No Escape : From Hell

[Marymog]

Which men?

Lol.....When I saw your post I was trying to figure out what you were talking about. I didn't recall posting that to YOU! I meant to respond to Jane and somehow responded to you!

So, I apologize for the mistake!

God bless.....Mary

 

[Marymog]

I have no interest in your church councils...they mean nothing to me.
If there was even one clear unequivocal statement from either God or his Son to that effect, there could be not assertions that state otherwise.

If humans have to rely on other humans to formulate their doctrines, then Scripture becomes redundant.
Why bother even referring to the Bible at all, if what is taught is not found there?

Hmmmm....Aunty Jane; are you a JW? I think you said you are. Soooooo you have no interest in The Church councils that gave you the bible you quote from? Those councils meant NOTHING to you? But you have interest in the councils of your JW men and those councils mean something to you? That makes no sense.

Do not your JW men that lead you "rely on other humans to formulate their doctrines" when they hold their councils? Do you not rely on yourself, a human, to make your own doctrines in your brain? You do realize you make no sense Jane! You throw a bunch of words together without even realizing what you are writing......You pulled a Kamala Harris! You made a word salad!

 

[Marymog]

The church divided itself because Christ was never in it....his words at Matt 7:21-23 were prophetic.....when he says to those who claim him as their “Lord”, and he says to them “I NEVER KNEW YOU”...”never” means “not ever”....so Christ has never set foot inside Christendom.....their divided state proves that God’s uniting spirit is missing. He does not give different people different truths....there can be only one. The body of Christ is not dismembered.

Huh!!!

Your post makes no sense!

You allege that Christ was never in The Church and Matt 7:21-23 is your evidence of that? Oh my how your men have lied to you kiddo. In that verse Jesus is saying that he never knew those people because they were not or are not members of His Church. Sooo there was at that time and still is today The Church and the gates of hell has never prevailed against The Church and it has never been divided or dismembered. Now there have been Protestant who left The Church to start a denomination. But your JW men didn't leave The Church. Your JW men left another Protestant denomination and that denomination broke off from another Protestant denomination and so on and so on. In other words the reason CHRISTIANITY, not The Church, is divided is becaouse of men like your JW men and the other Protestant men before your men that divided Christianity by breaking away from The Church because they thought they knew Scripture better than the men of The Church. The Church never stopped existing; your men just chose to defy it.

Mary

PS: You are wearing me out with your alternative facts of Christian history and Scripture.

 

[GodsGrace]

Lol.....When I saw your post I was trying to figure out what you were talking about. I didn't recall posting that to YOU! I meant to respond to Jane and somehow responded to you!

So, I apologize for the mistake!

God bless.....Mary

No problem.

 

[walter]

Walter,

I apologize! I don't understand what you are saying. Could you clarify. It's the "agreement" word in your sentence that is throwing me off.

For example Jesus says something.. And later in the New Testament one of the Apostles says some words that agree with something Jesus said already.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Hmmmm....Aunty Jane; are you a JW? I think you said you are. Soooooo you have no interest in The Church councils that gave you the bible you quote from? Those councils meant NOTHING to you? But you have interest in the councils of your JW men and those councils mean something to you? That makes no sense.

Of course it makes no sense through the lens with which you view Christian history.....it speaks for itself if you know what Christ and his apostles taught in the beginning......nothing close to what the Catholic Church (of any rite) has led their people to believe for centuries, ever since that apostasy engulfed the world, from the second century onward. The “church” has been “friends with the world” (James 4:4) since its defection because it lost sight of it place, and was corrupted by the power it was given....it still is.

We needed no “church councils” to receive God’s word.
God can provide what we need in spite of the ones through whom it comes. The “church” included books that were rejected later as not belonging in Scripture because they were contradictory. God has used his enemies in the past to do his will.....don’t get carried away with yourself...

He used ancient Babylon to punish his own nation when it was necessary. Those not killed were captured and taken into exile to Babylon so, with no hope of escape, the Jews had two choices....resist the false worship all around them, or be persuaded to join them. They were being punished for their participation in false worship anyway, but a small number remained faithful, not succumbing to the prevailing atmosphere of false worship all around them. Daniel, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego are names we remember from Bible history....remembered for their courageous resistance.

