A World Of Masters And Slaves

[Hidden In Him]

Since I think the basic human sin nature remains intact in the Millennium, I think the absence of international warfare will simply be a matter of a relaxation of tensions in the world. The human sins will still be there, and I think the world will continue much the way it is today, with the exception that the glorified Church will be able to spiritually rule, perhaps from heaven. We come to earth with Christ only to impose the rule of his Kingdom, but we may be retained in heaven until the New Jerusalem descends from heaven at the end of the Millennium.

In the Millennium, I think we, the glorified Church, will be able to impose the realization of all of the promises God made to Abraham, with a large group of Christian nations restored, and a restraint of pagan nations to maintain a civilized order among nations. I don't think it will be "heaven" yet for those on the earth!

More than that, I think the Lord reigning from Jerusalem will be the biggest factor. Kingdoms and nations are only as strong as their rulers are.

Take care. BTW, you might talk to Cady (if he's on this forum) about making videos. I've long enjoyed his informative videos--they're simple but worthy. Good luck!

Thanks for that! I might look him up when the time comes. I believe I watched one or two of his videos, and I thought they were well-done as well : )

 

[Hidden In Him]

But I don't think Satan has done half the things he would've loved to do on earth. God controls what happens. The Church continues to operate. Satan cannot stop God's word from being fulfilled.

Yes, I agree.

So I would place less emphasis on the fear and anxiety associated with the Antichrist,

I think sometimes people view me as focusing too much on what the enemy is doing, but it may be more of a psychological difference is all. I'm very into Christianity from the perspective of the spiritual war, so I am constantly watching what the enemy is doing, just as he is constantly watching us. Most of what he does works through deception, so the more you expose it the less effective his strategies are. But not everyone has a taste for an endless diet of meditating on what the enemy is doing, and I fully understand it. With each of us, it's a matter of how much we can or even should endure, given our own calling and temperament.

 

[Hidden In Him]

This is happening now.
Hard to believe over the clanging and clamour of the left, But God is on the move.
And His body is turning ploughshares into swords.
What are these swords? They are the words of TRUTH.
We are in an information war.
There has been one narrative pervasively moving the world in the direction it wants it to go under the banner of "Democracy"
But this "Democracy" in Truth is Tyranny. And it is being called out, and pushed back, all around the world.
We do not fight against flesh and blood. This is no conventional war used with conventional weapons.
This war requires the Armor of God. And you need to be wearing yours at all times.

So many people complaining.. Why aren't the rebublicans using the same tactics as the democrats?
Because Republicans believe in Law and Order, not Unlawfulness and Chaos.
Yes the fight is slow and it is long. And more soldiers are needed to combat the disinformation and the lies controlling the minds of our children.
They have been indoctrinating them with hate since kindergarten, even from the womb.
Our greatest weapon is Love. They don't understand it. They can't relate. They have no tolerance for peace.

Their very mantra "No Justice No Peace" is not a cry for fairness and equality. It is a statement and something they strive to acheive.

You can not fight an informational war if you do not understand the language.
And most are able to see now for themselves the deliberate twisting of the meanings and descriptions of the words.
They have created their own lingo. And everything we know to mean good, they mean to be evil. And everything we know to mean evil, to them it is good.

In order to fight in this war you have to be a kind of undercover agent. Going into places like tweets and chatrooms where most christians would never set foot in. You have to learn the language. Understand who is pulling the strings, financing their movement, and what their objective is on any given day.
One day it is the Supreme Court, another day it is the media, another day it is education. Whatever they need to attack will be done in such a subliminal way it will seem foolish and harmless until it takes a foothold in your community.
Gay Pride Parades, DragQueen story hour at the library. Children invited to bars to offer money at queer stripclubs.
They will turn your children against you. They already tell them that they are not to listen to you, but they themselves are the authority.
If you move against them to protect your children, you are arrested as child abusers and they take them from you.
You have no right to say you don't want your children's genitilia modified. You are inhibiting their mental health.

