What is the one true Church?

[Keiw]

This seems like madness. It doesn't matter whether "the doctrine of one God in three persons was not solidly established nor fully assimilated into Christian [Catholic!] life prior to the end of the 4th century", the Bible clearly states that truth. "Among the apostolic Fathers, there had been nothing even remotely approaching such a mentality or perspective" is irrelevant.

Jesus said, "When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak on his own but will speak whatever he hears, and he will declare to you the things that are to come." (John 16:13) If some didn't believe that it's not important.

Yes and it has lead them into truth. And corrections had to be made of all the error teachings that got in through the centuries and errors of their own. Some think they don't get error teachings, a very unwise way to think since errors started getting in in Peters books and the book of Titus. Satan doesn't stop, none are immune.

 

[Jim B]

I brought what peter and others wrote . You brought the SKY is falling .
Exactly jim . You have no words other than to try and accuse .

Your accusing me is "the pot calling the kettle black". All you ever do is accuse others. Apparently you don't like it, so why do you constantly accuse others?

 

[Brakelite]

And you have completely ignored the Biblical fact that the FIRST MENTION of the Sabbath in Scripture is in Exodus 16:23. And the PUPOSE for it was the gathering of the Manna – the bread from Heaven.

It's way beyond time you stopped taking everyone else here on this forum for idiots... Or at least stop treating them as such. Your stubborn bluster and oft repeated assertions don't make something factual. Exodus 16 is not the first time the Sabbath is mentioned in scripture. I already posted above a direct quote from Genesis, but it seems you think that if you talk long enough and loud enough I will succumb to your arrogance and stop believing in scripture. Here is the same passage again... Maybe you will recognize this better...

KJV Genesis 2:2-3
2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Rested...

07673 תבַשָׁ shabath shaw-bath’
‭
‭a primitive root; v; [BDB-991b, BDB-992b] {See TWOT on 2323} {See TWOT on 2323 @@ "2323c"}
‭
‭AV-cease 47, rest 11, away 3, fail 2, celebrate 1, misc 7; 71
‭
‭1) to cease, desist, rest
‭ 1a) (Qal)
‭ 1a1) to cease
‭ 1a2) to rest, desist (from labour)
‭ 1b) (Niphal) to cease
‭ 1c) (Hiphil)
‭ 1c1) to cause to cease, put an end to
‭ 1c2) to exterminate, destroy
‭ 1c3) to cause to desist from
‭ 1c4) to remove
‭ 1c5) to cause to fail
‭2) (Qal) to keep or observe the sabbath

KJV Mark 2:27-28
27 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:
28 Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.

Jesus is saying above that He was the one who created, made, the Sabbath day. Genesis tells us when. Jesus also tells it's that He made it for man. A day of rest to benefit mankind, a specific day, blessed and sanctified by Jesus Himself whereby gifting man a day in which to better relate to His God. Adam and Eve without doubt were the first to benefit from this. They were created at the very end on the 6th day. The following day was the day that was afterward blessed and made holy by Jesus as He walked with them in the garden, explaining their existence and teaching them to trust Him. That 7th day would have become a sanctuary for their relationship with their Creator. A day blessed and made holy, a day still holy and the subject of the 4th commandment which requires man to remember to keep holy. Are we to therefore forget to obey God on the say so of the church? What authority has the church to dictate to man what is right and what is wrong outside of written inspired revelation?
As shown above, the Sabbath was made at creation by Jesus Himself for the benefit of mankind. Israel was reminded of this later, but that wasn't the first Sabbath. And it wasn't established then for the purpose of giving manna, but to give Israel rest, and on the same day Jesus had blessed and sanctified and made holy for that purpose in the beginning which 400 years of slavery had obliterated.

 

[Johann]

I already know that brakelite....You accept only one mans teaching: Your own!!

YOU decide who is teaching in harmony with Scripture. Which makes YOU accountable for your soul when you "stand before God" even though Scripture teaches opposite of what you believe (Hebrews 13:17). 2 Peter 3:16 speaks of men like you.

It's amazing that when the Arians attack the RCC--how gracious you are in not reacting, but responding--keep this up.

 

[Johann]

Correct


They are a requirement.....for the Jews and they are still a requirement for the Jews. The Mosaic Law never stopped. They pretty much define the Old Covenant with God.

Christians have a New Covenant with God and the Mosaic law is no part of it.

The law of Christ. Christians aren't lawless--law of Christ

 

[Brakelite]

It's way beyond time you stopped taking everyone else here on this forum for idiots... Or at least stop treating them as such. Your stubborn bluster and oft repeated assertions don't make something factual. Exodus 16 is not the first time the Sabbath is mentioned in scripture. I already posted above a direct quote from Genesis, but it seems you think that if you talk long enough and loud enough I will succumb to your arrogance and stop believing in scripture. Here is the same passage again... Maybe you will recognize this better...

