The myth of grace-only & easy-believism shattered forever

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BreadOfLife

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Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of

You highlighted the wrong part.

You think it says "name(s) of".

Unless you think Father, son and Holy Ghost are exactly the same.

You think something like this.....

...in the name of John, Paul and George(3 separate names)....

Makes sense?
Good grief . . .
I highlighted the correct part - you're simply not understanding.

"And of" means a separate name for each Person. YOUR point would only make sense if the Persons were separated by a mere comma.
Here's another grammatical example:

I recited the address of Mike, John and Tim.
I recited the address of Mike and of John and of Tim.

I went to Jogn
 

Truther

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Good grief . . .
I highlighted the correct part - you're simply not understanding.

"And of" means a separate name for each Person. YOUR point would only make sense if the Persons were separated by a mere comma.
Here's another grammatical example:

I recited the address of Mike, John and Tim.
I recited the address of Mike and of John and of Tim.

I went to Jogn
You highlighted 3 different names.

The Bible says baptized into 1 name.

You think 3 names are 1 name.

That is not even imaginable.
 

BreadOfLife

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"Father" is NOT a name.
"Son" is NOT a name.
"Holy Ghost" is NOT a name.

This is so simple, a child could understand it. Ask a child, "what is the NAME of your father."

The proper understanding is this...

Jesus is the name of the Father (John 5:43),
John 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

Jesus is the name of the Son (Matthew 1:21)
Matthew 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.

Jesus is the name of the Holy Ghost (John 14:26)
John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

God Bless!
This is heresy.
You have perverted Scripture.

The Father and the Holy Spirit are NOT names "Jesus". Jesus was only named Jesus after He was born as man.
John 5:43 means that when Jesus said He came in His "Father's name" - it DOESN'T mean they have the same name. It means that He came by the Father's AUTHORITY.

This is similar to a knight proclaiming, "I come in the name of the King!"
It doesn't mean that the Knight and the King have the SAME name. He came by the AUTHORITY of the King.
 

BreadOfLife

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You highlighted 3 different names.

The Bible says baptized into 1 name.

You think 3 names are 1 name.

That is not even imaginable.
Sooooooo, the grammatical examples went over your head??
These are simple, 3rd grade English examples.

I recited the address of Mike, John and Tim.
This indicates that they live at the SAME address.

I recited the address of Mike and of John and of Tim.
This indicates that they EACH have a different address.
 

Truther

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Sooooooo, the grammatical examples went over your head??
These are simple, 3rd grade English examples.

I recited the address of Mike, John and Tim.
This indicates that they live at the SAME address.

I recited the address of Mike and of John and of Tim.
This indicates that they EACH have a different address.

Let's look at this carefully....


19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name(singular) of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost(Titles of a singular name):


Not....

19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name(plural) of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:


Matthew did not make a typo.
 

BreadOfLife

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I have indeed addressed 1 John 1:8, and Romans 7:14-25, within this very thread. I will post the links to the posts shortly.

The myth of grace-only & easy-believism shattered forever

The myth of grace-only & easy-believism shattered forever

The myth of grace-only & easy-believism shattered forever

I do indeed have sin...indwelling sin. I can walk in freedom from and victory over indwelling sin even though sin dwells in me...I don't have to submit to the dictates of what indwelling sin wants me to do. I can walk above the desires of the flesh so that I do not obey them.

1 John 1:8 does not say that if we say that we don't sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth isn't in us. If that were the case, then 1 John 3:5-9 wouldn't be the reality; but it is the reality. 1 John 1:8 declares that we all have sin dwelling in us as an element that is either alive or dead...if it be alive, then we do not have the blessing of 1 John 3:5-9; but if it be dead, then we do not have to obey the dictates of indwelling sin....it is in fact rendered dead so that it no longer dictates to us the behaviour of sin...it is rendered dead and therefore silent.

And I have not claimed that I never stumble.

I have claimed that I do not stumble during any moments of my life that I am found abiding in Christ.

1 John 3:6 is clear on this: that if we abide in Christ, we sin not, for as long as we abide in Christ.

This should teach us the method and key to walking in freedom and victory over indwelling sin.