If you have not seen any of this for yourself, if you have not heard of such things, you MUST educate yourself for your children's sake.
We're not going to let them take us down without a fight. And people are rising, people are PRAYING, people are putting on their armour and saying, NO MORE!
The war is already in progress. It's time to decide which side you will choose.
Because if not now, when?

Jesus is Our King. We bow to no man. We trust no man. And we will fight.


Godspeed
Hugs

Let me get to this one later today. Some interesting statements.

Have a blessed day, sister!
- H

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Mind control - where the populace is reduced to in essence existing as slaves controlled by the State.

mind control makes me think of a reprobate mind. (My husband suggested mind control is Christianity…I’m thinking he is right). Your title also “masters and slaves” makes me reflect on Jesus Christ who warn about those who want to be masters. What did He teach, or reveal?

One thing that your post has helped with is
Revelation 17:17 For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.

“For God has put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast…” why? Why would God put in their hearts—to agree—and give their kingdom to the beast …especially with
Matthew 5:25 Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison.

My question is it against the will of God —when it says He put it in their hearts to fulfill His will—any one who does the will of God?—they fulfill His Will and will hand their kingdom over to the beast …lest at any time the adversary deliver you to the judge, and the judge deliver you to the officer, and you be cast into prison.prayer, praying, pray

 

[Ziggy]

For God hath put in their hearts

Who is "their" ?

In the days of Moses, God hardened Pharoah's heart. He would not admit nor submit to an Almighty God.
And Pharoah's army rushed to their own death in the red sea, because they gave all authority to Pharoah who sat on the throne.

Rev 17:12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.
Rev 17:13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.
Rev 17:14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.


Rev 17:15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.
Rev 17:16 And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.
Rev 17:17 For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.
Rev 17:18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.

What is God's will?

Exo 9:13 And the LORD said unto Moses, Rise up early in the morning, and stand before Pharaoh, and say unto him, Thus saith the LORD God of the Hebrews, Let my people go, that they may serve me.
Exo 9:14 For I will at this time send all my plagues upon thine heart, and upon thy servants, and upon thy people; that thou mayest know that there is none like me in all the earth.
Exo 9:15 For now I will stretch out my hand, that I may smite thee and thy people with pestilence; and thou shalt be cut off from the earth.
Exo 9:16 And in very deed for this cause have I raised thee up, for to shew in thee my power; and that my name may be declared throughout all the earth.
Exo 9:17 As yet exaltest thou thyself against my people, that thou wilt not let them go?


Rev 17:12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.

Luk 22:52 Then Jesus said unto the chief priests, and captains of the temple, and the elders, which were come to him, Be ye come out, as against a thief, with swords and staves?
Luk 22:53When I was daily with you in the temple, ye stretched forth no hands against me: but this is your hour, and the power of darkness.

Rev 3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

True christians are being slandered, called conspiracy theorists, coerced, bullied into believing what the world wants us to accept as "normal"
They are calling us nazi's, white supremists, terrorists, to cause us to cower in fear. To be ashamed for what we stand for.
This is their hour, and this power has been given into their hands by the rich, the elites, the corporations, the religions, the education, the militaries of the world, to beat us down into submission.
We are being tested and tried, and if we remain true, we will not fall under their power of delusion.

But in truth, this is a false sense of power. God is allowing them to believe they have the authority of God in their hands.
And just like Pharoah, God will bring them down with their own devices.

They send plagues upon us, and yet it is them who are getting this virus.
They called us the pandemic of the unvaccinated and took away our livlihood, our families, our lives. They tried to shut down our meeting houses of worship. Told us we couldn't sing. We couldn't hold our loved ones as they were dying. We watched through plexiglass windows while they killed our parents, grandparents, brothers and sisters.
WE'RE STILL HERE!

They have power over our food supply, our water supply, our land, our education, our military, our children.
And we will suffer this loss gladly, because we know what is waiting on the other side.

