Real Christians Stand up and Condemn the LBGT, Transgender Abomination.

[OzSpen]

The Torah.
Who is ignoring who?
Do you think homosexuals have not already chosen to act upon the thought or have not the option to STOP and flee from their sin?

Again..

What measure do you use to give you the knowledge to KNOW what IS "wrong doing or unriteous"?

Where does it originate from?

Danube,

Don't you think it would be courteous to deal with the issues I raised in #93 when replying to you?

Oz

P.S. What is 'unriteous'?

 

[OzSpen]

So what happens to the light ISRAEL carries, to be shone as a light unto ALL NATIONS upon the earth?
Where would north or south be on the moral compass?

The Old Covenant was for Israel as Ex 20:1-17 and Lev 11:1-3 confirm.

The 'moral compass' of the 10 Commandments is in Jesus' Sermon on the Mount (Matt 5-7).

 

[OzSpen]

The Torah.
Who is ignoring who?
Do you think homosexuals have not already chosen to act upon the thought or have not the option to STOP and flee from their sin?

Again..

What measure do you use to give you the knowledge to KNOW what IS "wrong doing or unriteous"?

Where does it originate from?

The Torah was not given to Gentiles like me but it was for the Israelites. We have the New Testament as our moral compass.

Why Are Old Testament Commands No Longer Binding? | Desiring God

Oz

 

[Danube]

The Torah was not given to Gentiles like me but it was for the Israelites. Where have the New Testament as our moral compass.
Why Are Old Testament Commands No Longer Binding? | Desiring God

Oz

Those that have the Son have the Father also.

 

[Danube]

Which commandments was Jesus referring to?

Should there be capital punishment for children who curse their parents?

What about adulterers? She they be killed also.

How about homosexuals and those who rape certain people?

What about bestiality? Should it be a capital offense?

Oz

What does Jesus say about Loving God and Loving your brother as you do yourself?
Do you show love to God by raping a woman or to your brother by killing him? No.
Would you yourself LOVE to be killed or raped? No.

....and the Prophets?

Hosea 4:6



Amen.

 

[Danube]

Danube,

For whom were the Ten Commandments written, according to Ex 20:1-17 (NIV). Ex 20:1-3 tells us:

And God spoke all these words:
2 ‘I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.
3 ‘You shall have no other gods before me....​

The 10 Commandments were not given as the Law for every nation. It was for the nation brought out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery for the Israelites.

I hope this thread grapples with homosexuality as an 'abomination' as language used for the Israelites under the Old Covenant. For those covered by the New Covenant - Christian believers - these are 2 prominent instructions about homosexuality:

9 Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men 10 nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.​

In God's kingdom, homosexuality is only one of a list of a number of sins/wrongs that prevents one from entering God's kingdom. Therefore, I suggest that homosexuality, since the passion and resurrection of Jesus and the emergence of the New Covenant, is placed as one of many wrongs. Let's not single it out more than other sexual immorality, idolatry, adultery, theft, greed, drunkenness, slandering, and swindling.

Could you imagine what would happen in the local church if we placed slandering on the same level of sinfulness as homosexuality? That's where 1 Cor 6 places it.

Others have discussed Rom 1.

Oz

No I could not imagine what would happen in your local church building. However here is what the CoE Anglican "church"(?) is rolling out for the British....skip to 15.00

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

Real Christians Stand up and Condemn the LBGT, Transgender Abomination. God does!!
When Are Christians Going to Care About This?

We all know that the scriptures which are God word teach us that all those who practice all forms of sexual immorality, which include homosexuality and lesbianism and those who change themselves from a male to female or vice-versa will not be in Gods Kingdom. That doesn't give us the right however to ignore the rights of human beings. God doesn't ignore the rights of human beings. God tells people they are accountable to him for their choices. God allows people to form organizations such as LBGT and others like it. God allows people to form organizations that say there is no God, that doesn't mean we agree with what they say and do. We don't, however, ignore peoples rights. People have the right to form such organizations. We as Christians understand that it's wrong for a man to lay with another man the way a man lays with a woman or the way a woman lays with another woman as she would lay with a man, but we don't force our morality on them nor do we physically or emotionally abuse them. two men who get married or two women who do the same thing have the right to do that. We as Christians don't ignore their rights. We certainly don't abuse them physically or emotionally when they exercise their rights. Do we agree with what they are doing? No, we do not.