Jhn 15:1, I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
Jhn 15:2, Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
Jhn 15:3, Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
Jhn 15:4, Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
Jhn 15:5, I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
Jhn 15:6, If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
Jhn 15:7, If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.
Jhn 15:8, Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.


Psa 104:16, The trees of the LORD are full of sap; the cedars of Lebanon, which he hath planted;

We draw up nourishment from the vine and this enables us to walk in freedom and victory; and to bear much fruit.
No - you didn't properly exegete these verses - you offered EISEGESIS, which is your own spin on them.
You have perverted ALL of the verses you presented because you have applied your "absolutism" to ALL of them. These are NOT black and white absolutes. they are generalizations.

EVERY verse you have presented is about going back to a life of willful rebellion against God. They are NOT condemnations for those who stumble. If they were - then NOBODY would make it.
As I proved to you already - the Scriptures show that Peter, John and Paul sinned. Their point was that they have a was OUT through Christ - NOT that they wold never stumble.

They weren't as arrogant as YOU are . . .
 

Truther

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I am a father, son and husband.

This is not my name, but titles of myself.

Jesus is the everlasting Father(by default/Col 2;9), a Son of the Father(Matt 1) and a Holy Spirit(he is Holy and a Spirit).

These are his titles, with a name to his titles called Jesus Christ.
 

BreadOfLife

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Let's look at this carefully....

19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name(singular) of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost(Titles of a singular name):

Not....
19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name(plural) of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

Matthew did not make a typo.
Your comparison is ridiculous because all you did was post the exact same text in both cases - and put YOUR spin on it.
You didn't look at anything "carefully" - you just added different notes to each one.

This is an act of desperation . . .
 

Truther

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Your comparison is ridiculous because all you did was post the exact same text in both cases - and put YOUR spin on it.
You didn't look at anything "carefully" - you just added different notes to each one.

This is an act of desperation . . .
I don't see you asking questions, just throwing up a defensive wall.
 

BreadOfLife

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I am a father, son and husband.

This is not my name, but titles of myself.

Jesus is the everlasting Father(by default/Col 2;9), a Son of the Father(Matt 1) and a Holy Spirit(he is Holy and a Spirit).

These are his titles, with a name to his titles called Jesus Christ.
You're twisting Scripture again.
Col. 2:9 states:
For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form,

This says NOTHING about Him being called "Father".
If you are going to apply ONE name to ALL Three - then that name is "YHVH" - not Jesus.
 

Truther

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You're twisting Scripture again.
Col. 2:9 states:
For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form,

This says NOTHING about Him being called "Father".
If you are going to apply ONE name to ALL Three - then that name is "YHVH" - not Jesus.
Isaiah 9:6 says the son will be called the Everlasting Father, correct?
 

BreadOfLife

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I don't see you asking questions, just throwing up a defensive wall.
Your comparison was NO comparison at all.
It was the exact same text, twisted to fit YOUR interpretation.

I showed you different grammatical examples of the SAME scenario.
 

Truther

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Your comparison was NO comparison at all.
It was the exact same text, twisted to fit YOUR interpretation.

I showed you different grammatical examples of the SAME scenario.
How am I wrong?
Please quote.
 

BreadOfLife

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Isaiah 9:6 says the son will be called the Everlasting Father, correct?
That' doesn't mean that Jesus is the Father.
Isaiah. 9:6 is an early revelation about WHO Jesus is (God). It is a hint about the Trinity, which had not yet been revealed.

Good grief - you guys are open;y and freely perverting Scripture and you don't see it.
 

BreadOfLife

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How am I wrong?
Please quote.
You didn't address the grammatical example I gave.
ALL you did was post the same text TWICE and add different notes.

Address the point I made.
 

user

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This is heresy.
You have perverted Scripture.

The Father and the Holy Spirit are NOT names "Jesus". Jesus was only named Jesus after He was born as man.
John 5:43 means that when Jesus said He came in His "Father's name" - it DOESN'T mean they have the same name. It means that He came by the Father's AUTHORITY.

This is similar to a knight proclaiming, "I come in the name of the King!"
It doesn't mean that the Knight and the King have the SAME name. He came by the AUTHORITY of the King.


Isaiah 9:6 foretold, "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his NAME shall be called Wonderful, counsellor, The Mighty God, The Everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace."