When the time was right, God liberated his people from Babylonian captivity, by bringing the Medes and Persians against the renown might of Babylon. The Babylonians were so sure their city was impregnable, unassailable....but as God foretold, the city went down in defeat in one night with barely a shot fired. The new conquering King liberated the Israelites, but only a small remnant of that nation went “home” to rebuild God’s temple and the city that had laid in ruins for 70 years.
Read about the “diaspora”.

When the time was right for God’s word to be given back to the people, the absolute power of the RCC was broken....no longer could it hide the Bible’s message and impose its pagan inspired doctrines on anyone who questioned them.
Freedom to read God’s word was important for those who wanted to make sure that what they believed was actually Bible backed....like the ancient Boereans. (Acts 17:10-11) It was God’s time to “draw” people to his truth. (John 6:44; 65)

But the “Babylonian” connection is lost on those in Christendom because they do not understand the origins of their beliefs. All of them came from original Babylon, but today it’s a “Babylon” whose beliefs have engulfed the whole world....satan’s world empire of false worship....he created them all.....and God tells us to get out of that place before he uses his angelic forces again to destroy it once and for all. (Rev 18:4-5)

Do not your JW men that lead you "rely on other humans to formulate their doctrines" when they hold their councils?

We do not have councils.....we rely on God’s spirit to direct Christ’s disciples as we have assurance from Jesus himself that he would personally appoint “a faithful and wise slave” to “feed” his entire household “their food at the proper time” (Matt 24:45) This was part of Jesus prophesy on “the end” of these times.
So at the time of his return, that slave would be found doing what Christ commanded.....not part of satan’s world with blood on their hands, and hate in their heart for their enemies hp(Matt 5:43-44)....but preachers of good news. (Matt 24:14)
This “slave” is not an individual, but a body of Christians....the body of Christ.

Do you not rely on yourself, a human, to make your own doctrines in your brain? You do realize you make no sense Jane! You throw a bunch of words together without even realizing what you are writing......You pulled a Kamala Harris! You made a word salad!

Amazing how people who are in ill health because of a poor diet will resist healthy salad because their palate is jaded. Try the salad...it’s life saving....junk food will lead to ill health and a premature death.
There is a way to avoid it....

 

[Marymog]

We do not have councils.....we rely on God’s spirit to direct Christ’s disciples as we have assurance from Jesus himself that he would personally appoint “a faithful and wise slave” to “feed” his entire household “their food at the proper time” (Matt 24:45) This was part of Jesus prophesy on “the end” of these times.
So at the time of his return, that slave would be found doing what Christ commanded.....not part of satan’s world with blood on their hands, and hate in their heart for their enemies hp(Matt 5:43-44)....but preachers of good news. (Matt 24:14)
This “slave” is not an individual, but a body of Christians....the body of Christ.

Riiiiight.....JW's don't have councils but you do have a body of elders that supervises each congregation, and those congregations receive periodic visits from traveling elders known as circuit overseers. And your "Bible-based guidance and instructions" are provided by a Governing Body made up of longtime Witnesses who currently work at the world headquarters of Jehovah’s Witnesses.........but you don't have councils (even though your "traveling elders" council you) and you don't have a Vatican type setting even though you have a world headquarters.

You crack me up AJ.

 

[Marymog]

For example Jesus says something.. And later in the New Testament one of the Apostles says some words that agree with something Jesus said already.

Okay, so here is your original statement: Isn't it true that everyone including myself have been deceived, if we don't listen to Jesus and the Apostles words and agreement?

Now that I have clarification on what you are saying, here is my response: Yes, of course, if we don't listen to Jesus and the Apostles, we have been deceived. That's logic! But the words of Jesus and the Apostles (the NT) have to be interpreted by men because the Apostles and Jesus are no longer here for us to ask clarification on what they meant. There were some men during the NT times, all the way thru today, that are deceiving people by misinterpreting those words. The Apostles appointed men to take their place so that those men would carry/pass on the "Truth". Those men then appointed other men to carry on the truth. Those men then appointed other men to carry on the truth and so on and so on. If you, like @Aunty Jane, believe that the truth stopped being passed down for the last 2,000 years then your belief is opposite of what Scripture teaches. The fact is that the one Church with one doctrine and one Truth never ceased to exist.