Keep the Faith
Trust God
Hugs

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Who is "their" ?

that is a good question. I don’t know because I’m just now considering those verses as well. I’ve always wondered though why that verse says God put it in the heart to fulfill His Will. My thought process being how is it bad to fulfill the Will of God …for example when Christ asked for the cup to be removed but submitted to going to be crucified “Father, not my will be done, but your Will be done”

Still Revelation 17:17 makes me Think of agreeing with your adversary quickly, and who that instruction is for? Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

‘For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.’


Romans 1:28-32 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; [29] Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, [30] Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, [31] Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: [32] Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Rev 17:14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

2 Peter 2:19-22 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage. [20] For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. [21] For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them. [22] But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.
?

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Concerning a world of “Masters and slaves”
“My kingdom is not of this world”?
John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

The topic really has me asking what confession did Jesus witness before Pilate?
1 Timothy 6:11-15 But thou, O man of God, flee these things; and follow after righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, meekness. [12] Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, whereunto thou art also called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses. [13] I give thee charge in the sight of God, who quickeneth all things, and before Christ Jesus, who before Pontius Pilate witnessed a good confession; [14] That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukeable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ: [15] Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;

 

[Randy Kluth]

Yes, I agree.


I think sometimes people view me as focusing too much on what the enemy is doing, but it may be more of a psychological difference is all. I'm very into Christianity from the perspective of the spiritual war, so I am constantly watching what the enemy is doing, just as he is constantly watching us. Most of what he does works through deception, so the more you expose it the less effective his strategies are. But not everyone has a taste for an endless diet of meditating on what the enemy is doing, and I fully understand it. With each of us, it's a matter of how much we can or even should endure, given our own calling and temperament.

Just sharing brother. I actually have a high level of respect for you and for what you're doing. And I do think you're doing exactly what you say you're doing. Again, we're talking inches apart--not miles on some pretty speculative matters. Good brothers can do that.

My flesh and blood brother and I mix it up regularly--sometimes heated. But he's the best brother in the world, and we both respect each other. He's very language oriented, ie biblical languages, and I'm theology-minded. So there are different elements in both approaches, and it helps to share.

I do believe in much of what you're saying about what Satan is trying to do. I just try to keep perspective about Satan's limitations, and try not to give him too much credit!

I've spent my life in biblical prophecy, and have, in recent years focused on a couple of key issues. One of them is the conspiracy you speak of. The Christian West has been slowly deteriorating over the last few centuries, particularly after the Enlightenment. Things have greatly accelerated in the last few decades. I think we can finally say, "the end is here!"

I just keep in mind what Paul warned about--getting too worked up. Hyperventilating gets in the way of a well-reasoned message that appeals to people beyond their emotional state of mind. We are speaking to the spirit of men--not working them up emotionally. But emotions sometimes help, as well. A big red dragon does get the attention, and the Holy Spirit used that language literally.

 

[Ziggy]

Jhn 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

Jesus says to Pilate: This is the reason I was born, and for this cause came I into the world...
What reason? What cause?
That I should bear witness unto the truth.
Jesus never said he was a King, other's accused him of wanting to be king. Others accused him of wanting to dethrone Caesar.
Others believed he came to restore the Kingdom of Jerusalem as David's heir to the throne.
And Pilate asked him, art thou a king? Jesus answered, that's what you say.
But I will tell you why I was born and what is my cause.
I was sent here to bear witness to the truth.

Jesus would not receive his kingdom until after he rose from the dead and all enemies were put under his feet.

Jesus said: My Kingdom is not of this world, some say age.
My Kingdom is not of this age, meaning it was not at that time that his Kingdom would reign.

John was given a letter to the churches in the book of Revelation which reads:

Rev 1:4 John to the seven churches which are in Asia: Grace be unto you, and peace, from him which is, and which was, and which is to come; and from the seven Spirits which are before his throne;
Rev 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,
Rev 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

Was this message to the current churches in Asia, or were they written for a future world?
In verse 6, we are either now or yet to be kings and priests.
And what does it mean, "The time is at hand" in verse 3?
Rev 1:3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.

