to it so he could not eat from it and live forever! There’s even an exclamation point in my translation.

Adam was made to bring forth of his own kind. So how could a man who did not have eternal life in him from eating from that tree then sire someone with eternal life in THEM? His “kind” was not an eternally living kind.

 

[Johann]

Outer darkness, whatever you think that means, is a place of weeping and gnashing of teeth according to scripture.

David, members here will tell you Blue Letter Bible and the link is not "scripturally" correct.
J.

 

[marks]

The antithesis would be..those who do not will "live" eternally in the wrong destination.
Blessings
J.

The issue there is not where each will be, as the believer is promised life. But the issue is, what is the Biblical definition and use of "life" and of "death"?

This is commonly thought of as an end, but in the Bible, it's a separation.

Much love!

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Outer darkness, whatever you think that means, is a place of weeping and gnashing of teeth according to scripture.
See link:
KJV Search Results for "weeping" AND "and" AND "gnashing" (blueletterbible.org)

You’re right. Outer darkness is described with weeping and gnashing. So is being thrown in the lake of fire. But I don’t think they are the same place.

 

[Johann]

? Not sure what you are referring to here?

Never mind David, keep up the good fight.
J.

 

[Johann]

This is commonly thought of as an end, but in the Bible, it's a separation.

Everlasting separation, a short space of "purgatory" or total annihilation?