In-depth Bible Study on Eternal Punishment

[MatthewG]

It's a completed farce!

1John 2:17

"And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

Here we see the contrast of the world/lust coming to an end, but forever going into infinity.

This is proof that "forever" does not come to an end in age, as the UR insists on! But it can depending on context.

As far as the "flames and fire" you speak of,

Matt. 25:41

"Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:"

These are men to whom Jesus is speaking. They will go to "everlasting fire" that was prepared for the devil and his angels.

So we see that man will be in "flames" and it will be "everlasting/forever." Into infinity!

Everlasting and forever both come from the Greek word "aionios."

This was explained already in the post. Some words in the Kjv are mistranslated, when they should say Age.

You can read something 100 times, but if you are willfully blind, you will continue to be blind. I have already posted two verses to refute your false beliefs about eternal Hell. So you can either repent of false doctrine, or you can persist in your heresies. The choice is yours.

Many people are always warning me. I don’t know why? It is probably due to handed down traditions that where handed down. There could be many reasons.

 

[Charlie24]

This was explained already in the post. Some words in the Kjv are mistranslated, when they should say Age.

John was not comparing an Age that would come to an end (the world of lust) to another Age that would come to an end (The believer who lives forever).

He was comparing an Age that will come to an end to an Age that will not come to an end.

For example, Paul calls the New Covenant the everlasting covenant. It has no end.

The New Covenant will cover several Ages in time but has no end.

 

[atpollard]

The “walls of text” suggest the monologue of someone that is “waiting to speak” rather than any sort of dialogue with someone that is “listening”. There may be some that are looking to read a diadectic monologue, but I come to topics looking for a more give and take dialogue in which “iron sharpens iron”.

So while the SUBJECT holds some interest to me … this “study” does not.
I will simply say “I disagree.” and move on.

 

[MatthewG]

Yes, but one has to go back to the Greek to find out where all these words line up @Charlie24

I have a young’s literal translation here at the house and I use it to read from, the revelation compared to Ylt and Kjv or even Niv are totally different yet the same though all the Greek words are straightly translated.

Anyway, this topic is not about the new covenant so let’s stay on topic please.

This topic deals with Eternal Punishment through it we learn about the several words from the Greek understanding and looking at scripture to help build up a case.

If anyone is honestly looking to see what is being presented here it is encouraged to start from the first post all the up the summary post to get the fullest picture.

I don’t mind if people do not want to do that, in fact the other day talking to a twenty three year old man I asked him does he like to read the Bible he stated since his grandpa died he kind of just doesn’t read the Bible anymore.

Aside from just reading the Bible there is also something called studying the Bible, the posts from the book called Anarchist CrookBook, by Shawn is an aim at studies done over time which he collaborated in a work which is presented on the first page: so please if anyone desires to do a full look, please consider from the first post to the summary.

 

[MatthewG]

The “walls of text” suggest the monologue of someone that is “waiting to speak” rather than any sort of dialogue with someone that is “listening”. There may be some that are looking to read a diadectic monologue, but I come to topics looking for a more give and take dialogue in which “iron sharpens iron”.

So while the SUBJECT holds some interest to me … this “study” does not.
I will simply say “I disagree.” and move on.

That is the polite thing to do, sir.

 

[MatthewG]

Many people will miss out on the information that is lead on Eschatology (found in the book that was mention in the first post) which many would find heretical because the sign out on the church near the place you go to clock into work reads “Jesus rose again and He is coming back”, I personally don’t believe Jesus is coming back like he did in 70Ad for his first church bride which was pure, holy, and blameless and according to the text virgins those 144,000.

So while I hold on to Jesus came already back already many people still today are hoping for the future return of the Messiah, I too was in this group however upon discovering truths founded upon Jesus him and the aposltes themselves my mind was altered and changed to believing he came back in 70Ad and has established the Kingdom of God and the New heavens and new earth.

 

[MatthewG]

@atpollard sometimes I just tired of the iron sharpens iron, which it’s a good thing to do sure, however there are many people who will simply refuse to change their mind and then it becomes wasted time.

 

[Charlie24]

Yes, but one has to go back to the Greek to find out where all these words line up @Charlie24

I have a young’s literal translation here at the house and I use it to read from, the revelation compared to Ylt and Kjv or even Niv are totally different yet the same though all the Greek words are straightly translated.