KJV Genesis 2:2-3
2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Rested...

07673 תבַשָׁ shabath shaw-bath’
‭
‭a primitive root; v; [BDB-991b, BDB-992b] {See TWOT on 2323} {See TWOT on 2323 @@ "2323c"}
‭
‭AV-cease 47, rest 11, away 3, fail 2, celebrate 1, misc 7; 71
‭
‭1) to cease, desist, rest
‭ 1a) (Qal)
‭ 1a1) to cease
‭ 1a2) to rest, desist (from labour)
‭ 1b) (Niphal) to cease
‭ 1c) (Hiphil)
‭ 1c1) to cause to cease, put an end to
‭ 1c2) to exterminate, destroy
‭ 1c3) to cause to desist from
‭ 1c4) to remove
‭ 1c5) to cause to fail
‭2) (Qal) to keep or observe the sabbath

KJV Mark 2:27-28
27 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:
28 Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.

Jesus is saying above that He was the one who created, made, the Sabbath day. Genesis tells us when. Jesus also tells it's that He made it for man. A day of rest to benefit mankind, a specific day, blessed and sanctified by Jesus Himself whereby gifting man a day in which to better relate to His God. Adam and Eve without doubt were the first to benefit from this. They were created at the very end on the 6th day. The following day was the day that was afterward blessed and made holy by Jesus as He walked with them in the garden, explaining their existence and teaching them to trust Him. That 7th day would have become a sanctuary for their relationship with their Creator. A day blessed and made holy, a day still holy and the subject of the 4th commandment which requires man to remember to keep holy. Are we to therefore forget to obey God on the say so of the church? What authority has the church to dictate to man what is right and what is wrong outside of written inspired revelation?
As shown above, the Sabbath was made at creation by Jesus Himself for the benefit of mankind. Israel was reminded of this later, but that wasn't the first Sabbath. And it wasn't established then for the purpose of giving manna, but to give Israel rest, and on the same day Jesus had blessed and sanctified and made holy for that purpose in the beginning which 400 years of slavery had obliterated.

@BreadOfLife PS... Jesus isn't only the Lord of the Sabbath... He is supposed to be your Lord as well, and not the church.

 

[Taken]

It's way beyond time you stopped taking everyone else here on this forum for idiots... Or at least stop treating them as such. Your stubborn bluster and oft repeated assertions don't make something factual.

Applause!!

 

[Grailhunter]

The law of Christ. Christians aren't lawless--law of Christ

This is just something for you to think about.
Picture a wall with 613 bricks....the Mosaic Law has 613 Laws, but it was not enough to lead a culture to a moral conclusion, it was not enough to provide a path to heaven. They were hard, they were cruel, and no one could keep them and no matter how many bricks in the wall there were, there were always holes and ways to get around them. Picture Christ in a Jewish home for dinner as the father sold his daughter to be concubine....a sex slave. What would Christ say? The Mosaic allowed for a father to sell his daughters into concubinage.

Now in the New Testament. Christ's Laws.....the Law of Christ.....the golden rule....the Commandments of Christ.....He only needed two. Why? Of course a lot of Christians do not like the word philosophy but Christ's and the Apostle's teachings are not so much about law and more about away of thinking, with a foundation of love. If you broke Mosaic Law it is said you broke them all and you were done. No sacrifice removed sins they only appeased the wrath of God. In Christianity, you can get forgiveness for sins. You are expected to repent and learn from your mistakes and that leads to wisdom and a better character. That is actually a workable scenario that improves a person and above and beyond that you have a relationship with God as in the family of God. And above and beyond that Christ has your back on eternal life in heaven.

 

[ChristisGod]

“Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word; that they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us...” — John 17:20, 21

It is often asked, “What is the right denomination?” There are hundreds, if not thousands of denominations all claiming to be this one true church, but does God recognize any of these as His representative on earth? This subject should be approached prayerfully and honestly. If there was but one church in the beginning, established by our Lord, there should be but the one church in the end — the church triumphant in glory. Colossians 3:4

The word church was first used in the New Testament and is a translation of the Greek word ekklesia, which means a calling out. Jesus said to his disciples, “I have chosen you out of the world.” (John 15:19) The true church is a company of believers who, in accepting the invitation of Christ, have become sanctified or separated from the world, worldly pursuits and worldly organizations.