Deuteronomy 6:4 clearly tells us ... "Hear, O Israel: the LORD our God is one LORD:"

Therefore, compare the following references:

The Lord God is the Creator. Isaiah 42:5.
The Lord Jesus is the Creator. John 1:3, 10.

The Lord God said, "I am He." Isaiah 43:10.
The Lord Jesus said, "I am He." John 8:24.

The Lord God is the only Saviour. Isaiah 43:10, 11.
The Lord Jesus is the Saviour. Titus 1:4.

The Lord God shall reign forever. Psalms. 146:10.
The Lord Jesus reign forever. Luke 1 :33.

The Lord God is the King of Israel. Isaiah 43:15.
The Lord Jesus is the King of Israel. Matt. 27:37.

The Lord God is Almighty. Genesis 17:1.
The Lord Jesus is Almighty. Revelation 1:8.

The Lord God is the First and the Last. Isaiah 44:6.
The Lord Jesus is the First and the Last. Revelation 1:8.


Jesus tells us in Revelation 22:16
I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

God Bless!
 

Truther

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That' doesn't mean that Jesus is the Father.
Isaiah. 9:6 is an early revelation about WHO Jesus is (God). It is a hint about the Trinity, which had not yet been revealed.

Good grief - you guys are open;y and freely perverting Scripture and you don't see it.
No, Is 9:6 says the son shall be called the Father.

Simple, the son inherited the name of the Father per Hebrews 1:4.

This means the name of the Father is Jesus by default.

This is why Jesus said "I am come in my Father's name" and when Peter said ...baptized in the name of Jesus Christ in Acts 2:38, omitting Father and Holy Ghost titles, he was correct.

Peter simply knew they were all descriptions of Jesus himself.
 

BreadOfLife

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Isaiah 9:6 foretold, "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his NAME shall be called Wonderful, counsellor, The Mighty God, The Everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace."

Deuteronomy 6:4 clearly tells us ... "Hear, O Israel: the LORD our God is one LORD:"

Therefore, compare the following references:

The Lord God is the Creator. Isaiah 42:5.
The Lord Jesus is the Creator. John 1:3, 10.

The Lord God said, "I am He." Isaiah 43:10.
The Lord Jesus said, "I am He." John 8:24.

The Lord God is the only Saviour. Isaiah 43:10, 11.
The Lord Jesus is the Saviour. Titus 1:4.

The Lord God shall reign forever. Psalms. 146:10.
The Lord Jesus reign forever. Luke 1 :33.

The Lord God is the King of Israel. Isaiah 43:15.
The Lord Jesus is the King of Israel. Matt. 27:37.

The Lord God is Almighty. Genesis 17:1.
The Lord Jesus is Almighty. Revelation 1:8.

The Lord God is the First and the Last. Isaiah 44:6.
The Lord Jesus is the First and the Last. Revelation 1:8.

Jesus tells us in Revelation 22:16
I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

God Bless!
Another Scriptural perversion and a COMPLETE misunderstanding of WHO Jesus is.

First of all - Isaiah.9:6 says that Jesus's "Name" shall be called:
Wonderful counsellor, The Mighty God, The Everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

NONE of these were His names. These are titles - and they are SYMBOLIC names.
His name is "Jesus".

As for ALL of the other Scriptural comparisons - NONE of these verse state that He is the Father - only that He is GOD.
Jesus IS God - so is the Father and so is the Holy Spirit.
 

Truther

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You didn't address the grammatical example I gave.
ALL you did was post the same text TWICE and add different notes.

Address the point I made.
All I saw was you think your own name is really a title.

Do you write "son" on your checks to folks or your actual name?
 

BreadOfLife

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No, Is 9:6 says the son shall be called the Father.
Simple, the son inherited the name of the Father per Hebrews 1:4.
This means the name of the Father is Jesus by default.


This is why Jesus said "I am come in my Father's name" and when Peter said ...baptized in the name of Jesus Christ in Acts 2:38, omitting Father and Holy Ghost titles, he was correct.

Peter simply knew they were all descriptions of Jesus himself.
And this is absolute HERESY.

God's name is "YHVH".
The Father and Holy Spirit don't have pro[er names, individually.