Was this 2000 years ago or is this for today, or for some future time yet to come?

Are there ather examples of the "time being at hand" ?

Mat 4:17 From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

Mat 26:18 And he said, Go into the city to such a man, and say unto him, The Master saith, My time is at hand; I will keep the passover at thy house with my disciples.

Mar 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

Rev 22:10 And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand.


I personally believe Jesus's Kingdom is here and now. And he teigns as King of kingd and Lord of Lords.
But his kingdom is not a material kingdom, but rather a government that is administered by his Spirit.
And we are the army of the Lord, here and now to do his will.
We will see the manifestation of this kingdom when all enemies of the truth are removed.
Until then it is still hidden behind a veil of secrecy. The world doesn not believe that it exists because it can not see it.
But we know it exists, because we live it every day. And we bare fruit, and we witness to others this glorious kingdom of the Lord, by being his Ambassadors, his representatives, as lights in a dark world.

Most of us are the blind man that could only see men walking as trees. We can't see through that dark glass.
But the closer you draw to God, the clearer the glass becomes. Until you find yourself no longer living in a material world,
but one where people are known by the spirit they bear.

Picture your life right now, where you are, living in the kingdom of God.
Hold that thought. Now take it with you everywhere you go for the rest of your life.
Amazing the things you see and hear and learn and know.

Faith:
Heb 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Hugs

 

[L.A.M.B.]

This thread give an immense amount of information relative to the times we are
living in.

There have been horrors pushed upon ppl since time began and Cain murdered his brother Abel. So why does it shock and horrify us the accounts of genocide, mass murders, abortions, ppl murderinging their whole family, road rage killings we look at it like the world has gone insane !

The glass truly is darkened but we walk in the light of the world if we be true followers of Christ. Our rest should be in him for perfect love cast out fear and fear has torment.

We know too that the one in control is God and he alone allows any to do what they do as fulfilment of his will. Is there really anything we can do about the end or must each instead focus on how to spread the word and share the love of Christ?

Now I'm not saying we bury our head in the sand for the word tells us to be sober and vigilant for the devil desires to devour us.( I too believe his chance will come by our death [ he thinks....lol ] in the great tribulations, which are directed at only those who call upon God...MO) Jesus said those in our own households would be our worst enemy turning us in to the council to be killed.

How ppl only see that the end is approaching and think in themselves ahhh I'm fixing to escape all by a pre- trib rapture astounds me.
Yes we are tried and persecuted here on earth today and some of us can barely stand it, whining like bleating lambs......poor us !

THIS IS NOT THE GREAT TRIBULATIONS WHICH SHALL COME UPON THE WHOLE WORLD TO TRY THEM THAT SAY THEY ARE OF CHRIST AND ......ARE NOT !

 

[Randy Kluth]

Jesus would not receive his kingdom until after he rose from the dead and all enemies were put under his feet.

Yes, but that will take place at the consummation of the age, I believe.

Jesus said: My Kingdom is not of this world, some say age.
My Kingdom is not of this age, meaning it was not at that time that his Kingdom would reign.

Yes, Christ's Kingdom will eventually take over the kingdoms of this world (Rev 11). It will eventually be an earthly Kingdom--just not the one JWs envision!

I would go farther and saw that even ancient Israel was a temporary form of the Kingdom of God. And I believe this theocracy was passed down to the Roman Empire when it converted to Christianity.

But again, these are *temporary* forms of God's Kingdom. Jesus said, "the Kingdom is near." He did not say it was already *here!*

Rev 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

Was this message to the current churches in Asia, or were they written for a future world?
In verse 6, we are either now or yet to be kings and priests.
And what does it mean, "The time is at hand" in verse 3?
Rev 1:3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.