 

[OzSpen]

Those that have the Son have the Father also.

You didn't deal with my comment but added your own content that was extraneous to what I wrote.

 

[OzSpen]

What does Jesus say about Loving God and Loving your brother as you do yourself?
Do you show love to God by raping a woman or to your brother by killing him? No.
Would you yourself LOVE to be killed or raped? No.

....and the Prophets?

Hosea 4:6

Amen.

Danube,

You did not answer my questions from #99:

Should there be capital punishment for children who curse their parents?

What about adulterers? She they be killed also.

How about homosexuals and those who rape certain people?

What about bestiality? Should it be a capital offense?​

Do Old Covenant Laws apply to New Covenant Christians?

Oz

​

 

[OzSpen]

No I could not imagine what would happen in your local church building. However here is what the CoE Anglican "church"(?) is rolling out for the British....skip to 15.00

Danube,

I know of that situation because I live in one of the States of Australia.

However, you have not dealt with the topic I raised in #99. You have a bad habit of going off and running with what you want to talk about and not deal with the matters I raise.

Oz

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

Danube,

You did not answer my questions from #99:

Should there be capital punishment for children who curse their parents?

What about adulterers? She they be killed also.

How about homosexuals and those who rape certain people?

What about bestiality? Should it be a capital offense?​

Do Old Covenant Laws apply to New Covenant Christians?

Oz

​

I believe the old covenant or the law covenant (law ofoMoses) was a covenant relationship between The True God and Israel not a relationship between The True God, Israel and the gentile nations. The New Covenant brought together by Jesus Christ was simply the law of love. There were some laws given such as at Acts 15: 19-23 but basically these laws had to do with love. We keep in mind in every situation to do unto others as we would want them to do to ourselves. Would you want someone to abuse you physically or emotionally for any reason? Would you want someone to steal from you or kill you? Would you want someone to bear false witness against you? The law of love applies in all of these questions. The law of love applies first and foremost to The True God. We do not lie about him but bear witness to the truth about him. When the scriptures tell us not to go beyond what is written in his word we obey cause of our love for him(God) and humanity especially our spiritual brothers and sisters in the truth. We hate the evil that people do, not the people. We love all people especially our spiritual brothers and sisters in the truth because God sent his Son to die for all humanity and his only begotten Son willingly came to die for all humanity.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

And how are Christians to do this?
On a much simple issue in the UK Christians could not agree to unite over the 'Keep Sunday Special' campiegn.
This is much bigger has universal support from society etc.

Many Christians are struggling with being openly Christian, without the extra problem of being abused by everyone because as a Christian they are opposed to lgbt.

How do you relate to a work collegue who is lgbt? Do you preach at them or befriend them without approving of their lgbt and seek to win them for Jesus?

I think if you are going to talk to someone about what the scriptures say on any given subject, those people must desire or want to know what the scriptures have to say on said subjects. A person may not care to hear what you have to say about the scriptures. But we treat all people lovingly, we don't agree with the sin they are practicing, whatever it may be. We also limit our association with people who practice sin. We all know that if you associate with someone like say those that are criminals you just may become one cause you associate with them more than your spiritual brothers and sisters in the Truth. The scriptures tell us bad association spoil useful habits.

As far as being abused because we choose to agree with the scriptures, Jesus Christ told us the way the world treated him is what we should be expecting from the world. People called Jesus a demon and a drunkard the world bore false witness against him. We should be expecting the world to treat us the same, after all if you are a friend to the world then you are a enemy of God. We should be happy that the world hates us.

 

[OzSpen]

I believe the old covenant or the law covenant (law ofoMoses) was a covenant relationship between The True God and Israel not a relationship between The True God, Israel and the gentile nations. The New Covenant brought together by Jesus Christ was simply the law of love....

