The word, "Doctrine"

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Helen

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In my opinion the doctrines of God's Word has been twisted by man's religious interpretations and making it doctrines of men.....so doctrines has become a controversial issue between fellow Christians because of what their church "doctrine" supports as their core beliefs....and it really irks me when a church demands that you agree with their doctrine to be a member.

Amen!!! Agree a thousand % :D Clearly said.

I have come to almost hate the word Doctrine....and all it stands for today.
It has become a control tool in the hands of the legalists.

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bbyrd009

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I think he was saying that far too many people may worship the writings (as the Jews do their Talmud) without really ever coming to know the author and experiencing Him living life through us.
they are still putting meat and milk on diff fridge shelves for God's sake
lol pls
 
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marks

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You know, @Willie T ,

This thread does make me take notice that the word "doctrine" is in disfavor by many, and that's a word to the wise!

Much love!
 
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Marymog

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But that has always been the problem...those old men with white beards that decide for everyone else for the rest of time, and make ridged rules, what is doctrine and what is not true teaching.

What makes them any more right than your interpretation of the scriptures?
God says that the Holy Spirit is THE Teacher...
Were they so much more holy? I think not.
Hi BG,

What men it white beards do you speak of?

Curious Mary
 

Stranger

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I found this to be an interesting few words in a book that spoke of what Christianity is NOT.

In 1611 A.D., King James of England authorized what became known as the Authorized Version, better known as the King James Version, of an English translation of the Bible. The "Christian religion" of that day was still engaged in competing belief-systems.

King James hired translators to translate the Bible into English. The word for "teaching" in the English language of King James' time was "doctrine." The King James Version refers to the word "doctrine" 56 different times. But languages evolve, and the meanings of words change. So it is with the word "doctrine." Looking at a contemporary English dictionary you will discover that although "doctrine" used to mean "teaching" or "instruction," that definition is now regarded as "archaic" or "obsolete." What does the word "doctrine" mean in contemporary English? Webster's Collegiate Dictionary reads: "Doctrine a principle accepted by a body of believers or adherents to a philosophy or school; principles of knowledge or a system of belief." "Doctrinaire dictatorial or dogmatic." "Indoctrinate to imbue with a partisan or sectarian opinion, point of view or principle." Synonyms used for "indoctrinate" include "propagandize, program, brainwash, infect, instill, inculcate, etc." Is it any wonder that newer English translations tend to avoid the word "doctrine"? The New American Standard Bible, for example, uses the word "doctrine" only fourteen times, and even those are probably a carry-over of the traditionalism of ecclesiastical terminology. The Greek words, didache and didaskalia, should be consistently translated "teaching," except when reference is being made to "man-made doctrines" (Eph. 4:14; Col. 2:22; etc.)

In contemporary English language "doctrine" has come to mean "A traditional belief-system as interpreted and accepted by a particular group of people." "Doctrinaire" means "to dogmatically assert a traditional belief-system as interpreted and accepted by a particular group of people." "Indoctrinate" implies "to propagandize or brainwash others with this traditional belief-system as interpreted and accepted by a particular group of people."

Such a definition was most certainly not what the hearers intended when they listened to Jesus and "were astonished at His doctrine" (Luke 4:32 — KJV ). They were not "astonished at His traditional belief-system," rather they were "amazed at His teaching" (NASB). The teaching of Jesus was the extending, the offering, the demonstration of Himself His Life. His teaching was Life-teaching. The etymological root for the Greek word "teaching" had to do with "extending the hand" or "offering oneself." To demonstrate what is being taught; that is the way to teach Life!

The fundamentalism and evangelicalism that predominate in popular "Christian religion" in America today tend to key in on "doctrine" as belief-system. That may be the reason they often prefer to retain the King James Version, and interpret the use of the word "doctrine" throughout the New Testament as their particular brand of formulated and fixated belief-system. These religious doctrinarians continue to indoctrinate others and perpetuate the factious and fractious denominationalism of differing belief-systems. Americans, with their fierce individualism and concepts of personal freedom, have elevated denominationalism to an all-time high, a real "religious science", with thousands of religious denominations, divided by disputed doctrinal belief-systems. Those involved in "Christian religion" today still think that Christianity is essentially consent to a particular doctrinal belief-system.