Anyway, this topic is not about the new covenant so let’s stay on topic please.

This topic deals with Eternal Punishment through it we learn about the several words from the Greek understanding and looking at scripture to help build up a case.

If anyone is honestly looking to see what is being presented here it is encouraged to start from the first post all the up the summary post to get the fullest picture.

I don’t mind if people do not want to do that, in fact the other day talking to a twenty three year old man I asked him does he like to read the Bible he stated since his grandpa died he kind of just doesn’t read the Bible anymore.

Aside from just reading the Bible there is also something called studying the Bible, the posts from the book called Anarchist CrookBook, by Shawn is an aim at studies done over time which he collaborated in a work which is presented on the first page: so please if anyone desires to do a full look, please consider from the first post to the summary.

The New Covenant was just an example of a point I made concerning this thread. Surly you understand that.

But look, once the seed of the UR sets in there is nothing that can be said. The bottom line in the UR thing is that they believe man will have a second chance to accept Christ and diminish his punishment.

No such thing exists in scripture!

 

[MatthewG]

The New Covenant was just an example of a point I made concerning this thread. Surly you understand that.

But look, once the seed of the UR sets in there is nothing that can be said. The bottom line in the UR thing is that they believe man will have a second chance to accept Christ and diminish his punishment.

No such thing exists in scripture!

Nothing says it can’t happen either.

Jesus is the only way, one way, through him.

God bless bud.

 

[Charlie24]

Nothing says it can’t happen either.

Jesus is the only way, one way, through him.

God bless bud.

Reminds me of several years ago when a URist told me that this is a surprise to humanity from God.

I told him not to hold his breath considering they have rejected the Father's only Son and have gone to the grave with that denial.

 

[atpollard]

@atpollard sometimes I just tired of the iron sharpens iron, which it’s a good thing to do sure, however there are many people who will simply refuse to change their mind and then it becomes wasted time.

Too true.

 

[MatthewG]

This study may not seem all that important and many people may just be comfortable where they are relative to the subject at hand but it probably would be beneficial to one considering the end scope of things.

Understanding that there is after-life punishment which results in loss, however and expected outcome is that one will find out their need for Christ Jesus in the end, and they will go on to be in the heavenly realm, though not into the kingdom of Heaven which is where those of Faith here and now go into after this life if they lived their life in having love for God and love for others.

Learning a subject like this is very vast, and deep and it takes time to really study it, may people be blessed whoever may take a moment of their time to see what has been discovered.

God bless to all people and may you find this message encouraging to you because I get tired of all the bullsh*** when it comes to people and them only resulting in the only defense they have which is calling “Heresy!”

Take care, may the spirit of the Lord guide.

Matthew Gallagher

 

[quietthinker]

quietthinker said: ↑
Matthew, make the effort and listen to this. I'd even appreciate your feedback.
101 Idioms and the Bible Part One

Matthew G said:
Maybe I will get to this, I don’t know.

quietthinker said:
@ MatthewG ...You need to make the effort Matthew.....it'll save you making the thousands of words you currently make.

 

[MatthewG]

quietthinker said: ↑
Matthew, make the effort and listen to this. I'd even appreciate your feedback.
101 Idioms and the Bible Part One

Matthew G said:
Maybe I will get to this, I don’t know.

quietthinker said:
@ MatthewG ...You need to make the effort Matthew.....it'll save you making the thousands of words you currently make.

All that is known is to serve God and love him first and to love others while given the chance in this life. Thank you for the link, it’s fine for helping others. Assuredly that is what the people are trying to do. It’s good to help others and that being the spiritual needs of others, even though we have the poor with us all the time (what Jesus said.)

 

[quietthinker]

All that is known is to serve God and love him first and to love others while given the chance in this life. Thank you for the link, it’s fine for helping others. Assuredly that is what the people are trying to do. It’s good to help others and that being the spiritual needs of others, even though we have the poor with us all the time (what Jesus said.)

I'm certain none of us are that rich in understanding we cannot learn more.

 

[Hidden In Him]

The Second Scenario of After-life Punishment

Matthew, it took you until Post #39 to finally start addressing people responding to this thread, principally because you were apparently busy copying and pasting a huge amount of material no one here could conceivably address. We've had members here who marathon posted like that before, but they didn't last long. Eventually the forum gets sick of them posting themselves into oblivion with seemingly no regard for others.