Those of the early church bore no denominational names, but were simply identified by their location. “Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, …sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints…” (1 Corinthians 1:2) These sanctified individuals in various communities set themselves apart from the world and dedicate their lives to God through the merit of His Son. Thus, the true church is not a place to go to, nor is it a denomination to belong to. The church is the gathering of sincere believers. Paul emphasized this when he confirmed that Jesus’ followers were baptized only into Christ and not into an earthly organization. There is but one baptism, and that is into Christ. Thus, it is a misconception that one joins or is baptized into a particular church denomination. Ephesians 4:4-6; Galatians 3:27; Romans 6:3, 4

Those who follow Jesus as their LORD, GOD and SAVIOR.

 

[Philip James]

Heya Grailhunter, how ya been?

If you broke Mosaic Law it is said you broke them all and you were done.

were you?

But if the wicked man turns away from all the sins he committed, if he keeps all my statutes and does what is right and just, he shall surely live, he shall not die.

None of the crimes he committed shall be remembered against him; he shall live because of the virtue he has practiced.

Do I indeed derive any pleasure from the death of the wicked? says the Lord GOD. Do I not rather rejoice when he turns from his evil way that he may live?

And if the virtuous man turns from the path of virtue to do evil, the same kind of abominable things that the wicked man does, can he do this and still live? None of his virtuous deeds shall be remembered, because he has broken faith and committed sin; because of this, he shall die.

You say, "The LORD'S way is not fair!" Hear now, house of Israel: Is it my way that is unfair, or rather, are not your ways unfair?

When a virtuous man turns away from virtue to commit iniquity, and dies, it is because of the iniquity he committed that he must die.

But if a wicked man, turning from the wickedness he has committed, does what is right and just, he shall preserve his life;

since he has turned away from all the sins which he committed, he shall surely live, he shall not die.

And yet the house of Israel says, "The LORD'S way is not fair!" Is it my way that is not fair, house of Israel, or rather, is it not that your ways are not fair?

Therefore I will judge you, house of Israel, each one according to his ways, says the Lord GOD. Turn and be converted from all your crimes, that they may be no cause of guilt for you.

Cast away from you all the crimes you have committed, and make for yourselves a new heart and a new spirit. Why should you die, O house of Israel?

For I have no pleasure in the death of anyone who dies, says the Lord GOD. Return and live!

Ezekiel 18: 21-32

Pax et Bonum

 

[quietthinker]

What is the one true Church?​

The number of replies and views to this question indicates a lostness and a desperation to identify....and not surprisingly, trying to find it in a denomination.
Could it be as in the reply Jesus gave his questioners, 'Now when He was asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, He answered them and said, “The kingdom of God does not come with observation; nor will they say, ‘See here!’ or ‘See there!’......' Luke 17:20-21

 

[Grailhunter]

Heya Grailhunter, how ya been?




were you?

But if the wicked man turns away from all the sins he committed, if he keeps all my statutes and does what is right and just, he shall surely live, he shall not die.

None of the crimes he committed shall be remembered against him; he shall live because of the virtue he has practiced.

Do I indeed derive any pleasure from the death of the wicked? says the Lord GOD. Do I not rather rejoice when he turns from his evil way that he may live?

And if the virtuous man turns from the path of virtue to do evil, the same kind of abominable things that the wicked man does, can he do this and still live? None of his virtuous deeds shall be remembered, because he has broken faith and committed sin; because of this, he shall die.

You say, "The LORD'S way is not fair!" Hear now, house of Israel: Is it my way that is unfair, or rather, are not your ways unfair?

When a virtuous man turns away from virtue to commit iniquity, and dies, it is because of the iniquity he committed that he must die.

But if a wicked man, turning from the wickedness he has committed, does what is right and just, he shall preserve his life;

since he has turned away from all the sins which he committed, he shall surely live, he shall not die.

And yet the house of Israel says, "The LORD'S way is not fair!" Is it my way that is not fair, house of Israel, or rather, is it not that your ways are not fair?

Therefore I will judge you, house of Israel, each one according to his ways, says the Lord GOD. Turn and be converted from all your crimes, that they may be no cause of guilt for you.

Cast away from you all the crimes you have committed, and make for yourselves a new heart and a new spirit. Why should you die, O house of Israel?

For I have no pleasure in the death of anyone who dies, says the Lord GOD. Return and live!

Ezekiel 18: 21-32

Pax et Bonum

There are a lot of words there but the word that pretty much nullifies the rest is "if" if he keeps all my statutes....some say that is impossible and none were righteous....God afford Abraham righteous because of.....
Like James said....For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of all. James 2:10 and also For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins. Hebrews 10:4

 

[Grailhunter]

Heya Grailhunter, how ya been?

I am great. Retired and happy, healthy and having fun. Making fun of the global warmists.....the weather people have been trying to forecast warmer weather here for a month! But they keep having to change it....every morning it is 32 degrees or less.
Hope you are doing great!

 

[Philip James]

There are a lot of words there but the word that pretty much nullifies the rest is

Ha, lawyers, always trying to trip up those with a humble and contrite heart..