Barney,

This is God's judgment of unbelievers at the end of the world:

46 “Then these evil people will go away to be punished forever. But the godly people will go and enjoy eternal life.” (Matt 25:45 ERV).​

Is this 'the law of love' of the New Covenant?

Oz

 

[CoreIssue]

No one is born homosexual at DuckDuckGo

There is no gay gene at DuckDuckGo

 

[Windmillcharge]

As far as being abused because we choose to agree with the scriptures

Easy to say, not so easy to do.

A question we all should look at and think about.

' Would a new member of staff or a neighbour see that we were Christian by how we behaved and talked?'

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

Barney,

This is God's judgment of unbelievers at the end of the world:

46 “Then these evil people will go away to be punished forever. But the godly people will go and enjoy eternal life.” (Matt 25:45 ERV).​

Is this 'the law of love' of the New Covenant?

Oz

Actually, it is. In this scripture, Jesus is showing or letting people know they are not showing love for The True God or his Only-Begotten Son by Jesus saying to them that those that don't show love for The True God people who are Jesus Christ disciples or followers(True Christians) will depart into everlasting punishment.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

Easy to say, not so easy to do.

A question we all should look at and think about.

' Would a new member of staff or a neighbor see that we were Christian by how we behaved and talked?'

I have another question for people. When you look at the history of Christendom and see all the wars fought in the name of Jesus Christ, especially the two world wars where spiritual brother killed each other in the name of Jesus, did Jesus Christ teach brothers to act this way to each other? Is it showing love to each other? Christendom has a long history of failing to show love as they should. Are they True Christian organizations or just organizations that say they are.

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

I believe the old covenant or the law covenant (law ofoMoses) was a covenant relationship between The True God and Israel not a relationship between The True God, Israel and the gentile nations. The New Covenant brought together by Jesus Christ was simply the law of love. There were some laws given such as at Acts 15: 19-23 but basically these laws had to do with love. We keep in mind in every situation to do unto others as we would want them to do to ourselves. Would you want someone to abuse you physically or emotionally for any reason? Would you want someone to steal from you or kill you? Would you want someone to bear false witness against you? The law of love applies in all of these questions. The law of love applies first and foremost to The True God. We do not lie about him but bear witness to the truth about him. When the scriptures tell us not to go beyond what is written in his word we obey cause of our love for him(God) and humanity especially our spiritual brothers and sisters in the truth. We hate the evil that people do, not the people. We love all people especially our spiritual brothers and sisters in the truth because God sent his Son to die for all humanity and his only begotten Son willingly came to die for all humanity.

Wrong !
The Law of Israel is total regardless, it's just that Jesus came and put two above all the rest and that finished it all off, If one thinks that the Jew has another law you are wrong, they have just as any Christian has, but are lost as to the two that Jesus gave. so the Jew is lost and all that one has to do is come to Jesus, just like the Jews who did 2000 years ago. and that's it bingo ! the lights come on.

Holy Moses said of Jesus, was to come and any true Israelite know this fact, just like Nathaniel did, who was in fact a True Israelite as Jesus said so. if one rejects Holy Moses they are not worthy of being true Jews at all, not to mention one can not be a true Christian if you reject Holy Moses.

NT In Israel = the Kingdom of God, you do not have people who are not worthy, such can not enter, they are outside and in the world, lost to the Kingdom, just as it was with Adam and Eve when they disobeyed God.

We seen that in OT Israel that others are not allowed to come into Israel because they have Idols and that's why they are not to enter, as such is a pox on the Tribe in fact, such would be a curse on Israel and they would fail by adding stupid Idols into the Tribe.

True Christianity is Israel and anyone who rejects Jesus Christ is not a Israel and if such claim to be Israel, they are in fact of Satan, fact is such are doing the works of Satan because they reject Jesus Christ and any true Christian should know that is a fact, not to mention if they don't then they have another Jesus and are rejecting the true Jesus Christ.