I realize that may not have been your intention, but just a heads up. Forums are for dialogue. Attempt to turn things into a long-running monologue and you will get addressed about it, and eventually ignored. I was going to respond to a few things myself, but lost interest immediately when I noticed you were downloading dozens of pages of material that could never be adequately countered unless one were to dedicate weeks to doing so, and most of us have too much going on to be addressing that many posts.

God bless,
Hidden In Him

 

[MatthewG]

I'm certain none of us are that rich in understanding we cannot learn more.

That is up to the individual? Wouldn’t you say?

There wasn’t anything wrong with your link by the way, did check it out.

Nothing to add though here, from me personally other than for people to be encouraged to read their bibles, and seek out having rest and peace found in the Lord.

Matthew, it took you until Post #39 to finally start addressing people responding to this thread, principally because you were apparently busy copying and pasting a huge amount of material no one here could conceivably address. We've had members here who marathon posted like that before, but they didn't last long. Eventually the forum gets sick of them posting themselves into oblivion with seemingly no regard for others.

I realize that may not have been your intention, but just a heads up. Forums are for dialogue. Attempt to turn things into a long-running monologue and you will get addressed about it, and eventually ignored. I was going to respond to a few things myself, but lost interest immediately when I noticed you were downloading dozens of pages of material that could never be adequately countered unless one were to dedicate weeks to doing so, and most of us have too much going on to be addressing that many posts.

God bless,
Hidden In Him

Oh you know, I cannot help what people like or dislike.

On a thread you make you decide how you handle things don’t you? This one was specifically a Bible study for the purpose of addressing a certain topic, thus it was handled a certain way.

 

[MatthewG]

What a terrible world one would have to live in to worry about what individuals thought about them, highly anxiety driven.

There is God who is rich in mercy, kindness, long suffering and Love that desires to provide you a way to have peace in your own life by seeking and learning and growing in the knowledge of His Son, Jesus Christ.

All of us as human beings are different from each other in the body of Christ, and I’m probably just a small toe nail, or perhaps part of the stinky methane gas that leaves our bowels but that is my part in the body.

Everyone has their own part in the body of Christ and not everyone is exactly the same so remember that whoever may be reading and be joyful and rejoice knowing you are loved by God and nothing can separate you from that love in Christ Jesus (except you yourself), if you worry about what a collective group of people may think about you, trust in God and remember he will provide, just like he provided for Abraham.

Continue to grow in knowledge and in spirit, but don’t become prideful and haughty which the LORD hates, but lowly and humble.

May the Spirit of God, be with you, and remember when you are having troubles you have God (our Father) to pray to and ask for help in wisdom (James) and for help by the spirit (Galatians 5), in Jesus name!

Be encouaged.

 

[Charlie24]

All that is known is to serve God and love him first and to love others while given the chance in this life. Thank you for the link, it’s fine for helping others. Assuredly that is what the people are trying to do. It’s good to help others and that being the spiritual needs of others, even though we have the poor with us all the time (what Jesus said.)

I've been pretty hard on you, Matthew. I can see that you love God and have a big heart for others, and I certainly don't want to discourage you from that with negativity toward this thread.

I'm sure you are aware how that scriptural doctrine is established. It's by scripture interpreting scripture on facts. Those facts can be misinterpreted and leads to false doctrine. But even false doctrine is derived from scriptural facts, even though that scripture may be misinterpreted. It's up to the individual to determine for themselves what is true and what is false.

In the case of UR, there are no facts being interpreted. I hope you can see that! It's all a theory, no facts whatsoever from scripture to create a doctrine. It's reasoning with no factual foundation.

The problem is that it is not presented as such, but quite the opposite. Many will lead you to believe this is a doctrine, but it's not, it's just wishful thinking.

I hope you will give this some thought and in the future present this theory as it should be presented, a theory with no foundation.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Oh you know, I cannot help what people like or dislike.

Yes you can. Conducting oneself as having consideration for others is something entirely under your control.

You teach a great deal of falsehoods, Matthew - granted, so do a lot of members here - but the problem is that this becomes less tolerable the less considerate you are of others.