This is, in fact, the definition of "fundamentalism," a grouping of people who has rigidly determined the "fundamentals" of their acceptable doctrinal belief-system. "Fundamentalism" is a word much used today. The newspapers and news reports are full of references to "Muslim fundamentalists" in Iran, Libya, Lebanon, Egypt, etc.; "Hindu fundamentalists" in Sri Lanka; "Christian fundamentalists" barging at and bombing abortion clinics in the United States. Have you ever noticed that fundamentalists always fight? Why is that? They feel they have an obligation to defend the particular way they have stacked all of their doctrinal blocks in their belief-system.

The fundamentalist "Christian religion" in general has allowed doctrine, their belief-system, to become the supreme issue. "Doctrine" becomes their basis of fellowship, acceptance, security, bonding, etc. It is a tragic misrepresentation of the Church when the basis of our commonality is calculated by doctrinal agreement, rather than the indwelling Lord Jesus Christ; when uniformity of doctrine is the primary issue instead of unity in Christ. How sad when much of what is called "Christian preaching" is but tirades against so-called "heretics" who do not stack the doctrinal fundamentals of their belief-system just like we do!

Doctrine has been deified in "Christian religion" today. Doctrine has become their " god." It is a gross form of idolatry when one's properly-aligned stack of doctrinal ideas is elevated and revered to the extent that it must be defended at all costs, even to the point of terrorism, even to the point of dying for it.

God alone is absolute and immutable. His attributes are exclusive to Himself. What God is, only God is. To attribute God's attributes to our doctrine and determine that our doctrine is absolute and unchangeable is to deify doctrine, and to engage in the absolutism that is indicative of fundamentalistic religion around the world.

The Scottish preacher and teacher, James S. Stewart, wrote these words: "Those who have succeeded in defining doctrine most closely, have lost Christ most completely."

Doctrines, belief-systems, will always be the focus of religion, but not of Christianity. Christianity is Christ! Jesus' teaching was about Himself. He is the essence of Christian teaching, contrary to what Buddha said about his religion.

In Christianity, TRUTH is a Person, Jesus Christ. "Truth" is not just propositional truth statements within a belief-system of doctrinal theology by which orthodoxy is rationalistically determined. Jesus Christ is Truth! Jesus Christ is our Life! He is so exclusively; there is no other Way! John 14:6 - "I AM the way, the truth and the life."

Christianity is not a belief-system. Christianity is Christ!

The author of this writing is just as guilty as those he is accusing. He is just emphasizing knowing God by the Spirit, at the expense of the truth. Yes, of course Jesus is the Truth. That doesn't mean we do not have the written truth also.

Whether you want to call it 'doctrine' or 'teachings', what does it matter? It speaks to the same thing. Jesus Himself had a doctrine. (John 7:16-17) "Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me. If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself."

So, just because you as a believer want to declare that you have 'no doctrine' but Jesus, that doesn't somehow make you all spiritual. It does mean you probably ignore the written Word.

Jesus didn't ignore the written Word. (Matt. 4:4,7,10). And as we already saw, He had a doctrine. For some reason people want to believe that if you have a doctrine then you must not be spiritual. If you have a doctrine then you must be ignoring the Person of Jesus Christ. How silly. We can know God only by the Spirit and Truth. Not by Spirit only. Not by the written Word only. Both are involved.

(John 4:24) "God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth."

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Willie T

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The author of this writing is just as guilty as those he is accusing. He is just emphasizing knowing God by the Spirit, at the expense of the truth. Yes, of course Jesus is the Truth. That doesn't mean we do not have the written truth also.

Whether you want to call it 'doctrine' or 'teachings', what does it matter? It speaks to the same thing. Jesus Himself had a doctrine. (John 7:16-17) "Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me. If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself."

So, just because you as a believer want to declare that you have 'no doctrine' but Jesus, that doesn't somehow make you all spiritual. It does mean you probably ignore the written Word.

Jesus didn't ignore the written Word. (Matt. 4:4,7,10). And as we already saw, He had a doctrine. For some reason people want to believe that if you have a doctrine then you must not be spiritual. If you have a doctrine then you must be ignoring the Person of Jesus Christ. How silly. We can know God only by the Spirit and Truth. Not by Spirit only. Not by the written Word only. Both are involved.

(John 4:24) "God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth."

Stranger
"A Doctrine"?????? What is that??
 

Stranger

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I made a thread about the meaning of a word. You tried to make that word into a "concept."

Oh gee, that's deep stuff. You feigned ignorance about 'doctrine'. Now you claim to know the difference between 'doctrine' and a 'concept'. See what happens when you are being dishonest?