Soooooo, with that said, my original statement still holds true: You have been deceived by the men that you follow. And to answer your question, No! It is not true that everyone has been deceived. Those that belong to The Church that Christ started, of which the gates of hell will not prevail against and is the pillar and foundation of truth, has not been deceived!

 

[Marymog]

My Church or Leader is ultimately the Bible.. I can explain why I believe something with the Bible alone.

For example I believe in these fundamental beliefs and I let the Bible do all the talking and explaining, I don't have to add any commentary.

- Salvation is a free gift. read these scriptures...
- I observe all Jesus words. read these scriptures...
- I observe all the Bible words. read these scriptures...
- Many inherit the Earth living forever upon it and a little flock inherits heaven and they become priests and judges.. scriptures...
- God gave specific instructions to Moses to engage in war with enemy nations, Jesus gave new instructions on how we are to treat our neighbors, our brothers and sisters and even our enemies. [ We have brothers and sisters in every nation totaling 1,108 languages. ]
- All our fundamental beliefs can be explained with scriptures alone.
- When the Bible does not directly address a topic, Jehovah's Witnesses rely on Bible principles and an informed conscience to make decisions. They research relevant scriptures, and pray for wisdom.

Hey Walter,

Since your "Church or Leader is ultimately the Bible" what do you make of these passages? Obey those who rule over you, and be submissive, for they watch out for your souls, as those who must give account. Let them do so with joy and not with grief, for that would be unprofitable for you. Therefore take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood.

Who rules over you that you are submissive too? Who is the overseer of your flock that the Holy Spirit has chosen?

Curious Mary

 

[walter]

Hey Walter,

Since your "Church or Leader is ultimately the Bible" what do you make of these passages? Obey those who rule over you, and be submissive, for they watch out for your souls, as those who must give account. Let them do so with joy and not with grief, for that would be unprofitable for you. Therefore take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood.

Who rules over you that you are submissive too? Who is the overseer of your flock that the Holy Spirit has chosen?

Curious Mary

Since your "Church or Leader is ultimately the Bible" what do you make of these passages? Obey those who rule over you, and be submissive, for they watch out for your souls, as those who must give account. Let them do so with joy and not with grief, for that would be profitable for you. Therefore take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood. Matthew 22:21

AI Overview

The Bible passages you cited (Hebrews 13:17 and related concepts) emphasize submitting to spiritual leaders because they care for your soul, accountable to God; this is understood within a framework where the Bible itself is the ultimate authority, meaning leaders must guide according to Scripture, and believers should obey when leaders align with biblical teachings, not blindly, ensuring joyful, godly leadership that benefits the flock.
Here's how these passages fit when the Bible is the ultimate standard:

• Biblical Mandate for Leadership: Hebrews 13:17 (which you quoted) highlights leaders watching over souls and being accountable to God, requiring believers to be submissive and not cause grief.
• Leaders Must Be Scriptural: The condition for this submission is that leaders are shepherding according to the Bible, as mentioned in your prompt's context. Answers in Genesis notes, "This only applies if the church we attend follows the Bible as the ultimate authority".
• Purpose of Submission: It's not about blind obedience but about trusting leaders who teach God's Word, making your life easier and more profitable spiritually, as they guide you in faith.
• The "Bible First" Principle: While obeying leaders is commanded, the ultimate standard remains the Bible. If a leader deviates from Scripture, believers aren't called to follow them into error; rather, the Bible itself provides the framework for discerning true vs. false teaching, as seen in passages about testing spirits or confronting error (e.g., Galatians, Acts 17).
• Matthew 22:21 ("Render to Caesar"): This verse, about paying taxes, establishes a principle of honoring governing authorities while also acknowledging God's higher authority, which extends to church leadership – obey earthly leaders as directed by God's ultimate law (the Bible).

In essence, these verses call for respectful, trusting, and obedient participation within a church structure led by biblically faithful individuals, always under the final authority of God's written Word.