Yes, I believe it was a statement of ultimate destiny, with ramifications for who we already are. We already have a limited amount of authority--again, a temporary application of God's heavenly Kingdom until the Kingdom ultimately comes. We have authority to carry out our specific ministries, as the Holy Spirit gifts us and leads us. Some can heal, deliver, bring to salvation, etc. We all have power to live righteous lives, to overcome sin. We have authority to declare Christ's forgiveness to all who repent and confess his name.

But the authority of an immortal life remains in the future. That's when we will actually reign as kings in a more complete way. I can't say that when we are persecuted here on earth, chastised, and suffer in various ways that we are yet heavenly kings!
But we should certainly have confidence in God's love for us, and believe that He stands with us as we carry out His directions.

 

[Ziggy]

You cannot live today hoping for tomorrow.
Tomorrow IS Today.
You will not observe the coming of the Kingdom of Christ, because that Kingdom resides within us.
Only when those in Christ rise up and claim this world as our inheritance, a gift from the Lord given to man to tend and keep it,
Then the true manifestation of Christ's Kingdom on earth shall be seen.

Destiny begins Today.

What is the interpretation or description of kings and priests to the Lord?
What does it mean to be His kings and priests?
Shall we all rule our own kingdom? Shall we all lead our own church?

How do you see that vision unfolding?
Melchisadek keeps coming to mind. He was both a king and a priest who went out to meet Abraham after the days of the battles of 5 kings.
What did Melchisadek do? He brought Abraham bread and wine.
Melchisadek was sent to give sustenance to Abraham.

Do you see yourself sitting on a throne expecting to be served by the people? Exacting tribute? Providing security?
What is the role of the kings and priests we are given to be unto the Lord?
Do we go into battles? Do we raise armies?
Do we provide refuge and a safe haven for a place of prayer?
Do we provide bread for the hungry and shelter for the widow and the fatherless, while their father's are off battling in the war?

What?
And why aren't we doing it now?
What are we waiting for?
Hugs

 

[Randy Kluth]

You cannot live today hoping for tomorrow.
Tomorrow IS Today.
You will not observe the coming of the Kingdom of Christ, because that Kingdom resides within us.
Only when those in Christ rise up and claim this world as our inheritance, a gift from the Lord given to man to tend and keep it,
Then the true manifestation of Christ's Kingdom on earth shall be seen.

I'm not a supporter of Faith Doctrine. I don't "claim" things unless I know God has already led me to do so. I believe Christ should dwell within us, but I believe that the Kingdom dwells within us only in the sense Christ reigns within us.

We don't "claim" the world as our inheritance, but we accept it as a gift from Christ through his redemptive sacrifice. We've been given new life, and this life was designed to inherit Christ's Kingdom. We don't "claim" it--we just accept it.

Destiny begins Today.

Spiritual Salvation is now--it is "today." However, what we've already received from Christ is merely a down payment on our inheritance. The eschatological Kingdom has not yet come.

As I said, the Kingdom is "near"--not *here.* It is within us only in the sense that we've given ourselves over to Christ's reign, by letting his spiritual life dominate our own life.

What is the interpretation or description of kings and priests to the Lord?

We share in Christ, who is our great high priest and king. We exercise his authority in matters of sharing his redemption with others, and aid others in subjecting their lives to the reign of Christ.

What does it mean to be His kings and priests?
Shall we all rule our own kingdom? Shall we all lead our own church?

We administer Christ's regal authority and priestly gifts by testifying to his word. It is Christ who brings redemption to the soul, and he is the king over all. As his ambassadors, we have authority to bind and to loose, to loose the sins of men by sharing with them the grace of Christ. And we bind them to their sins and to judgment when we speak the word of God against their sins, and they refuse to repent.

This is the matter of being his representatives, his ambassadors. The way we handle the word of God, by revelation from God, demonstrates with power God's word in our lives. There are signs and wonders that confirm this. We see people saved, and we see divine design in all we do.