So, what is it? Do you know or do you not. Are you ignorant, or are you not?

I called you on 'doctrine'. You crawfished by claiming some ignorance. So, what is it?

Stranger
 

Jay Ross

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@Willie T

Please forgive a man of understanding who love to argue for the sake of arguing since he believes his teaching/doctrine is worthy of him.

Shalom
 
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Helen

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Oswald Chambers said :-

It is possible to know all about doctrine and still not know Jesus.
A person’s soul is in grave danger when 'the knowledge of doctrine' surpasses Jesus, avoiding the intimate touch with Him.
Why was Mary weeping at the tomb?
Doctrine meant no more to her than the grass under her feet. In fact, any Pharisee could have made a fool of Mary doctrinally, but one thing they could never ridicule was the fact that Jesus had cast seven demons out of her, yet that blessings were nothing to her in comparison with knowing Jesus Himself. “…she turned around and saw Jesus standing there, and did not know that it was Jesus….Jesus said to her, ‘Mary!’ ” John 20.
Once He called Mary by her name, she immediately knew that she had a personal history with the One who spoke.

Good word and true.
 

Enoch111

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What men it white beards do you speak of?
She is thinking about theologians and possibly the Early Church Fathers (although many did not have white beards). And having a beard has no relevance to the subject. There was a time when all men wore beards, and they are now back in vogue.

Now had she mentioned Black Beard the Pirate, you could say he had no clue about Bible doctrine.:D
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Heart2Soul

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Oswald Chambers said :-

It is possible to know all about doctrine and still not know Jesus.
A person’s soul is in grave danger when 'the knowledge of doctrine' surpasses Jesus, avoiding the intimate touch with Him.
Why was Mary weeping at the tomb?
Doctrine meant no more to her than the grass under her feet. In fact, any Pharisee could have made a fool of Mary doctrinally, but one thing they could never ridicule was the fact that Jesus had cast seven demons out of her, yet that blessings were nothing to her in comparison with knowing Jesus Himself. “…she turned around and saw Jesus standing there, and did not know that it was Jesus….Jesus said to her, ‘Mary!’ ” John 20.
Once He called Mary by her name, she immediately knew that she had a personal history with the One who spoke.

Good word and true.
This is a deeper truth than most can comprehend. You really nailed it... it is all about Jesus. Thank you for sharing this.
 
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Marymog

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She is thinking about theologians and possibly the Early Church Fathers (although many did not have white beards). And having a beard has no relevance to the subject. There was a time when all men wore beards, and they are now back in vogue.

Now had she mentioned Black Beard the Pirate, you could say he had no clue about Bible doctrine.:D
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Hi Enoch,

I don't disagree with you that is who @"ByGrace" was talking about. HOWEVER there have been MANY theologians over the last 2,000 years with differing rules/beliefs/interpretations/teachings etc. who started their owne "church" sooooooo I am interested if she has any specific names in mind!!

So to be more precise in my question TO @"ByGrace": What are the names of the old men with white beards that have decided for everyone else for the rest of time who make ridged rules and doctrine? Who decides what is or is not a true teaching? Which of those men are "the problem"?

If ALL "old men" are "the problem" and do not have a "true teaching" then who decides what is a "true teaching"? Me? You?

Curious Mary
 

Marymog

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In my opinion the doctrines of God's Word has been twisted by man's religious interpretations and making it doctrines of men.....so doctrines has become a controversial issue between fellow Christians because of what their church "doctrine" supports as their core beliefs....and it really irks me when a church demands that you agree with their doctrine to be a member.
Hi,

Do you have any doctrines you adhere to that support your core beliefs?

Who decides what are to be the "sound doctrines" spoken of in Scripture? (1 Timothy 4:6; 6:3, Titus 2:1) Who decides the doctrines that we may all agree with one so we can fulfill Scripture? (1 Corinthians 1:10)

Mary
 
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Heart2Soul

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Hi,

Do you have any doctrines you adhere to that support your core beliefs?

Who decides what are to be the "sound doctrines" spoken of in Scripture? (1 Timothy 4:6; 6:3, Titus 2:1) Who decides the doctrines that we may all agree with one so we can fulfill Scripture? (1 Corinthians 1:10)

Mary
The whole Word of God is what I stand on allowing the Holy Spirit to guide me and teach me into all truth.
 
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