 

[walter]

Okay, so here is your original statement: Isn't it true that everyone including myself have been deceived, if we don't listen to Jesus and the Apostles words and agreement?

Now that I have clarification on what you are saying, here is my response: Yes, of course, if we don't listen to Jesus and the Apostles, we have been deceived. That's logic! But the words of Jesus and the Apostles (the NT) have to be interpreted by men because the Apostles and Jesus are no longer here for us to ask clarification on what they meant. There were some men during the NT times, all the way thru today, that are deceiving people by misinterpreting those words. The Apostles appointed men to take their place so that those men would carry/pass on the "Truth". Those men then appointed other men to carry on the truth. Those men then appointed other men to carry on the truth and so on and so on. If you, like @Aunty Jane, believe that the truth stopped being passed down for the last 2,000 years then your belief is opposite of what Scripture teaches. The fact is that the one Church with one doctrine and one Truth never ceased to exist.

Soooooo, with that said, my original statement still holds true: You have been deceived by the men that you follow. And to answer your question, No! It is not true that everyone has been deceived. Those that belong to The Church that Christ started, of which the gates of hell will not prevail against and is the pillar and foundation of truth, has not been deceived!

2 Timothy 3:16
New King James Version
All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness,

I think if we interpret something into the words that are written and recorded in the Bible, that is a problem.
I myself do not interpret the words in the Bible, they speak for themselves!

 

[Aunty Jane]

Hey Walter,

Since your "Church or Leader is ultimately the Bible" what do you make of these passages? Obey those who rule over you, and be submissive, for they watch out for your souls, as those who must give account. Let them do so with joy and not with grief, for that would be unprofitable for you. Therefore take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood.

Who rules over you that you are submissive too? Who is the overseer of your flock that the Holy Spirit has chosen?

Curious Mary

Well, Curious Mary.....I think you just answered your own questions.....what you fail to see is that an “overseer” is not a boss. Any leader is also a follower.....our leaders are followers of Jesus Christ. They have no power to force any belief on anyone....but he will emphasise what the Scriptures teach, not ever presenting information that is absent from the Bible....or are his own opinions. We are urged to check the Scriptures for ourselves, not merely performing rituals and being spoon fed man-made doctrines.

Our leaders oversee the spiritual health of the congregation, and the travelling overseers are charged with oversight of a group of congregation so that problems can be identified and dealt with accordingly, as it was in the first century. Keeping the congregations organised and united was a priority. Paul was a travelling overseer.

The fact remains that Jehovah is “a God of order” and that he has always organized his people, especially in their worship....hence those who “take the lead”, are spiritually qualified men, not those who have attended schools of higher learning to attain doctorates or degrees in theology.
Mental capacity runs second to spiritual maturity. Knowing God’s word thoroughly, is more important than knowing church doctrines.
We are Bible students, because we appreciate the details that Scripture includes, that church doctrines ignore.

We operate just as the first Christians did.....nothing close to the RCC’s hierarchical system....and certainly not with a pope who lives in his own city, dressed in resplendent robes, in a gold inlaid palace to accommodate him and have people kiss his hand and treat him like a pop star.

What Jesus didn’t institute for Christianity was the same kind of organisation that applied to the Jews under the old covenant.....which is why a new covenant was necessary.
The old covenant had done what it was meant to do, and a new system of worship was now adopted....unlike the old one in many ways. What ancient Israel pictured on earth, was representative of what was in heaven. The RCC wanted to replicate it on earth.....it has failed miserably to imitate original Christianity.

 

[walter]

I agree with most people's line of reasoning I think this is probably one of the hardest subject to prove, because:

#1. When one person believes that the wicked are destroyed and they don't get life in the first place, they vanish and disappear, this agrees with the Bible throughout but disagrees with being tormented day and night forever, which is also in the Bible.

#2. Another person agrees and believes that the wicked are tormented day and night forever, must also disagree with other Bible texts.

IMO Both perspectives agree with scripture and also disagree with scripture.