How do you see that vision unfolding?
Melchisadek keeps coming to mind. He was both a king and a priest who went out to meet Abraham after the days of the battles of 5 kings.
What did Melchisadek do? He brought Abraham bread and wine.
Melchisadek was sent to give sustenance to Abraham.

M. was an actual king and an actual priest. As such, he was not these things the way we are in Christ. He was a political ruler, and he did administer truth to others on behalf of God. As such, he was a type of Christ, and not a type of us.

Do you see yourself sitting on a throne expecting to be served by the people? Exacting tribute? Providing security?
What is the role of the kings and priests we are given to be unto the Lord?
Do we go into battles? Do we raise armies?
Do we provide refuge and a safe haven for a place of prayer?
Do we provide bread for the hungry and shelter for the widow and the fatherless, while their father's are off battling in the war?

What?
And why aren't we doing it now?
What are we waiting for?
Hugs

As I said, we are not ruling in the eschatological Kingdom yet. We have authority to carry out our ministries, if we obey the Lord and carry out His instructions. We will see miracles, perhaps, and certainly signs and wonders.

And the things we teach and preach will show themselves to be true in the lives of those who hear. Good fruit will emerge. Children will be born. Yes, this is wonderful. But it isn't cause for self-glory--all the glory goes to Christ.

In this age we demonstrate power, but we still get sick, and we still die. Furthermore, we suffer persecution in this wicked world.

In the age to come, we will be sinless immortals. There will, as such, be a new earth, with no more cause for sin and rebellion against God. That Kingdom has not yet come, nor may we claim it...yet.

 

[Ziggy]

I plant seeds in my garden. I can't see the end results until it is put in motion.
Once it begins to grow, the vegetables take form and become recognizable.
We are the seeds in God's garden. We can't see the the manifestation of what we shall become.
But once we begin to move and grow, a shape will manifest itself and you will see the kingdom of God working in real time.

You will not walk until you take up your bed and move your feet soldier.
That angel isn't coming down to the pool to move the water for you.
Peter said: LORD! Let me walk on the water with you!
Jesus said: not yet, keep waiting, I'll tell you when.
NOT.

Timing:

Rom 8:18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time (2000 years ago) are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.
Rom 8:19 For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.
Rom 8:20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,
Rom 8:21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
Rom 8:22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now. (2000 years ago)
Rom 8:23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.
Rom 8:24 For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?
Rom 8:25 But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it.

What is this body Paul is speaking of? Is it the individual or is it the body of Christ in which we all have a role to play?

If that which we hope for ever manifests itself, is it then no longer hope?
Should we ever have an expectation of something becoming fulfilled because we will no longer need hope, but will have acheived the thing hoped for?
What will the manifestation of the sons of God look like?
Who are the sons of God?

1Jo 3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.


Jhn 6:35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.
Jhn 6:36 But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not.
Jhn 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
Jhn 6:38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
Jhn 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
Jhn 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Have you seen the Lord? Do you know what he looks like?
Is it the flesh body of a man that we seek or the Spirit of the Lord within eachother?
Are you able to see the spirit with carnal eyes?
Either you believe you have seen him and have everlasting life, or you have never seen him and have no everlasting life.
Must one see to believe?

Jhn 20:29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.

Faith can move mountains. If we have faith and we all live today as if we are residing in the very kingdom we are hoping to find,
eventually it will manifest itself before our eyes.
Where is that Faith??!!

Mat 21:21 Jesus answered and said unto them, Verily I say unto you, If ye have faith, and doubt not, ye shall not only do this which is done to the fig tree, but also if ye shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; it shall be done.
Mat 21:22 And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive.

Thy Kingdom Come, Thy Will Be Done, On Earth as it is in Heaven.

It's not going to happen if we keep praying about it and don't believe that we have already received our request.