This Is the message of the Gospel, from the beginning of time:

But if a wicked man, turning from the wickedness he has committed, does what is right and just, he shall preserve his life;

since he has turned away from all the sins which he committed, he shall surely live, he shall not die.

God has not changed, But our understanding of Him has..


In Christ He revealed His Love for us and in Christ, all men of good-will will find Life!

Nice to see you!

Pax et Bonum

 

[Grailhunter]

This Is the message of the Gospel, from the beginning of time:

Well my friend the Old Testament is not the Gospel.....Good New! Good New of Christ.

God has not changed, But our understanding of Him has..

Ya know how would you measure change of a God? Do you think Christ would command Christians to kill all that breaths and do not forget the babies? Is that a Change?

God bless you mister!

 

[Johann]

As a protestant, I had to search for whatever seemed to be the most “biblical” doctrine. The problem was that good, learned people took different views of this on every issue under the sun. To add to the confusion, they would oftentimes appeal to the Holy Spirit as the guarantor of their doctrine—but clearly the Holy Spirit could not be schizophrenic.

As I discovered, this was in total distinction from the Catholic Church on many of the most important issues.
I will use three to illustrate how grave of a problem this is for those who seek the unadulterated truth:
-Christian baptism,
-Christian worship,
-and Church governance.
I get these three from Christ’s Great Commission to the Apostles (governance):
to baptize in the name of the Trinity (baptism),
and make disciples who obey everything Christ commanded (which surely included the proper mode of worshipping Him).

The Catholic Church has had an astonishingly consistent set of doctrinal beliefs on these three fundamental matters since the first century—we can show overwhelming, even unanimous testimony to each one in every century, east and west. After all, what is of God is not confused.
#1: Christian baptism regenerates, cleanses from sin, and justifies.
#2: Christian worship is the sacrifice of the Holy Eucharist.
#3: The government of the Church consists of the bishops, the successors of the Apostles.

As a protestant, none of these issues were agreed upon. The various sects diverge widely on all of them. If you want to find the truth, you will find good and learned people on all sides. There is no consistent answer, despite 500 years to see what would happen. If anything, the answers have grown more splintered on each point, with no one having the authority to “bind and loose” and declare “Thus saith the Lord.”
Thus, there is irreconcilable confusion on:
(1) how to properly become a Christian;
(2) how to properly worship Christ; and
(3) how the Church is rightly governed over time.

That’s the whole ball game folks. Whereas protestants are nowhere close to having consistent answers on these things after just 500 years (which began immediately), the Catholic Church has had consistent answers on this in every century since literally the first century.
For those like myself, and many others, who truly desired the truth with all of their heart—how to become a Christian, how to worship Christ, and how His Church was governed—there was no possibility of finding it in protestantism. It was simply our best guess against their best guess.
But God is not the author of confusion.
Such Catholic consistency over such a vast period of time is a hallmark not of man’s power, but God’s.

To say the Church has been so consistent because our leaders are so smart and holy is a joke.

I have to agree with your post on Protestantism--however, and don't get me wrong here--I cannot accept the RCC's traditions from the church fathers--I have download a copy on "The Church Father's know best" and have bookmarked Catholic Answers catholic.com--and right of the bat I can tell you I don't believe in baptismal regeneration and a number of other issues written by the church fathers, endorsed by the RCC.

Do you have links re rebuttals/debates with RCC against Protestantism, or any other denomination--especially Jewish rabbi's?

Love this though--

Jesus Is God

Quasi-Christian sects like the Jehovah's Witnesses deny the divinity of Christ. Here's how to defend the central Catholc teaching that Jesus is God.

www.catholic.com

 

[Johann]

That's a nice thought. However, Catholics set themselves (only) as the one true church and, instead of accepting and following God' word -- the Bible -- they follow the unScriptural teachings of their denomination.

What unscriptural teachings from "their denomination?"--you mean the church fathers?

 

[Johann]

The sky is falling! The sky is falling! (Chicken Little)

BTW, you aren't exposing anyone, you're just ranting (as usual).

@amigo de christo is not rambling or ranting--but always pointing others to Christ Jesus--don't use this Forum to belittle others, you don't know his heart
1) The devil never gives up trying to destroy the Lord's people; 2) it is easy to take matters into one's own hand and bring unending grief upon he who does so; 3) God's people should be ready to boldly proclaim the sins of the lost to them; 4) humility is always in place when seeking to persuade others to do right; 5) one must never trust the promises of the world.

 

[amigo de christo]

 

[Taken]

What is the one true Church?​

OP^

Individuals once and forever Converted IN Christ Jesus..

Heb 7:
[22] By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

Glory to God,
Taken