Jesus finished of the Law and did not remove one jot of the Law and that's a fact !
The Laws are all still there but Grace abounds because Jesus added two that are above all and with in this the others come truly to light, but before this they were in darkness, just dead works. Something like a cake one could say and Jesus added what was needed and baked the cake and there you go. enjoy ! she is scrumptious ? but before this no she was not finished.

God is there for everyone every race, God never turns his back on anyone and anyone who makes out a so called race to be above others is just a nutcase. such idiots would easy fall for and follow Hitler and all his crap I am sure.

If one thinks that the so called Jew of today is some how separated from the whole world, who were the ones who followed Jesus hey ! give me and the true Jews a brake for crying out loud, some took Jesus on and were Saved and the ones who did not are nothing worthless and do not even know God ! because the fact is that no one comes to the Father but through his only begotten Son and anyone who rejects such is of Satan.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

Wrong !
The Law of Israel is total regardless, it's just that Jesus came and put two above all the rest and that finished it all off, If one thinks that the Jew has another law you are wrong, they have just as any Christian has, but are lost as to the two that Jesus gave. so the Jew is lost and all that one has to do is come to Jesus, just like the Jews who did 2000 years ago. and that's it bingo ! the lights come on.

Holy Moses said of Jesus, was to come and any true Israelite know this fact, just like Nathaniel did, who was in fact a True Israelite as Jesus said so. if one rejects Holy Moses they are not worthy of being true Jews at all, not to mention one can not be a true Christian if you reject Holy Moses.

NT In Israel = the Kingdom of God, you do not have people who are not worthy, such can not enter, they are outside and in the world, lost to the Kingdom, just as it was with Adam and Eve when they disobeyed God.

We seen that in OT Israel that others are not allowed to come into Israel because they have Idols and that's why they are not to enter, as such is a pox on the Tribe in fact, such would be a curse on Israel and they would fail by adding stupid Idols into the Tribe.

True Christianity is Israel and anyone who rejects Jesus Christ is not a Israel and if such claim to be Israel, they are in fact of Satan, fact is such are doing the works of Satan because they reject Jesus Christ and any true Christian should know that is a fact, not to mention if they don't then they have another Jesus and are rejecting the true Jesus Christ.

Jesus finished of the Law and did not remove one jot of the Law and that's a fact !
The Laws are all still there but Grace abounds because Jesus added two that are above all and with in this the others come truly to light, but before this they were in darkness, just dead works. Something like a cake one could say and Jesus added what was needed and baked the cake and there you go. enjoy ! she is scrumptious ? but before this no she was not finished.

God is there for everyone every race, God never turns his back on anyone and anyone who makes out a so called race to be above others is just a nutcase. such idiots would easy fall for and follow Hitler and all his crap I am sure.

If one thinks that the so called Jew of today is some how separated from the whole world, who were the ones who followed Jesus hey ! give me and the true Jews a brake for crying out loud, some took Jesus on and were Saved and the ones who did not are nothing worthless and do not even know God ! because the fact is that no one comes to the Father but through his only begotten Son and anyone who rejects such is of Satan.

You can disagree all you want, that's your right but I'm not wrong what I said. When God through Moses led the people out of Egypt to the Mountain where The True God gave the ten commandments and other laws that were added as time passed were laws that God gave to those people that had gathered at the mountain and they were asked by The True God if they were willing to obey these laws. These are the people God made a covenant with, not those people gathered at the mountain and all the people in the gentile nations surrounding Israel.

 

[Danube]

You can disagree all you want, that's your right but I'm not wrong what I said. When God through Moses led the people out of Egypt to the Mountain where The True God gave the ten commandments and other laws that were added as time passed were laws that God gave to those people that had gathered at the mountain and they were asked by The True God if they were willing to obey these laws. These are the people God made a covenant with, not those people gathered at the mountain and all the people in the gentile nations surrounding Israel.

What about Israel using the LAW for protection from the lawless gentile?
If you identify 2 opposing law systems (mans graceful/political laws and Gods Laws) how can you not expect discordance in society?