Sometimes I believe people like living in the drama. They enjoy bad news about people getting killed and raped, and about criminals getting away without justice. They enjoy it. Even so called christians who claim they can't wait to see the Kingdom of God but aren't willing to lift one damn finger to bring it about.

We get what we deserve.

 

[Randy Kluth]

You will not walk until you take up your bed and move your feet soldier.
That angel isn't coming down to the pool to move the water for you.

So now we do the work that only angels do?

Peter said: LORD! Let me walk on the water with you!
Jesus said: not yet, keep waiting, I'll tell you when.
NOT.

Jesus did tell him when. Peter asked him 1st.

Matt 14.28 “Lord, if it’s you,” Peter replied, “tell me to come to you on the water.”
29 “Come,” he said.

I would suggest you and others *not* get out ahead of the Lord. You'll sink!

Rom 8:19 For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.

I notice you emphasize "manifestation of the sons of God." There has been some serious errors about this, including in the cults. They wish to make us more like gods than glorified saints.

But this is speaking of the resurrection, and not of *now!* And your entire emphasis is on the idea that we can do this or be this *now.*

Certainly we are already children of God, and have been endowed spiritually now. But as I said above, there are limitations between what the Kingdom does today, and what it will do later, in the consummation. Today, we live in righteousness, and we do our ministries or fulfill our callings. But we still get sick, suffer, and are persecuted. We still die. We don't lock Satan up, but can only cast out demons. There are limitations. We have to go by the leading of the Holy Spirit.

What is this body Paul is speaking of? Is it the individual or is it the body of Christ in which we all have a role to play?

The glorification of our bodies is our hope of "manifestation."

If that which we hope for ever manifests itself, is it then no longer hope?

"Hope," in the biblical sense, is something we in the present age wait for in the coming age. When it comes, our hope is realized and will last forever.

Have you seen the Lord? Do you know what he looks like?
Is it the flesh body of a man that we seek or the Spirit of the Lord within eachother?
Are you able to see the spirit with carnal eyes?
Either you believe you have seen him and have everlasting life, or you have never seen him and have no everlasting life.
Must one see to believe?

Quite frankly, you seem to think you have a private revelation that gives you superior insight. Paul never treated his spirituality that way. He and John always said they were teaching Christians something they already knew and experienced, and were only serving them reminders. There is no elite spirituality--only walking in it or not. There can, however, be a level of ignorance or misinformation that need to be straightened out.

Mat 21:22 And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive.

This is not a special Christian methodology to get what you want. Faith is not the pin to get your heart's desires.

Rather, we are told that if we don't even believe in Christ, we won't live like him and we won't give him proper credit for answers to prayer. So when we ask him things, it is a matter of acknowledging who he is, and what he is like, so that we don't spend on our passions. Then, when he answers those prayers, we'll give him glory, praise, and thanksgiving.

 

[L.A.M.B.]

You cannot live today hoping for tomorrow.
Tomorrow IS Today.
You will not observe the coming of the Kingdom of Christ, because that Kingdom resides within us.
Only when those in Christ rise up and claim this world as our inheritance, a gift from the Lord given to man to tend and keep it,
Then the true manifestation of Christ's Kingdom on earth shall be seen.

Destiny begins Today.

What is the interpretation or description of kings and priests to the Lord?
What does it mean to be His kings and priests?
Shall we all rule our own kingdom? Shall we all lead our own church?

How do you see that vision unfolding?
Melchisadek keeps coming to mind. He was both a king and a priest who went out to meet Abraham after the days of the battles of 5 kings.
What did Melchisadek do? He brought Abraham bread and wine.
Melchisadek was sent to give sustenance to Abraham.

Do you see yourself sitting on a throne expecting to be served by the people? Exacting tribute? Providing security?
What is the role of the kings and priests we are given to be unto the Lord?
Do we go into battles? Do we raise armies?
Do we provide refuge and a safe haven for a place of prayer?
Do we provide bread for the hungry and shelter for the widow and the fatherless, while their father's are off battling in the war?