* I can post the scriptures that show that the wicked are: to be cut off, like a dream he flies away, no more to be found, banished like a vision of the night, to disappear like smoke nowhere to be found, to perish, will not get life, be destroyed, the soul and the body are both destroyed in hell, indeed, the lamp of the wicked is extinguished, but the Bible still says: they will be tormented day and night forever.

 

[rvmb]

I agree with most people's line of reasoning I think this is probably one of the hardest subject to prove, because:

#1. When one person believes that the wicked are destroyed and they don't get life in the first place, they vanish and disappear, this agrees with the Bible throughout but disagrees with being tormented day and night forever, which is also in the Bible.

#2. Another person agrees and believes that the wicked are tormented day and night forever, must also disagree with other Bible texts.

IMO Both perspectives agree with scripture and also disagree with scripture.

* I can post the scriptures that show that the wicked are: to be cut off, like a dream he flies away, no more to be found, banished like a vision of the night, to disappear like smoke nowhere to be found, to perish, will not get life, be destroyed, the soul and the body are both destroyed in hell, indeed, the lamp of the wicked is extinguished, but the Bible still says: they will be tormented day and night for

 

[Jack]

BILLIONS of humans will spend eternity in Hell who don't believe in Hell!

Matthew 13:49-50
49 So it will be at the end of the age. The angels will come forth, separate the wicked from among the just,
50 and cast them into the furnace of fire. There will be wailing and gnashing of teeth."

 

[walter]

If we consider the words in each scripture, as equally valuable to our understanding, could it be possible that some of the words are figurative? And other words are not figurative?

Eternal Torment - Revelation 14:11, 20:10; Matthew 25:46
Will not see life - John 3:36, Matthew 7:14
Destroy both soul and body in hell - Matthew 10:28
Will disappear nowhere to be found - Psalm 37:10, 37:35-36; Isaiah 41:12
Eternal Destruction - 2 Thessalonians 1:9
Detestable things to God. nor did it enter my mind.- Deut 12:31; Jeremiah 7:31; 2 Kings 17:17

 

[Marymog]

Since your "Church or Leader is ultimately the Bible" what do you make of these passages? Obey those who rule over you, and be submissive, for they watch out for your souls, as those who must give account. Let them do so with joy and not with grief, for that would be profitable for you. Therefore take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood. Matthew 22:21

AI Overview

The Bible passages you cited (Hebrews 13:17 and related concepts) emphasize submitting to spiritual leaders because they care for your soul, accountable to God; this is understood within a framework where the Bible itself is the ultimate authority, meaning leaders must guide according to Scripture, and believers should obey when leaders align with biblical teachings, not blindly, ensuring joyful, godly leadership that benefits the flock.
Here's how these passages fit when the Bible is the ultimate standard:

• Biblical Mandate for Leadership: Hebrews 13:17 (which you quoted) highlights leaders watching over souls and being accountable to God, requiring believers to be submissive and not cause grief.
• Leaders Must Be Scriptural: The condition for this submission is that leaders are shepherding according to the Bible, as mentioned in your prompt's context. Answers in Genesis notes, "This only applies if the church we attend follows the Bible as the ultimate authority".
• Purpose of Submission: It's not about blind obedience but about trusting leaders who teach God's Word, making your life easier and more profitable spiritually, as they guide you in faith.
• The "Bible First" Principle: While obeying leaders is commanded, the ultimate standard remains the Bible. If a leader deviates from Scripture, believers aren't called to follow them into error; rather, the Bible itself provides the framework for discerning true vs. false teaching, as seen in passages about testing spirits or confronting error (e.g., Galatians, Acts 17).
• Matthew 22:21 ("Render to Caesar"): This verse, about paying taxes, establishes a principle of honoring governing authorities while also acknowledging God's higher authority, which extends to church leadership – obey earthly leaders as directed by God's ultimate law (the Bible).

In essence, these verses call for respectful, trusting, and obedient participation within a church structure led by biblically faithful individuals, always under the final authority of God's written Word.

LOL ...Thanks for the "AI Overview" Walter, however I was wanting your personal overview. It would be nice you hear from YOU and not AI.

Sadly, your "AI Overview" is flawed with the usual Protestant deception. It says that the "leaders must guide according to Scripture, and believers should obey when leaders align with biblical teachings, not blindly, ensuring joyful, godly leadership that benefits the flock."

I know you won't be able to see the flaw in your "AI Overview" of which I am sure you have taken that flaw on as your own personal belief. Here is the flaw in your and @Aunty Jane belief that you both practice which is against Scripture and therefore a false teaching: YOU decide when YOU should "obey" your leaders! When YOU decide that their teachings don't "align with biblical teachings" then YOU can leave that denomination and start your own denomination (of which many Protestant men did in the 1,600's and fulfilled Satan's wish by dividing Christianity and ignored Jesus prayer of One Church with One doctrine) with YOU giving your new flock of fools "the final authority of God's written Word".

Happy new year.......Keeping it real with truth and logic........Praying for you..........Marymog

 

[Marymog]

All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness,

I think if we interpret something into the words that are written and recorded in the Bible, that is a problem.
I myself do not interpret the words in the Bible, they speak for themselves!

Completely not true. Scripture does not speak for itself otherwise you and I and millions of Christians before us would not be debating what Scripture means. Scripture doesn't even say what you have written: "the words in the Bible, they speak for themselves!" Your ignorance of Scripture is astounding. But I don't blame you. I blame the men you blindly follow. Or is this another AI cut and paste?

2 Timothy was not written to you or me or the BILLIONS of Christians that have lived since Christ died. 2 Timothy is a pastoral letter written by Paul to Timothy who is a bishop of The Church. That letter are instructions to pastors/elders. If you look at the passage in context AND in context to other passages in Scripture, you will see that Scripture is NOT the only form of reproof, correction or instruction of righteousness. But you and @Aunty Jane will never see that since you have drunk too much Kool aide. If 2 Timothy was written to me then you should be listening to me instead of the Kool-Aid man that you follow.

Mary

 

[Marymog]

Well, Curious Mary.....I think you just answered your own questions.....what you fail to see is that an “overseer” is not a boss.

Thank you for your opinon. I will stick with Scripture of which is posted below. What you have written is a complete lie and totally opposite of what Scripture and historical Christian writings say. I know that your "historical Christian writings" only go back to the 1800's when your men created your Church, but you should really take the time to read the writings of the Apostolic Fathers and Early Church Fathers. I know your men discourage you from doing that, but the fact is that your men have lied to you and have not taught you well! That is why your "church" is decaying and loosing membership.......FLEE them!!

Obey them that have the rule over you and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.

Likewise, ye younger, submit yourselves unto the elder.

Remember your leaders, those who spoke the word of God to you; consider the outcome of their way of life and imitate their faith.

Pay careful attention to yourselves and to all the flock, in which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to care for the church of God,

I wish you well Aunty Jane and @walter .........My hope is that you someday flee your men and join The Church! However, I think you have drunk to much Kool aide for that to happen......Mary

 

[walter]

LOL ...Thanks for the "AI Overview" Walter, however I was wanting your personal overview. It would be nice you hear from YOU and not AI.

Sadly, your "AI Overview" is flawed with the usual Protestant deception. It says that the "leaders must guide according to Scripture, and believers should obey when leaders align with biblical teachings, not blindly, ensuring joyful, godly leadership that benefits the flock."

I know you won't be able to see the flaw in your "AI Overview" of which I am sure you have taken that flaw on as your own personal belief. Here is the flaw in your and @Aunty Jane belief that you both practice which is against Scripture and therefore a false teaching: YOU decide when YOU should "obey" your leaders! When YOU decide that their teachings don't "align with biblical teachings" then YOU can leave that denomination and start your own denomination (of which many Protestant men did in the 1,600's and fulfilled Satan's wish by dividing Christianity and ignored Jesus prayer of One Church with One doctrine) with YOU giving your new flock of fools "the final authority of God's written Word".

Happy new year.......Keeping it real with truth and logic........Praying for you..........Marymog

I have an idea, maybe you have a better idea please let me know. What if we both just give comments that reflect some of our strongest reasons why our view makes sense? And then after we have both listed our Strongest reasons, we can both objectively take a look at all the reasons that we both have explained.

Instead of words and questions about every little thing. We both explain our strongest reasons for our different conclusions.