What?
And why aren't we doing it now?
What are we waiting for?
Hugs

May I ask you ,Ziggy, what is your denominal faith or teaching ?
No attempt to cause offense nor discredit here.
Thank you.

 

[Hidden In Him]

This is happening now.
Hard to believe over the clanging and clamour of the left, But God is on the move.
And His body is turning ploughshares into swords.
What are these swords? They are the words of TRUTH.
We are in an information war.
There has been one narrative pervasively moving the world in the direction it wants it to go under the banner of "Democracy"
But this "Democracy" in Truth is Tyranny. And it is being called out, and pushed back, all around the world.
We do not fight against flesh and blood. This is no conventional war used with conventional weapons.
This war requires the Armor of God. And you need to be wearing yours at all times.

So many people complaining.. Why aren't the rebublicans using the same tactics as the democrats?
Because Republicans believe in Law and Order, not Unlawfulness and Chaos.
Yes the fight is slow and it is long. And more soldiers are needed to combat the disinformation and the lies controlling the minds of our children.
They have been indoctrinating them with hate since kindergarten, even from the womb.
Our greatest weapon is Love. They don't understand it. They can't relate. They have no tolerance for peace.

Their very mantra "No Justice No Peace" is not a cry for fairness and equality. It is a statement and something they strive to acheive.

You can not fight an informational war if you do not understand the language.
And most are able to see now for themselves the deliberate twisting of the meanings and descriptions of the words.
They have created their own lingo. And everything we know to mean good, they mean to be evil. And everything we know to mean evil, to them it is good.

In order to fight in this war you have to be a kind of undercover agent. Going into places like tweets and chatrooms where most christians would never set foot in. You have to learn the language. Understand who is pulling the strings, financing their movement, and what their objective is on any given day.

Sorry about the late response, sister. Been kinda busy lately.

At the moment it is more of an information war, yes, but the times are coming where it will evolve into a true spiritual war. The army that quote was referring to is Joel's army, and it is the same army upon which He has promised to pour out His Spirit upon, and they will prophesy, dream dreams and see visions. When you combine this with what it goes on to say in Joel 2:31, the implication is that they will prophecy during a time when great judgments are being executed upon the earth, and by extension great miracles are taking place. This is what is meant by "and they will do great exploits for Me." There are numerous other prophecies to the same effect. But when that time comes, Satan will also be rising up with great signs and wonders, to if possible deceive the very elect.

This is why I say it will become a true spiritual war, rather than an informational/ socio-political war like we have still going on now.

 

[Randy Kluth]

Interesting looking at both Ziggy and Hidden In Him on this war. Have to agree with both in many respects. Thanks to you both.

 

[Hidden In Him]

• I suppose I would be wasting my time suggesting
• Antichrist is already actively manipulating and instructing governments to implement the policies spoken of above.
• That these policies are designed to introduce religious global governance, not political
• That the mark of the beast is a sign of allegiance to as religious power, not political, and therefore a religious belief/observance
• Read Pope Francis two most relevant encyclicals...Fratelli Tutti, and Laudato Si.
• The above information is correct maybe in many areas, but the real powers behind it... All roads lead to Rome. Still.

Hey, Brakelite/Backlit/Brakelite2 stop changing your name, LoL.

This is the primary difference between my eschatology and SDA's. I do think mainline Christianity headed by the Catholic church will play a great part for evil in seeking to have the true saints of God murdered during the end-times, but the focus on Catholicism being the center of the Antichrist's power is incorrect, at least according to what the Spirit has been revealing. That theory was popular in centuries past, but it is becoming apparent now over the last 30 years or so in particular that Islam fits the Biblical narrative better, and Islam is actually more political than it is religious when it comes to its influence in the earth.

I couldn't sign off that the Spirit is saying all roads still lead to Rome. Will Rome play a part? Yes and a gruesome one. But what the Spirit is saying to the churches doesn't suggest that Rome will be the seat of the Antichrist's power.